Kids DDSL - Pedantic ??

mirwillbeback

My boy plays in DDSL under 8's league. After an enjoyable season watching all the kids in the league give it their all, both his team and another from Coolock have both finished on 20pts.

Both team managers agreed to pay for and present winners trophies to each team as champions. However, the DDSL have determined a play off is needed, on a neutral ground. Does this not seem ridiculous or am I just looking for glory:)

Both teams will be promoted so not sure why they are so insistent ??

The Muppet

At that level it should be all about the fun of participating IMO.

Both teams could play to a draw in the playoff if forced to play it.

bamboozling

The Muppet wrote: »

At that level it should be all about the fun of participating IMO.

Both teams could play to a draw in the playoff if forced to play it.

How in the name of **** are you still allowed to post here after what you said last weekend?

Hulk Hands

Compare this to the GAA and their idea for go games (games where no score is kept and everyone gets equal minutes) up to and including u-12 level :rolleyes:. The answer of course lies somewhere in the middle. This does seem a bit excessive for u-8 level

Mars Bar

That's ridiculous by the DDSL. That's why teams are more worried about winning at such a young age than teaching them how to play football properly. Awarding both teams is a smashing idea and should be awarded on their participation and dedication than the fact that they both finished on 20 pts.

AgileMyth

Hulk Hands wrote: »

Compare this to the GAA and their idea for go games (games where no score is kept and everyone gets equal minutes) up to and including u-12 level :rolleyes:. The answer of course lies somewhere in the middle. This does seem a bit excessive for u-8 level

I'd be leaning towards agreeing with the GAA on that one..and I don't say that lightly:D. Competitive games at under-8 level is detrimental to footballing development.

Diabhal Beag

When its all about enjoyment the DDSL made a poor choice there. Both teams would have been winners after a very fair agreement and who doesn't want to be a winner? That really was a buzzkill move.

Panthro

ye should get on to the other team and all agree that everybody bring a picnic filled family along with them, all ye get together and invade the pitch, armed with the picnics and the family and camp out on it for the duration of the game.
And make a nice day of it.

dreamers75

Odd 2 years ago same thing happened my kid and both managers claimed them as champions maybe they told DDSL to feck off. Its normal that the manager pays for the trophy tho.

DB10

another example of shoddily run underage soccer in this country. if this is the worst you encounter then count yourself lucky!

I remember my brother and most of his friends quit playing soccer because they had to travel to Monaghan to play games and train.

There was no pitches fit for purpose in Cavan. So you had the absurdity of all the Cavan teams training and playing in Monaghan bar one, because there was no pitches....:eek:

Needless to say most players quit.

dreamers75

DB10 wrote: »

another example of shoddily run underage soccer in this country. if this is the worst you encounter then count yourself lucky!

I remember my brother and most of his friends quit playing soccer because they had to travel to Monaghan to play games and train.

There was no pitches fit for purpose in Cavan. So you had the absurdity of all the Cavan teams training and playing in Monaghan bar one, because there was no pitches....:eek:

Needless to say most players quit.

Not the DDSL tho?

Most problems with junior soccer over here is with individuals who most likely have mental issues anyway.

stovelid

DB10 wrote: »

There was no pitches fit for purpose in Cavan. .

There is very little fit for purpose in Cavan.

micks

mirwillbeback wrote: »

My boy plays in DDSL under 8's league. After an enjoyable season watching all the kids in the league give it their all, both his team and another from Coolock have both finished on 20pts.

Both team managers agreed to pay for and present winners trophies to each team as champions. However, the DDSL have determined a play off is needed, on a neutral ground. Does this not seem ridiculous or am I just looking for glory:)

Both teams will be promoted so not sure why they are so insistent ??

Dont agree with it myself but its in the rules and if your club feels strongly about it they should bring it up at the upcoming AGM and amend the rule if that's what they feel.The DDSL dont necessarily make the rules and any member/club can change them at the AGM
AFAIK the small sided games were non-competitive up to a few years ago but were changed for what ever reason. You'll find loads of pros and cons regarding how it should be done there is a trial scheme going on at U7 called "Don't X the line" which awards a score to each team and the result of the match only counts for a small % of the score and includes points for respect and even how the parents behave.
The Futsal that's run by the DDSL is non-competitive and has no league tables.
A plus point about this is that it will give the kids a day out/cup final experience that they will remember win or lose.

Ebbs

Its been like this for a while, always has to be one winner and goal difference has never counted towards the league. We had a play off when I was playing u10s for the league despite us winning it by a point.. due to walk overs and etc etc.

It was nice to win it outright.

Perhaps things have changed but they have an awards ceramony at the end of the season and the captain and vice captain of all under 11 teams pick up the trophy and get a round of applause from a few hundred people, pics taken, and such.

I guess it is a little pedantic but looking back on it, im glad we were made play. Win or lose its a good experience.

bohsboy

The Dutch and German schoolboy setups are streets ahead of us. No league tables are compiled for a season, no trophies or medals given out until U15s. All emphasis up until that age are on participation and fun.

Surprised at the DDSL on this but I suppose only one team can "win" the league.

From my experience at schoolboy level, some of the bigger clubs have alarming ambitions for very young kids. I reffed an U12 game yesterday between a big well known club and a small club who worked hard to keep the score at 0-0 with 15 mins to go. The manager of the small club brought on his three subs to give them all a run and they proceeded to fall apart and lose 3-0.

The big club went for their warm down after the game, all eleven players and their NINE unused subs. Win at all costs. Absolutely no development for the unlucky players on the bench.

BrookieD

I managed my under 8's in the NDSL cup yesterday, good game but we lost to an unlucky goal but one of my kids was in tears... After spending the last few weeks telling them its not the result its the taking part and learning the game the parents rev up the kid by offereing a "reward" for scoring and winning.

The pressure he was under was so so wrong and pretty much led to a breakdown during the game.

Under 8's and my new team under 10s' should be about the development of the game and nothing else. Just let the kids enjoy the sport, there is plenty of time to learn about winning and losing.

Superbus

I played up to U10, when a friend of mine joined the team. He was brutal, but it was still unforgivable that he didn't get to play one second. Showed up to every training session, every match, and never got a chance, despite genuinely improving.

So I just thought 'fcuk this' (well, less vulgar - I was 10) and quit. Couldn't be bothered being in a situation that toxic and unfair when I could just repeatedly pulverise the same guy at wall ball, without seeing his heart sink every week.

mirwillbeback

It gets better.

Had the play off yesterday at our home ground. 2 nil down with 7 mins left, the lads scored 2 in 3 minutes and the game ended all square.

The referee wasn't aware of any need for a definitive result, so both managers agreed to penalties. Our lads won and both sides came back to the club house for burgers / hot dogs and there was a great atmosphere between the two.

Late last night, we received a text from the DDSL saying that extra time should have been played, so once again, under 8s have to play yet another playoff game tomorrow at 7.

Madness.

karma_

mirwillbeback wrote: »

It gets better.

Had the play off yesterday at our home ground. 2 nil down with 7 mins left, the lads scored 2 in 3 minutes and the game ended all square.

The referee wasn't aware of any need for a definitive result, so both managers agreed to penalties. Our lads won and both sides came back to the club house for burgers / hot dogs and there was a great atmosphere between the two.

Late last night, we received a text from the DDSL saying that extra time should have been played, so once again, under 8s have to play yet another playoff game tomorrow at 7.

Madness.

Lunacy of the highest degree. It's quite pathetic there is that level of bureaucracy and muppetry at the age level you are talking about.

S.R.F.C.

Why don't both clubs just tell them where to go? Absolute joke.

bohsboy

The ref should of checked out beforehand if extra time was needed or made a quick call at full time to check. Going straight to peno's was a strange one.

But in fairness, ridiculous stuff from the DDSL.

dreamers75

mirwillbeback wrote: »

It gets better.

Had the play off yesterday at our home ground. 2 nil down with 7 mins left, the lads scored 2 in 3 minutes and the game ended all square.

The referee wasn't aware of any need for a definitive result, so both managers agreed to penalties. Our lads won and both sides came back to the club house for burgers / hot dogs and there was a great atmosphere between the two.

Late last night, we received a text from the DDSL saying that extra time should have been played, so once again, under 8s have to play yet another playoff game tomorrow at 7.

Madness.

Are you 100% sure the other coach agrees with you on this? It may be his club behind this.

Mars Bar

Jesus christ, they are U8's! Of course there was no need for extra time and penalties was the right thing to do IMO.

OhNoYouDidn't

While I appreciate that some of the pedantry is hard to understand or accept, rules are rules and they should be enforced evenly for fairness.

If you want your kid to be involved in a sport that has a rulebook they ignore and makes it up as they go along, let them play Gah and get their jaw broken.

Mars Bar

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

While I appreciate that some of the pedantry is hard to understand or accept, rules are rules and they should be enforced evenly for fairness.

If you want your kid to be involved in a sport that has a rulebook they ignore and makes it up as they go along, let them play Gah and get their jaw broken.

Yeah you're right, rules are rules.

But it'd be better if there was rules appropriate to the age group.

Extra time for U8's seems harsh. Especially if they knew they were getting hot dogs and stuff after, they probably wanted to finish it quickly at that stage! :pac:

Why these kids are playing 11 a side at that age is mad anyway.


They way I think it should be done is:

It should be 7 a side firstly.
If there is enough kids then they'll be able to play a couple of games between themselves. Set up 7 a side competition with 2 or 3 different clubs and have a mini tournament over a day a couple of times a season, preferably over the summer.
Small goals with focus on passing and movement.

SantryRed

It is 7 a side

Mars Bar

SantryRed wrote: »

It is 7 a side

Thank fúck for that!

OhNoYouDidn't

mars bar wrote: »

Yeah you're right, rules are rules.

But it'd be better if there was rules appropriate to the age group.

Extra time for U8's seems harsh. Especially if they knew they were getting hot dogs and stuff after, they probably wanted to finish it quickly at that stage! :pac:

Why these kids are playing 11 a side at that age is mad anyway.


They way I think it should be done is:

It should be 7 a side firstly.
If there is enough kids then they'll be able to play a couple of games between themselves. Set up 7 a side competition with 2 or 3 different clubs and have a mini tournament over a day a couple of times a season, preferably over the summer.
Small goals with focus on passing and movement.

I don't disagree with much of that, but am fairly sure its 7 a side at that age already, and I think we are a lot closer to scores not being recorded till they are 13 in Ireland than people think, but what you see as pedantry is probably the fairest result.

bohsboy

mars bar wrote: »

Why these kids are playing 11 a side at that age is mad anyway.


They way I think it should be done is:

It should be 7 a side firstly.
If there is enough kids then they'll be able to play a couple of games between themselves. Set up 7 a side competition with 2 or 3 different clubs and have a mini tournament over a day a couple of times a season, preferably over the summer.
Small goals with focus on passing and movement.

All games at that level are seven a side. Check out www.ddsl.ie
Includes all the SSG rules, mentioning that teams who finish level on points will have to play off to determine a winner.
Lexlip v Willows it looks like.

Mars Bar

bohsboy wrote: »

All games at that level are seven a side. Check out www.ddsl.ie
Includes all the SSG rules, mentioning that teams who finish level on points will have to play off to determine a winner.
Lexlip v Willows it looks like.

But now they are having a play off of a play off?!

They played by the rules until they skipped extra time.

OhNoYouDidn't

mars bar wrote: »

But now they are having a play off of a play off?!

They played by the rules until they skipped extra time.

As dreamer said above, stinks to me of an appeal from the other club.

But like it or not, the ref was wrong. Its within the power of the league to replay a game in those circumstances. Thems is the rules.

Mars Bar

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

As dreamer said above, stinks to me of an appeal from the other club.

But like it or not, the ref was wrong. Its within the power of the league to replay a game in those circumstances. Thems is the rules.

That's really bad form from the other club if they did that.

mirwillbeback

mars bar wrote: »

That's really bad form from the other club if they did that.

TBH, I wouldn't have thought they did, there seemed to be a great rapport between the two. Who knows all the same, though it would shake my belief in the genuine aspect of the game.

Playing tomorrow so will keep you posted.

bohsboy

Well, if its any help, from next season, the NDSL will be having non-competitive Small Sided Games according to this forum:
http://www.a2zsoccer.com/SoccerForum/tabid/43/forumid/2/threadid/4093/scope/posts/Default.aspx

A great move.

mirwillbeback

CHAMPIONS

2 1 win, saga put to bed!!