Paying by debit card - foreign currency.

CiniO

My mum which is in Ireland on holidays paid for her shopping in Ireland with a Maestro debit card which was issued in Poland by Polish bank.
One thing worth mentioning here, is that even in Poland there is different currency (PLN) even though this card was issued to Euro account, so card currency is Euro.
My mum got this card intentionally, to avoid currency conversions while paying in Euro-zone countries like Ireland.

Shopping total was 24.90 euro, but the card terminal in the shop recognised it was a Polish card, and converted a currency to PLN, which displayed a sum of 102.70 PLN at currency conversion rate of 4.127682.

My mum was not really concerned at that time, but only when we got home, she check online with her bank, and amount which was taken from her account was over 27 euros. (hence her shooping bill was only 24.90).

We looked at the receipt, and it states that transaction currency was PLN and amount 102.70. It also states something like that:

Currency Conversion Provided by Elavon Merchant Services

I accept that I have been offered a choice of currencies for payment. I accept the conversion rate amount & that the final selected transaction currency is POLISH NEW ZLOTY. I also accept that my choice of currency is final.

From what I understand, the POS terminal provider converted transaction currency at rate 4.12 (which is very bad conversion) and charged the card in Polish PLN currency.
Then because the card is issued to Euro account, issuing bank, had to convert a currency again at it's conversion rate from PLN to Euro, and that amount was taken from the account.

My mum wanted to avoid currency conversion, but unfortunately suffered double conversion.

I've got few questions here.

1. She was never informed by shop assistant, that she will be charged for her shopping in PLN. How actually could she expect that for shopping in Ireland she will be charged in foreign currency (PLN). Is charging someone in foreign currency in Ireland legal?

2. What can she do now? As I said she was never informed that she will be charged in PLN currency, but on receipt it states that she accept that she has been offered a choice of currencies for payment.

Who should she make a complaint to?

PS. I know it's just a few euros, as shopping was not big, but anyway - I thing that's not right.

Paulw

CiniO wrote: »

1. She was never informed by shop assistant, that she will be charged for her shopping in PLN. How actually could she expect that for shopping in Ireland she will be charged in foreign currency (PLN). Is charging someone in foreign currency in Ireland legal?

2. What can she do now? As I said she was never informed that she will be charged in PLN currency, but on receipt it states that she accept that she has been offered a choice of currencies for payment.

Who should she make a complaint to?

1 - Yes, charging in a foreign currency (using the bank currency exchange rate) for a foreign bank card is normal, and is certainly legal.

2 - Not a whole lot. She should have checked the receipt on the spot. You could write to the bank, and also to the shop, and see what they have to say. I doubt you will get much satisfaction though. At least it was only a few Euro and you'll know better next time, to insist that transactions are processed in Euro. The shop really should have given your mom the option to pay in Euro or home currency.

McLoughlin

Card was issued in Poland by Polish bank and when it was used the machine reconized it as a polish card and therefore was charged in the polish currency

CiniO

Paulw wrote: »

1 - Yes, charging in a foreign currency (using the bank currency exchange rate) for a foreign bank card is normal, and is certainly legal.

The only thing is that the currency conversion was provided by Elavon Merchant Services as it's stated on receipt. Bank which issued a card, had to do opposite conversion.

Anyway - I just thought that as official currency in Ireland is Euro, so charging someone if foreign currency was illegal. Probably then I was wrong.

2 - Not a whole lot. She should have checked the receipt on the spot. You could write to the bank, and also to the shop, and see what they have to say. I doubt you will get much satisfaction though. At least it was only a few Euro and you'll know better next time, to insist that transactions are processed in Euro. The shop really should have given your mom the option to pay in Euro or home currency.

That't the same what I thought. Even on receipt is states that she was offered a choice of payment currency. But she never was.
She should have checked a receipt on the spot, but it probably would be not much help as she only received a receipt after finalising transaction and after entering pin.

I can't see a point in writing to her bank, as bank did what it was supposed to do.
Transaction was in PLN, card is in Euros, so bank had to do currency convesion.
The main issue is why transaction was in PLN, if it was in Ireland, where legal currency is Euro.
I might contact the shop next time I'm there to clarify the whole situation.

And as you said - luckily it was just a few quid.

CiniO

McLoughlin wrote: »

Card was issued in Poland by Polish bank and when it was used the machine reconized it as a polish card and therefore was charged in the polish currency

But how mu mum could expect she will be charged in Polish currency while paying in Ireland?

Paulw

CiniO wrote: »

The main issue is why transaction was in PLN, if it was in Ireland, where legal currency is Euro.

If I US national, using a US issued debit card buys something in Ireland, the machine will send the Euro value to the processing centre. It will then turn it in to the national currency of the issuing bank (US dollars). If the person had an account in Euro (don't think it's legally possible in the US), then it would be converted by the local bank in the US back to Euro.

I do find it unusual for a bank in Poland to allow people to operate a Euro account. Surely there is some local currency conversion going on somewhere in the chain, and back again?

Anyway, it's a few Euro this time, and you now know what happens.

CiniO

Paulw wrote: »

If I US national, using a US issued debit card buys something in Ireland, the machine will send the Euro value to the processing centre. It will then turn it in to the national currency of the issuing bank (US dollars).

What would be that "processing centre" you mentioned?
I thought that in this case, your bank would charge your account with the amount in Euros, and as the currency of the account is $ the bank would convert the currency.
Is that not right?

If the person had an account in Euro (don't think it's legally possible in the US), then it would be converted by the local bank in the US back to Euro.

Now I don't get it. Why would the bank had to convert a transaction to Euro if it was Euro account already?

I do find it unusual for a bank in Poland to allow people to operate a Euro account. Surely there is some local currency conversion going on somewhere in the chain, and back again?

Polish banks offer, and always offered account in foreign currencies. US$, Euro, swiss franks, etc accounts are pretty much offered by almost every bank in Poland. It makes it handy for people to keep their savings in foreign currencies in banks without a need for conversion.
I didn't know that it's not available in other countries like Ireland or US.
No currency conversions going on anywhere.

Anyway, it's a few Euro this time, and you now know what happens.

The thing which confuses me the most, is that I have an Euro account in Polish bank as well, and I have a debit card to this account.
I used it plenty of times in differenct places in Ireland, and other EU countries and never had any problems with it.
When transaction was f.e. 60 euros, then 60 euros was gone from my account. No currency conversions at all.
That's why that what happened to my mum surprised me a lot.

dudara

Moved to Banking & Insurance & Pensions

dudara

Toboldlygo

CiniO wrote: »

My mum which is in Ireland on holidays paid for her shopping in Ireland with a Maestro debit card which was issued in Poland by Polish bank.
One thing worth mentioning here, is that even in Poland there is different currency (PLN) even though this card was issued to Euro account, so card currency is Euro.
My mum got this card intentionally, to avoid currency conversions while paying in Euro-zone countries like Ireland.

Shopping total was 24.90 euro, but the card terminal in the shop recognised it was a Polish card, and converted a currency to PLN, which displayed a sum of 102.70 PLN at currency conversion rate of 4.127682.

My mum was not really concerned at that time, but only when we got home, she check online with her bank, and amount which was taken from her account was over 27 euros. (hence her shooping bill was only 24.90).

We looked at the receipt, and it states that transaction currency was PLN and amount 102.70. It also states something like that:



From what I understand, the POS terminal provider converted transaction currency at rate 4.12 (which is very bad conversion) and charged the card in Polish PLN currency.
Then because the card is issued to Euro account, issuing bank, had to convert a currency again at it's conversion rate from PLN to Euro, and that amount was taken from the account.

My mum wanted to avoid currency conversion, but unfortunately suffered double conversion.

I've got few questions here.

1. She was never informed by shop assistant, that she will be charged for her shopping in PLN. How actually could she expect that for shopping in Ireland she will be charged in foreign currency (PLN). Is charging someone in foreign currency in Ireland legal?

2. What can she do now? As I said she was never informed that she will be charged in PLN currency, but on receipt it states that she accept that she has been offered a choice of currencies for payment.

Who should she make a complaint to?

PS. I know it's just a few euros, as shopping was not big, but anyway - I thing that's not right.

Complain to MasterCard!. The shop assistant is supposed to ask the customer what currency they want to use for the purchase. No doubt the printing on the receipt will cover the shop legally but this is just sharp practice. I had a similar experience in a Hotel in the midlands where the receptionist did not ask me what currency I wanted to use when paying. My card is issued in Northern Ireland so the currency is sterling. I noticed that the transaction had been converted to sterling automatically by the terminal and insisted that it was cancelled and redone in euros. I kept the cancelled receipt and checked how much I would have been charged compared to the amount I was actually charged. My bank charged me a currency conversion fee of 2.75% for the actual transaction but in the cancelled transaction the hotel conversion had 5% added! This type of sharp practice is a real put off for tourists visiting Ireland, fortunately for the tourism industry not many visitors actually realise this.

Richard

Toboldlygo wrote: »

Complain to MasterCard!. The shop assistant is supposed to ask the customer what currency they want to use for the purchase. No doubt the printing on the receipt will cover the shop legally but this is just sharp practice. I had a similar experience in a Hotel in the midlands where the receptionist did not ask me what currency I wanted to use when paying. My card is issued in Northern Ireland so the currency is sterling. I noticed that the transaction had been converted to sterling automatically by the terminal and insisted that it was cancelled and redone in euros. I kept the cancelled receipt and checked how much I would have been charged compared to the amount I was actually charged. My bank charged me a currency conversion fee of 2.75% for the actual transaction but in the cancelled transaction the hotel conversion had 5% added! This type of sharp practice is a real put off for tourists visiting Ireland, fortunately for the tourism industry not many visitors actually realise this.

I had a problem at a filling station in Clones about 10 years ago where I was paying for petrol with an Ulster Bank (ROI) credit card. They wanted to charge me in Sterling. I had to wait for the manager to try and sort their machine out but when he apparently couldn't I had to pay in cash.

Marcin_diy

Hi OP

My Dad has similar card he keeps some savings in euro, and got a card for euro transactions. He purchased goods here in Ireland few times already and every single time he was asked if he wants to pay in PLN or euro.

Your mum has a right to complain. Simply go to the shop again and talk to the manager. If they say no return your purchase and buy it somewhere else.

CiniO

Just a little update.
I talked to shop manager then, but he was completely unhelpful, and generally told me to f..k off.

I left it as it was only few euros.

However I realised since, that when terminal is asking for PIN, it always displays amount and currency.
So in general, when currency is incorrect, just don't enter the pin, and ask to amend the transaction to correct currency.