Wedge Degrees

Zak Flaps

Hi. 24 handicap golfer here.

Want to but some new wedges. My pitching wedge is 44 degrees.
Should I go for a GW of 49, SW 54, LW 59 ? (5 degrees difference between each)

OR

Should I go for a GW 50, SW 56, LW 62 ? (6 degrees difference between each)

I am leaning more towards option 1.
If that's the right option, would that mean I'd have to get a 58 or 60 bent into a 59, or do 59's exist?

Zak.

soundsham

Overkill !!

Osgoodisgood

Option 2b. Make sure you have some bounce in the 56 so it is useful in the sand.
Throw the 62 into the river where it belongs.

BoardsMember

I think what people are saying is that if you are playing off 24 handicap it wont make a hell of a lot of difference if there is 5 degrees or 6 degrees between each of your short irons. As Osgood mentions, you need to be sure there is enough bounce on the SW, that's the most important thing.

At the risk of setting the cat amongst the pidgeons, the guys I play with who are playing golf off twenty-something would not benefit from having 4 wedges in the bag at all, they would benefit much more from having an extra utility club or something of that nature.

Maybe I'm being too old school, hopefully not handicap snob too, but having four wedges in the bag is something the pros and lower handicappers have to ensure that they can control distance perfectly, being able to hit every yardage on the money from inside 130 yards or so. Unless you are hitting the ball very well, and consistently the same distance, I think you are wasting your time/moeny putting four wedges in the bag.

Or, as soundsham put it, Overkill!!

Zak Flaps

You could be right.

Got back into the game last year after a long break from it. Used to play off 18 and am pretty sure I can get back to that fairly soon as I am getting regular lessons these days.
If anything, my wedge play is by far the strongest point of my game. That's why I'd like the option of the extra wedge. I'm even pretty good with the dreaded lob wedge!!!
It's off the tee and the longer irons where my main problems lie.

Also, seeing as the loft on my PW is very strong (44), thought I may need the extra club.

zak.

DonkeyPokerTour

Zak

If you look back at the past your PW would have had a 9 on it a few years ago. Just in order for people to think "these clubs are great, look at how far they go" clubs gradually got stronger and stronger. That's why today people are struggling to hit 4 and 5 irons where in the past it was 3 and 4 irons because the lofts of modern 4 and 5's are the same as the old 3 and 4 irons.

I'm off of 14 and since I was off of 16 I've carried 4 wedges. 46, 52, 56 and 60. I definitely would not recommend going any more than 60 degrees with the lob wedge its not really needed. Next I would try out a few sand wedges from the sand. See if you prefer a 54, 56 or 58 out of the sand. I could never get on with a 54degree or 58degree sand wedge but found a 56 much better so I'd recommend deciding your sand wedge based on this. If you take a 58 you can probably eliminate the Lob Wedge as this will be you lob wedge and can add two lower lofted wedges as "gap wedges". Your gap wedge/wedges just try and fill the gap as best as possible. If you go with a 56degree sand wedge when your gap will be 12degrees so you'd need a 50degree wedge to split that gap. If you go with a 54degree sand wedge then the gap is 10 so you need a hypothetical 49degree wedge. Personally I've not seen one of those but I'm sure their available. If not either putting in a 48 or 50 degree wedge would not be the end of the world, or you could get one of them bent. But remember bending a club also changes not only the bounce of the club but also adds onset or off set to the club which can completely change how a club plays. Sometimes your better off with the slightly wrong angle on a club you like rather than bending it and finding you don't like it any more.

Regards
Ian

derra

Zak Flaps wrote: »

Hi. 24 handicap golfer here.

Want to but some new wedges. My pitching wedge is 44 degrees.
Should I go for a GW of 49, SW 54, LW 59 ? (5 degrees difference between each)

OR

Should I go for a GW 50, SW 56, LW 62 ? (6 degrees difference between each)

I am leaning more towards option 1.
If that's the right option, would that mean I'd have to get a 58 or 60 bent into a 59, or do 59's exist?

Zak.

Take it you got your Cobra s9's then Zak?
Wrote a similar thread a while back as was in same situation as yourself.
Ended up getting the S9 49* Gap wedge and 58* MD Norman Drew wedge.

Did you not get a SW in the set you got?

GreeBo

BoardsMember wrote: »

I think what people are saying is that if you are playing off 24 handicap it wont make a hell of a lot of difference if there is 5 degrees or 6 degrees between each of your short irons. As Osgood mentions, you need to be sure there is enough bounce on the SW, that's the most important thing.

At the risk of setting the cat amongst the pidgeons, the guys I play with who are playing golf off twenty-something would not benefit from having 4 wedges in the bag at all, they would benefit much more from having an extra utility club or something of that nature.

Maybe I'm being too old school, hopefully not handicap snob too, but having four wedges in the bag is something the pros and lower handicappers have to ensure that they can control distance perfectly, being able to hit every yardage on the money from inside 130 yards or so. Unless you are hitting the ball very well, and consistently the same distance, I think you are wasting your time/moeny putting four wedges in the bag.

Or, as soundsham put it, Overkill!!

+1000

With the greatest of respect, you are not off 24 because you are missing some wedges from your set.

Zak Flaps

DonkeyPokerTour wrote: »

Zak

If you look back at the past your PW would have had a 9 on it a few years ago. Just in order for people to think "these clubs are great, look at how far they go" clubs gradually got stronger and stronger. That's why today people are struggling to hit 4 and 5 irons where in the past it was 3 and 4 irons because the lofts of modern 4 and 5's are the same as the old 3 and 4 irons.

I definitely would not recommend going any more than 60 degrees with the lob wedge its not really needed.

Regards
Ian

Cheers Ian.
Yeah, my clubs have pretty strong lofts, and I do struggle with the likes of a 4 iron.
I wouldn't go any further than a 60 degree wedge. I'm using one at the moment that someone kindly lent me, and that loft is fine for me.

derra wrote: »

Take it you got your Cobra s9's then Zak?
Wrote a similar thread a while back as was in same situation as yourself.
Ended up getting the S9 49* Gap wedge and 58* MD Norman Drew wedge.

Did you not get a SW in the set you got?

Hi Derra.
Yes you guessed correctly.
I got some S9s just recently. Got them second hand but unfortunately, the guy didn't have a SW.
I was looking at Golfbidder.co.uk last night and spotted a Cobra S9 gap wedge so I might buy that. I emailed them to ask if it was 49 degrees as most of the S9 GWs seem to be. Awaiting reply.
If so, I will probably purchase it.

GreeBo wrote: »

+1000

With the greatest of respect, you are not off 24 because you are missing some wedges from your set.

Hi Greebo.
You are correct in what you say.
I recently bought some Cobra S9s to replace my prehistoric "Heritage" irons but no SW was included. They are a great improvement on my old clubs and I'm hitting the ball much better. But I'm stuck with my old SW and a borrowed LW (which I want to return).
So I needed to get some new wedges.
Was just curious as to the approach I should take.
As my PW has such a strong loft (44) and the fact that I hit the 60 degree lob wedge pretty well, i thought it was too big a gap for just one more wedge.
As I said previously, it's probably the strongest part of my game. So I didn't think It would be a waste of time having the extra wedge. Perhaps I'm wrong though.

DonkeyPokerTour

BoardsMember wrote: »

I think what people are saying is that if you are playing off 24 handicap it wont make a hell of a lot of difference if there is 5 degrees or 6 degrees between each of your short irons. As Osgood mentions, you need to be sure there is enough bounce on the SW, that's the most important thing.

At the risk of setting the cat amongst the pidgeons, the guys I play with who are playing golf off twenty-something would not benefit from having 4 wedges in the bag at all, they would benefit much more from having an extra utility club or something of that nature.

Maybe I'm being too old school, hopefully not handicap snob too, but having four wedges in the bag is something the pros and lower handicappers have to ensure that they can control distance perfectly, being able to hit every yardage on the money from inside 130 yards or so. Unless you are hitting the ball very well, and consistently the same distance, I think you are wasting your time/moeny putting four wedges in the bag.

Or, as soundsham put it, Overkill!!

Got to say I disagree with that completely. Say he adds a 2iron hybrid to the bag which he can hit lets say 230yards but not consistently straight or on target. Second shot to a long par four, he's 230yards out. He takes out the new 2iron hybrid and goes for it. Slices it into the bushes! Now he's 230yards out playing his forth. Now say instead he takes out say a 6 or 7 iron. Knocks it down the middle to about 80yards. Uses his wedge to get it on the green. He now has a putt for par instead of needing to hole out from 230yards for par.

If having 4 wedges in his bag means he's much more comfortable and more likely to make sound decisions i.e. laying up instead of going for it then he's better having 4 wedges. Remember in the past most players had "4 wedges" in their bag. They had a 9iron and PW, SW and LW. Now because of clubs getting stronger the old 9iron now has PW written on it. So having 4 wedges is normal!

Osgoodisgood

DonkeyPokerTour wrote: »

Got to say I disagree with that completely. Say he adds a 2iron hybrid to the bag which he can hit lets say 230yards but not consistently straight or on target. Second shot to a long par four, he's 230yards out. He takes out the new 2iron hybrid and goes for it. Slices it into the bushes! Now he's 230yards out playing his forth. Now say instead he takes out say a 6 or 7 iron. Knocks it down the middle to about 80yards. Uses his wedge to get it on the green. He now has a putt for par instead of needing to hole out from 230yards for par.

He plays off 24. I don't think hitting 16 degree hybrids from 230 yards is likely to be something he needs to worry about but taking a 7 iron from there is an odd piece of course management.

Remember in the past most players had "4 wedges" in their bag. They had a 9iron and PW, SW and LW. Now because of clubs getting stronger the old 9iron now has PW written on it. So having 4 wedges is normal!

In "The Past" most players carried what we would now consider to be 3 wedges. The lob wedge (the 60+ degree kind anyway) is a relatively new option and is of questionable merit in most bags.

DonkeyPokerTour

Osgoodisgood wrote: »

He plays off 24. I don't think hitting 16 degree hybrids from 230 yards is likely to be something he needs to worry about but taking a 7 iron from there is an odd piece of course management.

At the risk of going off topic could you expand further on this? Why would a 7iron be a bad decision here? lay up to 80yards which could be his favourite wedge distance and then hit a full wedge. Odd course management?

Osgoodisgood wrote: »

In "The Past" most players carried what we would now consider to be 3 wedges. The lob wedge (the 60+ degree kind anyway) is a relatively new option and is of questionable merit in most bags.

Well Lob wedges have been fairly common since the Ping Eye 2 range which was released in 1982, and the square groved version was released in 85 so thats over 25years ago. So I wouldn't say its a relatively new option.

Russman

I think he meant its a fairly new option for the masses. Broadly speaking not many people had lob wedges until maybe 10 years ago or less. They were seen as a club for the pros who play on courses set up in such a way as to make the lob wedge a big help.

IMHO I think a lob wedge is unnecessary for most amateurs most of the time. Learn how to use a 56 deg SW properly and you'll rarely need a lob wedge - only my opinion, I'm not criticising anyone who has one

derra

Zak Flaps wrote: »

Cheers Ian.

Hi Derra.
Yes you guessed correctly.
I got some S9s just recently. Got them second hand but unfortunately, the guy didn't have a SW.
I was looking at Golfbidder.co.uk last night and spotted a Cobra S9 gap wedge so I might buy that. I emailed them to ask if it was 49 degrees as most of the S9 GWs seem to be. Awaiting reply.
If so, I will probably purchase it.

Good stuff and best of luck with them.
Looked at the Gap wedges on Golfbidder and they would definitely be 49* so that's a start having a gap wedge in the bag same as the rest of your clubs.

The SW is a nice club too and easy to use in the bunkers so maybe have a look at picking one up on Ebay.

As i mentioned, i did get a MD 58* and is also a great club but took me a while getting used to having all these wedges tbh.(pw,gw,sw,58) and still getting used to it as handicap goes down you really have to get club selection right to get close to pin around the greens and approaching.

Probably could of done without the 58* adding to the confusion but mainly use that now when conditions are right for it.

BoardsMember

DonkeyPokerTour wrote: »

Got to say I disagree with that completely. Say he adds a 2iron hybrid to the bag which he can hit lets say 230yards but not consistently straight or on target. Second shot to a long par four, he's 230yards out. He takes out the new 2iron hybrid and goes for it. Slices it into the bushes! Now he's 230yards out playing his forth. Now say instead he takes out say a 6 or 7 iron. Knocks it down the middle to about 80yards. Uses his wedge to get it on the green. He now has a putt for par instead of needing to hole out from 230yards for par.

If having 4 wedges in his bag means he's much more comfortable and more likely to make sound decisions i.e. laying up instead of going for it then he's better having 4 wedges. Remember in the past most players had "4 wedges" in their bag. They had a 9iron and PW, SW and LW. Now because of clubs getting stronger the old 9iron now has PW written on it. So having 4 wedges is normal!

We'll have to agree to disagree I suppose. Bottom line is a 24 handicapper needs to improve mechanics, having 4 wedges or more is not relevant at all, to start with, there is no way they are deliovering the club head with the same loft every time they hit the wedge, so it doesnt matter.

And even thinking about whether to have 5 degrees between each wedge rather than four or six suggests that too much emphasis is being placed on the equipment. My first set of clubs I played golf with for ten years, they were very average clubs to start with, £150 or so for the lot, and I got down to 12 handicap with them. I know this is a bit like "I used to walk to school in bare feet" type thing, but you get my point maybe. The advanced equipment is all well and good, but there is something pretty fundamentally wrong with the idea of agonising over the minutiae of degrees on wedges, rather than fixing your swing! Just an opinion of course.

LostPassword

I think it's reasonable for a high-handicapper to have both a gap wedge and a lob wedge in the bag. Lots of courses nowadays have elevated greens and when shooting on to them, the greater the loft on the club, the easier the shot (as long as you can hit it vaguely reliably, of course - few high-handicappers can hit a 64 degree wedge close to reliably). With modern PWs being 45-46 degrees and sand-wedges being 54-56 degrees, that is a reasonably serious distance gap, even for high handicappers, who tend to be more reliable hitters of these clubs than they are for low irons or woods. That means lots of situations where you need to decide whether to hit a 'soft' pw or a hard sw into a green and these shots are generally much easier to duff than full swings. Having four wedges in the bag means that you're much more likely to be able to take a full, normal swing on whatever approach you have.

kagni

BoardsMember wrote: »

. . . there is something pretty fundamentally wrong with the idea of agonising over the minutiae of degrees on wedges, rather than fixing your swing!

But it's not an option of - fixing his swing OR getting new wedges.
Where did the OP say he wasn't going to bother working on fixing his swing when he got new wedges? He's spending some money on new clubs and wants to do his best to make sure he gets the right ones what's the problem with that?

I have the same Cobra S9 irons 5-PW and carry two other wedges 53* & 58*.
I find it enough for me. But I have room for another club so if I was to buy again I would probably get three wedges (maybe 51, 56 & 60).
I would recommend trying them out before you buy if possible. I find the cavity back style wedges go a bit shorter than the equvalent loft on a blade style wedge, I reckon that the 49* S9 gap wedge might only go as far as a 51* blade style wedge.

BoardsMember

kagni wrote: »

But it's not an option of - fixing his swing OR getting new wedges.

Fair point. I just cant get my head around someone playing off 24 thinking about this kind of stuff.

Osgoodisgood

DonkeyPokerTour wrote: »

At the risk of going off topic could you expand further on this? Why would a 7iron be a bad decision here? lay up to 80yards which could be his favourite wedge distance and then hit a full wedge. Odd course management?

Obvously it depends on the circumstances, water in front etc, but in general I would encourage him to pull out the 3wood (or whatever his fairway weapon of choice is) and learn how to get it on or near the green. If you're thinking that there'll be times that he hits it 20 yards or jams it up a cow's arse in a neighbouring field you'd be right, but unless he tries how else will he improve? And my guess is that this particular 24 handicapper is enthusiastic about improving his game. But it's up to him and it is off topic.

Zak Flaps

derra wrote: »

The SW is a nice club too and easy to use in the bunkers so maybe have a look at picking one up on Ebay.

cheers derra, i'll keep a look out on ebay for the SW.

BoardsMember wrote: »

there is something pretty fundamentally wrong with the idea of agonising over the minutiae of degrees on wedges, rather than fixing your swing!

Where did you get the impression that I was agonising over this? I merely asked for some advice.

LostPassword wrote: »

I think it's reasonable for a high-handicapper to have both a gap wedge and a lob wedge in the bag.

few high-handicappers can hit a 64 degree wedge close to reliably

With modern PWs being 45-46 degrees and sand-wedges being 54-56 degrees, that is a reasonably serious distance gap, even for high handicappers, who tend to be more reliable hitters of these clubs than they are for low irons or woods. That means lots of situations where you need to decide whether to hit a 'soft' pw or a hard sw into a green and these shots are generally much easier to duff than full swings. Having four wedges in the bag means that you're much more likely to be able to take a full, normal swing on whatever approach you have.

cheers lostpassword...

i do prefer to hit a wedge at or near my full swing, as you say, i'm less likely to duff when this is the case...

( don't worry, i won't be going near any 64 degree wedges )

kagni wrote: »

But it's not an option of - fixing his swing OR getting new wedges.
Where did the OP say he wasn't going to bother working on fixing his swing when he got new wedges? He's spending some money on new clubs and wants to do his best to make sure he gets the right ones what's the problem with that?

I have the same Cobra S9 irons 5-PW and carry two other wedges 53* & 58*.
I find it enough for me. But I have room for another club so if I was to buy again I would probably get three wedges (maybe 51, 56 & 60).
I would recommend trying them out before you buy if possible. I find the cavity back style wedges go a bit shorter than the equvalent loft on a blade style wedge, I reckon that the 49* S9 gap wedge might only go as far as a 51* blade style wedge.

thanks kagni.
you seem to be happy with your 3 wedges? but i get the impression that you may add a forth down the line? Meaning you may have to buy in fact 3 more wedges? (51,56,60)
So would it make more sense for me to have the 4 now, and be done with it?

BoardsMember wrote: »

Fair point. I just cant get my head around someone playing off 24 thinking about this kind of stuff.

To be honest, I'm only guessing my handicap is 24...it wouldn't be far off it...i usually shoot in the 90s...
but my wedge play is usually very good....i can hit most of my irons well...
i usually shoot in the 90s because i tend to drive the ball into trees, out of bounds etc...i'm working hard on trying to fix that!!!
i need to get wedges for reasons i've mentioned earlier, just wanted to get the right ones now,and be done with it, rather than getting any old ones and having to buy again later on when i improve further...

Osgoodisgood wrote: »

And my guess is that this particular 24 handicapper is enthusiastic about improving his game.

Very enthusiastic at the moment!!! Loving it!!
Cheers Osgoodisgood.