What craziness is this?? Bondholders?? Burned!!!??

thebigbiffo

Well, that's one protester catch phrase we can now resign to history...

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/noonan-secures-high-court-order-against-sub-ordinated-aib-bondholders-501311.html

Minister for Finance Michael Noonan has secured a High Court order burning the sub-ordinated bondholders at AIB.

Mr Noonan has welcomed the move, which he said would ensure that some of the taxpayers’ burden in recapitalising the bank is shared.

A similar move is planned for Bank of Ireland and Irish Life and Permanent.

AIB currently owes €2.5bn on subordinated bonds.

This evening, following a court ruling, the subordinated bondholders are to share some of the taxpayers' burden of bailing out the bank.

New terms are to be imposed on their securities: for example, bonds that were due to mature in 2017 won't now be realised until 2035.

It is hoped that these less favourable terms will tempt subordinated bondholders to sell the securities back to AIB at a significant discount, and allow the bank to raise capital.

hardCopy

Nice to see, how big is some though?

thebigbiffo

hardCopy wrote: »

Nice to see, how big is some though?

well that's the 2.5bn euro question. i cant imagine it'll be a huge amount in the grand scheme of things but it's good to see the f'uckers having to pay something...

on a side note...says a lot about the irish psyche (or possibly just the AH psyche) that this news has only 2-3 views and feck all responses even though it's been up 15 mins. you can't open a thread without hearing the cliche 'burn the bondholders' coming up...when it's done, nobody's really bothered!

silverspoon

Well, it's a start anyway. I get the impression that the current government are severely constrained by the EU and actions of the previous government, so while I'm not exactly unfurling the Fine Gael flag, I appreciate that this move, however little it means in actual burden-sharing, is at least some acknowledgement by the government that the status quo is not what they would ideally wish.

It's not worth much, but at least they're not thumbing their noses at us.

hardCopy

thebigbiffo wrote: »

well that's the 2.5bn euro question. i cant imagine it'll be a huge amount in the grand scheme of things but it's good to see the f'uckers having to pay something...

on a side note...says a lot about the irish psyche (or possibly just the AH psyche) that this news has only 2-3 views and feck all responses even though it's been up 15 mins. you can't open a thread without hearing the cliche 'burn the bondholders' coming up...when it's done, nobody's really bothered!

Yeah, I cross-posted it in the Irish Economy forum, should get more interest there

rc28

These are only subordinated (junior) bondholders that are taking a hit. This was always on the cards and the Credit Institutions Act 2010 already provided for this. The whole 'burn the bondholders' thing is about unsubordinated (senior) bondholders taking a haircut - they are a class of creditors that have been completely untouched so far because of pressure from Europe.

ejmaztec

thebigbiffo wrote: »

well that's the 2.5bn euro question. i cant imagine it'll be a huge amount in the grand scheme of things but it's good to see the f'uckers having to pay something...

on a side note...says a lot about the irish psyche (or possibly just the AH psyche) that this news has only 2-3 views and feck all responses even though it's been up 15 mins. you can't open a thread without hearing the cliche 'burn the bondholders' coming up...when it's done, nobody's really bothered!

Most of us have got a mental block about opening anything with Biffo on it. If you changed your name to Mother Teresa or something, you might have more success.

Mike 1972

ejmaztec wrote: »

Most of us have got a mental block about opening anything with Biffo on it. If you changed your name to Mother Teresa or something, you might have more success.

I wouldnt be so sure about that

Spacedog

I want to see bondholders burned. literally

and then pissed on a little.

AskMyChocolate

thebigbiffo wrote: »

Well, that's one protester catch phrase we can now resign to history...

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/noonan-secures-high-court-order-against-sub-ordinated-aib-bondholders-501311.html

Smoke and mirrors Biff. They're good at moving the goalposts. Kick someone hard enough in the bollix and you can convince them that a punch in the face is a good deal for which they should be grateful. Well done RTE. Don't forget to sell them some plasters though (at corner shop prices;)).

We are now supposed to be grateful, as a nation, for the fact that we shouldered only part of their "burden" (a losing docket after so many winners).

Let's hear it for Dermot Desmond,Peter Sutherland,Denis O'Brien, Sir Anthony O'Reilly, and Sarah Carey. They know their sheep.

That's why they're rich.

Maybe we deserve to be poor.:(

spider guardian

Spacedog wrote: »

I want to see bondholders burned. literally

and then pissed on a little.

One of them bondholders you want burned and pissed on could be your granny for all you know

strobe

for example, bonds that were due to mature in 2017 won't now be realised until 2035.

It is hoped that these less favourable terms will tempt subordinated bondholders to sell the securities back to AIB at a significant discount, and allow the bank to raise capital.

Not exactly burned now is it? You will have to wait a little longer to cash in, or you can cash in now and take a little less than you would have done if you waited. More, comfortably warmed by an open fire for a couple of minutes longer than you usually like, than burned.

EarlERizer

spider guardian wrote: »

One of them bondholders you want burned and pissed on could be your granny for all you know

If so, Serves her right the greedy bitch ...as the saying goes, "ya can pick your nose but ya cant pick your family"

_Cato_

Don't hold your breath.

It's a token gesture to keep the masses happy. Bondholders to pay 1b = Taxpayers 80 odd billion? Don't get carried away - read into it first, there's a lot that does not meet the eye.

Mike 1972

EarlERizer wrote: »

If so, Serves her right the greedy bitch ...as the saying goes, "ya can pick your nose but ya cant pick your family"

Have you ever put money into a private pension scheme ?

If so theres a fairly good chance that YOU are a bond holder.

Im not saying that burning (in the figurative sense) the bondholders is not a good idea but lets not get carried away here.

Cavehill Red

This is a little shot across the bows of the ECB and our European 'partners' to start playing nice. That's all.
One billion is better than no billion and it's great to see. But there's around 150 billion or so to go yet.
When we reach where Iceland are, then I'll be happy.
But for now, good work Noonan. Keep it up.