Anzac Dawn Ceremony this Easter Monday

quad_red

For those that might have an interest.

http://ireland.embassy.gov.au/dubl/anzac2011.html

PatsytheNazi

quad_red wrote: »

For those that might have an interest.

http://ireland.embassy.gov.au/dubl/anzac2011.html

Will they apologise to the people of Turkey for trying to invade their country and honour the bravery of the Turkish soldiers in defending their nation against invasion ?

quad_red

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

Will they apologise to the people of Turkey for trying to invade their country and honour the bravery of the Turkish soldiers in defending their nation against invasion ?

To be fair, I think any Anzac Day ceremony I've ever been at has acknowledged the absolute horrendous unjustness of the entire enterprise. What Australians honour are the virtues of the ordinary grunts shovelled into the meat grinder. And Attaturks epilogue and the bravery of the Turkish defenders are frequently recognised, honoured and lauded.

You do know the biggest Anzac ceremonies are at Gallilpoli and held with the support and assistance of the Turkish government?

Manic Moran

quad_red wrote: »

To be fair, I think any Anzac Day ceremony I've ever been at has acknowledged the absolute horrendous unjustness of the entire enterprise.

Just so that I don't go banning Patsy for nothing, what actually was unjust about it? Ottoman had joined the Central Powers and was an enemy, no?

NTM

PatsytheNazi

Manic Moran wrote: »

Just so that I don't go banning Patsy for nothing, what actually was unjust about it? Ottoman had joined the Central Powers and was an enemy, no?

NTM

Yes, what was so unjust about this battle and not every other battle ? One guys attacked another bunch of guys and got their asses kicked ?

Gillipoli is held in the same esteem for the people of Turkey like, say, Waterloo for the British. The young officer who inspired the Turkish soldiers to hold at all costs when the invasion started Mustafa Ataturk is one of Turkey's national heros with streets and football stadiums etc named after him.

goldie fish

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

Yes, what was so unjust about this battle and not every other battle ? One guys attacked another bunch of guys and got their asses kicked ?

Gillipoli is held in the same esteem for the people of Turkey like, say, Waterloo for the British. The young officer who inspired the Turkish soldiers to hold at all costs when the invasion started Mustafa Ataturk is one of Turkey's national heros with streets and football stadiums etc named after him.

You mean Mustafa Kemal?

LondonIrish90

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

Yes, what was so unjust about this battle and not every other battle ? One guys attacked another bunch of guys and got their asses kicked ?

Gillipoli is held in the same esteem for the people of Turkey like, say, Waterloo for the British. The young officer who inspired the Turkish soldiers to hold at all costs when the invasion started Mustafa Ataturk is one of Turkey's national heros with streets and football stadiums etc named after him.

They may have won the battle, but soon got their whipping elsewhere in the Middle East.

I understand what you say about Gallipoli as a source of pride for the turks in the same vein as waterloo, yet you haven't explained why it should be apologised for!

I've never understood the ANZAC element to it though, they seem to forget that almost 3 times as many British and Irish troops were killed and injured that Aussies and New Zealanders.

Manic Moran

Actually, I'm more interested in Quad Red's opinion on the "unjustness"

NTM

quad_red

Manic Moran wrote: »

Actually, I'm more interested in Quad Red's opinion on the "unjustness"

NTM

Unjustness = 16 million dead and 21 million injured.

I wasn't speaking about the Gallipoli campaign in particular. I've always had an interest in military history. But any sort of overblown pumping up of the 'glory' of such an insane conflict would make me uncomfortable.

I wasn't apportioning blame or bias towards any side in that conflict.

Manic Moran

Thought as much.

[Mod]Patsy gone for a month for trolling.[/Mod]

NTM

Zambia

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

They may have won the battle, but soon got their whipping elsewhere in the Middle East.

I understand what you say about Gallipoli as a source of pride for the turks in the same vein as waterloo, yet you haven't explained why it should be apologised for!

I've never understood the ANZAC element to it though, they seem to forget that almost 3 times as many British and Irish troops were killed and injured that Aussies and New Zealanders.

ANZAC day is pretty impressive over here.

R.Dub.Fusilier

without going into the politics of the war or who did what to who, i think its great that the ANZACS are remembered by by ex-pats around the world. lets not forget that thousands of Irish men suffered and died in Gallipoli for a cause they thought , rightly or wrongly, was a just one.

LondonIrish90

Zambia wrote: »

ANZAC day is pretty impressive over here.

I wasn't denying that. I've seen footage and its very impressive indeed. I just wonder how many of those honouring the Australians and New Zealanders realise that the sacrifice played by the British at Gallipoli was far, far greater. In fact, I think it is pretty disgraceful that in the UK so much emphasis when talking of the tragedy of Gallipoli is put on the losses of ANZAC troops, while there is barely a mention of the British and Irish.

Zambia

Maybe its just they lost so many troops in so many places.

Sorry I hit quote on yours as opposed to just hitting Post reply.