What is average contract paid to provincial players?

kevin99

Now that Ian Dowling has announced his retirement from the game I wondered how he is fixed financially for his future.
In turn, I wondered how much these guys earn per season. I'm not talking about the international guys, but the players in the provincial squads who don't have an international contract.

The game has become so fast and physical, is it any wonder that player such as Dowing have to call it a day at such an early age?
The hits, the tackles, the covering these players cover must surely affect their bodies.
Fast forward ten years and it will be interesting to see how the current crop of international players cope with the niggly injuries, arthritis etc.

hardCopy

I'm nearly sure this has been discussed here before but I can't find the threads, there were a few articles in the press a couple of years ago that are copied and pasted in this thread on munsterfans.

The impression I got previously was that if you're a regular international you'll be fairly well looked after (up to about 400K/year + sponsorship deals) but if you're a provincial squad player you'll be on a lot less and need to find a new career sharpish.

(Mods, feel free to remove the MF link if it's not OK)

CIARAN_BOYLE

My impression is that central contracts are 200-400K while guys on provincial contracts are generally well paid in terms of the national averages but would rarely break 100K a year.

GerM

I think you're close enough to the truth in relation to the central contracts, Ciarán. Most wouldn't be on the massive contracts many assume. Only the top players with a proven track record would be commanding the upper end. A fair few of them would be on less than €300k.

In terms of provincial contracts, it is heavily geared in terms of experience. The longer a player has been around, the more he will earn. Jackman was on €150k in his final year. The younger lads on their first senior, full professional contracts would be on less than half that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDgKHySObFs

Watch Muldoon's pieces

bamboozle

i'd say between 80-150k for Munster and Leinster contracts and maybe between 50-80 for connacht with a select few earning closer to 100k out west.

a lot of the players have accommodation allowances, discounted car leases etc.

heard recently about a certain D4 club offering a player around 200k over 3 years to return from playing abroad, crazy money for the AIL.

as for how dowling is financially fixed for the future, he seems to be clued in given that he's back in college studying, he'll be able to claim a huge tax rebate on tax payed on income as a pro rugby player.

I've often wondered if many of the first crop of pro rugby players ended up buying up lots of property and are now facing negative equity on rental properties, i'm sure its the case with some of them.

CIARAN_BOYLE

bamboozle wrote: »

as for how dowling is financially fixed for the future, he seems to be clued in given that he's back in college studying, he'll be able to claim a huge tax rebate on tax payed on income as a pro rugby player.

Doesn't he need to have 10 years of pro rugby behind him to claim that rebate

kevin99

Thanks for the info guys.
Professional rugby salaries at international and provincial level pale into insignificance when compared to the top football players.

Judging from an article in last Sunday Times a number of Munster players are facing the courts either as plaintiffs or respondents over property deals.

I hope the contracted players get very sound advice on investments.
I remember listening to a programme on the very topic on BBC 5 live probably 3-5 years back.
The guy being interviewed was an agent and he said he always advised his players to invest 35% of their nett monthly earnings in pension, property and equities.
I wonder how many heeded his advice.

Hopefully, Ian Dowling will do well aprés rugby career.

Was it Lansdowne who offered the player playing abroad €200k to come back. Because they are the only club able to make that kind of offer given all the money they received from the IRFU for the redevelopment of Lansdowne Road.

profitius

kevin99 wrote: »

Thanks for the info guys.
Professional rugby salaries at international and provincial level pale into insignificance when compared to the top football players.

Judging from an article in last Sunday Times a number of Munster players are facing the courts either as plaintiffs or respondents over property deals.

I hope the contracted players get very sound advice on investments.
I remember listening to a programme on the very topic on BBC 5 live probably 3-5 years back.
The guy being interviewed was an agent and he said he always advised his players to invest 35% of their nett monthly earnings in pension, property and equities.
I wonder how many heeded his advice.

Hopefully, Ian Dowling will do well aprés rugby career.

Was it Lansdowne who offered the player playing abroad €200k to come back. Because they are the only club able to make that kind of offer given all the money they received from the IRFU for the redevelopment of Lansdowne Road.

I'd advise them to invest in gold and silver!

GerM

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

Doesn't he need to have 10 years of pro rugby behind him to claim that rebate

Nah, it refers to the 10 highest earning years of a player's career I believe. It requires the player to finish their career in Ireland though. Dowling should be eligible.

GerM

bamboozle wrote: »

heard recently about a certain D4 club offering a player around 200k over 3 years to return from playing abroad, crazy money for the AIL.

I've often wondered if many of the first crop of pro rugby players ended up buying up lots of property and are now facing negative equity on rental properties, i'm sure its the case with some of them.

I would be shocked if any AIL club could afford that sort of money including Lansdowne. Even if they could afford it, there's simply no way in hell they'd pay a player that. AIL money is a few hundred thrown to players each week cash in hand. Would think the rumour is a massive porkie pie. €200k over 3 years, cash in hand would equate to a good full professional contract with one of the provinces.

In relation to the property, several current players invested significantly in property and have had their fingers badly burned with the crash.

CIARAN_BOYLE

GerM wrote: »

Nah, it refers to the 10 highest earning years of a player's career I believe. It requires the player to finish their career in Ireland though. Dowling should be eligible.

Thanks man, I knew there was a 10 there somewhere

bamboozle

GerM wrote: »

I would be shocked if any AIL club could afford that sort of money including Lansdowne. Even if they could afford it, there's simply no way in hell they'd pay a player that. AIL money is a few hundred thrown to players each week cash in hand. Would think the rumour is a massive porkie pie. €200k over 3 years, cash in hand would equate to a good full professional contract with one of the provinces.

In relation to the property, several current players invested significantly in property and have had their fingers badly burned with the crash.

well Lansdowne was the club i was told about, 200k seemed like a daft figure, in saying all that they assembled a serious squad for this season which was on paper as strong as any club side in the country so they must have been throwing some money about.

thankfully Clontarf did the double on them!

thunderthing

as a reference, what kind of money would equivalent Southern Hemisphere players be on?

The video I posted has lots of info if you have 20mins spare.

If I remember correctly, $60k was the Salary cap for one union.

thunderthing

ah cool i'll check it out, thanks!

danthefan

Jackman said in his book he was on around €150k a year.

Conas

It's easy enough to guess who the best paid players are

BOD
Paul O'Connell
ROG

I'd say the players who signed new deals recently got very nice pay packages...Heaslip etc.

ormond lad

Conas wrote: »

It's easy enough to guess who the best paid players are

BOD
Paul O'Connell
ROG

I'd say the players who signed new deals recently got very nice pay packages...Heaslip etc.

Link here estimated heaslip to be on €400'000-€500'000 so you can guess BOD,POC, ROG are on similar

durkadurka

Given the lifespan of a typical player there isn't too many of them who would be wealthy.

Most need to be working on alternative careers.

Is poc doing engineering or something? Most of the Leinster lads seem to be studying something or other.

sleepyman

durkadurka wrote: »

Given the lifespan of a typical player there isn't too many of them who would be wealthy.

Most need to be working on alternative careers.

Is poc doing engineering or something? Most of the Leinster lads seem to be studying something or other.

POC was in UL same time as me doing computer/electronic engineering but he broke into the Munster team in 2001-2002.Don't think he finished his degree but I know UL & other colleges have an arrangement where you can finish it part time.Jeremy Staunton was doing business studies at the same time & I think he was accomodated by UL.

Like other posters have said the money would be much higher than the national average but not enough to sit on your todd for the rest of your life(unless you're Bod, POC & Rog maybe).
John Kelly retired from Munster a few years back & is now a qualified accountant I think.Victor Costello is a pilot,Shane'the Mullet' Byrne is running his family's recycling business.

profitius

They get plenty of freebies too like sponsored cars etc.

durkadurka

Is hickie selling wavin or something

profitius

profitius wrote: »

They get plenty of freebies too like sponsored cars etc.

Think its "the use of a car" for the most part? I know that some of the Leinster squad used to get them from Kenilworth Motors, but I don't think they owned them.

durkadurka wrote: »

Is hickie selling wavin or something

Sounds fantastic in a Tommy Tiernan esque accent!

durkadurka

You can still you YouTube it...

durkadurka

durkadurka wrote: »

You can still you YouTube it...

done

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6z8pfTYXg8

GerM

Deleted User wrote: »

Think its "the use of a car" for the most part? I know that some of the Leinster squad used to get them from Kenilworth Motors, but I don't think they owned them.

True. The association with KM has ended and Leinster now have a sponsorship deal with VW. A large number of the players now have VW cars provided to them as part of that. I'm sure a few of the Munster squad drive Toyotas too.

durkadurka

Poc said something on tubridy about doing engineering or electronics or something. Locky was whinging on twitter about exams. Sexton and fitz doing commerce. Dorce doing arts, r Kearney doing an MBA ,

At least they have their heads screwed on. Sob seems to be going down the coaching route

durkadurka

profitius wrote: »

They get plenty of freebies too like sponsored cars etc.

Even the likes of chris keane had a sponsored car.

Conas

In comparison to soccer players it's so so small. I mean Ronaldo would make in two weeks what Heaslip makes in a year, and if you even take sponsorship in consideration it's scary the difference. Look at the intensity of rugby training and the physicality of rugby matches, it's so obvious that footballers are way way way over payed. You tend to get more exciting Rugby matches compared to soccer too, so I think they should both swap salaries.

I feel sorry for players like Trevor Hogan, John Fogarty, and Ian Dowling who had to stop playing because of injury. I honestly hope they get some sort of combo.

Kilo

Conas wrote: »

In comparison to soccer players it's so so small. I mean Ronaldo would make in two weeks what Heaslip makes in a year, and if you even take sponsorship in consideration it's scary the difference. Look at the intensity of rugby training and the physicality of rugby matches, it's so obvious that footballers are way way way over payed. You tend to get more exciting Rugby matches compared to soccer too, so I think they should both swap salaries.

I feel sorry for players like Trevor Hogan, John Fogarty, and Ian Dowling who had to stop playing because of injury. I honestly hope they get some sort of combo.

TV is the major bankroller of soccer. Rugby is still a long way behind commanding the kind of deals that soccer gets from TV. Until that changes, players will always be way underpaid in comparison with their soccer playing counterparts.

The first hurdle is to get attendances up. Most provincial matches here are still undersold and it's far worse in the UK. How many times have we seen matches played in an almost empty Murrayfield?

David900

Conas wrote: »

In comparison to soccer players it's so so small. I mean Ronaldo would make in two weeks what Heaslip makes in a year, and if you even take sponsorship in consideration it's scary the difference. Look at the intensity of rugby training and the physicality of rugby matches, it's so obvious that footballers are way way way over payed. You tend to get more exciting Rugby matches compared to soccer too, so I think they should both swap salaries.

I feel sorry for players like Trevor Hogan, John Fogarty, and Ian Dowling who had to stop playing because of injury. I honestly hope they get some sort of combo.

All the players pay some sort of compensation/insurance fund which pays them a % of their salary for the rest of their expected career I think.

JustinDee

Kilo wrote: »

TV is the major bankroller of soccer. Rugby is still a long way behind commanding the kind of deals that soccer gets from TV. Until that changes, players will always be way underpaid in comparison with their soccer playing counterparts

TV is the main 'bankroller' of rugby union as well as rugby league, cricket, AFL, GAA ...etc etc...

bamboozle

Conas wrote: »

In comparison to soccer players it's so so small. I mean Ronaldo would make in two weeks what Heaslip makes in a year, and if you even take sponsorship in consideration it's scary the difference. Look at the intensity of rugby training and the physicality of rugby matches, it's so obvious that footballers are way way way over payed. You tend to get more exciting Rugby matches compared to soccer too, so I think they should both swap salaries.

I feel sorry for players like Trevor Hogan, John Fogarty, and Ian Dowling who had to stop playing because of injury. I honestly hope they get some sort of combo.

all these retired players get their tax back from their 10 years of highest income from playing rugby (not endorsements) assuming they were on average 80k for an 8 year career and average 30k was going on tax they'd be looking at a tax rebate of about 240k, that would be more than enough to sustain them while returning to college or to set up a business or if they've a profession to walk into then its a nice lump sum to knock off the mortgage.

Hogan is back in UCD studying history with a view to becomming a teacher, he already has a degree in Journalism from DCU, think his brother is back running the family farm after he retired, ex connacht prop ray hogan. Trevor was on newstalk a few saturdays ago, very interesting talking mainly about players going through the academy and how tough it is.

the likes of Jackman has gone from Leinster player last season to coach of Clontarf and St. Michael's SCT and is also director of rugby in DCU.