major drop in shares !!!!!!!!

jellybeans

OMG I just checked my shares and they have dropped €1,000 in the last couple of days

:(:(

I pay 50% into on both of these funds,

AIB Multi Track Fund
Invests in widely diversified portfolio, which spans all major world stockmarkets and also provides exposure to Eurozone bonds.
The fund holds a portfolio of securities that provides exposure to more than 1700 companies.

AIB Managed Fund Series 2

Designed to invest in a carefully monitored portfolio of international shares, fixed interest securities, properties and cash deposits.
Profit through capital growth potential and reinvested income

is it just because of the oil and Japan and Libya etc???? do you think they will come back up???

Speculator

jellybeans wrote: »

OMG I just checked my shares and they have dropped €1,000 in the last couple of days

:(:(

I pay 50% into on both of these funds,

AIB Multi Track Fund
Invests in widely diversified portfolio, which spans all major world stockmarkets and also provides exposure to Eurozone bonds.
The fund holds a portfolio of securities that provides exposure to more than 1700 companies.

AIB Managed Fund Series 2

Designed to invest in a carefully monitored portfolio of international shares, fixed interest securities, properties and cash deposits.
Profit through capital growth potential and reinvested income

is it just because of the oil and Japan and Libya etc???? do you think they will come back up???

Yes because of the Japan and Libya crisis and due to over 100 other factors. The markets are very fragile at the moment. There's a common saying which goes like this " sell in May and go away" Which generally makes sense.

No doubt your investments will recover some lost ground, unfortunately this may not happen in the short term, although markets were up again on Thursday and Friday there are lot of worried investors out there. On the other side there are a lot of investors out there throwing money at the stock market indiscriminately, I personally am unsure if this is the time to invest unless you do a lot of research and know the risks especially taking into consideration global events and world debts crisis.

irishh_bob

jellybeans wrote: »

OMG I just checked my shares and they have dropped €1,000 in the last couple of days

:(:(

I pay 50% into on both of these funds,

AIB Multi Track Fund
Invests in widely diversified portfolio, which spans all major world stockmarkets and also provides exposure to Eurozone bonds.
The fund holds a portfolio of securities that provides exposure to more than 1700 companies.

AIB Managed Fund Series 2

Designed to invest in a carefully monitored portfolio of international shares, fixed interest securities, properties and cash deposits.
Profit through capital growth potential and reinvested income

is it just because of the oil and Japan and Libya etc???? do you think they will come back up???

im sure the rep who sold you the fund will claim its down to libya - japan but the reality is that the majority of investment funds dont make any money or rather they only make money for the banks selling them and the fund managers ( managing :rolleyes: ) them

ixus

jellybeans wrote: »

AIB Multi Track Fund
Invests in widely diversified portfolio, which spans all major world stockmarkets and also provides exposure to Eurozone bonds.

AIB Managed Fund Series 2

Designed to invest in a carefully monitored portfolio of international shares, fixed interest securities, properties and cash deposits.
Profit through capital growth potential and reinvested income

is it just because of the oil and Japan and Libya etc???? do you think they will come back up???

Underlined your probable exposure risk at the moment.

Bonds have been taking a hit due to inflation fears.
Nikkei has taken a major hit due to events in Japan.
DAX and SMI took hits with their insurance companies.

Your international shares probably cover a lot of Japanes stocks.
S&P is negative for the year so far.
You have major FX exposure across the board.

The markets are extremely volatile at the moment. It's likely you will see big swings across all markets for the next few months before the next trend begins.

If you're a fan of RandomWalk, ignore all this and keep going with your investment if you plan on having it for 10+ years.

If you intend using this money in the next year and can't handle any heat you best exit the kitchen.

jellybeans

thanks for all the replies well I could leave it for another year but is it likely to recover in that time, I have it now probably 7 years, I took it out during the SSIA year. I think I would make more money if I transferred it into a deposit account but now having lost so much this week Im not sure whether to wait a month and see what happens then move them into my deposit account or whether to keep buying shares and leave them for another few years??

ixus

jellybeans wrote: »

thanks for all the replies well I could leave it for another year but is it likely to recover in that time, I have it now probably 7 years, I took it out during the SSIA year. I think I would make more money if I transferred it into a deposit account but now having lost so much this week Im not sure whether to wait a month and see what happens then move them into my deposit account or whether to keep buying shares and leave them for another few years??

Can you financially/emotionally handle any further losses?

If the answer to that is no then I would say that exiting is the best thing you could do as it eliminates any further financial risk and, more importantly, the stress that it can bring.

Don't think about it as making back that you lost. Assess the current market situation and where you think it is going. If you are happy to invest based on this, continue to do so.

How did you handle the drawdowns during the 2008 crisis if you've been investing for seven years?

jellybeans

well I think my answer to that one was to just delete the account from 24 hour banking and forget about it!!

I was just reading in a different forum and came across the following....

"Its a PIP ARK LIFE investment. I would be looking at a minimum of 10 years for this type of investment so if it was me I would continue investing knowing that my monthly contribution is buying more units now given that markets have fallen substantially. I look at equity investments over a ten to fifteen year period and property over a twenty year plus period."

I opened my account in April 2002 so that would mean I am saving 9 years, I think the government incentive which I earned has been wiped out and I am only just barely above what I put in. Basically any profit I made has been wiped out. Something is telling me that selling when the fund is at it lowest is not good but will the world markets recoup?

Speculator

jellybeans wrote: »

well I think my answer to that one was to just delete the account from 24 hour banking and forget about it!!

I was just reading in a different forum and came across the following....

"Its a PIP ARK LIFE investment. I would be looking at a minimum of 10 years for this type of investment so if it was me I would continue investing knowing that my monthly contribution is buying more units now given that markets have fallen substantially. I look at equity investments over a ten to fifteen year period and property over a twenty year plus period."

I opened my account in April 2002 so that would mean I am saving 9 years, I think the government incentive which I earned has been wiped out and I am only just barely above what I put in. Basically any profit I made has been wiped out. Something is telling me that selling when the fund is at it lowest is not good but will the world markets recoup?

Hi Jelly,

The unending European debt/bank crisis, Middle East unrest, increased probablity of adverse weather conditions around the world and the Nuclear disasterous event in Japan are gradually nibbling away at the foundations of investor confidence. Some are concerned that a new bear market is upon us.

With the prospects of high inflation and the austerity measures taken by most countries around the world the prospects do not look good in the short term. No doubt the markets will recover over the long term!

You have been saving for the last 9 years, if you dont need this money in the short/medium term why bother cashing it in?

jellybeans

Speculator wrote: »

Hi Jelly,

The unending European debt/bank crisis, Middle East unrest, increased probablity of adverse weather conditions around the world and the Nuclear disasterous event in Japan are gradually nibbling away at the foundations of investor confidence. Some are concerned that a new bear market is upon us.

With the prospects of high inflation and the austerity measures taken by most countries around the world the prospects do not look good in the short term. No doubt the markets will recover over the long term!

You have been saving for the last 9 years, if you dont need this money in the short/medium term why bother cashing it in?

hey thanks for the reply, because it's only worth the amount I put into it after 9 years investing!! also if I have it in a deposit account it will make a steady (albeit small) profit and at least that some growth.

I was just wondering though what you mean by long term? I actually dont need the money now at all but who knows what will happen in the next 5 years....if you were in my position how long would you leave it for?

Speculator

jellybeans wrote: »

hey thanks for the reply, because it's only worth the amount I put into it after 9 years investing!! also if I have it in a deposit account it will make a steady (albeit small) profit and at least that some growth.

I was just wondering though what you mean by long term? I actually dont need the money now at all but who knows what will happen in the next 5 years....if you were in my position how long would you leave it for?

My definition of long term would be 10-15+ years.

Both investments are fundamentally sound, its external factors causing the downward trend. Unfortunately I can not advise on how long you should hold onto your investments as I know nothing about your personal financial circumstances.


If I were you, I would do a lot of research in relation to the these investment vehicles and ask yourself are they the most suitable investments for you at this point in time taking into consideration security and current disposable income.

P.S. I would take all advice you receive on an investment forum with a pinch of salt.

jellybeans

I think I'm actually gonna move my shares into a deposit account but I'm thinking it's not wise to move them now, I feel a little trapped in them now that they have dropped. It's weird though coz last week or the week before they were worth the most I have seen them yet and then a couple of days later they just plummeted I'm guessing it would be worth waiting a few weeks to see if they will rise again?? or should i just bail now ??

jank

Me personally...I would wait for at least some recovery to take place. The Japanese factor will blow over, just look at the history of the Kobe earthquake. The markets will also demand a quick resolution to the Gaddafi situation, Obama does not want another multi years war there. The euro zone issue is harder to pin but there appears to be at least the realization the EU leaders must face the music if they want to save the eurozone.

You are being emotional with your investment. By all means stop paying into it and pay into another investment. But taking the hit now because of these current events after investing in it for 9 years is a bit pre-mature and juvenile.

Go away for 6 months and come back, assess analyse and interpret the situation then. Cool heads man...

Again this is my personal look on things, you do what you want to do.

jellybeans

thanks Jank, ye I think ill stop paying into them and save into my deposit account but Ill leave them where they are for another year or so.

Thanks

arrowloopboy

jank wrote: »

Me personally...I would wait for at least some recovery to take place. The Japanese factor will blow over, just look at the history of the Kobe earthquake. The markets will also demand a quick resolution to the Gaddafi situation, Obama does not want another multi years war there. The euro zone issue is harder to pin but there appears to be at least the realization the EU leaders must face the music if they want to save the eurozone.

You are being emotional with your investment. By all means stop paying into it and pay into another investment. But taking the hit now because of these current events after investing in it for 9 years is a bit pre-mature and juvenile.

Go away for 6 months and come back, assess analyse and interpret the situation then. Cool heads man...

Again this is my personal look on things, you do what you want to do.

I'd agree with your summing up of the current situation only been short term.
But the o/p dosn't have to recover his investment in the piss poor performing funds that he is currently invested in.
He states he's only at b/e after 9 yrs ,the only thing pre mature and juvinile is that he stayed invested for this lenght.

jellybeans

well it did make a profit at one stage but that's been wiped out now and the government's SSIA incentive has been wiped out too, heartbreaking now it's just should i wait or should i cut my losses and move to make at least some sort of a profit in a deposit account?????

radioactiveman

This is going to sound odd jellybean but I'd actually buy more shares if I were you at the moment now that they're not as expensive.

Ditch the AIB fund and buy shares directly (won't say what I'd do in that situation with AIB .

Deutsche bank do an ETF that is very like AIBs multi track fund. It's a "world" index that is made up of 1658 companies in the single share, you can't go wrong if shares are ok for you. Funnily enough AIB's fund has about 1700 also..

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=XWO.PA+Interactive#chart2:symbol=xwo.pa;range=20080417,20110318;indicator=volume;charttype=line;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=on

the yearly charges for this are 0.45%. I don't know what AIB's charges are but they could be anything (knowing AIB maybe 2 or 3% or more, this is actually HUGE over time). The dividends are reinvested as well they're about 2.67% which isn't great but you could google for different ones there's loads.

You can't time the market but you can assess when shares are expensive or not. Have a look at the shares underlying the index (like exxon mobil, IBM etc) and see if they are pricey or not. Researching stocks, researching cheap online brokers (probably not Irish) is hard work but you just have to do it.

If you stay in the market you will be 100% guaranteed to get every up day as well as every down day and given that there are more up days than down, eventually you will win. But if you sell and re-enter, you you will have to re-enter each time at exactly the right time.

Smcgie

Jellybean to give you a rough idea over the last 3 week my portfolio was down over €40,000 last 2 trading days have seen that recover. You need balls of steel in times like that as I could have easily panicked and left the markets.

The markets will eat you alive if you are nervous about the money you have invested. If its needed then withdraw it straight away, if not hold tight.

arrowloopboy

Smcgie wrote: »

Jellybean to give you a rough idea over the last 3 week my portfolio was down over €40,000 last 2 trading days have seen that recover. You need balls of steel in times like that as I could have easily panicked and left the markets.

The markets will eat you alive if you are nervous about the money you have invested. If its needed then withdraw it straight away, if not hold tight.

Balls of steel :rolleyes:,what ya need is a stop loss.

The markets will eat you alive if your nervous......... or stupit

Is that a demo acc ?

Smcgie

arrowloopboy wrote: »

Balls of steel :rolleyes:,what ya need is a stop loss.

The markets will eat you alive if your nervous......... or stupit

Is that a demo acc ?

LOL I'm not even going to reply to such a patronizing post.

jellybeans

Smcgie wrote: »

Jellybean to give you a rough idea over the last 3 week my portfolio was down over €40,000 last 2 trading days have seen that recover. You need balls of steel in times like that as I could have easily panicked and left the markets.

The markets will eat you alive if you are nervous about the money you have invested. If its needed then withdraw it straight away, if not hold tight.

OMG ok I take your point!! holy sheisse that must have been a bit upsetting Im happy to hear that your stocks recovered. Can I ask have you invested in particular companies or is it like mine where they are spread accross 1700 companies and eurozone bonds etc??

By the way I wondered did I read it right when I saw that Berkshire Hathaway shares are 127,770.00 per share????

Thargor

My portfolio did the exact same thing in the last fortnight, 40k down but limping back up again, its no reason to panic though you just have to have patience, the share I hold that dropped in value by 40k is currently worth 95k, my original investment in it was only 30k last July so I dont care, I fully expect to sell it for a lifechanging amount of money this year or early next year so the fluctuations don't bother me.
This time last year I didnt even know how to buy shares or anything about trading, you should do a bit of reading yourself and do your own trades, breaking even after 9 or 10 years is a bit pathetic even with the financial crisis. There are great opportunities out there at the minute if you want to take a few risks.

Idu

Ignore monetary figures when listening to advice on forums. What you want to focus on is percentages. If you figure out how to consistently return 10%(or any percentage) on 100 then theoretically you should be able to do the same regardless of the sums involved. Good trading is about separating yourself from the emotion that comes with monetary gain or loss. If you can't handle that then stick to deposit accounts

PeakOutput

Thargor wrote: »

My portfolio did the exact same thing in the last fortnight, 40k down but limping back up again, its no reason to panic though you just have to have patience, the share I hold that dropped in value by 40k is currently worth 95k, my original investment in it was only 30k last July so I dont care, I fully expect to sell it for a lifechanging amount of money this year or early next year so the fluctuations don't bother me.
This time last year I didnt even know how to buy shares or anything about trading, you should do a bit of reading yourself and do your own trades, breaking even after 9 or 10 years is a bit pathetic even with the financial crisis. There are great opportunities out there at the minute if you want to take a few risks.

Do You mind me asking how much money you had starting your portfolio off a year ago? totally off topic and personal but im about to graduate and am lucky enough to have 2 jobs when i finish that will allow me to have some disposable income and want to start a portfolio asap so i am just curious

Thargor

I had about 35k in savings, just graduated myself, pissed away 6k's worth on stupid mistakes (BP )

Then I found Range Resources (RRL.L) thanks to tips on here and piled into them and to a lesser extent XCITE Energy (XEL.L) and it was like winning the lottery so I couldn't be happier but it was pure gambling really and you shouldn't try to repeat that because you'll just lose most of the time.

I like Oil and Gas because generally it can only go up and I have high risk appetite.

jellybeans

Thargor wrote: »

I had about 35k in savings, just graduated myself, pissed away 6k's worth on stupid mistakes (BP )

Then I found Range Resources (RRL.L) thanks to tips on here and piled into them and to a lesser extent XCITE Energy (XEL.L) and it was like winning the lottery so I couldn't be happier but it was pure gambling really and you shouldn't try to repeat that because you'll just lose most of the time.

I like Oil and Gas because generally it can only go up and I have high risk appetite.

well if it can only go up you can't lose!!! My God you make it sound so tempting "like winning the lottery" makes me eager to learn! how did you decide on your shares?? did you buy the shares through a broker and how much per share??

Thargor

Errrrr when I say it was like winning the lottery I mean it was a freak once or twice in a lifetime occurrence and I was very lucky to be there at the right time, not that its like winning the lottery the minute you start trading, and when I say oil and gas can only go up I mean that in general 10-20 years down the road definitely not every oil and gas company and most definitely not the little explorers which are nearly pure gambling, I was down nearly 20% at one stage in Range after I got in at 5.65p per share when it looked like one of their major projects was on indefinite hold and I was kicking myself for being an idiot, but it all came good, the shares are trading around 20p now and some people think we'll see 50-60p by the end of the year or sooner, do your own research though.

I found them just by chance after Id just started, someone on here was asking about shares that could double in the next year or 2 and Poodles and Smcgie were pimping Range, every company Ive ever traded has come from tips on bulletin boards to be honest, you're not supposed to do that but I do put in the research afterwards before I buy.

I use National Irish Bank, I dont trade much just sit on what I have so I think they're perfect, good trading interface on the website, €20 minimum per trade or 0.4% if more, they waive the annual fee if you're a new customer and their phone trading is very good if you're at work, plus they're owned by Danske Bank in Denmark so I dont have to worry about the Irish financial system.

Good luck with whatever you do anyway and make a thread about it here first.

jellybeans

Thargor wrote: »

Errrrr when I say it was like winning the lottery I mean it was a freak once or twice in a lifetime occurrence and I was very lucky to be there at the right time, not that its like winning the lottery the minute you start trading, and when I say oil and gas can only go up I mean that in general 10-20 years down the road definitely not every oil and gas company and most definitely not the little explorers which are nearly pure gambling, I was down nearly 20% at one stage in Range after I got in at 5.65p per share when it looked like one of their major projects was on indefinite hold and I was kicking myself for being an idiot, but it all came good, the shares are trading around 20p now and some people think we'll see 50-60p by the end of the year or sooner, do your own research though.

I found them just by chance after Id just started, someone on here was asking about shares that could double in the next year or 2 and Poodles and Smcgie were pimping Range, every company Ive ever traded has come from tips on bulletin boards to be honest, you're not supposed to do that but I do put in the research afterwards before I buy.

I use National Irish Bank, I dont trade much just sit on what I have so I think they're perfect, good trading interface on the website, €20 minimum per trade or 0.4% if more, they waive the annual fee if you're a new customer and their phone trading is very good if you're at work, plus they're owned by Danske Bank in Denmark so I dont have to worry about the Irish financial system.

Good luck with whatever you do anyway and make a thread about it here first.

ok so Im gonna get all this up and running over the next week or so, I just have to decide whether to use NIB or sharewatch and then it's study study study. I'm not at all remotely associated with business or finance so it will be a hardwork and a steep learning curve, expect to hear lots from me Ill take a look into those shares, any other good forums?

arrowloopboy

jellybeans wrote: »

ok so Im gonna get all this up and running over the next week or so, I just have to decide whether to use NIB or sharewatch and then it's study study study. I'm not at all remotely associated with business or finance so it will be a hardwork and a steep learning curve, expect to hear lots from me Ill take a look into those shares, any other good forums?

Its a good idea taking control of your own finances,the smart guys managing the funds you are in could only break even after 9 years,a gurilla sticking pins in tickers would do better than that.
Its a misconception that you have to be associated with business or finance to make decent returns from trading/investing.
If its shares your intrested in ,i'd highly reccomend an online subscription to investors cronicle,well worth the small fee they charge.

The main things you need to study are money management and position sizing ,if you get those right and use a decent trading stratagy,its very hard to go broke at this business.

Good luck.

Smcgie

Jellybean don't use Sharewatch they're terrible!

Speculator

jellybeans wrote: »

ok so Im gonna get all this up and running over the next week or so, I just have to decide whether to use NIB or sharewatch and then it's study study study. I'm not at all remotely associated with business or finance so it will be a hardwork and a steep learning curve, expect to hear lots from me Ill take a look into those shares, any other good forums?

I'd recommend TD Waterhouse http://www.tdwaterhouse.ie/

Best of luck with your research, buying the Weekend Fin Times is a must if you wish to keep up to date with the stock market.

jellybeans

thanks guys for all your advice, now i just need to find the stocks I want to buy!!! any pointers or advice???

freeze4real

Anyone that's interested in oil and gas should pay attention to LNG cheirne oil and gas. 8months ago it was around $2 - 3 and now it's around $9.29. It went over $10 but with the works diasters happening it plummeted.

jellybeans

freeze4real wrote: »

Anyone that's interested in oil and gas should pay attention to LNG cheirne oil and gas. 8months ago it was around $2 - 3 and now it's around $9.29. It went over $10 but with the works diasters happening it plummeted.

how would you determine whether there is a possivbility it would continue to rise? (complete novice)

freeze4real

jellybeans wrote: »

how would you determine whether there is a possivbility it would continue to rise? (complete novice)

http://stocks.investopedia.com/stock-analysis/2011/Liquefied-Natural-Gas-Expands-GLNG-TGP-CVX-LNG-CHK0324.aspx

Read the section about LNG or even the whole thing.

Speculator

jellybeans wrote: »

how would you determine whether there is a possivbility it would continue to rise? (complete novice)

Tread carefully, you need to step back and consider what sector of the market you would like to invest in. Once you have decided on the sector you need to do a lot of research!

Conduct a SWOT Test on present and future developments within the industry. Once this is established you can then research individual shares. There is no easy way around it!