Can Arsenal summon the will to beat Man U?

chelseavera

Thus possibly put an unlikely Title back in Chelsea's hands?
Not impossible imo - its at home, pressure is off and they owe their supporters some joy after (yet) another season which promised so much.
Also in Chelsea's favour of course is an away leg in CL semi for Man U, plus the ramping up of pressure if Chelsea beat Spurs and are within 3pts!

A few weeks ago I would jumped at 2nd place, but where there's life - theres hope - what d'ye think?

tommyhaas

chelseavera wrote: »

Thus possibly put an unlikely Title back in Chelsea's hands?
Not impossible imo - its at home, pressure is off and they owe their supporters some joy after (yet) another season which promised so much.
Also in Chelsea's favour of course is an away leg in CL semi for Man U, plus the ramping up of pressure if Chelsea beat Spurs and are within 3pts!

A few weeks ago I would jumped at 2nd place, but where there's life - theres hope - what d'ye think?

Ah not this again :pac:

Leiva

No !

L'prof

We haven't beaten United in 2.5 years, so it's hardly likely. They'll shut us out by sitting deep and hope to catch us on the counter.

flahavaj

In a way they have a better chance now than before. We've seen how they've capitulated repeatedly when they've been under pressure, they can't do any worse now that the weight of expectation has ben lifted from their shoulders. Utd have the distraction of two CL games either side of this so dropping points is a very strong possibility.

Pepe LeFrits

I wouldn't say there's no pressure on Arsenal; there's the annual 4th place dog-fight coming.

... but yes, there is a certain logic that Arsenal may benefit from being out of the title race for this game. There's clearly a mental block in the team when it comes to the crunch games.

chelseavera

There's always the small matter of a change in fortune. The old idiom of luck levelling itself out over the season suggests Man U will concede a host of penalties and Red Cards over the next four games (6 incl CL).

Fuhrer

chelseavera wrote: »

There's always the small matter of a change in fortune. The old idiom of luck levelling itself out over the season suggests Man U will concede a host of penalties and Red Cards over the next four games (6 incl CL).

If thats true then United should just walk the chelsea game after loads of their players get sent off and United win with lots of penalties

KeithAFC

With Diaby in the team? LOLs. Nope. Unless we actually take our chances and defend well. Which you would think is normal for most teams but.. yeah get the point.

Hank Scorpio

Its the way they play, its not effective vs teams like Man Utd, lots of the balls, no end product. United will beat them imo

mike65

Not if a win requires more than talent.

craggles

L'prof wrote: »

We haven't beaten United in 2.5 years, so it's hardly likely. They'll shut us out by sitting deep and hope to catch us on the counter.

Hope? They won't hope, they will. It's absolutely nailed on and Wenger can do nothing about it.

Ebbs

They'll be 6 nill up with 10mins to go and then bottle it.

Its the arsenal way of life.

L'prof

craggles wrote: »

Hope? They won't hope, they will. It's absolutely nailed on and Wenger can do nothing about it.

Ridiculous! I expect United to get at least a point, but nothing's ever "absolutely nailed on" in football!

SDTimeout

I can't see it.

I can see Nani or someone running a straight line, passing it to Rooney who scores a tap in and the media spontaneously combust over such a feat of brilliance.

Cesc will go missing in the big games , even though he's been slightly better at showing up in them this season.

2-1 United imo.

heyjude

chelseavera wrote: »

There's always the small matter of a change in fortune. The old idiom of luck levelling itself out over the season suggests Man U will concede a host of penalties and Red Cards over the next four games (6 incl CL).

Don't let the facts get in the way of what you believe, Utd(with 3) have the 8th highest(not the lowest) number of red cards in the Premier League this season, though I conceed that Arsenal have equal most with 6(Chelsea have had just one),but United have also been awarded the 2nd fewest free kicks(fouls won) with 342(West Ham have fewest with 337), which refutes the allegation from the supporters of other teams that Utd get more free kicks than other teams(the team receiving the most free kicks is Everton with 470).

See http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rankings/4949054/Premier-League-Statistics.html

or this table for disciplinary records

http://www.premierleague.com/page/Statistics/0,,12306,00.html

This shows the number of penalties awarded and conceeded by each Premier League club

http://www.football-lineups.com/tourn/FA_Premier_League_2010-2011/Stats/Penalties/

Note that Arsenal have been awarded more penalties and conceeded more than Utd, but United have conceeded the 2nd highest number of penalties, while only being awarded half as many penalties as Man City or Chelsea

As for penalties, there are no independent stats for how many penalties a team Should have had or should have conceeded but in one of yesterdays papers it said that Utd had scored 100 goals in all competitions so far this season and just 4 of them were penalties

keano_afc

We dont have a plan B so we havent a hope of getting a result. Utd will do what they always do, soak up our tippy-tappy sideways bullshit and then Park will score.

wandatowell

Arsenal will play their usual pass the ball around just about 20 yards from Utd's goal then utd counter. Ball ends up with Rooney who plays it into space behind Clichy for Nani to cut in and serve the ball on a plate for Hernandez to tap it home. Final score 3-1 to Man Utd.

colly_06

chelseavera

heyjude wrote: »

Don't let the facts get in the way of what you believe, Utd(with 3) have the 8th highest(not the lowest) number of red cards in the Premier League this season, though I conceed that Arsenal have equal most with 6(Chelsea have had just one),but United have also been awarded the 2nd fewest free kicks(fouls won) with 342(West Ham have fewest with 337), which refutes the allegation from the supporters of other teams that Utd get more free kicks than other teams(the team receiving the most free kicks is Everton with 470).

See http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rankings/4949054/Premier-League-Statistics.html

or this table for disciplinary records

http://www.premierleague.com/page/Statistics/0,,12306,00.html

This shows the number of penalties awarded and conceeded by each Premier League club

http://www.football-lineups.com/tourn/FA_Premier_League_2010-2011/Stats/Penalties/

Note that Arsenal have been awarded more penalties and conceeded more than Utd, but United have conceeded the 2nd highest number of penalties, while only being awarded half as many penalties as Man City or Chelsea

As for penalties, there are no independent stats for how many penalties a team Should have had or should have conceeded but in one of yesterdays papers it said that Utd had scored 100 goals in all competitions so far this season and just 4 of them were penalties

Thanks for all that Hey Jude! - none of which disguises the game changing decisions that have fallen your way this season.
Of the top of my head, I think of 2 straight red card challenges by Gary Neville against Stoke, another against WBA, an extraordinary decision to allow Nanis goal against Spurs after he handled in the box and ref chnaged his mind re Freekick, a Red for Rooney (and 3/5 game ban) for assault on James McCarthy, penalty not given for West Ham (already 2-0 up) and still in the 1st half a Red for professional foul by Vidic not given.
Next up was the Ramieres penalty at Stamford Bridge - but as its the CL - we know we dont get penalties!
As recently as Saturday, 2 penalties Everton should have had. I go back to Blackpool, also should have had a penalty when 2 up.
All these were game and result altering, and no amount of statistics explain these curious decisions. And no - I never consider my self a conspiricist - but the decisions this season have been extraordinary. Ye might have to roll out Howard Webb for the OT match! (just to be on the safe side!! lol!)

flahavaj

chelseavera wrote: »

Thanks for all that Hey Jude! - none of which disguises the game changing decisions that have fallen your way this season.
Of the top of my head, I think of 2 straight red card challenges by Gary Neville against Stoke, another against WBA, an extraordinary decision to allow Nanis goal against Spurs after he handled in the box and ref chnaged his mind re Freekick, a Red for Rooney (and 3/5 game ban) for assault on James McCarthy, penalty not given for West Ham (already 2-0 up) and still in the 1st half a Red for professional foul by Vidic not given.
Next up was the Ramieres penalty at Stamford Bridge - but as its the CL - we know we dont get penalties!
As recently as Saturday, 2 penalties Everton should have had. I go back to Blackpool, also should have had a penalty when 2 up.
All these were game and result altering, and no amount of statistics explain these curious decisions. And no - I never consider my self a conspiricist - but the decisions this season have been extraordinary. Ye might have to roll out Howard Webb for the OT match! (just to be on the safe side!! lol!)

Pull the other one.

OPENROAD

Football season is over imo.

That said I might start watching the womens football this summer, think we might win the league, Emma Byrne is kind of cute also imo.

greendom

OPENROAD wrote: »

Football season is over imo.
.

I agree, was saying the same thing earlier. First pre-season friendly on Sunday

ShamoBuc

a stunning 2-2 draw on the cards until injury time and an arsenal winner keeps the season alive for another week.

chelseavera

flahavaj wrote: »

Pull the other one.

So - I've imagined it all?

Warper

Who cares what Arsenal do at this stage really. They have proven to everyone this season that they havn't got the balls to win anything. So what if they win on Sunday, it would only highlight the fact that they have no bottle when it matters. Its obvious it is time for Wenger to go at this stage. 6 years of winning nothing isnt good enough for a club like Arsenal.

PHB

chelseavera wrote: »

Thanks for all that Hey Jude! - none of which disguises the game changing decisions that have fallen your way this season.
Of the top of my head, I think of 2 straight red card challenges by Gary Neville against Stoke, another against WBA, an extraordinary decision to allow Nanis goal against Spurs after he handled in the box and ref chnaged his mind re Freekick, a Red for Rooney (and 3/5 game ban) for assault on James McCarthy, penalty not given for West Ham (already 2-0 up) and still in the 1st half a Red for professional foul by Vidic not given.
Next up was the Ramieres penalty at Stamford Bridge - but as its the CL - we know we dont get penalties!
As recently as Saturday, 2 penalties Everton should have had. I go back to Blackpool, also should have had a penalty when 2 up.
All these were game and result altering, and no amount of statistics explain these curious decisions. And no - I never consider my self a conspiricist - but the decisions this season have been extraordinary. Ye might have to roll out Howard Webb for the OT match! (just to be on the safe side!! lol!)

Wow, are we really going to have a Chelsea fan tell us that the ref favours United? A Chelsea fan. Of all the clubs out there, the team that was gifted the league by an offside goal against United, is going to tell us that the system favours us. Cop on like.

Lukker-

PHB wrote: »

Wow, are we really going to have a Chelsea fan tell us that the ref favours United? A Chelsea fan. Of all the clubs out there, the team that was gifted the league by an offside goal against United, is going to tell us that the system favours us. Cop on like.

Gifted the league? If you watched the game I'm sure you'd have seen the decisions balanced.

m@cc@

chelseavera wrote: »

Thanks for all that Hey Jude! - none of which disguises the game changing decisions that have fallen your way this season.
Of the top of my head, I think of 2 straight red card challenges by Gary Neville against Stoke, another against WBA, an extraordinary decision to allow Nanis goal against Spurs after he handled in the box and ref chnaged his mind re Freekick, a Red for Rooney (and 3/5 game ban) for assault on James McCarthy, penalty not given for West Ham (already 2-0 up) and still in the 1st half a Red for professional foul by Vidic not given.
Next up was the Ramieres penalty at Stamford Bridge - but as its the CL - we know we dont get penalties!
As recently as Saturday, 2 penalties Everton should have had. I go back to Blackpool, also should have had a penalty when 2 up.
All these were game and result altering, and no amount of statistics explain these curious decisions. And no - I never consider my self a conspiricist - but the decisions this season have been extraordinary. Ye might have to roll out Howard Webb for the OT match! (just to be on the safe side!! lol!)

It's great to see Rafa is alive and kicking.

flahavaj

chelseavera wrote: »

So - I've imagined it all?

You should collaborate with Thanx 4 the Fish, he has a list even longer than yours, ye could join them into a super-list of grievances - maybe people would take ye twice as seriously if your list was twice as long?:pac:

chelseavera

PHB wrote: »

Wow, are we really going to have a Chelsea fan tell us that the ref favours United? A Chelsea fan. Of all the clubs out there, the team that was gifted the league by an offside goal against United, is going to tell us that the system favours us. Cop on like.

Which was balanced by a handball from Macheda. I laugh at you guys!!

Sergio

Warper wrote: »

Who cares what Arsenal do at this stage really. They have proven to everyone this season that they havn't got the balls to win anything. So what if they win on Sunday, it would only highlight the fact that they have no bottle when it matters. Its obvious it is time for Wenger to go at this stage. 6 years of winning nothing isnt good enough for a club like Arsenal.

Spot on couldnt agree more.;)

chelseavera

flahavaj wrote: »

You should collaborate with Thanx 4 the Fish, he has a list even longer than yours, ye could join them into a super-list of grievances - maybe people would take ye twice as seriously if your list was twice as long?:pac:

I dont doubt I've missed some - like I say - off the top of my head. But I'm sure there were a lot of dodgy ones early in the season, but cant end up being compared to Rafa!!

m@cc@

chelseavera wrote: »

Which was balanced by a handball from Macheda. I laugh at you guys!!

You've managed to de-rail your own thread with some petty squabble about key decisions. The joke is own you.

flahavaj

chelseavera wrote: »

I dont doubt I've missed some - like I say - off the top of my head. But I'm sure there were a lot of dodgy ones early in the season, but cant end up being compared to Rafa!!

Did you just start the thread so you could post your list of grievances? Was that the plan along or did it kinda just happen along the way?

WallyGUFC

chelseavera wrote: »

Which was balanced by a handball from Macheda. I laugh at you guys!!

And we'll be laughin' when we win the league kid. Simple as!

chelseavera

WallyGUFC wrote: »

And we'll be laughin' when we win the league kid. Simple as!

What a great response!!

Essien

PHB wrote: »

Wow, are we really going to have a Chelsea fan tell us that the ref favours United? A Chelsea fan. Of all the clubs out there, the team that was gifted the league by an offside goal against United, is going to tell us that the system favours us. Cop on like.

I'd be shocked if you actually believed this. How many times have we heard about the league being won over 38 games etc etc

Anyway, good thread.

chelseavera

Twas Hey Jude that weighed in with the detail (or some version of it) regarding the details. I merely brought it up as another reason possibility of why anything can happen in a one off game and for this reason an Arsenal win is not impossible though unlikely given their complete implosion.City s win tonight and their closing down on Arsenals 3rd place is another reason why Arsenal have to keep picking up pts ......So, quite happy to get this back on track - as its the outcome thats interesting me.

Essien

Arsenal are perfectly capable of beating them, however, they don't always do what they are capable of, they certainly haven't been this season anyway.

I've mentioned in the super-thread that I fancy them a wee bit more now that the pressure is off so to speak, they've been finding interesting ways to avoid winning trophies of late so if you take the trophy out of the equation I suppose you never no what they might come up with.

Though having said that, I still think United will get at least a point, they're like the anti-Arsenal this season, no matter how bad they perform they seem to relentlessly pull just enough out of the bag to get the result required. Sign of champions and all that....

chelseavera

MAYBE the luck is changing!!! :D:D

Frisbee

Not a hope.

2-0 United. We'll have ~60% of possession, but all in our own half/on the wings. United will catch us on the break with Park and Rooney scoring.

In short - the same as usual.

PHB

chelseavera wrote: »

Thanks for all that Hey Jude! - none of which disguises the game changing decisions that have fallen your way this season.
Of the top of my head, I think of 2 straight red card challenges by Gary Neville against Stoke, another against WBA, an extraordinary decision to allow Nanis goal against Spurs after he handled in the box and ref chnaged his mind re Freekick, a Red for Rooney (and 3/5 game ban) for assault on James McCarthy, penalty not given for West Ham (already 2-0 up) and still in the 1st half a Red for professional foul by Vidic not given.
Next up was the Ramieres penalty at Stamford Bridge - but as its the CL - we know we dont get penalties!
As recently as Saturday, 2 penalties Everton should have had. I go back to Blackpool, also should have had a penalty when 2 up.
All these were game and result altering, and no amount of statistics explain these curious decisions. And no - I never consider my self a conspiricist - but the decisions this season have been extraordinary. Ye might have to roll out Howard Webb for the OT match! (just to be on the safe side!! lol!)

chelseavera wrote: »

So - I've imagined it all?

Basically, yes. Because Chelsea get a ****ing lions share of decisions, as today's two goals in a game that were won 2-1 should not have been given. If they had been lost, title race over.

chelseavera

Genuinely - the first decisons I've seen go our way for 3/4 seasons - since we got a 'soft' penalty at Anfield when Malouda went over. OK ... there was the Dogba offside last yeat at OT - but (as I said before) that was cancelled out by Macheda handball. Squeaky bum time - like it or not!!

eternal

I dont know what disturbs me more United winning the League or Clelsea ,in saying that United deffo deserve it more .They have played with their hearts.
I imagine Arsenal could surprise with a win tomorrow and the title race will be down to the nail.

The Muppet

No


Next question.

LuckyGent88

Better not

That_Guy

craggles wrote: »

Hope? They won't hope, they will. It's absolutely nailed on and Wenger can do nothing about it.

Nailed on? Don't think so pal.

chelseavera

YES YES YES!! Fancy us from here!!! Thank you Arsenal!

eternal

eternal wrote: »

I dont know what disturbs me more United winning the League or Clelsea ,in saying that United deffo deserve it more .They have played with their hearts.
I imagine Arsenal could surprise with a win tomorrow and the title race will be down to the nail.

a dose of I was right.
Why was I the only one who predicted a win.Im not even an Arsenal supporter