Buddhism and Eckharte Tolle

Scanlas The 2nd

I'm curious, If you follow and live by the teachings of Eckharte Tolle such as described in "The Power of Now" and "A New Earth" are you essentially a Buddhist.

It seems so similar, Eckhart Tolle just like the Dalai Lama don't believe in a God.

[-0-]

In my opinion, Eckhart Tolle is a bit of a con artist and has invented a sort of "pseudo Buddhist philosophy" and is profiting from it with help from the likes of Oprah.

Scanlas The 2nd

[-0-] wrote: »

In my opinion, Eckhart Tolle is a bit of a con artist and has invented a sort of "pseudo Buddhist philosophy" and is profiting from it with help from the likes of Oprah.

In what way is he conning people?

I'm more at peace, happier and full of joy than ever since reading his work. No other literature has had such a profound effect on me. The world is a fun, light place for me now whereas before I was carrying with me anxiety almost all the time.

wylo

Eckhart Tolle is not a con artist, the problem is he is not teaching people how to drop the 'self', hes just telling people to live in the now. Thats fairly useless if you still believe in a self, If anyone needs a hand achieving the true clarity he sees, i.e. the real world, not the one being smothered by the self, I can show you somewhere. Within 2 weeks of trying I managed it, I may have been lucky though but with the correct approach you dont need meditation or any of that crap.
But if your not willing to accept that there is no such thing as a 'self' then you'll be a tough nut to crack.

.same.

The Power of Now has had very positive effect on my life I paid 12euros for it a few years ago and still to this day pick it up. Even if Eckhart Tolle lived and acted like Muammar Gaddafi it wouldn't change the fact that his teaching were of great benefit to me, so for me it was the best 12 quid i've ever spent. I never really felt the need to know what the guy is like nor the need to know what he does with his money, thats if he has any.

Can someone explain why it is they feel ET is a conman? also I've never watched the Oprah show, but what has this woman being a fan of his work got to do with anything?

Scanlas The 2nd

wylo wrote: »

Eckhart Tolle is not a con artist, the problem is he is not teaching people how to drop the 'self', hes just telling people to live in the now. Thats fairly useless if you still believe in a self, If anyone needs a hand achieving the true clarity he sees, i.e. the real world, not the one being smothered by the self, I can show you somewhere. Within 2 weeks of trying I managed it, I may have been lucky though but with the correct approach you dont need meditation or any of that crap.
But if your not willing to accept that there is no such thing as a 'self' then you'll be a tough nut to crack.

The illusion of the "self" pretty much makes up the entire book "A New Earth", which is I feel his best book, even better than "The Power of Now".

wylo

ok Ill be the first to admit that I have only read some of his stuff and ive only read a few bits from that book,so I am glad hes talking about that, but I hope in that book he is also talking about how to drop that sense of self, I mean in as practical way as possible.

Hookah

[-0-] wrote: »

In my opinion, Eckhart Tolle is a bit of a con artist and has invented a sort of "pseudo Buddhist philosophy" and is profiting from it with help from the likes of Oprah.

How is he conning people?

The Power of Now is the best, and easiest to understand, book I've read on the nature of the ego, and how to begin to negate it.

Where is the con artistry?

Scanlas The 2nd

wylo wrote: »

ok Ill be the first to admit that I have only read some of his stuff and ive only read a few bits from that book,so I am glad hes talking about that, but I hope in that book he is also talking about how to drop that sense of self, I mean in as practical way as possible.

"A New Earth" is much more practical than "The Power of Now" IMO. He gives concrete examples of situations where the ego controls you and causes you suffering. By far my favourite book I've ever read. Must have read it at least 4 times now.

mccoist

mr o i just cannot understand your logic
where i the con
i read tolle both books
and they have helped me tremendously
i did not buy either book they were presents

mccoist

i agree with scanlas on the point that tolles books are influenced by buddhist teachings
i have since moved on and i now attend a buddhist teaching and meditation class in limerick regualary

roosh

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

I'm curious, If you follow and live by the teachings of Eckharte Tolle such as described in "The Power of Now" and "A New Earth" are you essentially a Buddhist.

It seems so similar, Eckhart Tolle just like the Dalai Lama don't believe in a God.

Apologies for being pedantic, but it may be worth distinguishing: whether following the teachings of Tolle in the two books mentioned above, makes you a Buddhist; or whether Tolle's teachings are similar to Buddhist teachings?

What makes someone a Buddhist is tricky question, with a range of different answers; are Tolle's teachings similar to Buddhist teachings? I my relatively uneducated opinion, I would say yes, there are great similarities between Tolle's teachings and some Buddhist teachings - but not all. I may be wrong in saying that Tolle's teachings are somewhat influenced by Buddhism - I know he references Buddhism in "the Power of Now" (can't remember if he does likewise in "a New Earth").

Saying that however, I think that Buddhist teachings are probably a lot more broad ranging, and there is, I think, more to them than is encompassed in those two books by Tolle. Buddhist teachings outline a wide range of practices, including a wide range of meditation practices, which help to cultivate the mind-states that Tolle refers to. Mind you, I have only read those two books by Tolle, and started reading "practising the power of now" and "Stillness Speaks" - I haven't seen many of his talks, so he may go into more depth in those.

It was actually "the Power of Now" that really awoke an interest in spirituality for me, and ultimately lead me to explore Buddhism more. Personally I think it is a great starting point for exploring sprituality, but there is so much (and nothing at all!) to spirituality that I personally don't think that Tolle encompasses it all.


With regard to the issue of God, I wouldn't say that Tolle doesn't believe in a God, rather that he has developed an understanding of what God actually is

When you say Being, are you talking about God? If you are, then why don't you say it?

The word God has become empty of meaning through thousands of years of misuse. I use it sometimes, but I do so sparingly. By misuse, I mean that people who have never even glimpsed the realm of the sacred, the infinite vastness behind that word, use it with great conviction, as if they knew what they are talking about. Or they argue against it, as if they knew what it is that they are denying

Power of Now quotes

He goes on to say, essentially, that "God" is "being" but niether word captures the true essence or nature of what they attempt to describe; "being" however doesn't have the same connotations for some people that "God" does.

I think that is a concept that even the Dalai Lama could ascribe to, as well as many Hindus, Sufis, Kabbalists, and probably mystic or gnostic Chrisitans.

Ambersky

The lack of acknowledgement of his sources is a common critique of Toles writing this is not the first time it has come up.
Tolle says that he has personal experience of all his teachings. He says his book “is not derived from external sources, but from the one true Source within, so it contains no theory or speculation. I speak from inner experience.”
His work doesnt feel or reason like the kind of spirituality I want to be part of however I acknowledge he is hugely popular. In fact thats part of the problem for me, it feels like the cult of Tole and I havent heard enough testing or teasing out of his theories.
Heres some writing on that kind of questioning.
http://communities.canada.com/vancouversun/blogs/thesearch/archive/2008/02/11/eckhart-tolle-has-insights-but-not-the-answer.aspx
From. Eckhart Tolle has insights but not The Answer by Douglas Todd

Is he worth studying?
Tolle finds insightful ways to blend eastern and western traditions in a non-sectarian manner. He is a smart, gracious person with an often-eloquent way of expression.
His spiritual outlook has become more complex since The Power of Now, when he dismissed external reality as an illusion and made it sound as if "living in the now" was a panacea for all the world's problems.
His emphasis on being present in the moment has merit in hyper-productive North America. Spiritual teachers have long said people can become trapped in the habits of their past and in anxiety about the future.
There is also something to Tolle's plea to stop exalting our egos. Obsession with fame, power and feeling superior, he rightly says, causes much of the world's misery.
More recently Tolle has helpfully placed more emphasis on the value of "enthusiasm," which to me is similar to Henri Bergson's crucial élan vital.

However, respectfully, I have some concerns.
For one, I wish spiritual teachers like Tolle, whose publicists make much of him not following one religion, would more often credit their original sources, which often include big names from so-called organized religions.

And while I appreciate the way Tolle stresses "being" (a concept developed by the German philosopher Martin Heidigger), I think it's more valuable to think of oneself in a process of "becoming." Humans, and nature, are called by life toward the future. Tolle doesn't articulate how practising attentiveness means being receptive to how each moment offers possibilities for the next.

Tolle claims Jesus talked about the "kingdom of heaven" already being on Earth, to be experienced now. Which is true. But Tolle ignores Jesus also taught about how the "kingdom of heaven" is yet to be fully realized, that it also beckons us forward to the future.
In addition, Tolle believes outer realities -- including politics, war, poverty and even the climate -- will magically be transformed when individuals change their inner consciousness. This may be true, but only to an extent.
In my conversation with Tolle last week he acknowledged he has no "strategy" for how societal change will take place. He doesn't focus on politics.

In contrast, I'm glad Martin Luther King and other reformers have engaged the world, that they had strategies.
Tolle takes a monastic approach to life, which is fine. But being a hermit doesn't always jibe with practicalities -- paying the mortgage, running the soccer practice, adapting institutions. People with healthy egos who are not narcissistic are versatile, often the best at creatively navigating real-world challenges.

Finally, Tolle uses an unfortunate closed argument when he states in A New Earth: "This book is about you. It will change your state of consciousness or it will be meaningless. It can only awaken those who are ready."
The implication is that those who have criticisms of his work are "not ready" for awakening, his word for enlightenment. That's convenient -- and a tad, dare I say, egocentric.

Sometimes I sense Tolle, despite his humble demeanour, truly believes he has The Answer.
But "awakening" is not the kind of thing that comes out of a Crackerjack box, or through reading one man's books. It requires work, practice, grace and, often, the discipline of community.

Tolle is stimulating. But by his link with Winfrey he has lucked upon much more fame than many profound contemplatives and spiritual guides, who deserve checking out as much as him.
From Buddhism they include: Jon Cabot-Zinn, Jack Kornfield and Thich Nhat Hanh. From Christianity they include: Thomas Merton, Thomas Keating and B.C.'s Cynthia Bourgeault.
For that matter, another wise man worth studying is the 13th-century Christian mystic after whom Tolle named himself, Meister Eckhart

Scanlas The 2nd

Ambersky wrote: »

The lack of acknowledgement of his sources is a common critique of Toles writing this is not the first time it has come up.
Tolle says that he has personal experience of all his teachings. He says his book “is not derived from external sources, but from the one true Source within, so it contains no theory or speculation. I speak from inner experience.”
His work doesnt feel or reason like the kind of spirituality I want to be part of however I acknowledge he is hugely popular. In fact thats part of the problem for me, it feels like the cult of Tole and I havent heard enough testing or teasing out of his theories.
Heres some writing on that kind of questioning.
http://communities.canada.com/vancouversun/blogs/thesearch/archive/2008/02/11/eckhart-tolle-has-insights-but-not-the-answer.aspx
From. Eckhart Tolle has insights but not The Answer by Douglas Todd

Maybe you aren't ready to be awakened as Tolle said?

The only answer is there is no answer. Just be happy now. Too much thought causes suffering and misery.

Ambersky

Thats the argument Douglas Todd mentioned, that of a closed argument "your just not ready for it" as a way of dismissing those who argue against ones theories.

Finally, Tolle uses an unfortunate closed argument when he states in A New Earth: "This book is about you. It will change your state of consciousness or it will be meaningless. It can only awaken those who are ready."
The implication is that those who have criticisms of his work are "not ready" for awakening, his word for enlightenment. That's convenient -- and a tad, dare I say, egocentric..

Tole is not the only one to use this closed argument as it is popular in discussions involving criticisms of New Age spirituality.
I find this kind argument disturbing, it is manipulative and intentionally circular in my opinion.
It also dismisses the value of discernment.
The criticisms Todd has of Toles teachings are not just ones of semantics, they are about the implications of his teachings.
Todd is arguing that the implications of Toles teachings, the ignoring of politics etc. could be the ignoring of the suffering of others.

I would prefer and do try to live by

Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.
Buddha

limra

oh Eckharte, that old shanachie!

wylo

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

"A New Earth" is much more practical than "The Power of Now" IMO. He gives concrete examples of situations where the ego controls you and causes you suffering. By far my favourite book I've ever read. Must have read it at least 4 times now.

Sorry just saw this now, Im going to check it out , im nearly finished Power of Now.

regarding the other post about Tolle being egocentric because he mentions his critics 'aren't ready'.
The problem here lies in the fact that when someone no longer believes in the ego, when they can no longer see it because it was always an illusion they stop caring about whether they come across egotistical or not. This in turn can often make someone like Tolle seem that way , when in truth hes probably speaking fact. Having a solid base of reality behind you means you dont care, its in fact the other persons ego that has taken the blow (in this case his critics).

[-0-]

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

In what way is he conning people?

He has repackaged Buddhism and created his own philosophy, taking out some of the important aspects of it. None of his ideas are new, or even his own. It is a western bastardized version of Buddhism, and he is only doing it to line his own pockets.

Scanlas The 2nd

[-0-] wrote: »

He has repackaged Buddhism and created his own philosophy, taking out some of the important aspects of it. None of his ideas are new, or even his own. It is a western bastardized version of Buddhism, and he is only doing it to line his own pockets.

How are you so certain of this? Did he tell you.

He doesn't claim the ideas are originally his. In his books he references people from the past who had similar insight into presence and the ego. His work transformed the lives of people all around including mine. He deserves every penny he gets.

mccoist

i agree with scanlas
A NEW EARTH is special book
taking old ideas and explaining them in simple terms
i read the book at least 4 times
will always refer to book when i need apickup
take care all

stomprockin

Does Eckhart Tolle teach Buddhism? I can't comment on the guy as i have not read any of his books, but i have never come across him on study's.

By reading this thread this came to mind.

Summarised, the Buddha said:"Do not believe a spiritual teaching just because:

1. it is repeatedly recited,
2. it is written in a scripture,
3. it was handed from guru to disciple,
4. everyone around you believes it,
5. it has supernatural qualities,
6. it fits my beliefs anyway,
7. it sounds rational to me,
8. it is taught by a respectable person,
9. it was said to be the truth by the teacher,
10. one must defend it or fight for it.
However, only when it agrees with your experience and reason, and when it is conducive to the good and gain of oneself and all others, then one should accept the teachings, and live up to them."

Navarth

Tolle is a con artist of the first water. Either that or a lunatic.

What devotees of Tolle fail to understand - either through narcissism or naivety - is that these sorts of 'teaching's have to be judged by the standards of every day life.

For instance, let's take this assertion from Scanlas that "Too much thought causes suffering and misery." This assertion is easily debunked by taking the common moral problem of the German infantryman on the Eastern Front during WW II. As a soldier, he is under orders to kill, maim and execute without question. He is in a barn where he is asked to machine gun Jewish prisoners. The question is, is it better for said soldier to think about the horrors of his action? Either at the time or in the future? Or is it better to become a numb, mindless killing machine, driving away the emotional consequences?

The consequences of following Tolle's insanity are - naturally - that the devotee switches off to the moral implications of his actions. In other words, the devotee ceases to be responsible. Indeed, he or she can NEVER be responsible or follow any moral code. As a result, the devotee ceases even to be able to adapt to the demands of everyday life because they lose their critical faculties. This in my honest opinion is the ultimate destination of followers of Tolle - the mental asylum. They are certainly an ongoing danger to those around them, just like the brainwashed members of any flaky cult. Kool aid "happiness" is no excuse.

Irish Musician

Navarth wrote: »

Tolle is a con artist of the first water. Either that or a lunatic.

What devotees of Tolle fail to understand - either through narcissism or naivety - is that these sorts of 'teaching's have to be judged by the standards of every day life.

For instance, let's take this assertion from Scanlas that "Too much thought causes suffering and misery." This assertion is easily debunked by taking the common moral problem of the German infantryman on the Eastern Front during WW II. As a soldier, he is under orders to kill, maim and execute without question. He is in a barn where he is asked to machine gun Jewish prisoners. The question is, is it better for said soldier to think about the horrors of his action? Either at the time or in the future? Or is it better to become a numb, mindless killing machine, driving away the emotional consequences?

The consequences of following Tolle's insanity are - naturally - that the devotee switches off to the moral implications of his actions. In other words, the devotee ceases to be responsible. Indeed, he or she can NEVER be responsible or follow any moral code. As a result, the devotee ceases even to be able to adapt to the demands of everyday life because they lose their critical faculties. This in my honest opinion is the ultimate destination of followers of Tolle - the mental asylum. They are certainly an ongoing danger to those around them, just like the brainwashed members of any flaky cult. Kool aid "happiness" is no excuse.

You make a valid point but I think Tolle is refering to the fact that our minds our constantly cluttered by thought. What we have to do tomorrow,something someone said about us,will I have enough money to pay bills etc.I am over simplifying a bit here but the point is that when we stop the noise in our heads which people do through Yoga and meditation, your head becomes clearer and you can use your head to deal with things as they arise and not worry about the past which is gone,or the future which never seems to go exactly as you see it in your head(well in mine anyway)and deal with it in the "now" as Tolle says it.

Buddhists say that you should give your total concentration to whatever it is you are doing at that moment,which IMHO is the same thing that Tolle teaches. I am not an expert on any of this, I read a few of Tolles books and some on Buddhism and he has definitely used some Buddhist teachings in his books. He has never claimed his stuff is original.

I think the story about the German soldier is a bit different. He has been conditioned to not think and follow orders as is his training. Meditation helps you to not think about everything in your head and concentrate on what is happening now and evaluate it according to your experience or morals.Thats how I see it.

Scanlas The 2nd

Tolle doesn't say that you shouldn't think, he says you should remove useless repetitive thought that is linked with the ego, this sort of thought feeds the ego which causes more pain.

Snake Pliisken

For a certain kind of character in this modern world Tolle's teaching can break through the walls that person has built up against anything that could be considered spiritual. I have my own spiritual heroes but twice now I've witnessed seismic changes of understanding(one in a friend I'd thought lost) in friends of mine brought on by Tolle's calming words.

I haven't read the physical book myself, I downloaded the audio version instead and managed not to finish it after finding myself retreading old ground but his clear, calming explanations of the mechanisms of the ego could be just what's needed for those certain kind of empiricists who need to know what's going on inside their heads and not some fluffy idea(or non-idea) completely removed from themselves that's dressed up as religion.

He's doing a good thing.