HSE Motorcycle?

goldie fish

Saw a photo on facepalm of a Harley Davidson with all the stripes and markings of an ambulance, Please tell me this is a bad April Fools joke? 11KE reg.
If Not...
Have the HSE gone nuts? Did they seek advice from any other agency that routinely uses motorcycles?

Or did they just watch "Easy Rider"?

maglite

Its an officers Bike for long rides into the sunset at the beach.

PCPhoto

they have emergency service personnell on motorbikes in england .... why not here.

maglite

PCPhoto wrote: »

why not here.

If the pictures I have seen are anything to go by, Not mine so not posting, its akin to a Harley Road King Classic.

http://www.automobilebestbuys.com/cycle/imagegd/imagevp.php?1411685511.jpg


EDIT: It's a "FLHTP ELECTRIC GLIDE POLICE DR"

source

I've seen the pics of the ambulance service bikes on another forum. It is true. They already have BMW's in use in Dublin, what made them buy these is beyond me.........Someone watching too much Chips me thinks.

Hooch

goldie fish wrote: »

Saw a photo on facepalm of a Harley Davidson with all the stripes and markings of an ambulance, Please tell me this is a bad April Fools joke? 11KE reg.
If Not...
Have the HSE gone nuts? Did they seek advice from any other agency that routinely uses motorcycles?

Or did they just watch "Easy Rider"?

Its a joke or a mock up.

HSE grounded all their bikes in....circa 2006 (ish??). 1200 Pans and deauvilles. HSE NAS still have them I believe, just not allowing them be used......why they arent in cities is beyond me.

goldie fish

maglite wrote: »

If the pictures I have seen are anything to go by, Not mine so not posting, its akin to a Harley Road King Classic.

http://www.automobilebestbuys.com/cycle/imagegd/imagevp.php?1411685511.jpg


EDIT: It's a "FLHTP ELECTRIC GLIDE POLICE DR"

Why god, WHY????

Probably costs twice as much as a Pan or BMW.

What next, Fire engines from Seagrave? Ambulances by Horton on a Ford F350 Chassis? Crown Victoria Patrol cars?(Actually that wouldn't be so bad).

I would love to know what genius decided this was a good idea, given the commonality of BMW/Honda or Yamaha everywhere else in europe. Also, what happened the HSE Deauvilles?

source

NGA wrote: »

Its a joke or a mock up.

HSE grounded all their bikes in....circa 2006 (ish??). 1200 Pans and deauvilles. HSE NAS still have them I believe, just not allowing them be used......why they arent in cities is beyond me.

The pics I've seen on another forum, which I won't post here as they're not my pics have 2 or 3 of these bikes in a HSE facility, so neither a joke nor a mock up it would appear.

Hooch

foinse wrote: »

The pics I've seen on another forum, which I won't post here as they're not my pics have 2 or 3 of these bikes in a HSE facility, so neither a joke nor a mock up it would appear.

Mother of god....what the hell are they thinking???

EDIT: Pm me linky???

source

Sent

drill

NGA wrote: »

Its a joke or a mock up.

HSE grounded all their bikes in....circa 2006 (ish??). 1200 Pans and deauvilles. HSE NAS still have them I believe, just not allowing them be used......why they arent in cities is beyond me.

Not true i'm afraid NGA, NAS bikes were never grounded and work out in South County Dublin( NAS 999 call taking area) for the last 8+ years.

They started with Deauvilles now have 3 BMWs and 3 Harleys (had a pan now retired )
In relation to city use They have been placed in Dublin City on a number of occations but as DFB are the primary 999 calltakers for the city area DFB refused the offer of a bike response dispatching a tender instead

They respond to all calls in South County Dublin, Wicklow,Kildare and anywhere requested by NAS control requests

Hooch

drill wrote: »

Not true i'm afraid NGA, NAS bikes were never grounded and work out in South County Dublin( NAS 999 call taking area) for the last 8+ years.

They started with Deauvilles now have 3 BMWs and 3 Harleys (had a pan now retired )
In relation to city use They have been placed in Dublin City on a number of occations but as DFB are the primary 999 calltakers for the city area DFB refused the offer of a bike response dispatching a tender instead

They respond to all calls in South County Dublin, Wicklow,Kildare and anywhere requested by NAS control requests

Jesus didnt know that. Thanks for clarifying and good to hear. My only experience of the HSE bikes was Galway in that time, only lasted a month or so and they stopped.

Should be in every city. Harleys are a joke though.....

ivabiggon

drill wrote: »

DFB refused the offer of a bike response dispatching a tender instead

not true, DFB will always take an ambulance when its offered by the HSE, only problem they are not always available or are too far away, the bikes aren't posted around the city centre anyway... and the DFB will send a fire truck even if they have receive an ambulance or a bike if the case requires it. there is not alot a biker can do on their own at a serious incident anyway.

drill

ivabiggon wrote: »

not true, DFB will always take an ambulance when its offered by the HSE, only problem they are not always available or are too far away

Must be new Policy cause when i worked in control DFB would Q a call for a tallaght ( waiting on one to clear ) rather then accept a ambulance from naas or Loughlinstown reason to far ?

ivabiggon wrote: »

the bikes aren't posted around the city centre anyway....

The bikes have spend regular stints in Dublin City but were not getting the call volume babis bike response was offered with and outlying station ambulance if an eras city amb was not available ,but were declined. they were only dispatched on city calls by eras control if an ERAS
city amb was attending. all other bike offers for the city were declined by DFB

ivabiggon wrote: »

there is not alot a biker can do on their own at a serious incident anyway.

One NAS Biker delivered TWINS in south County Dublin no so long ago while amb enroute I'D say that was serious enough


Back on Topic

not sure about the Harleys will have to wait and see how they get on !!!!

NGA- AFAIK the Pan from Galway ended up in Dublin for couple of years as it wasn't been used or grounded as you say

Am I missing something here?

Was there not a thread on here not too long ago, and posters were saying we should be using motorbikes? People were saying they'd be great for moving body parts about the place at speed and such (in the event of transplants, etc.)?


Wouldn't it also be somewhat handy for areas were Doctor on Call might be very busy?

For general moving of things from one place to another or bringing medication or such at speed or to attend to situations where an ambulance's ability to carry people would ultimately be wasted?

ivabiggon

drill wrote: »

Must be new Policy cause when i worked in control DFB would Q a call for a tallaght ( waiting on one to clear ) rather then accept a ambulance from naas or Loughlinstown reason to far ?



The bikes have spend regular stints in Dublin City but were not getting the call volume babis bike response was offered with and outlying station ambulance if an eras city amb was not available ,but were declined. they were only dispatched on city calls by eras control if an ERAS
city amb was attending. all other bike offers for the city were declined by DFB



One NAS Biker delivered TWINS in south County Dublin no so long ago while amb enroute I'D say that was serious enough


Back on Topic

not sure about the Harleys will have to wait and see how they get on !!!!

NGA- AFAIK the Pan from Galway ended up in Dublin for couple of years as it wasn't been used or grounded as you say

if you think sending an ambulance from the far end of the county is suppling an emergency service you should think again, when there is a fire tender with 5 paramedic within that area less than 5 mins away and delivering a baby is a wonderful experience, and i've delivered between 20/30 including 2 sets of twins in my 20 yr career it still is a naturally occurring event and not a serious one, it only get serious when there is a complication. now explain how a single practitioner would deal with two babies in respiratory arrest and deal with a panic strictened mother.
personally i think having an extra transport ambulance in your armory is better than having two bikers, taking into account all the restrictions that come with the bike been put on the road, weather, night time etc. and you know there are restrictions.

Bang Bang

I think the old debate of the DFB having five Paramedics on a fire tender so is a better response has been done to death on a lot of similar threads.
Having an additional ambulance in your fleet would be great, but it is another vehicle than can be delayed on long transports or delayed in hospitals. Just the same way a fire tender can be delayed at fires or entrapments.

This thread is about the HSE National Ambulance Service Motorcycle Response Unit.

The idea of single responders, ie; Motorcycles is to have a qualified responder responding to emergency calls. They are not the only responder, an ambulance is also responded, or indeed a fire tender as we know the delays ambulance crews suffer in some of Dublin's Emergency Departments.

MRU's (Motorcycle Response Units) are a big success in London and Sydney, so much so that both cities have in recent years expanded the size of those units.

The NAS MRU has been based in Dublin for almost eleven years now and the success of this service speaks for itself.
It has had numerous successful cardiac arrest resusitations, assisted in many baby deliveries and has brought relief and aid to thousands of people well before an ambulance or fire tender arrived.

Over 90% of the MRU calls are on scene in under the best international practice guidelines, many of these calls are under five minutes.

The bikes have been deployed numerous times around the city center but due to the way Dublin City calls are received (another debate which comes up often) the call volume was low.

Tango Alpha 51

The deauvilkes were decommissioned towards the end of last year. A bike shop in Dublin was advertising them for sale at the start of the year but the ad was subsequently withdrawn. The MRU has it's place in pre hospital care along with ambulances, cfr groups etc. As NGA has already pointed out, the concept of MRU's should be expanded to other cities where it would aid the necessity to meet the HIQA response times but as other posters have stated, it could also free up responding ambulances if they weren't needed.

Hooch

Bang Bang wrote: »

I think the old debate of the DFB having five Paramedics on a fire tender so is a better response has been done to death on a lot of similar threads.

MOD NOTE: Agreed, lets not get into the petty old arguement of my hose is bigger than your stretcher......(see what I did there??:D) Both services provide top class service to the communities in which they service......lets not loose sight that its all for the patients benefit.....not a services. Not aimed at any above poster but at everyone.

Personally, speaking from experience I have often waited for a ambulance at a scene for over 30mins only a few miles from one of the largest ambulance bases in the state. A Para on a bike (or indeed an AP on a bike) could hope between calls.....a first responder as such to the the pressure off.

goldie fish

Deleted User wrote: »

Am I missing something here?

Was there not a thread on here not too long ago, and posters were saying we should be using motorbikes? People were saying they'd be great for moving body parts about the place at speed and such (in the event of transplants, etc.)?


Wouldn't it also be somewhat handy for areas were Doctor on Call might be very busy?

For general moving of things from one place to another or bringing medication or such at speed or to attend to situations where an ambulance's ability to carry people would ultimately be wasted?

Motorbikes, yes, But the H-D is to motorcycling what a camper van is to sports cars.

goldie fish

foinse wrote: »

I've seen the pics of the ambulance service bikes on another forum. It is true. They already have BMW's in use in Dublin, what made them buy these is beyond me.........Someone watching too much Chips me thinks.

If only,
CHiPs used Kawasaki's and BMWs in the updated TV Movie.

Buffman

Harleys seem to be popular with some US police forces, so maybe the HSE hasn't gone too mad! I'd be interested to know how much they cost compared to the BMW's. Can more equipment be carried on them?

With the current budget trends, I wonder will we see the below hitting the streets soon?:D

goldie fish

Buffman wrote: »

Harleys seem to be popular with some US police forces, so maybe the HSE hasn't gone too mad! I'd be interested to know how much they cost compared to the BMW's. Can more equipment be carried on them?

With the current budget trends, I wonder will we see the below hitting the streets soon?

Why not? It wouldn't break down as often as a H-D

Buffman

goldie fish wrote: »

It wouldn't break down as often as a H-D

I suppose that depends on who's pedaling!:)

They would come in handy in the city center I suppose, I've often seen ambos inching along Henry St or Grafton St at less than walking pace on a busy day.

goldie fish

Also, bicycles are immune from all aspects of the RTA so they would not be delayed by things like traffic lights or one way streets.........


ahem

Buffman

Actually, forget about the bikes, I think these are the solution.:D

maglite

Irish Army have them, why not?

Dermot Illogical

Buffman wrote: »

Harleys seem to be popular with some US police forces, so maybe the HSE hasn't gone too mad! I'd be interested to know how much they cost compared to the BMW's. Can more equipment be carried on them?

I suspect some of the MRU people have done the Route 66 challenge for Temple St, come back with a Harley fetish and purchased accordingly..

Harleys are popular with US Police forces because they want to buy American, not because they are technically superior. They're inferior to most modern motorcycles, even BMWs... A harley is a "lifestyle" motorcycle with 1920's technology, unreliable and incapable of cornering at speeds over 10mph. I wouldn't trust one with so serious a task and firmly believe that anyone who buys one for emergency response purposes is indeed mad!

goldie fish

RT66 wrote: »

I suspect some of the MRU people have done the Route 66 challenge for Temple St, come back with a Harley fetish and purchased accordingly..

Harleys are popular with US Police forces because they want to buy American, not because they are technically superior. They're inferior to most modern motorcycles, even BMWs... A harley is a "lifestyle" motorcycle with 1920's technology, unreliable and incapable of cornering at speeds over 10mph. I wouldn't trust one with so serious a task and firmly believe that anyone who buys one for emergency response purposes is indeed mad!

Most US police forces have switched to BMW in the last few years.

who wants to spend the day listening to "potato-potato-potato-potato" all day?

paraletic

maglite wrote: »

Irish Army have them, why not?

they have the sense not to show their faces.

ivabiggon

goldie fish wrote: »

Most US police forces have switched to BMW in the last few years.

who wants to spend the day listening to "potato-potato-potato-potato" all day?

potato patato patatoe......whats that all about?

goldie fish

ivabiggon wrote: »

potato patato patatoe......whats that all about?

The harley engine rumble is quite unique. No other V Twin sounds like it(mostly because all the other factories tighten the nuts before the bike leaves the factory).
Say "Potato" over and over again and you'll sound the same.

ivabiggon

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwkcgIV30Ws&NR=1

can't get potato sound thing yet???? sorry

savagecabbages

Any images of these HSE bikes in the public domain??

I can understand some fo the merits fo the Harley, they are a large, stable bike capable of carrying extra equipment, which may be useful for theparamedic role. How much more useful than other bikes i dont know...

seanybiker

One of me friends uploaded this to his Facebook. Pointless

Had to remove pic because of whingeing

savagecabbages

Ha it actually looks kinda ridiculous with the tiny battenburg markings.
I was expecting a 'yellow/green' bike.

Makes me wonder about the vehicle procurement procedures for the HSE...

Back on topic, how would a Harley fare up to other alternatives, given its attributes/drawbacks?? Many Police forces in the states (and a few in Europe!!) still use them. THey can surely at least match anything in terms of carrying capacity, not so sure about outright speed though...

supermedic

The decision did not lie with anyone from the ambulance service it seems. The spec was drawn up and the process was handed over to corporate HSE for the tendering process. It would appear that all of the normal suppliers, bmw, honda, yamaha etc, were not interested in quoting for 3 bikes and would only tag them on to a much bigger order for the gardai , army etc... Harley came up with a cheaper price and were happy to bring in 3 from the US.... still look stupid, but thats the story behind the new bike..... as for there use in Dublin, lots of stuff on google with police bike in the usa doing some pretty funking stuff on similar bikes.

ivabiggon

seanybiker wrote: »

One of me friends uploaded this to his Facebook. Pointless

ah dear god.... that doesn't look the part at all. it like some biker enthusiast who was going to a Harley Davidson rally and decided to dress up their bike for a fun run for the day.:eek:
pimp my medic...

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTbaFSr7OIFgxxQUNZycWXgA-I4UEjzxhHV5biUTEslu9ileWqGjA

joegriffinjnr

I seen this is the flesh today strange looking beast alright. One seems to be based at Loughinstown Ambulance Stn.

Terrontress

ivabiggon wrote: »

ah dear god.... that doesn't look the part at all. it like some biker enthusiast who was going to a Harley Davidson rally and decided to dress up their bike for a fun run for the day.:eek:
pimp my medic...

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTbaFSr7OIFgxxQUNZycWXgA-I4UEjzxhHV5biUTEslu9ileWqGjA

You'd expect a bottle of JD in one panier and a shotgun in the other.

Speaking of which....will the size of the Harley be beneficial in terms of larger paniers / equipment stores and therefore maybe a Hog is exactly the sort of machinery that paramedics should be on!

goldie fish

Terrontress wrote: »

You'd expect a bottle of JD in one panier and a shotgun in the other.

Speaking of which....will the size of the Harley be beneficial in terms of larger paniers / equipment stores and therefore maybe a Hog is exactly the sort of machinery that paramedics should be on!

BMW/Pan/FJR would carry the same kit, and do so far more nimbly.

ivabiggon

http://www.resourcesforbears.com/NEWS/ARTICLES/V03A0019/biker_hughes_lrg.jpg

will they be getting all the accessories to go with it.....change of uniform perhaps....
maybe change the canteen in loughlinstown to something out of the blue oyster club!!!:P

sgt.bilko

I was having a look at one of the new harleys today and having a grand chat with the paramedic today.

I have to admit that I thought the HSE had gone mad when I saw them first but i'm informed that the Harleys turned out cheaper than the other bikes and apparently there's a buy back clause as well.

It is a nice piece of kit and i'm told that it handles more smoothly than the other manufacturers.

All in all, the lads on the bikes are happy with them and if they're cheaper then why all the fuss?

FGR

The one thing those bikes scream is 'comfort'. A little OT but have AGS bought any new bikes recently?

If so; are they sticking with Honda? Pan Europeans?

goldie fish

ForegoneReality wrote: »

The one thing those bikes scream is 'comfort'. A little OT but have AGS bought any new bikes recently?

If so; are they sticking with Honda? Pan Europeans?

Most recently, Yamaha FJR for traffic Corps, Honda Deauville for everything else. The New Pan european has been classed as unsuitable for police use following a number of high profile Fatalities by Police in the UK using them. All the UK Police Pan 1300s were sold to the civvy market.
BMW have not made the grade in a while either, mostly down to reliability and warranty "issues".

Corcioch

Financially it was a good deal for the HSE, there is an extended warranty and a buy back deal.

Practically it is daft imo . . . .far from ideal . .

Here's a few reasons why;

http://www.lasdhq.org/sites/motorcycle-test/2011.pdf

Capri

Briefly saw this 'machine' going by a gap in the traffic today and decided to check it out here. Found this on the HSE site

http://www.hse.ie/eng/services/Find_a_Service/ambulanceservice/news/investment.html

Press Release 10th April 2011

The HSE National Ambulance Service has taken delivery of a new fleet of 16 state of the art Rapid Response Vehicles representing an investment of approx €0.6 million in fleet replacement. The new fleet consists of 10 Ford Mondeo Estate cars, 3 Subaru Forester all wheel drive estate cars and 3 Harley Davidson Special Motorcycles.

Robert Morton, Director of the National Ambulance Service stated: “the new fleet will contribute to a significant step forward in the quality and safety of our services to patients and the safety of the working environment for our Paramedics and Advanced Paramedics”

All of these vehicles will be used as Rapid Response Vehicles in different parts of the country. Feedback from HSE Advanced Paramedics identified that some of the existing fleet needed improved equipment carrying capacity. The Ford Mondeo estate has that capacity.

Following the severe weather in 2010, the HSE reviewed its equipment requirements. That review identified that the HSE had sufficient numbers of traditional 4x4 vehicles providing sufficient capability for deep snow conditions.

The HSE considered various traction systems and each system considered would require significant expenditure on both equipment and training. The HSE bought Estate Vehicles with All Wheel Drive capacity to replace some existing vehicles. This provides 4x4 type capability in a vehicle that will be operated daily. The cost of the vehicles are similar to traditional 2 wheel drive Estate cars representing improvements in road safety in severe weather and off road conditions without any additional expenditure over and above normal fleet replacement.

As part of the NAS drive to improve road safety, the NAS has also taken delivery of three new purpose built Driver training Vehicles to support the national rollout of Driver training, initially for 180 new Student Paramedics.

The HSE will monitor the effectiveness of these vehicles based on staff feedback and fleet management processes. This review will inform future decisions on fleet replacement.

The NAS Leadership Team are currently considering a Fleet Allocation Plan based on the mileage, age and activity of current Rapid Response Vehicles. The new fleet will be operational at a number of Ambulance Stations around the country by the end of May 2011.”

Members of the public are welcome to arrange a visit to their nearest Ambulance Station to meet our Paramedics and Advanced Paramedics and see any new vehicles. Visits can be arranged by contacting the Operations Performance Manager at the nearest Area Ambulance Headquarters.




Last updated on: 24 / 06 / 2011

They don't explain the 'logic' behind the Harleys tho :D

scholar007

drill wrote: »

Must be new Policy cause when i worked in control DFB would Q a call for a tallaght ( waiting on one to clear ) rather then accept a ambulance from naas or Loughlinstown reason to far ?



The bikes have spend regular stints in Dublin City but were not getting the call volume babis bike response was offered with and outlying station ambulance if an eras city amb was not available ,but were declined. they were only dispatched on city calls by eras control if an ERAS
city amb was attending. all other bike offers for the city were declined by DFB



One NAS Biker delivered TWINS in south County Dublin no so long ago while amb enroute I'D say that was serious enough


Back on Topic

not sure about the Harleys will have to wait and see how they get on !!!!

NGA- AFAIK the Pan from Galway ended up in Dublin for couple of years as it wasn't been used or grounded as you say

So does that mean, its not stored under the stairs in Galway anymore?

Actual Paramedic

scholar007 wrote: »

So does that mean, its not stored under the stairs in Galway anymore?

Was used in the East NAS but has since been sold off.