corporal punishment

Sunnyisland

Taboo that is corporal punishment.Today it is a subject that is almost impossible to discuss in public, but it's not that long since corporal punishment was a routine part of life.I remember when it was still used in our schools and I & many others were often given the leather belt/cane/stick to belt some manners into us But do you think in today's very liberal society that maybe some sort of corporal punishment should be brought back and what benefits would you expect from such a punishment.

Hookah

It's an abomination and should have no place in any society. Not in public, nor in private.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Corporal punishment, another term for cowerdice.

A grown up heating a child? Seriously, think about it for a second.

It's a lazy way to correct the wrongs a child does.

The proper way, right way, takes time and effort and most parents don't have that time and/or effort to invest in their children.

cml387

You mean ... spanking?

Refugee from RealLife

I always wondered why it was always the corporal's that got punished and not the other ranks. I was young.

AckwelFoley

Any teacher puts his hand on our child i'll break it.

Discipline of a child is done at home. Its a full time job, but doesn't require force.

If it does, you're losing the battle.


And yes, i acknowledge the irony in the above statment

PeterIanStaker

Some parents should be slapped, not their kids.

Kids are a blank slate, a tabula rasa, but there are plenty of people out there who shouldn't be allowed look after a potted plant, let alone bring another life into the world.

Chaotic_Forces

I'm only 22 but in seconday school I'd have been fine seeing a few of the more "unruly little fu*kers that are complete scumbags" getting a few slaps. Wouldn't have bothered me none since I never really got into much trouble. Of course, people will say "oh no, don't hit the kids". So damn what, if they're acting like scumbags, treat them like such.

Course, I don't agree with a slap or two just for not knowing an answer or not having yuor homework done.

Refugee from RealLife

Kathryn Hollow Hyacinth wrote: »

Corporal punishment, another term for cowerdice.

A grown up heating a child? Seriously, think about it for a second.

It's a lazy way to correct the wrongs a child does.

The proper way, right way, takes time and effort and most parents don't have that time and/or effort to invest in their children.

I predict this post will get alot of "Thanks".

Wolfe Tone

Some little bastards need a good slap.

Celly Smunt

Supernanny tactics on kids make them into little fúckers a good slap sorts them out.

Sunnyisland

Well being a grandfather myself I be more inclined to give a consequence for being naughty than any physical punishment but this must be done from a very early age.Imo.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Kathryn Hollow Hyacinth wrote: »

Corporal punishment, another term for cowerdice.

A grown up heating a child? Seriously, think about it for a second.

It's a lazy way to correct the wrongs a child does.

The proper way, right way, takes time and effort and most parents don't have that time and/or effort to invest in their children.

pmcmahon wrote: »

Supernanny tactics on kids make them into little fúckers a good slap sorts them out.

Bingo.

AckwelFoley

When my grandfather was only 10, his mother died on Christmas day. He went to school after the break and on the first day back the christian brother beat him with a rod, because he didnt learn his homework over the Christmas break.

Needless to say his father, went into the school the next day dragged the brother out of the class and beat the snot out of him

An 'aul skelp is fine im sure, it never harmed me, and my mother used to hammer me, but my father never laid a hand on me, yet it was him i feared the most, not because of physical retribution, because i never wanted to disappoint him

Duckworth_Luas

As an 11 year old our Primary School teacher was having some difficulties in his private life, he decided to take it out on us boys by whacking us around if we couldn't spell triskaidekaphobia correctly.

Nothing in my life has ever made me as nervous as a Monday morning during that year. The teacher would pick one one student and quiz them on the reams of homework we would get over the weekend. He would try to slowly break them down so that they would make mistakes and then deserved a good beating. Those that could withstand the mental torture were also inflicted with a good beating.

Chaotic_Forces

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

As an 11 year old our Primary School teacher was having some difficulties in his private life, he decided to take it out on us boys by whacking us around if we couldn't spell triskaidekaphobia correctly.

Nothing in my life has ever made me as nervous as a Monday morning during that year. The teacher would pick one one student and quiz them on the reams of homework we would get over the weekend. He would try to slowly break them down so that they would make mistakes and then deserved a good beating. Those that could withstand the mental torture were also inflicted with a good beating.

That's a bit different, though. Like I said (and a few others), some kids honestly do deserve a few slaps. Now, sure, going overboard and just harming kids for the sake of it is wrong.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

That's a bit different, though. Like I said (and a few others), some kids honestly do deserve a few slaps. Now, sure, going overboard and just harming kids for the sake of it is wrong.

If we give a few slaps to a child who deserves it, can we give a few slaps to an adult who desrves?

Chaotic_Forces

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

If we give a few slaps to a child who deserves it, can we give a few slaps to an adult who desrves?

TBH, I'd skip that and just lock away the scumbag parents and their kids.

Savage Tyrant

My auld lad used to batter us. Never for no reason mind you, but when he did it was excessive. That does a child no good as it just made us more likely to misbehave outside the home while walking on eggshells inside it.
That being said a good slap should be an option for many kids. If done sparely, the threat alone should then act as the deterrent. But there's no point telling a child they'll get a slap if they've never experienced one.

Spudmonkey

I remember a teacher we had suffered a mental breakdown because of the abuse she got from some scumbags in our year. A few slaps would have sorted those bastards out and would have allowed the rest of us to get on with learning.

Beating for the sake of it, no place for it. Shouldn't be allowed go to the other extreme either however were these sorts rule the roost.

Chaotic_Forces

Spudmonkey wrote: »

I remember a teacher we had suffered a mental breakdown because of the abuse she got from some scumbags in our year. A few slaps would have sorted those bastards out and would have allowed the rest of us to get on with learning.

Beating for the sake of it, no place for it. Shouldn't be allowed go to the other extreme either however were these sorts rule the roost.

Same with a teacher in my school. She left and when asked about it we were told "I hope you (the headmaster was obviously directing it at the scumbags) feel proud of yourself for destroying her career before it started". Followed by him leaving the room and a burts of laughter and congratulations were shared amongst the scumbags.

karma_

Max Mosley would approve.

Spudmonkey

karma_ wrote: »

Max Mosley would approve.

Nein Nein Nein...

easyeason3

Got a fair few beatings as a kid, I probably deserved a slap on the arse alright but getting hit across the face/ head wasn't nice.

If I had kids myself then I'd try not to slap them but if it came to it a tap on the back of the hand or a tap on the arse isn't going to harm them.

pragmatic1

Hookah wrote: »

It's an abomination and should have no place in any society. Not in public, nor in private.

Not only that. It doesnt work.

pragmatic1

Used to get battered. Belts and all. Learned nothing. Its lazy parenting.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Spudmonkey wrote: »

I remember a teacher we had suffered a mental breakdown because of the abuse she got from some scumbags in our year. A few slaps would have sorted those bastards out and would have allowed the rest of us to get on with learning.

Beating for the sake of it, no place for it. Shouldn't be allowed go to the other extreme either however were these sorts rule the roost.

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Same with a teacher in my school. She left and when asked about it we were told "I hope you (the headmaster was obviously directing it at the scumbags) feel proud of yourself for destroying her career before it started". Followed by him leaving the room and a burts of laughter and congratulations were shared amongst the scumbags.

Do you really think that that course of action will hae asbolutely no consequences whatsoever? In today's litigious society? With the amount of violence going around? Seriously?

Scumbags do not think "oh, deary me, I've been hit, well that's gonna hae to toe the line now, better start studying so I can catch up!"

And before the knee-jerkers come out, I am not against this because of some weakly mispercieved do-gooder bleeding-heart bias, I am against the idea because it doesn't. Fvcking. Work.

whadabouchasir

As a teacher or a parent you have to ask yourself do you want to be respected or feared?Any good leader or manager will tell you that it is better to have respect than fear,it is however much harder to earn. As previous posters have said hitting children is the easy way out.And as other posters have also mentioned it doesn't work.

Having said that if you are dealing with "scumbags" that a good ole verbal bollicking should do the trick,they are after all only children.And well if it has worked for Alex Ferguson then who am I to disagree!

Chaotic_Forces

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Do you really think that that course of action will hae asbolutely no consequences whatsoever? In today's litigious society? With the amount of violence going around? Seriously?

Scumbags do not think "oh, deary me, I've been hit, well that's gonna hae to toe the line now, better start studying so I can catch up!"

And before the knee-jerkers come out, I am not against this because of some weakly mispercieved do-gooder bleeding-heart bias, I am against the idea because it doesn't. Fvcking. Work.

Scenario 1: You have a woman, aged 22 or so, a starting teacher. She is harrassed daily by the students. They are told "bad boys, bad! Now you go to detention!". They do not go, they laugh and ignore it. They won't get thrown out because it ruins the reputation of the school.
The harrassment continues, the teacher quits.

Scenario 2: Everytime they harrass her, they get slapped in the face (not by her, but by a fully grown man who can defend himself). They soon learn "harrassing her = me getting hit" and will stop.

Spudmonkey

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Do you really think that that course of action will hae asbolutely no consequences whatsoever? In today's litigious society? With the amount of violence going around? Seriously?

Scumbags do not think "oh, deary me, I've been hit, well that's gonna hae to toe the line now, better start studying so I can catch up!"

And before the knee-jerkers come out, I am not against this because of some weakly mispercieved do-gooder bleeding-heart bias, I am against the idea because it doesn't. Fvcking. Work.

Absolutely not. I think those few trouble makers should have been taken out. Possibly had some counselling to find the source of their anger before they were re-integrated with the rest of the student population. Yip that might work.

Dusty87

If a teacher hit my daughter, it would be me going to prison.

I do remember me grandfather telling me about getting a beating in school. He went home and told the parents, who gave him a beating for getting a beating

siniman

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

That's a bit different, though. Like I said (and a few others), some kids honestly do deserve a few slaps. Now, sure, going overboard and just harming kids for the sake of it is wrong.

But the difficulty is - and was - that if it is something that is tolerated in any form it is open to abuse by teachers. My father had a teacher who, when in a bad mood used to pick on a poor child with a stammer and who inevitably got a caning when they could not immediately answer whatever question.

Would also be worried that for older kids they would just punch back!

philologos

realies wrote: »

But do you think in today's very liberal society that maybe some sort of corporal punishment should be brought back and what benefits would you expect from such a punishment.

As far as I know it is entirely legal for parents to use corporal punishment on their children. I personally think that there is very little issue with it as long as it doesn't involve excessive force or leave bruising.

It is one means of punishment to be used amongst many, and more likely than not to be used as a last resort but this is not to say that it shouldn't ever be used?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Scenario 1: You have a woman, aged 22 or so, a starting teacher. She is harrassed daily by the students. They are told "bad boys, bad! Now you go to detention!". They do not go, they laugh and ignore it. They won't get thrown out because it ruins the reputation of the school.
The harrassment continues, the teacher quits.

Scenario 2: Everytime they harrass her, they get slapped in the face (not by her, but by a fully grown man who can defend himself). They soon learn "harrassing her = me getting hit" and will stop.

No, they don't. They either hit back, or wait for an oppertunity to hit back. Or probably target the teacher outside of school hours. As isaid, it doen't work and you haven#t thought through the consequences.

Spudmonkey wrote: »

Absolutely not. I think those few trouble makers should have been taken out. Possibly had some counselling to find the source of their anger before they were re-integrated with the rest of the student population. Yip that might work.

Obiously not! Why in the hell would you think it would??

siniman

If a teacher hit my daughter, it would be me going to prison.

I do remember me grandfather telling me about getting a beating in school. He went home and told the parents, who gave him a beating for getting a beating

.....

heard the same from my parents also! we have gone from too much respect for teachers to many students having too little.

Chaotic_Forces

siniman wrote: »

But the difficulty is - and was - that if it is something that is tolerated in any form it is open to abuse by teachers. My father had a teacher who, when in a bad mood used to pick on a poor child with a stammer and who inevitably got a caning when they could not immediately answer whatever question.

Would also be worried that for older kids they would just punch back!

But here's the problem, kids get away with murder nowadays.

I mean really, anyone who drove an employee to quit from harrassment would be fired. But the kids that do it (equivelent would be getting expelled), are told "bad, don't do it again". That's the funny thing, people complain about coporal punishment, we remove it and there is a worse change. So we then have these idiots who say "oh the kids don't mean bad, they need a friend, someone to talk to". They have their fu*king friends, the ones that join in on the harrassment, like a group of bullies and they get to laugh about how "they drove a teacher out of the school" and are considered heroes in the school.

Chaotic_Forces

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

No, they don't. They either hit back, or wait for an oppertunity to hit back. Or probably target the teacher outside of school hours. As isaid, it doen't work and you haven#t thought through the consequences./QUOTE]

Untill people grow uo and learn "lock the scumbags up" nothing will work.

siniman

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

But here's the problem, kids get away with murder nowadays.

I mean really, anyone who drove an employee to quit from harrassment would be fired. But the kids that do it (equivelent would be getting expelled), are told "bad, don't do it again". That's the funny thing, people complain about coporal punishment, we remove it and there is a worse change. So we then have these idiots who say "oh the kids don't mean bad, they need a friend, someone to talk to". They have their fu*king friends, the ones that join in on the harrassment, like a group of bullies and they get to laugh about how "they drove a teacher out of the school" and are considered heroes in the school.

I don't disagree with you re their behaviour - just think it is not the answer. i think the problem kids should be removed from the schools - i would send them into a - don't know what they are called but a military style school where there are relevant consequences for thier behaviour.

Spudmonkey

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Obiously not! Why in the hell would you think it would??

I dont.

I don't pretend to know what would work. What I do know however is that many of the current punishments or techniques are almost seen as a badge of honour by disruptive scumbags.

Spudmonkey

siniman wrote: »

don't know what they are called but a military style school where there are relevant consequences for thier behaviour.

Gentle motivation. I like it.

Chaotic_Forces

siniman wrote: »

I don't disagree with you re their behaviour - just think it is not the answer. i think the problem kids should be removed from the schools - i would send them into a - don't know what they are called but a military style school where there are relevant consequences for thier behaviour.

I'd actually donate for a place like that. I'd say a lot of people would.
Obviously not those Hell-holes. But actual proper state ones, it'd work wonders.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

But here's the problem, kids get away with murder nowadays.

I mean really, anyone who drove an employee to quit from harrassment would be fired. But the kids that do it (equivelent would be getting expelled), are told "bad, don't do it again". That's the funny thing, people complain about coporal punishment, we remove it and there is a worse change. So we then have these idiots who say "oh the kids don't mean bad, they need a friend, someone to talk to". They have their fu*king friends, the ones that join in on the harrassment, like a group of bullies and they get to laugh about how "they drove a teacher out of the school" and are considered heroes in the school.

If you want to go down the road of comparing workplace bullying to school bullying, consider how you would react if corporal punishment was suddenly legalised in the work place.

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Untill people grow uo and learn "lock the scumbags up" nothing will work.

Not disagreeing with you there. I'm all for punihsment, but not when it only makes things worse.

Spudmonkey wrote: »

I dont.

I don't pretend to know what would work. What I do know however is that many of the current punishments or techniques are almost seen as a badge of honour by disruptive scumbags.

Not disagreeing with you here, either. But if they start getting corporal punihsment, then that will be work as badge, too.

Also, as you advocate the punihsment, how much force would you ccept? You said no beatings earlier on, but anything short of theat is just goign to be shrugged off either.

I am, however, all for the military style school/lifestyle. I worked in a place in Denmark that used this technique. First year was like the army, very disciplined, fourth year was more education and perparing for state exams. Second and third were in between. And the weird thing? It worked. I met so many well adjusted 17 year olds who kept saying "I was an unbeleiveebale wanker when I was 14".

Of course, part of the reason it worked was because it was on an island in the North Sea with one five-mile-long bridge to the mainland. Half the kids who tried escaping gave up and came back. (the other half just got picked up somewhere along the bridge).

When you isolate these kids, they do actaully start to think and reflect. There's feck all else to do. It does take time, but where the teenage human body can withstand a beating, the teenage human mind is nowhere near well equipped at dealing with isolation.

Corporal punishment in it's old form was just plain wrong. My godfather got beaten in school for being left-handed, it was seen as sinful. He still writes with his right hand to this day because of that.

The thing is, in schools it was replaced with nothing. I don't think that scum learn from the likes of suspensions - they'd be more like "fook yeah, no school for me." And they'd be all too happy to hear that a teacher they bullied had to leave as he/she couldn't handle them, there would be high fives all round.

Chaotic_Forces

But there's a difference of "you're a scumbag, we're given you enough chances, you'll get slapped if you do it again" and "ooh, I'm an adult in power, I'll torture the kids".

Chaotic_Forces

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

But there's a difference of "you're a scumbag, we're given you enough chances, you'll get slapped if you do it again" and "ooh, I'm an adult in power, I'll torture the kids".

Exactly. There has to be a balance somewhere.

Chaotic_Forces

Karsini wrote: »

Exactly. There has to be a balance somewhere.

But do you agree at some level, there can be some form of it that is useful? If it's done "properly". As in, if say a teacher did go overboard, the other students could report it without fear of being hurt themselves?

Chaotic_Forces

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

But do you agree at some level, there can be some form of it that is useful? If it's done "properly". As in, if say a teacher did go overboard, the other students could report it without fear of being hurt themselves?

I do. I'm not totally against it. The current situation can't go on, I'd almost say that the increase in scumbaggery is somewhat proportional to the "don't lay a finger on them" attitude.

I guess I'm somewhat biased. I used to get a slap across the bum or wrist by my mam when I did something wrong (which I'm ok with), however it was a different story from my dad, who on one occasion dragged me up the stairs by my legs.

Dudess

No way do I agree that any institution should be allowed to practise it. But if a parent is at their wits' end and has tried every other option, and the child is being really, really badly behaved, I don't disagree with a quick smack, or a couple of quick smacks, on the bum/arm/leg.
Anything more though is abusive - and there are some ****ed up stories here...

Spudmonkey

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Of course, part of the reason it worked was because it was on an island in the North Sea with one five-mile-long bridge to the mainland. Half the kids who tried escaping gave up and came back. (the other half just got picked up somewhere along the bridge).

When you isolate these kids, they do actaully start to think and reflect. There's feck all else to do. It does take time, but where the teenage human body can withstand a beating, the teenage human mind is nowhere near well equipped at dealing with isolation.

Spike Island is currently unused. So I believe anyway.

Savage Tyrant

Dudess wrote: »

No way do I agree that any institution should be allowed to practise it. But if a parent is at their wits' end and has tried every other option, and the child is being really, really badly behaved, I don't disagree with a quick smack, or a couple of quick smacks, on the bum/arm/leg.
Anything more though is abusive - and there are some ****ed up stories here...

My feelings exactly.
Now if someone else was to smack my kids... Be it teacher, minder or stranger... There'd be WAR.
I'd never lift my hand to discipline another persons child and I certainly wouldn't put up with someone doing it to mine.

Spudmonkey

Dudess wrote: »

No way do I agree that any institution should be allowed to practise it. But if a parent is at their wits' end and has tried every other option, and the child is being really, really badly behaved, I don't disagree with a quick smack, or a couple of quick smacks, on the bum/arm/leg.
Anything more though is abusive - and there are some ****ed up stories here...

There was no corporal punishment in school when I started. I did however get a few flakes at home when I was growing up. Did me no harm. It was probably the only way of dealing with me at the time.