Disruptive Neighbours

Mimikyu

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ABajaninCork

Maybe you should pop round and have a quiet word/note through the letter box?

Clearly, the walls are thin, so, if the neighbours are new, they may not have realised the noise levels generated.

I don't think there is a need as yet to go to the mgmt company all guns blazing just yet, but of course if it continues, then that will be your next port of call.

Mimikyu

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athtrasna

I disagree with the other post..give your Management AGENT a call first thing in the morning. Get them to log your complaint and send out a letter about the breach of lease agreement. That way they have a record of a complaint, which would be very valuable in the unfortunate case that this became a regular occurrence, but also the letter would be sent regarding a complaint and not identifying who made it. It's safer that way.

Everyone is entitled to peaceful enjoyment of their home, and apartments have rules and lease clauses regarding noise. Ours for example states no noise audible from outside between midnight and 9am.

By sending a letter now hopefully the Management Agent will nip a potential problem in the bud. Your neighbours may be new to apartment living and may not realise how many people they were disturbing. Or they may just not care. In this case the Agent having a file is a very valuable tool.

It's possible your neighbour works shifts and got in late, or that they went back to their apartment after the pub, hence the 4am start.

Mimikyu

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Kensington

Was this a once off occurrence? May be best to leave it pass, but if it becomes a regular thing, then start taking it further?

Mimikyu

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ABajaninCork

athtrasna wrote: »

I disagree with the other post..give your Management AGENT a call first thing in the morning. Get them to log your complaint and send out a letter about the breach of lease agreement. That way they have a record of a complaint, which would be very valuable in the unfortunate case that this became a regular occurrence, but also the letter would be sent regarding a complaint and not identifying who made it. It's safer that way.

Everyone is entitled to peaceful enjoyment of their home, and apartments have rules and lease clauses regarding noise. Ours for example states no noise audible from outside between midnight and 9am.

By sending a letter now hopefully the Management Agent will nip a potential problem in the bud. Your neighbours may be new to apartment living and may not realise how many people they were disturbing. Or they may just not care. In this case the Agent having a file is a very valuable tool.

It's possible your neighbour works shifts and got in late, or that they went back to their apartment after the pub, hence the 4am start.

Sorry, but I don't agree with you either!! Whilst I agree that the OP and their neighbours are entitled to peaceful enjoyment of their home, why create a problem where there might be none? If the OP went in all guns blazing to the mgmt company, who's to say they don't tell the noisy neighbour whence the complaint came? Even more problems might be caused then.

If the OP doesn't want to approach the neighbour, given his family situation that's fair enough. I would then adopt a wait and see policy. If the situation continues, THEN by all means go to the management company.

Dinky22

Hi Captain Morgan. I agree it is totally inconsiderate of your new neighbours and it must have been infuriating for you. You ask what you should do if it continues - I really feel that that that would be the time to write a letter to the Management requesting them to contact the landlord - but I kinda feel you should wait for it to happen again rather than contact the Management on this first occasion.

athtrasna

From 7 years of apartment living I have learned that you need to nip these things in the bud from Day 1. The MA will send a letter that's not accusatory just letting the unit in question know that there have been complaints about noise on a certain night and reminding them of the development rules. As they are new tenants they may not be aware how the noise carries in the block, they also may see the lack of reaction to this party as a licence to continue.

The OP doesn't even have to identify themselves to the MA if they are worried about the highly unlikely event of of being identified by the MA. I know from personal experience that even as a director, our MA would not identify the source of complaints when we put a for sale sign up. When I pointed our MA in the direction of the lease which did not ban signs, I wanted to know who had complained so I could point it out to them but our agents would not tell me. It's in the MA's best interest to be discreet.

D3PO

OP if its the first time then let it go. It was a long weekend and somebody had a party its hardly crime of the year.

My neighbour two doors up had a party the other night that kept me awake until 5am. First time they have had a party in the 6 years I have been living here. I could have gone and approached them but its hardly a reasonable response to a one off. I suggest you treat the incident the same way unless it becomes a regular occurance.

username123

OP - Id call directly to the neighbours - NOT all guns blazing, just a polite conversation that their party was quite disruptive and perhaps they werent aware but it woke a lot of people. Its quite possible that it was only a housewarming party and is not going to be a regular occurance.

Id start with a polite call, escalate it if things continue.

We had new neighbours move in just before xmas, from day 1 they were having very disruptive parties, and playing very loud music at any time, morning, evening, nighttime. Parties included a lot of running noise and roaring and shouting. Initially we spoke to them politely about it. They apologised, the noise continued. Then we complained to letting agent. They were quiet for 2 weeks then it continued. Then we spoke to other neighbours and a number of people complained to letting agent. Things improved but still a lot of loud music at all times. Eventually after a completely disruptive night were the entire block was woken up my OH called in to them the next morning and 8am and absolutely lifted them out of it on the doorstep. He followed that less polite complaint with a very angry call to the letting agent and the management company. They have been quiet since.

By contrast a different neighbour had quite a disruptive party lately, however, in 2 years it was the first peep Id ever heard out of him so ignored it and there hasnt been a sound since.

With new neighbours I believe its important to address noise issues immediately otherwise they think theyre not bothering anyone and just carry on.

Adrift

Dreaful advice on letting it pass guys. Typical Irish attitude. "Leave it be and see what happens"

Personally I would send the complaint to the management company so they have it on record and make a record of it yourself so you know exactly what you are talking about if it occurs again. I would also drop down and have a word with them, you can be assertive without being aggressive. If anyone else has a problem with the noise which I'm sure they had, encourage them to go and make a similar complaint. If you do nothing now it sets the precedent for future similar events.

D3PO

Adrift wrote: »

Dreaful advice on letting it pass guys. Typical Irish attitude. "Leave it be and see what happens"

Personally I would send the complaint to the management company so they have it on record and make a record of it yourself so you know exactly what you are talking about if it occurs again. I would also drop down and have a word with them, you can be assertive without being aggressive. If anyone else has a problem with the noise which I'm sure they had, encourage them to go and make a similar complaint. If you do nothing now it sets the precedent for future similar events.

In your opinion its terrible advice. What you consider being assertive others might consider as agressive. Nothing like ruining neighbourly relations from the outset now is there ?

P.S by your logic everybody who has been caught speeding should be off the road for life. I mean they did it once it sets a precedent for future similar events :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Adrift

What you consider being assertive others might consider as agressive

I think it's quite possible for the OP to get his point accross without being aggressive.

Ruining neighbourly relations? Lets not forget that it's the OP that has been wronged here. The party clearly sounded too loud, and I'd imagine the shouting and roaring could be quite intimidating especially for an expectant couple. So in the off chance that these guys take a quiet word about the noise as aggression so be it.

P.S by your logic everybody who has been caught speeding should be off the road for life. I mean they did it once it sets a precedent for future similar events

No, definitely not. You are making an arbitrary and irrelevant comparison here.

Adrift

My neighbour two doors up had a party the other night that kept me awake until 5am. First time they have had a party in the 6 years I have been living here. I could have gone and approached them but its hardly a reasonable response to a one off. I suggest you treat the incident the same way unless it becomes a regular occurance.

You like comparing situations that aren't very alike at all. This is very different to the OP's situation. You are familiar with your neighbour. They don't party regularly, you have nothing to worry about. If I were in the same position as you I wouldn't go down to them either.

The OP however knows nothing about his new neighbours,and they have announced themselves with a bang. I still say the best thing is to have a word with them.

D3PO

Adrift wrote: »

You like comparing situations that aren't very alike at all. This is very different to the OP's situation. You are familiar with your neighbour. They don't party regularly, you have nothing to worry about. If I were in the same position as you I wouldn't go down to them either.

The OP however knows nothing about his new neighbours,and they have announced themselves with a bang. I still say the best thing is to have a word with them.

exactly they know nothing about them so why not give them the benefit of the doubt ? Considering it was a bank holiday weekend and many persons have housewarming parties why not appraise the situation.

Fair enough if it was a Tuesday night or something but thats not the case. Its perfectly reasonable to have an expectation that it is a one off.

Now fair enough if next weekend the same thing happens then act on it, but surely its better not to get into a confrontation with a new neighbour regardless of how cordial the conversation is from the outset.

Adrift

Well you are obviously a person who accepts shouting and roaring at 4/5 am as long as it's a weekend or Bank Holiday whereas I'm the sort of person that doesn't mind a party on those occasions but if there is shouting, roaring and excessive noise and it's intimidating my family I'm going to complain about it regardless of when it is.

D3PO

Adrift wrote: »

Well you are obviously a person who accepts shouting and roaring at 4/5 am as long as it's a weekend or Bank Holiday whereas I'm the sort of person that doesn't mind a party on those occasions but if there is shouting, roaring and excessive noise and it's intimidating my family I'm going to complain about it regardless of when it is.

Accepting it as a one off I think is fine. My view is different than yours clearly, but some many people are so uptight these days that its rediculous. To attribute loud drunk talk to indimidation of your family is exactly the kind of over the top reaction too many people have these days.

if your not prepared to accept that occasionally and by that I mean maybe once or twice a year that one of your neighbours might have a party that goes on a bit then frankly you should be living in a detached house on an acre of land so you dont have to deal with people.

People need to be more tolerent of their neighbours, its amazing how in the last 15 years this has gone out the window. Christ I remember when you knew all your neighbours by name and wouldnt be afraid to drop in to borrow some milk or eggs or something should you have unexpectedly run out.

You would be amazed what tolerance and goodwill do with neighbours. Seems like more people would rather shout and stomp around causing a tantrum just because they can.

athtrasna

Can I point out here that these noisy neighbours have signed a legally binding agreement to abide by the development rules, which they have clearly breached. Therefore the MA should be informed, but the OP should not presume another neighbour will do it and make that call.

It's all well and good for many posters here to say, ah leave it, it's only happened that one time but it really does set a precedent. If they've disturbed other neighbours how do we know what they do? Drivers, pilots, doctors, nurses, people we rely on to be fully alert? Or maybe just people who work hard to keep a roof over their heads and deserve to be able to sleep in their beds at night. I keep saying, it may not have been deliberate, new residents can't know how noise travels in a block. Someone has to let them know that their party disturbed people, and it's safer for the MA to do it.

Teyla Emmagan

Hi OP,

I also think you should act immediately by going straight to the Management Company. I definitely wouldn't address these people directly - don't go near them. If other people have complained, and it's possible they have, then the last think you want to be is identified as the face of the neighbourhood.

Given the level of their inconsideration, I don't think there is any point in adopting a 'wait and see' approach. Also, they don't sound like they deserve the benefit of the doubt - from what you describe there is no way they wouldn't have known they were waking half the block up and they obviously didn't care.

The other thing you could do is contact the Guards. I think if you get issued with 3 formal warnings you can be issued with a noise Asbo (could be wrong on that but better to be proactive than to be kept awake all summer).

Good luck!

Adrift

To attribute loud drunk talk to indimidation of your family

I'm sorry, Shouting and Roaring at 5AM is intimidating. If it's keeping you awake and you don't know the people, it makes you uncomfortable.

athtrasna and Teyla are bringing some sense to the proceedings here.

People need to be more tolerent of their neighbours

I don't dispute that. I have a fantastic relationship with my neighbours, but referring to the OP here, it's not a case of stomping and shouting because he can, if he and his expectant partner are uncomfortable and can't get a nights sleep they are entitled to complain.

I'm starting to think it was D3PO's party the other night.

Mimikyu

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D3PO

Adrift wrote: »

I'm sorry, Shouting and Roaring at 5AM is intimidating. If it's keeping you awake and you don't know the people, it makes you uncomfortable.

athtrasna and Teyla are bringing some sense to the proceedings here.




I don't dispute that. I have a fantastic relationship with my neighbours, but referring to the OP here, it's not a case of stomping and shouting because he can, if he and his expectant partner are uncomfortable and can't get a nights sleep they are entitled to complain.

I'm starting to think it was D3PO's party the other night.

Like I said early clearly I have a different view than others here. In fact Im really shocked at what I percieve to be the intolerance many on here seem to have. Perhaps thats my fault given I live in a properly built house and not one of thse cardboard cutout apartments and hosues of the last 10 years.

I still cant help but feel theres a lynch mob mentality here. You would swear Im saying let them run rampage but lets gain a little perspective here. its one party, one night on a bank holiday weekend that was possible a housewarming.

You are all making presumptions about it setting a precident etc. How about you presmuem in the positive.

The glass half full and all that ....

Adrift definatly not my party. If it were all the neighbours would have got an invite, I get on with my neighbours ratgher than set about causing problems that dont exist

Faolchu

OP i'd report it to the Management company and have them contact the person in question. as said it may be a once off. but it may not be. at least if the MC contacts them and it goes away no problems but if it continues there a paper trail.

if it happens again I'd also suggest making some form of recording of the noise be it audio or video just make sure you can identify when it happened, date time that sort fo thing, that way the culprit cant claim it wasnt them. these recordings are also very helpful if you feel the need to go down the legal route and have a noiose abaitment order placed on the property as this will require evidence of the noise and not just your word in court.

athtrasna

D3PO wrote: »

Like I said early clearly I have a different view than others here. In fact Im really shocked at what I percieve to be the intolerance many on here seem to have. Perhaps thats my fault given I live in a properly built house and not one of thse cardboard cutout apartments and hosues of the last 10 years.

I still cant help but feel theres a lynch mob mentality here. You would swear Im saying let them run rampage but lets gain a little perspective here. its one party, one night on a bank holiday weekend that was possible a housewarming.

You have hit one nail on the head there anyway...living in an apartment is totally different to living in a house, which is why I was giving the new tenants the benefit of the doubt, they may not know. I've been in apartments where you could hear the neighbours talking at normal volume not to mind shouting with music blaring, I've been in others that are better insulated for noise. In the OP's block it's clear that noise carries.

But if nobody tells them they still won't know and I'm not a believer in doing that stuff face to face until you know who you're dealing with. The management agent is the one to do a letter with a reminder of the rules.

It's not a lynch mob mentality - we're not saying get the neighbours evicted, it's about letting them know that they caused a significant disturbance. How they behave after that will determine future reactions but they could well be under the impression that it disturbed nobody and so it's grand to party in such a way.

P_1

Tough one to call without knowing who/how the neighbours are, tbh if I were the neighbour I'd probably appreciate you coming over for a quiet word explaining your grievance but then again I'd like to consider myself as a reasonable individual. Perhaps your neighbours aren't quite as reasonable?

Again tough one to call but those are my €0.02.

Mimikyu

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P_1

Perhaps if you happen to bump into them when they're putting the bins out or something? That way you won't be seen as a busy body by knocking at their door.

Captain Morgan

Captain Morgan wrote: »

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Difficult one for you. If you call to the door not knowing what type of person your are going to meet they may be aggressive in response. It could inflame the situtation. The rules are their for a reason. Notify your management company who will in turn advise your neighbours there was a complaint. They will get a warning and hopefully take heed of the warning. If they dont take heed of the warning they only have themselves to blame and it takes you out of the potentially difficult situation you may arrive at be calling at their door.

the groutch

Has nobody on this thread ever heard of a public service called An Garda Siochana?

lainey316

the groutch wrote: »

Has nobody on this thread ever heard of a public service called An Garda Siochana?

Who can do nothing in this situation. If the party was on right now, they could call round and ask people to shut up, but cannot enforce it. Now taht the party was last week, what could they do?

I would go through the mgmt company OP, and if you wanted to be less confrontational suggest they send a letter to all saying 'for all new tenants, please be aware of the noise regulations, there have been some reports of excessive noise lately and please note that any confirmed future incidents will result in <some punishment>' so it's not as targeted.

angel01

the groutch wrote: »

Has nobody on this thread ever heard of a public service called An Garda Siochana?

The guards won't do anything, they will only do something if there is a fight outside, indoors and they won't touch it. The guards can only ask them to turn the noise down (if they show up at all) and they have no powers of enforcement at all.

I have been down this road before and Captain Morgan, you have my sympathies, if this does occur again, contact your management company, make a recording of the noise (every time it happens).

Are you renting? Are they renting? look up on the PRTB website for their apartment address and if it is listed, write a letter to them and ask them for the landlord's details. Once you have them, go and see him/her face to face. If you are renting, involve your landlord.

Be prepared to take it as far as you can, I did and got the people evicted.

athtrasna

Captain Morgan what did you decide to do in the end?

em_cat

Hi, has anyone here ever had to issue court proceedings against a neighbor who is owner occupier with a tenant, but may not be declaring the "rent" with revenue and has most likely not applied for the 'rent a room' scheme and is not required to register with the PRTB?(that is if it is a valid rent a room scheme).

I ask this b/c we are having difficulty with a neighbor whereby not only the owner occupier is causing the problems, but so is the tenant. The situation has gotten so bad that the managing agent, the building security and the Garda are now involved.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers

bernyh

D3PO wrote: »

exactly they know nothing about them so why not give them the benefit of the doubt ? Considering it was a bank holiday weekend and many persons have housewarming parties why not appraise the situation.

Fair enough if it was a Tuesday night or something but thats not the case. Its perfectly reasonable to have an expectation that it is a one off.

Now fair enough if next weekend the same thing happens then act on it, but surely its better not to get into a confrontation with a new neighbour regardless of how cordial the conversation is from the outset.

Sorry but b****x I've been living in an apartment for 7 years now and let me tell you it is absolute misery, I am at the moment awake cos my neighbour thinks it's ok to come home and cause mayhem at whatever hour he likes.. this has been the case from next door, down below, above us... the apartments are usually let on a yearly basis and generally the tenants move on, but that year is misery, I cringe for the day that my neighbour next door moves out as they are decent enough, never really much noise, but previous tenants have been a nightmare.

OP definately nip it in the bud, we had it so bad at one time from next door, the letting agents had an out of hours emergency number on their website, I took to phoning them at whatever time I had been awake at, allowing them to see the time that I was awake and also the level of noise, have to say pretty sharpish the tenent was out.

I ALWAYS complain if I hear noise, if you wanna have a party rent a function suite, an apartment is a shared building so why should anyone feel that they have the right to keep everyone up, it's selfish and rude.

Merch

athtrasna wrote: »

You have hit one nail on the head there anyway...living in an apartment is totally different to living in a house, which is why I was giving the new tenants the benefit of the doubt, they may not know. I've been in apartments where you could hear the neighbours talking at normal volume not to mind shouting with music blaring, I've been in others that are better insulated for noise. In the OP's block it's clear that noise carries.

But if nobody tells them they still won't know and I'm not a believer in doing that stuff face to face until you know who you're dealing with. The management agent is the one to do a letter with a reminder of the rules.

It's not a lynch mob mentality - we're not saying get the neighbours evicted, it's about letting them know that they caused a significant disturbance. How they behave after that will determine future reactions but they could well be under the impression that it disturbed nobody and so it's grand to party in such a way.

I totally agree with what you are saying, except the highlighted bit, I live in a house and have put up with years of varying types of hassle from tenants next door to me. In fact there are loads of rented houses on my road but mine seem to be among/if not the worst. I've even written a post about it last night. I guess in apartments its possible to be worse in that people could be on different floors and there are more people in close proximity to each other, but also there is the potential (hopefully) that a management company can do some of the hard work on your behalf too.
Its completely unfair/inconsiderate for a person to announce themselves that way, I'd prefer it wasnt the way but I think the best approach is to nip it in the bud, Id approach the Management company, if you are lucky they are proactive (hate that word) and send out either a general message regarding noise, but maybe its fairer to send out a specific message, as it doesnt target potential new renters that have done nothing. In reality its a record but can they do anything.
I think the local authority can be approached as there is legislation regarding anti social behaviour.

athtrasna

Merch wrote: »

I totally agree with what you are saying, except the highlighted bit, I live in a house and have put up with years of varying types of hassle from tenants next door to me. In fact there are loads of rented houses on my road but mine seem to be among/if not the worst. I've even written a post about it last night. I guess in apartments its possible to be worse in that people could be on different floors and there are more people in close proximity to each other, but also there is the potential (hopefully) that a management company can do some of the hard work on your behalf too.

You also hit the nail on the head. Worst case scenario in a house is mid terrace, house either side. In an apartment you can have apartments either side, above and below, and that's not even including courtyard echoes, sound and vibrations through the building, common stairwells...this is what I was referring to. Also there tends to be better (even slightly) noise insulation between houses than apartments.

Doesn't mean I don't sympathise with you, nuisance neighbours are a pain whatever your dwelling. If your issue is with tenants you can take a case through the PRTB against the landlord.

bedstuybosco

Check the Residential Tennancies Act 2004 .... You have rights

Merch

bedstuybosco wrote: »

Check the Residential Tennancies Act 2004 .... You have rights

But how do you enforce those rights, do they actually have the power to evict? or force people to be evicted?

bedstuybosco

i think you have to bring your case to thr prtb first and when they make a ruling then you can bring ruling and facts to court.

Give the prtb a call ... im sure they will fill you in