Sportsmanship?

tommyl2010

May open a can of worms with a few previous incidents but whats peoples views on touching gloves! After the ivory Fiskow fight id just like to hear what people think is right. I understand there is nothing in the rules but is it poor sportsmanship? Should there be a sportsman agreement that you can touch gloves or not but not drop your opponent after faking a glove touch?

Kal_El

tommyl2010 wrote: »

May open a can of worms with a few previous incidents but whats peoples views on touching gloves! After the ivory Fiskow fight id just like to hear what people think is right. I understand there is nothing in the rules but is it poor sportsmanship? Should there be a sportsman agreement that you can touch gloves or not but not drop your opponent after faking a glove touch?

What happened in the fight?

I think that the fighters should touch gloves when the ref brings them into the middle for the final instructions and come out fighting when the bell rings.

Raze_them_all

Fighters are under no obligation to touch gloves once the bell rings, that being said if a fighter has his hand up to touch gloves a simple nod or shake of the head should be given by the other fighter if they'll do it or not

tommyl2010

Kal_El wrote: »

What happened in the fight?

I think that the fighters should touch gloves when the ref brings them into the middle for the final instructions and come out fighting when the bell rings.

Fiskow came out to touch gloves, as did Ivory, Ivory swept his hand to the side and dropped him. Didnt finish the fight but was the beginning of the end so to speak. I do agree to an extent that it should done before the action begins, but its part of the sport worldwide that sportsman ship is shown before the fight again. One of those things everyone will have a different view on tho

arybvtcw0eolkf

tommyl2010 wrote: »

Fiskow came out to touch gloves, as did Ivory, Ivory swept his hand to the side and dropped him

Although there is no obligation to touch gloves, its rarely something welcomed by the spectator's, does nothing for the sport & in the rare times I've seen it lead to a victory in the eye's of the spectators its a hollow win.

IMO (as an MMA spectator) its just poor sportsmanship, and I don't like to witness it.

ollieo

tommyl2010 wrote: »

After the ivory Fiskow fight id just like to hear what people think is right. I understand there is nothing in the rules but is it poor sportsmanship? Should there be a sportsman agreement that you can touch gloves or not but not drop your opponent after faking a glove touch?

Fighters touch gloves when the referee brings them to the centre at the start of the fight. If they touch gloves again is completely up to the fighters.

What Richie Ivory did was very unsporting, Mihai had his glove out, Richie ran across the cage with his right glove out also but buried Mihai with a straight left that dropped him.

Mihai showed alot of heart to survive the round, (he escaped a tight rnc and triangle along with some vicious gnp).

Mihai being the sport that he is even touched gloves with Ivory at the start of the second.

I along with the rest of the crowd were unimpressed by the Ivory cheap shot, and as it has already been said, it didn't end the fight but it was as good as over after.

On another note it was a good stoppage by Dave Jones, Mihai was taking some vicious gnp but there was no quit in him.

tommyl2010

ollieo wrote: »

Fighters touch gloves when the referee brings them to the centre at the start of the fight. If they touch gloves again is completely up to the fighters.

What Richie Ivory did was very unsporting, Mihai had his glove out, Richie ran across the cage with his right glove out also but buried Mihai with a straight left that dropped him.

Mihai showed alot of heart to survive the round, (he escaped a tight rnc and triangle along with some vicious gnp).

Mihai being the sport that he is even touched gloves with Ivory at the start of the second.

I along with the rest of the crowd were unimpressed by the Ivory cheap shot, and as it has already been said, it didn't end the fight but it was as good as over after.

On another note it was a good stoppage by Dave Jones, Mihai was taking some vicious gnp but there was no quit in him.

I do agree Mihai did still put in a great performance givin the situation and it was definitly a justified stoppage. It can only be defined as a cheap shot tho. I understand aswell as every other mma fan/fighter you dont HAVE to touch gloves however raze_them said a simple nod would have been sufficient!

Hirst1000

I thought it was a really dirty move to pull. If he didn't show any intention to touch gloves it might not be so bad. I'm sure every featherweight in Ireland is after him now! (In the cage of course;))

On the other hand, Mihai showed some heart and it was great to see the crowd get behind him like that. And he's only 17...

ollieo

tommyl2010 wrote: »

I do agree Mihai did still put in a great performance givin the situation and it was definitly a justified stoppage. It can only be defined as a cheap shot tho. I understand aswell as every other mma fan/fighter you dont HAVE to touch gloves however raze_them said a simple nod would have been sufficient!

I know that is what he SHOULD have done if he didn't want to touch gloves, but the fact that he came running the whole way across the cage holding his glove out only to throw the cheap shot makes it worse IMO.

I don't know if it was a rush of blood to the head or part of his gameplan, either way he did himself no favours last night.

sonic85

i actually think mihai did something similar when i seen him fight before - the memory is a bit hazy so cant be 100% sure but i think he did. wasnt as vicious as ivorys cheap shot last night though. hate seeing stuff like this to be honest - its just a sport after all and i think it shows a real lack of respect but thats just my opinion.

mihai did really well just to hang in there but like a poster above said it was the beginning of the end

cowzerp

Basic advise to all fighters, circle as you touch gloves!
this stops the oncoming attacker geting a punch off, also i seen the video of the startof the fight and from behind you could just see richie running at opponent and dropping him, the side step would have sorted that straight away, also if someone is running at you (Dont touch gloves)

Id prefer if the initial option to touch gloves was the end of the glove touching and if you dont ask to touch gloves then its fair game, but if you ask then hit i would not like that

On a side note, Ritchies opponent came in and had no problems and told ritchie he did not need to apologise so if he's cool with it then thats that.

Mouthalmighty

sonic85 wrote: »

i actually think mihai did something similar when i seen him fight before - the memory is a bit hazy so cant be 100% sure but i think he did. wasnt as vicious as ivorys cheap shot last night though. hate seeing stuff like this to be honest - its just a sport after all and i think it shows a real lack of respect but thats just my opinion.

mihai did really well just to hang in there but like a poster above said it was the beginning of the end

Disagree I've seen Mihai fight all of his fights & he's never done anything like that he's a fine ambassador for the sport & a sound level headed young man to deal with.

sonic85

Mouthalmighty wrote: »

Disagree I've seen Mihai fight all of his fights & he's never done anything like that he's a fine ambassador for the sport & a sound level headed young man to deal with.

i didnt say he did exactly the same - i said it wasnt as vicious but was something similar where he went to touch gloves and then threw a really quick shot. could have been at a kilkenny show. like i said im not sure - not trying to bad mouth him or anything - hes a great fighter.

i think if both fighters agree to touch gloves do so but then take a step back - then there couldnt be any problems

Xlami

cowzerp wrote: »

Basic advise to all fighters, circle as you touch gloves!
this stops the oncoming attacker geting a punch off,

I think Donald Cerrone was circling when Paul Kelly hit him during the glove touch and minimized the impact of the shot.

Palhambran

tommyl2010 wrote: »

May open a can of worms with a few previous incidents but whats peoples views on touching gloves! After the ivory Fiskow fight id just like to hear what people think is right. I understand there is nothing in the rules but is it poor sportsmanship? Should there be a sportsman agreement that you can touch gloves or not but not drop your opponent after faking a glove touch?

Well Tommy, Alan here from Fighthounds. I think the sucker punch is totally unsporting. Fair enough there's nothing in the rules and the fighters are not obliged to step back but in all sports there are things considered bad practice. Like in football, not returning the ball to the team who put the ball out of play so an injured player from the other team could be treated. Not sure what sanctions if any could be imposed though.

Hats off to Mihai for staying in there, that kid is a warrior.

Raze_them_all

Palhambran wrote: »

Well Tommy, Alan here from Fighthounds. I think the sucker punch is totally unsporting. Fair enough there's nothing in the rules and the fighters are not obliged to step back but in all sports there are things considered bad practice. Like in football, not returning the ball to the team who put the ball out of play so an injured player from the other team could be treated. Not sure what sanctions if any could be imposed though.

Hats off to Mihai for staying in there, that kid is a warrior.

No sanctions should and can be imposed. What happened was 100% legal just not something 100% approved. Mihai will just learn to either step back and circle as cowzwer said or not touch gloves

stevemc01

ollieo wrote: »

I don't know if it was a rush of blood to the head or part of his gameplan, either way he did himself no favours last night.

First of all, Richies gameplan was not to 'cheap shot' (as its being called) Mihai, what happened was unfortunate but it wasn't intentional. From where I was and from the video it appears that they touched and Richie followed up quickly with the left. It looks a hell of a lot worse because Mihai is an orthodox fighter and Richie is a southpaw. Again it didn't look good but it wasn't planned, Richie generally doesnt touch gloves and he didnt realise what had happened until after the fight.

Contrary to popular opinion this happens more often than you would think but nobody complains whern its a home town fighter or its an Irish guy fighting a foreigner.

I would like to compliment Mihai on being one hell of a fighter, tough as nails. He is a great fighter at only 17 years old and in 3 or 4 years is going to be an absolute monster. He is a real class act.

cowzerp wrote: »

Basic advise to all fighters, circle as you touch gloves!
this stops the oncoming attacker geting a punch off, also i seen the video of the startof the fight and from behind you could just see richie running at opponent and dropping him, the side step would have sorted that straight away, also if someone is running at you (Dont touch gloves)

Id prefer if the initial option to touch gloves was the end of the glove touching and if you dont ask to touch gloves then its fair game, but if you ask then hit i would not like that

On a side note, Ritchies opponent came in and had no problems and told ritchie he did not need to apologise so if he's cool with it then thats that.

I agree with Paul here, Mihai came into the dressing room the 2 guys had a talk and Mihai had no problems.

I would also like to thank you guys for not robbing our gear as we started to panic when we got to the cage and realised we'd left our bags in the dressing room with 4 northsiders

Hirst1000 wrote: »

I thought it was a really dirty move to pull. If he didn't show any intention to touch gloves it might not be so bad. I'm sure every featherweight in Ireland is after him now! (In the cage of course;))

Every featherweight in Ireland would be right to be after Richie as they'd have 10lbs on him as he fights at Bantamweight

Palhambran wrote: »

Not sure what sanctions if any could be imposed though.

None should be and none can be. There is a fighters rules meeting before each event. Dave Jones clearly states at these meetings that once the bell rings be ready to fight and dont complain if someone punches you if you are trying to touch gloves. It would be nice on occasion if more than 10 fighters showed up for these meetings.


Although I train with Richie, these are my opinions and my words. I can confirm that he is not the devil and neither does he have 666 printed on his head. What happened last night was just one of those things but I'll stress again and I know this for a fact, it was not intentional or planned. Mihai seems happy to accept that and thats the main thing. Hopefully everyone involved will learn from it and move on. Best of luck to Mihai, he has a great future.

tommyl2010

stevemc01 wrote: »

First of all, Richies gameplan was not to 'cheap shot' (as its being called) Mihai, what happened was unfortunate but it wasn't intentional. From where I was and from the video it appears that they touched and Richie followed up quickly with the left. It looks a hell of a lot worse because Mihai is an orthodox fighter and Richie is a southpaw. Again it didn't look good but it wasn't planned, Richie generally doesnt touch gloves and he didnt realise what had happened until after the fight.

Ill be 100% honest here, i have nothing at all against richie, i don't know him on a personal level, i think he is a great talent and have always enjoyed watching him fight, however that being said, the video i took (which i am not going to put up because there is no need its a discussion) clearly shows richie walk across the cage with his fist in the air about to touch gloves, as the gloves are about to touch he then quickly opens his hand and brushes it to the side putting fiskow off balance and lands with the other hand, i was literally right under it and watched it a few times today as i was editing and it was definitely a cheap shot! Im not saying richie is a bad guy in anyway but he did make a mistake here, it happens as you said a lot i know, it is probably down to a rush of blood to the head but it is/was very un sportsman like. It was a punch and every punch thrown is intentional!

I also have no affiliation to the guy he was fighting, and i'm not complaining, just something i thought so wanted to discuss.

Clive

tommyl2010 wrote: »

Should there be a sportsman agreement that you can touch gloves or not but not drop your opponent after faking a glove touch?

In the general case, faking glove touches to get a "free dig" is the act of a coward. Sure, it's not against the rules, but then again, neither is cranking a heel hook on someone and not letting go until the ref physically pulls you off them.

Hirst1000

Every featherweight in Ireland would be right to be after Richie as they'd have 10lbs on him as he fights at Bantamweight

Oh sorry. My mistake:) All in all this card was stacked full of awesome fights!

DB888

As people were saying,Richie came running out towards Mihai,if someone came running towards me in a fight with a bad look in their eyes the last thing on my mind would be touching gloves.Richie did not have this planned too ''cheap shot'' or anything of the sort.I honestly dont think Richie intended to touch gloves either,as he never does so people need too forget about this alleged ''cheap shot''

Wrestlingcowjim

they did touch gloves with dave its not a glove touching competition so get over it .call him out if yea want but go join a club first.the plan was to bully mahai he has very good stand up ,it was a close fight against levi and mahai ,

John Ferguson

stevemc01 wrote: »

. He is a great fighter at only 17 years old

This fact would worry me more than the glove touching/non touching tbh, this is another case of a jnr fighting a snr?

I have seen a few shows of late letting under 18 year olds fight adults (and before anyone come running out squawking I am not getting at the skill level of the under 18 fighter as some have won their fights).

While it might only be a few months until the jnr is 18 and in the eyes of the law an adult the fact in law still remains its a child fighting an adult. My fear is that if someone with a bias or prejudice against MMA pushes this issue further (Joe Duffy etc etc) it will make life difficult for us all. Or worse still god forbid a child is injured at the hands of an adult it will bring all the wrong type of focus on the sport in Ireland

Sid_Justice

tommyl2010 wrote: »

Ill be 100% honest here, i have nothing at all against richie, i don't know him on a personal level, i think he is a great talent and have always enjoyed watching him fight, however that being said, the video i took (which i am not going to put up because there is no need its a discussion) clearly shows richie walk across the cage with his fist in the air about to touch gloves, as the gloves are about to touch he then quickly opens his hand and brushes it to the side putting fiskow off balance and lands with the other hand, i was literally right under it and watched it a few times today as i was editing and it was definitely a cheap shot! Im not saying richie is a bad guy in anyway but he did make a mistake here, it happens as you said a lot i know, it is probably down to a rush of blood to the head but it is/was very un sportsman like. It was a punch and every punch thrown is intentional!

I also have no affiliation to the guy he was fighting, and i'm not complaining, just something i thought so wanted to discuss.

go on put the video up

tommyl2010

Sid_Justice wrote: »

go on put the video up

No i dont think its needed, as i said this wasnt a personal attack on Richie and isnt me "calling him out" (:rolleyes:) it was an example i used for the topic.

pablohoney87

tommyl2010 wrote: »

No i dont think its needed, as i said this wasnt a personal attack on Richie and isnt me "calling him out" (:rolleyes:) it was an example i used for the topic.

More the fact that it sounded like a pretty crackin fight Id like to see it:D

tommyl2010

pablohoney87 wrote: »

More the fact that it sounded like a pretty crackin fight Id like to see it:D

It actually was a great fight to be honest. Leave it with me ill get it up at some stage

theboxingclinic

youve a patient girlfriend so tommy ;-)

tommyl2010

theboxingclinic wrote: »

youve a patient girlfriend so tommy ;-)

walked into that one :P

theboxingclinic

couldnt resist

Palhambran

stevemc01 wrote: »

First of all, Richies gameplan was not to 'cheap shot' (as its being called) Mihai, what happened was unfortunate but it wasn't intentional. From where I was and from the video it appears that they touched and Richie followed up quickly with the left. It looks a hell of a lot worse because Mihai is an orthodox fighter and Richie is a southpaw. Again it didn't look good but it wasn't planned, Richie generally doesnt touch gloves and he didnt realise what had happened until after the fight.

Contrary to popular opinion this happens more often than you would think but nobody complains whern its a home town fighter or its an Irish guy fighting a foreigner.

I would like to compliment Mihai on being one hell of a fighter, tough as nails. He is a great fighter at only 17 years old and in 3 or 4 years is going to be an absolute monster. He is a real class act.




I agree with Paul here, Mihai came into the dressing room the 2 guys had a talk and Mihai had no problems.

I would also like to thank you guys for not robbing our gear as we started to panic when we got to the cage and realised we'd left our bags in the dressing room with 4 northsiders




Every featherweight in Ireland would be right to be after Richie as they'd have 10lbs on him as he fights at Bantamweight



None should be and none can be. There is a fighters rules meeting before each event. Dave Jones clearly states at these meetings that once the bell rings be ready to fight and dont complain if someone punches you if you are trying to touch gloves. It would be nice on occasion if more than 10 fighters showed up for these meetings.


Although I train with Richie, these are my opinions and my words. I can confirm that he is not the devil and neither does he have 666 printed on his head. What happened last night was just one of those things but I'll stress again and I know this for a fact, it was not intentional or planned. Mihai seems happy to accept that and thats the main thing. Hopefully everyone involved will learn from it and move on. Best of luck to Mihai, he has a great future.

I in no way implied Richie was the devil or underhanded. What I said was there are certain things in every sport that are considered unsporting and in MMA a punch while or immediately after touching gloves is one of them. I know what Richie did was legal and I have zero personal knowledge of the man but I'm sure he's nice guy was well as a good fighter.