Data/TV/Telephone Points for a New Build

BMD

Hi,

I want to enquire what would be considered necessary with respect to data points and tv points in a new build?

My current spec is for cat 5 cabling from all bedrooms and living areas back to a central hub in the utility room.

Regarding tv points, I also have spec'd for coax cables from all these rooms to an antenna on the roof

The master bedroom, the living area's will also be hard wired for telephone connections.

I want to make sure my points are sufficient should I need to install Sky in the future, use internet tv or network to a central printer etc.

I am not very technical in this respect therefore I would appreciate any advice as I am sure there are other things that I haven't though of.

imitation

I think you have a pretty solid spec, one thing that was pointed out to me was to run 2 coax cables wherever you want to have a Sky HD box / Satellite recorder. One cable is used for Live TV while the second is for background recording.

Make sure you have a good spot to bring back all your Cat 5 cables, you'll want to have enough space for a switch and a few sockets, maybe even a mini home server of some sort.

Its a handy time to put in speaker wire and alarm wiring too.

gman2k

Go with Cat6 cable instead of Cat5, very little difference in material cost, and you are future proofed.
Run dual Cat6 to each TV point also from your Hub. Dual Cat6 cables can be converted to HDMI at each end, and can cater for long distance transmission of 1080p video signals.
Run multiple Cat6 to each bedroom for future telephone/ internet etc.

Run TV cable from each TV point back to your central point, and from there, run 2 cables to your aerial point. Put your aerial in the attic, easy to access, no ladders to roof etc and not visually intrusive.
You can fit an amp/splitter in your hub position to distribute TV signal.
Run Satellite cable to each TV point back to your hub, or as I did direct to dish point - I fitted an Octo LNB so each TV can access Sat TV independently. Freeview Sat boxes are very cheap now. (FreeSat are a bit dearer)
Run 2 sat cables to your main satellite receiver position from dish (generally living room) so you can watch and record different channels.
Wire your living room for 7.1 sound - use good quality speaker cable, do not let your builder buy speaker cable - get it yourself from Richersounds or similar. Fit a specific sub-woofer cable during built process, and have all cables concealed. Get help from some one in the know about planing a 7.1 system.
Allow for multi-room sound.
Plan in detail your living room, look at furniture layouts and where your TV will go. Think about what way your TV will be - i.e. wall mounted? then allow for sockets, HDMI, PC monitor compatible cables, central speaker position behind TV etc.
Allow for a possible projector position in your living room area - ceiling mounted. Again a few Cat6 cables and elec socket.

What way will you be accessing the internet?
If through landline, then make sure your hub position has landline connection also. The old fashioned way of having your telephone in the hall is for the birds - make sure your builder brings your land line cable to your hub point.
If through Wireless, run another Sat cable up to your attic so a wireless can be piped back down to your hub from here. Fit a few sockets in your attic!
Run Cat 6 cables to each corner of the eaves of your house - to allow for possible CCTV. Put a couple of elec sockets in your eaves for Xmas lights.
Run Cat6 to your entrance door point, allows for video. Likewise to your entrance gates....

Make sure you install lots of sockets at your hub location. I put in 10, and wish I had 15 as they are all used already.
Fit a master kill switch for these sockets. Run your hub elec sockets on one independent spur, so you don't get spikes from other items in the house - fridges etc.

creedp

gman2k wrote: »

Go with Cat6 cable instead of Cat5, very little difference in material cost, and you are future proofed.
Run dual Cat6 to each TV point also from your Hub. Dual Cat6 cables can be converted to HDMI at each end, and can cater for long distance transmission of 1080p video signals.
Run multiple Cat6 to each bedroom for future telephone/ internet etc.

Run TV cable from each TV point back to your central point, and from there, run 2 cables to your aerial point. Put your aerial in the attic, easy to access, no ladders to roof etc and not visually intrusive.
You can fit an amp/splitter in your hub position to distribute TV signal.
Run Satellite cable to each TV point back to your hub, or as I did direct to dish point - I fitted an Octo LNB so each TV can access Sat TV independently. Freeview Sat boxes are very cheap now. (FreeSat are a bit dearer)
Run 2 sat cables to your main satellite receiver position from dish (generally living room) so you can watch and record different channels.
Wire your living room for 7.1 sound - use good quality speaker cable, do not let your builder buy speaker cable - get it yourself from Richersounds or similar. Fit a specific sub-woofer cable during built process, and have all cables concealed. Get help from some one in the know about planing a 7.1 system.
Allow for multi-room sound.
Plan in detail your living room, look at furniture layouts and where your TV will go. Think about what way your TV will be - i.e. wall mounted? then allow for sockets, HDMI, PC monitor compatible cables, central speaker position behind TV etc.
Allow for a possible projector position in your living room area - ceiling mounted. Again a few Cat6 cables and elec socket.

What way will you be accessing the internet?
If through landline, then make sure your hub position has landline connection also. The old fashioned way of having your telephone in the hall is for the birds - make sure your builder brings your land line cable to your hub point.
If through Wireless, run another Sat cable up to your attic so a wireless can be piped back down to your hub from here. Fit a few sockets in your attic!
Run Cat 6 cables to each corner of the eaves of your house - to allow for possible CCTV. Put a couple of elec sockets in your eaves for Xmas lights.
Run Cat6 to your entrance door point, allows for video. Likewise to your entrance gates....

Make sure you install lots of sockets at your hub location. I put in 10, and wish I had 15 as they are all used already.
Fit a master kill switch for these sockets. Run your hub elec sockets on one independent spur, so you don't get spikes from other items in the house - fridges etc.

Mother of God are you wiring up NASAs next moon station there! I'd have to be awake in the house 24/7/365 for years to justify that kind of spec!! In addition I hope the SEAI don't find out about the potential power requirements of all those electrical appliances you'll be running as they are trying to make my build non-compliant because I'm running a 100watt Mhrv unit. I think I'm very much in OP territory because with the rate of technological change today I'm afraid what's considered future proofing today is old hat tomorrow. Anyway everyone to their own but if I thought I'd have an hour to watch a bit of TV in peace over the next 10 years I'd whoop for joy!!

paddy147

gman2k wrote: »

Go with Cat6 cable instead of Cat5, very little difference in material cost, and you are future proofed.
Run dual Cat6 to each TV point also from your Hub. Dual Cat6 cables can be converted to HDMI at each end, and can cater for long distance transmission of 1080p video signals.
Run multiple Cat6 to each bedroom for future telephone/ internet etc.

Run TV cable from each TV point back to your central point, and from there, run 2 cables to your aerial point. Put your aerial in the attic, easy to access, no ladders to roof etc and not visually intrusive.
You can fit an amp/splitter in your hub position to distribute TV signal.
Run Satellite cable to each TV point back to your hub, or as I did direct to dish point - I fitted an Octo LNB so each TV can access Sat TV independently. Freeview Sat boxes are very cheap now. (FreeSat are a bit dearer)
Run 2 sat cables to your main satellite receiver position from dish (generally living room) so you can watch and record different channels.
Wire your living room for 7.1 sound - use good quality speaker cable, do not let your builder buy speaker cable - get it yourself from Richersounds or similar. Fit a specific sub-woofer cable during built process, and have all cables concealed. Get help from some one in the know about planing a 7.1 system.
Allow for multi-room sound.
Plan in detail your living room, look at furniture layouts and where your TV will go. Think about what way your TV will be - i.e. wall mounted? then allow for sockets, HDMI, PC monitor compatible cables, central speaker position behind TV etc.
Allow for a possible projector position in your living room area - ceiling mounted. Again a few Cat6 cables and elec socket.

What way will you be accessing the internet?
If through landline, then make sure your hub position has landline connection also. The old fashioned way of having your telephone in the hall is for the birds - make sure your builder brings your land line cable to your hub point.
If through Wireless, run another Sat cable up to your attic so a wireless can be piped back down to your hub from here. Fit a few sockets in your attic!
Run Cat 6 cables to each corner of the eaves of your house - to allow for possible CCTV. Put a couple of elec sockets in your eaves for Xmas lights.
Run Cat6 to your entrance door point, allows for video. Likewise to your entrance gates....

Make sure you install lots of sockets at your hub location. I put in 10, and wish I had 15 as they are all used already.
Fit a master kill switch for these sockets. Run your hub elec sockets on one independent spur, so you don't get spikes from other items in the house - fridges etc.

Its a house and not a data storage facility.

gman2k

paddy147 wrote: »

Its a house and not a data storage facility.

Nothing difficult in the the spec I outlined, all the Cat6, TV, Sat and AV cabling was bought and wires pulled by myself.
PS, I've multiroom audio to dining room, wired back to hub/ AV cabinet.
Master bedroom is wired for 7.1, with bathroom speaker'ed also.
Kitchen ceiling has built in speakers, again, no rocket science here.
If you are doing a self build it's a piece of pi$$, just has to be planned carefully.
Maybe €300 spent on the physical wires.

There's a lot of lads out there going a hell of a lot further with home automation, running Cat cables to all light switches, sockets etc.

Re data storage, that's next on the list, a NAS will have to be bought soon, and linked into the Wifi network, and the home server properly setup for streaming audio and video! :pac:

imitation

gman2k wrote: »

Go with Cat6 cable instead of Cat5, very little difference in material cost, and you are future proofed.
Run dual Cat6 to each TV point also from your Hub. Dual Cat6 cables can be converted to HDMI at each end, and can cater for long distance transmission of 1080p video signals.
Run multiple Cat6 to each bedroom for future telephone/ internet etc.

You have quite the media hub home gman

The advantage of Cat 6 over Cat 5e it has better bandwidth, and in order to do this it must be less susceptible to noise, some of this noise reduction comes from the physical layout of the wires in the insulation. The problem here lies in the fact that the electrician may not take much care in laying the cable causing damage and negating the benefit.

I'd also be careful of the future proofed trap, you can spend alot of money on cabling only to find in a decade a new standard has replaced it. Its very possible we might be wiring our homes with fibre optic cables. One of the things i was hoping to do was to insert conduits for cabling, but this proved too difficult to do while keeping airtightness rating as low as possbile.

gman2k

Yeah, but dual Cat6 can handle 1080p video and beyond, and very high speed data. It'll be a long time before anything faster than that is needed (in low band Ireland anyway)
There is no justification in going to the bother of putting in Cat5 when Cat6 is only marginally more expensive.
If it's a timber frame house, it's definitely a DIY job for a day to lay out a network.
You don't have to spend megabucks on cable, a 100m drum of Cat6 isn't really expensive, and should do the needs for a standard house no bother.
You just have to be careful with radii and pulling it though tight spots. Even terminating the ends is an easy DIY job

Poor Uncle Tom

Is there any way a percentage of those could be handled wirelessly and reliabaly?

M cebee

gman2k wrote: »

Go with Cat6 cable instead of Cat5, very little difference in material cost, and you are future proofed.
Run dual Cat6 to each TV point also from your Hub. Dual Cat6 cables can be converted to HDMI at each end, and can cater for long distance transmission of 1080p video signals.
Run multiple Cat6 to each bedroom for future telephone/ internet etc.

Run TV cable from each TV point back to your central point, and from there, run 2 cables to your aerial point. Put your aerial in the attic, easy to access, no ladders to roof etc and not visually intrusive.
You can fit an amp/splitter in your hub position to distribute TV signal.
Run Satellite cable to each TV point back to your hub, or as I did direct to dish point - I fitted an Octo LNB so each TV can access Sat TV independently. Freeview Sat boxes are very cheap now. (FreeSat are a bit dearer)
Run 2 sat cables to your main satellite receiver position from dish (generally living room) so you can watch and record different channels.
Wire your living room for 7.1 sound - use good quality speaker cable, do not let your builder buy speaker cable - get it yourself from Richersounds or similar. Fit a specific sub-woofer cable during built process, and have all cables concealed. Get help from some one in the know about planing a 7.1 system.
Allow for multi-room sound.
Plan in detail your living room, look at furniture layouts and where your TV will go. Think about what way your TV will be - i.e. wall mounted? then allow for sockets, HDMI, PC monitor compatible cables, central speaker position behind TV etc.
Allow for a possible projector position in your living room area - ceiling mounted. Again a few Cat6 cables and elec socket.

What way will you be accessing the internet?
If through landline, then make sure your hub position has landline connection also. The old fashioned way of having your telephone in the hall is for the birds - make sure your builder brings your land line cable to your hub point.
If through Wireless, run another Sat cable up to your attic so a wireless can be piped back down to your hub from here. Fit a few sockets in your attic!
Run Cat 6 cables to each corner of the eaves of your house - to allow for possible CCTV. Put a couple of elec sockets in your eaves for Xmas lights.
Run Cat6 to your entrance door point, allows for video. Likewise to your entrance gates....

Make sure you install lots of sockets at your hub location. I put in 10, and wish I had 15 as they are all used already.
Fit a master kill switch for these sockets. Run your hub elec sockets on one independent spur, so you don't get spikes from other items in the house - fridges etc.

-the sockets for the eaves can be fed through photocell+timer and looped

-inacessible sockets eg:ceiling and behind telly will need isolating switches

-domestic phone line can be brought from master socket(ntu) to hub

'clean line/s' for hub and separate rcbo/s

IT equipment can also be exempted from rcd protection-if you prevent sockets use for general purpose

paddy147

gman2k wrote: »

Yeah, but dual Cat6 can handle 1080p video and beyond, and very high speed data.

Can I ask how you turn 2 cat 6 cables into 1080p HDMI and what type of connections you would use?

Do you have a pic of them going into your TV or media hub?

Thanks.:)

gman2k

paddy147 wrote: »

Can I ask how you turn 2 cat 6 cables into 1080p HDMI and what type of connections you would use?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HDMI-RJ45-Cat-6-Extender-110M-360FT-1080p-V1-3b-/390075608266?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item5ad2516cca#ht_2708wt_700
or
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HDMI-Over-CAT5E-CAT6-7-Wall-plate-Extender-Kit-Krone-/220670139193?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_Video_HomeCinemaSystems&hash=item3360f71b39#ht_4512wt_1068

BMD

Thanks for all the advice......to be honest I am not a real techi and therefore don't want something that is over the top...I just want something which delivers good speed internet (mainly for email) in accessible locations and a decent entertainment system which allows me to access sky etc. should I want it without having to run cables across the floor etc....I hope you may be able to answer my questions below based on your replies

Am I correct in thinking that all the cat 5e data cables will run back to a utility hub in the utility room and this hub effectively works as a home server. Are these hubs widely available or do you have to go down the smart homes route??

Am I also correct in thinking that for any room where I want a tv that I should install two co-ax cables and if I want to add sky at this point that I should have four co-ax points? Will all these co-ax cables be routed to a central point in the attic space?

What is the difference in co-ax and sat cables?

Regarding phone lines, I can either use the cat5e cables or alternatively run phone wire from each point to another central location in the attic?

If I want to install a sky dish at some stage what do I need? A dish outside with a co-ax cable running to the central location in the attic? Is there a requirement for a phone point or data point for sky? What provisions do I need to make regarding a hole to take the wire into the attic?

Is a sky box located in one room and is multi room viewing a possibility?

Is it possible to play a DVD in the main living room and watch it in the master bedroom? If so, then what do I need to do?

Also what is the story with digital tv, will my antenna become redundant soon?

Should I run my coax cables back to the utility room also or just leave them in the attic?

Finally, if I wanted to put in a central music system in the future, should should I also run speaker cables to possible speaker points and back to a central point in the utility room?

imitation

This post could probably be split up into 3 or 4 different threads on different forums given all the questions

BMD wrote: »

Am I correct in thinking that all the cat 5e data cables will run back to a utility hub in the utility room and this hub effectively works as a home server. Are these hubs widely available or do you have to go down the smart homes route??

You'll want to bring all your cabling back to a central location. At this point you will have a Network switch that will form your network. The switch will form the centre of your network, so if you have two computers in two different rooms connected into you Cat 5 the switch will pass data between them. You can also plug your broadband router into the switch. Switches are very common and pretty inexpensive, starting from 20 quid and working up depending on ports and there sophistication. Id recommending getting one from a well know manufacturer like Cisco or Netgear. Its important to note that you can't use the switch for stuff like speaker wires or analogue phones.

Smart homes goes beyond a basic switch with stuff like multiroom audio, I don't know much about it but it seems pretty expensive and you would really want to have the features.

Am I also correct in thinking that for any room where I want a tv that I should install two co-ax cables and if I want to add sky at this point that I should have four co-ax points? Will all these co-ax cables be routed to a central point in the attic space?

What is the difference in co-ax and sat cables?

You'll need one coaxial cable for your analogue TV, and two more for your Sky (if you only have one then you can't record one channel while watching another). Your satellite dish should have a corresponding number of connectors.

Satellite cables are the same as coax cables, the only difference is the connector at the end, a LNB

If I want to install a sky dish at some stage what do I need? A dish outside with a co-ax cable running to the central location in the attic? Is there a requirement for a phone point or data point for sky? What provisions do I need to make regarding a hole to take the wire into the attic?

Is a sky box located in one room and is multi room viewing a possibility?

Is it possible to play a DVD in the main living room and watch it in the master bedroom? If so, then what do I need to do?

Put your coax cables into the attic, these need to be connected to the satellite dish itself and your aerial. Its worth putting a socket nearby in case you need a booster for your aerial.

You can get various video senders that will work over all sorts of medium, Cat5-6 would be the best option as far as I know (not really my field).

Also what is the story with digital tv, will my antenna become redundant soon?

Digital TV uses normal UHF aerials, the only thing you will have to change for digital is your TV, there should be set top boxes soon that you can plug into your existing TV.

Id check out the TV form, theres some good information there http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=40

paddy147

gman2k wrote: »

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HDMI-RJ45-Cat-6-Extender-110M-360FT-1080p-V1-3b-/390075608266?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item5ad2516cca#ht_2708wt_700
or
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HDMI-Over-CAT5E-CAT6-7-Wall-plate-Extender-Kit-Krone-/220670139193?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_Video_HomeCinemaSystems&hash=item3360f71b39#ht_4512wt_1068

Thanks.:)

Laroshrwd1

Just a quick note to say I agree with gman2K, currently in the process of building a house and for the sake of ~€1.5k I'm going to make sure the house is a future proof as can be reasonably done in 2011!.. Running km's of Cat6, speaker, WF100 co-axial, some HDMI and optic fibre to most places. running the low voltage "stuff" myself. Some of the things that can be done with home automation really is amazing...

the real cost is the hardware at the end of all the relatively cheap cabling, this I can add over the years as it invariably becomes less expensive..

My initial plans are control 4 partials for video, lighting, heating... Sonos for multiroom audio...

LaroshRWD1

Carlow52

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Is there any way a percentage of those could be handled wirelessly and reliabaly?

Bandwidth is the issue here with any wireless as well as the security issues with wireless. I know wireless compression is getting better but it is resource hungry so u need more processing power
IMO 'hardwired built' is better built:)

As to the comment somewhere in this thread on air tightness, all the wiring should be inside the air tightness membrane and wires going out should either be grommet-ed or buried in ducts in the floor, same as the ESB cable from meter

fclauson

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Is there any way a percentage of those could be handled wirelessly and reliabaly?

There are a number of problems with this
1) any aluminium coated insulation works as a great faraday shield
2) there is more and more "noise" in a home these days - and despite saying on the packet "will reach 100M in clear air" an home (especially in a built up area) does not have clear air

So solid, hard cables work best

Francis

fclauson

Carlow52 wrote: »

...As to the comment somewhere in this thread on air tightness, all the wiring should be inside the air tightness membrane and wires going out should either be grommet-ed or buried in ducts in the floor, same as the ESB cable from meter

yes remember that any polystyrene will make PVC cables brittle and the insulation will fail over time

Thats why you diskwasher which comes in nice packaging has the cable in a little plastic bag to protect it

cuculainn

Hi Just to ressurect this thread,

We are just that the point of wiring in tv internet etc.

I plan on running Cat6 to each room (more or less)

Is one cat6 enough to run?

I plan on creating a hub in the utility with NAS and broadband

Will the one Cat6 be enough to handle potentially playing media from NAS and Broadband simultaneously?

Are there other things I need to consider?

I am also considering a centralised sound sytem/internet radio/ provisions but dont know where to start on that:eek:

Laroshrwd1

Cuculain, I suggest you run a minimum of three CAT6 and two good co-axials (e.g. WF100, CT100) to each TV point... there are a lot of "smart" TV's coming onto the market that can be used for browsing the web, this will become even more common in years to come. the two further cat6 can be used with balun's to transfer HDMI signal from your hub.

Two co-axial in case you want to run a sky+ or sky HD receiver at your TV, or you may want to run terrestial and feed from a centralised sky box...

Personally I have run 6 Cat6 and 4 co-ax (+HDMI and optical) to the main TV areas... better to have them there that not, easy to do when building...

HTH
Laroshrwd1

sas

Laroshrwd1 wrote: »

My initial plans are control 4 partials for video, lighting, heating... Sonos for multiroom audio...

LaroshRWD1

Any chance you have a contact (PM please) for getting control 4 that doesn't involve the Irish agents? Got a price recently, never laughed so hard in all my life...

cuculainn

Laroshrwd1 wrote: »

Cuculain, I suggest you run a minimum of three CAT6 and two good co-axials (e.g. WF100, CT100) to each TV point... there are a lot of "smart" TV's coming onto the market that can be used for browsing the web, this will become even more common in years to come. the two further cat6 can be used with balun's to transfer HDMI signal from your hub.

Two co-axial in case you want to run a sky+ or sky HD receiver at your TV, or you may want to run terrestial and feed from a centralised sky box...

Personally I have run 6 Cat6 and 4 co-ax (+HDMI and optical) to the main TV areas... better to have them there that not, easy to do when building...

HTH
Laroshrwd1

Thanks for the reply Laroshrwd1. Thats a serious amount of Cat6.....We definitely dont have the chases in for that....Might squeeze 3 in tho!

Is there still the same constraints with running cat6 parallel to electrical cables?

AFAIK Cat5 have to run perpendicular to electricals if very close? Or if we install shielded CAT is it easier to near electrics

Laroshrwd1

Might be worth considering a 2nd chase to widen the first... I did
(& a 3rd & 4th) but maybe I got carried away :eek:

As far as I know both Cat 5 and 6 are similarly succeptable to being affected by external noise, e.g. powerlines running parallel in close proximity, shielded is better but probably not necessary for domestic use. My take on it is to have powerlines perpendicular where possible, and if in parallel; keep at least 10cm away. TBH I'm not sure how big a problem it will be for the freq and data capacity that can be used in domestic situations, I will have locations where power lines will be within a few cm of the CAT 6 for ~50cm or longer and its pretty much unavoidable... I'm sure (hoping) it will still work fine...

Laroshrwd1