Bought a cashed car ?-dealership

poker--addict

Discovered what appears to me to be damage to the boot floor under the covering. I am furious at the moment. Decided I would post here for advice before deciding what to do.

Car is a 2006 fiesta. It was bought from a genuine dealership. 12months warranty or 12,000km whichever came first, I think was the agreement.

The dealer stated to me and my father
"This car has had one owner, who I know personally and is from the town, car has never been crashed!!! and driver took great care of it".
"Reputable" and thrusted dealer in the town which we had done business with several times.

So basically, I dont know much about cars but am i correct in thinking:

• It takes a good smack to damage the boot floor?

• Would I be correct in thinking a garage would have checked spare wheel/boot when car arrivedIF they had then they would have seen the damage.(I didnt check-yes dumb I know now) Car looked immaculate with low milleage.
• What is my position now? What should I do?

stephendevlin

poker--addict wrote: »

• It takes a good smack to damage the boot floor?

Sure does...

EPM

Get the car looked at to confirm if it has actually been damaged before you approach the seller. Did you do a history check on the car? If not I'd suggest doing one of those also as it might show up an insurance claim. Go to the seller with as much evidence as possible.

stephendevlin

Did you get the car checked out before the purchase was made to see if there was any accidents or if the milage was indeed correct.

Car dealers are not stupid IMO.

I was at one recently where a guy told me the same story.

I looked underneath the front bumper and it told me a very different story.

cadaliac

How long ago did you purchase the car?
To be honest, more cars on the road have rear damage than you think. It probally got a smack and (if you can notice the damage) was not repaired correctly.
Can you take a pic and post it up so we can see?
Is the damage bad?

Vicxas

www.motorcheck.ie

Worth the 35 euro. that'll give you the answers you need if its been reported.

poker--addict

have not approached dealer yet as want to make sure it is damage and not just the way it should look. (like i said i dont know much:o)

Car showed up clean when check was ran before buying.

If it is damage it doesnt appear bad IMO, but it will be a case of I have been lied to and paid for a car i was told was 100% not 90.

Will get a photo soon for ye guys to let me know is it normal or not

thanks for quick replies lads:)

Vicxas

Maybe take a pic and upload, see what we think?

poker--addict

2 things:Lack of clean smooth finish towards bottom right corner of wheel well, looks buckled to me.Then this rectangular "bandage like" piece on the floor. This normal?:o see attached for mine!!!

what my previous cars and what i expected to see= http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y89/escort_rs_turbo_series_2/SaphCos/a293efab.jpg

EPM

Is it the bottom of pic you're on about?

jamiecall

+ 1 . Thats defo normal

thenightrider

Nothing wrong there if there is all cars ive have must hav been crashed

robtri

poker--addict wrote: »

2 things:Lack of clean smooth finish towards bottom right corner of wheel well, looks buckled to me.Then this rectangular "bandage like" piece on the floor. This normal?:o see attached for mine!!!

what my previous cars and what i expected to see= http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y89/escort_rs_turbo_series_2/SaphCos/a293efab.jpg

hard to tell from the pic, bottom right does look to have a crease.. the large rectangle piece of material is normal...

EPM

robtri wrote: »

hard to tell from the pic, bottom right does look to have a crease.. the large rectangle piece of material is normal...

Noticed that too. But that could be caused by dropping the spare on it or some tools possibly. Rest of it looks fine.

Gumbo

poker--addict wrote: »

2 things:Lack of clean smooth finish towards bottom right corner of wheel well, looks buckled to me.Then this rectangular "bandage like" piece on the floor. This normal?:o see attached for mine!!!

what my previous cars and what i expected to see= http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y89/escort_rs_turbo_series_2/SaphCos/a293efab.jpg

doesnt look crashed to me, can you compare it to another 06 Fiesta to check for differences?

poker--addict

i figured the rectangle piece may be normal its really the crease i was worried about?

omb0wyn5ehpij9

EPM wrote: »

Noticed that too. But that could be caused by dropping the spare on it or some tools possibly. Rest of it looks fine.

Agreed.

If it had of had a proper smack at the back, I would be expecting more damage TBH

poker--addict

closer one of what i was looking at..?

Happy if its normal hate thought of not knowing what you have

langdang

That crease looks to me to be more than something heavy dropped in the boot! A whole section of the wheel well wall seems to have moved down and toward the back of the car? Take a better photo from another angle of the right hand side of the boot OP. Either I need to go to specsavers or some of the previous posters do!

Motorcheck/Cartell etc might very well show up nothing for this, even if there was a significant repair.

mickdw

It certainly has creases. Would have had a bit of a bang to the rear imo. Certainly anything that would leave any kind of crease internally is significant damage and a garage should certainly have made you aware of this.

stephendevlin

Deffo a kink due to impact IMO. My mate got rear ended at about 45mph some dozy cow must have fell asleep when coming up to a roundabout. To look at the car you'd think that the back bumper only was damaged. unfortunatly there was a lot more to it.

I would ask a bodyshop for thier opinion. Trained eyes.

poker--addict

Have to chuckle, its either the 2 different photo angles or our posters have very different thoughts:D
just to add note as may not be obvious but the denty shape also goes down/in. Its not flat like, as the guys have been saying hard to see and explain with photos.

mullingar

It would take a fair whack to crease that metal!

Is there any other damage in the area? Check behind the tail lights/quarter panel!

Owen

The wheel well in any car is always a poorly finished job as the manufacturers don't need to make it pretty. No point in taking anyone's word on here for it, check it against a similar model and year. If you're still unhappy, have an assessor look at it.

IMHO, it doesn't seem too bad, but it's always hard to tell from photos.

poker--addict

I think i will need to see photos of the same type of car. I cant see anything else strange but god knows whats behind the bumper!! Something dropped in boot doesnt seem plausible to me This metal aint tinfoil unless ur talking about a tone of bricks falling on it!

Say it is damaged whats the advice? Send it back, punish them for lying, full refund, or keep car but demand some money? Car had quite low milleage and if this is damage it throws anything believed to be genuine into doubt.

EPM

The second photo makes it easier to see. Is it possible the damage wasnt from a rear impact but from a side impact (based on the way the rest of it looks factory finish and the second buckle in the middle of the wheel well).

Vicxas

Hmm, it does look like a sizeable dent to me, do you know any friends who are mechanics?

langdang

EPM wrote: »

Is it possible the damage wasnt from a rear impact but from a side impact (based on the way the rest of it looks factory finish and the second buckle in the middle of the wheel well).

It looks to me like something hit the back corner (bumper RHS + quarter panel) or just the quarter panel. Def get it checked out by a third party OP
Random internet opinion OP, I am not a panel beater

poker--addict

Gez a side hit? :eek:I am going out to inspect some more, surely be more signs if car hit hard enough to damage that spot?

I am actually out of country with car now to complicate things, and country doesnt speak english so major hassle try get professional opinions here lol.

Where do I stand if I have been lied too? I am sure this is obviously normal or not normal to a ford mechanic, so they knew either way.

On a side note was ment to ring dealer this week as sunroof has been ridiculously loud once over 50mph so must not be sitting right. Was dry untill last week when after car wash I found moisture. Presuming the cars not completely bent and thats why sunroof wont sit!:rolleyes: That would be my luck.:pac:

SilverBell

quick internet check brought up this, similar damage on a salvage site.
http://www.salvagesparefinder.co.uk/FORD+FIESTA+FINESSE-428673.htm

and when you have a look at bumper mts on this photo, its possible the car could have got a straight "rear ender" causing the buckling in the wheel well. Dunno.......????

Now, I dont know if the cars here are the exact same models or anything, but it could point you on your way. All the best.

langdang

OK - not sure now "which way is what" in the photos.
I had thought the bottom of the photo was the RHS of the car but it's probably the back.
In that case it could have been a straight rear ender. Sorry for my confusion...

VolvoMan

Something very heavy would've had to be dropped in that boot to crease the metal.

SilverBell

VolvoMan wrote: »

Something very heavy would've had to be dropped in that boot to crease the metal.

yep, very heavy!! plus the damage lines from a weight falling would have to line up........ and the vent bung seems to be elongated. looks more like a buckling failure tbh.

crawl under and have a look at the bumper mounts. Look for packing pieces, straightening work etc.

Henry Ford III

Compare it to another one.

omb0wyn5ehpij9

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Compare it to another one.

I definitely think that is the best bet. Didn't look too bad in the first photo, but in the close ups i'm not so sure.
If you know anybody else with the same car, check their boot, or go to a dealer who has one and have a nosey
Nobody on here will be able to tell you what's what unfortunately, the car would need to be seen in the metal.

poker--addict

ok guys had another look. no good news i think at all. i will compare with another one at another dealer at weekend.

when i had a close look i notice
x= corner is "folded down"...smooth/vertical on other side.
y= hard to see in photo but it is the head of a bolt half "sheared" off.
z=when looked in here could see metal had been "pushed" in, smooth and vertical on other side.

SilverBell

poker--addict wrote: »

ok guys had another look. no good news i think at all. i will compare with another one at another dealer at weekend.

when i had a close look i notice
x= corner is "folded down"...smooth/vertical on other side.
y= hard to see in photo but it is the head of a bolt half "sheared" off.
z=when looked in here could see metal had been "pushed" in, smooth and vertical on other side.

A quick look underneath will help too, esp to check if some main members are buckled. As far as I know, if the dealer sells you a car described as "not crashed" and it turns out to be crashed you have a strong position to return/demand money back or come to some resolution. And its the dealer who has wronged you. Others here will know more about that than me.
Best of luck.

poker--addict

silverbell I had done the look under cheers, was taking me a while to get photo bright enough to make out. At first look photo doesnt make sense but picture lying on back looking up just inside the bumper.

A bar runs usually runs across just behind the bumper,I do not know what it is called??? It is usually attached to 2 mounts. Well it appears the bar took the brunt of whatever hit it and was removed? I can see one of the mounts and even 2 or 3 bolts are left.??

Verdict: Crashed:(

The funny thing about it was that there was 2 cars on done deal I was mad after, and decided to go with thrustworthy dealers just incase!ha:eek:

sdanseo

poker--addict wrote: »

silverbell I had done the look under cheers, was taking me a while to get photo bright enough to make out. At first look photo doesnt make sense but picture lying on back looking up just inside the bumper.

A bar runs usually runs across just behind the bumper,I do not know what it is called??? It is usually attached to 2 mounts. Well it appears the bar took the brunt of whatever hit it and was removed? I can see one of the mounts and even 2 or 3 bolts are left.??

Verdict: Crashed:(

The funny thing about it was that there was 2 cars on done deal I was mad after, and decided to go with thrustworthy dealers just incase!ha:eek:

I know the feeling. My car had a dodgy clutch which went just a few weeks after purchase, that and constant other smaller probs that the dealer just refuses to put right.

I'd say that was definately either crashed, or had something hugely heavy dropped inside it. You can see the circular cap in the pictures is clearly meant to be flush.

Your saving grace is that the dealer assured you it had never been crashed. If it has, then that's breach of contract, breach of the Consumer Information Act 1978 (misleading advertising), and breach of the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act, 1980 (not as described, and, arguably, not fit for purpose).

poker--addict

Soo..obviously first step is I approach a professional and get him to confirm it, maybe give an estimate of the date of repair if at all possible!I have the car about 9 weeks.

Then approach the dealer. What do I seek?

P.S the new search feature on boards is pathetic! I remember seeing several similar threads on this exact topic and now they are very hard to find, ones from 2-3 years ago come up.

SilverBell

hello poker addict.
You have very strong grounds to go back to your dealer and get this sorted. I'd go straight back to the dealer first, see what he says and take it from there. You might not be a mechanic or panel beater but you have sussed out the car is damaged, so you are not to be fooled by him. All the best and post how you get on.
G

poker--addict wrote: »

silverbell I had done the look under cheers, was taking me a while to get photo bright enough to make out. At first look photo doesnt make sense but picture lying on back looking up just inside the bumper.

A bar runs usually runs across just behind the bumper,I do not know what it is called??? It is usually attached to 2 mounts. Well it appears the bar took the brunt of whatever hit it and was removed? I can see one of the mounts and even 2 or 3 bolts are left.??

Verdict: Crashed:(

The funny thing about it was that there was 2 cars on done deal I was mad after, and decided to go with thrustworthy dealers just incase!ha:eek:

Fries-With-That

Just my tuppence ha'penney worth, is that bung supposed to be silver or black plastic.

I was always told to look for paint over spray when looking at second hand cars.

I would imagine this bung or plug should be black plastic fitted after factory spray.

Have a look at wiring loom going to lights on this side of the car, sometimes lazy panel beaters don't mask the loom, so you might see signs of spray paint on this too.

Best of luck with it.

poker--addict

thanks for help guys! will keep ye posted. Bit sick as car is actually lovely to drive and is a sporty model so looks quite well for a little city car!Knowing it was crashed just bugs a guy though! So does been lied too.

firefly08

I hate to be pedantic (but someone has to do it): if you really quoted the dealer word for word when you posted:

"This car has had one owner, who I know personally and is from the town, car has never been crashed!!!

...then you might not have any comeback at all - he hasn't necessarily lied to you. I always ask "has the car ever been involved in a crash?" for exactly this reason. For instance, if the car was stationary, and someone else crashed into it, then it has been involved in a crash, but has not itself been crashed.

Hopefully it won't come to that and the dealer will live up to his reputation.

poker--addict

lol firefly, thats a real war of words, a judge would slaughter a salesman if that was his argument in a court room. Sales man built up a photo of a gentleman who uses car to tip around the down on errands, taking care of his car and engine and he was putting up less then 9000km a year on the car.Anyways hopefully wont come to that.

VolvoMan

poker--addict wrote: »

The funny thing about it was that there was 2 cars on done deal I was mad after, and decided to go with thrustworthy dealers just incase!ha:eek:

It's a funny old world, isn't it?

I've found that when buying a used car in Ireland you're nearly safer to buy privately. Most of the used car trade are generally crooks.

firefly08 wrote: »

I hate to be pedantic (but someone has to do it): if you really quoted the dealer word for word when you posted:



...then you might not have any comeback at all - he hasn't necessarily lied to you. I always ask "has the car ever been involved in a crash?" for exactly this reason. For instance, if the car was stationary, and someone else crashed into it, then it has been involved in a crash, but has not itself been crashed.

Hopefully it won't come to that and the dealer will live up to his reputation.

What a load of rubbish.:p

Ignore the above, OP.

morrga

Ask the Gardai to run a history check on the car. They have details of all crashed incidents relating to the car.

langdang

morrga wrote: »

Ask the Gardai to run a history check on the car. They have details of all crashed incidents relating to the car.

Is this an official service?
Nobody (Insurance/car history check/dealers/gardai) has info on every crash. Perfectly possible to damage a car and repair on the quiet?

morrga

No not an official service, you would need a contact within the guards. Generally most crashes will involve garda intervention. Worth checking to see if it is on their radar.

langdang

morrga wrote: »

No not an official service, you would need a contact within the guards.

I know you mentioned it in your other thread, I'm sure the two guys who did you a favour are delighted with you spreading the word around! I'd advise you to keep quiet about it for their sake...

JimmyCrackCorn

stephendevlin wrote: »

Sure does...

Not really a good smack, i hit one very gently and messed up its boot floor.


If you asked any questions on the cars history and it was not mentioned the goods are not as described and can be returned.

See the sales and supply of goods act.