Commercial Questions (sync, licensing, royalties, etc)

MilanPan!c

I kinda think we should have a sticky with a good over-view of info related to this.

I just tried to find this info, which a ton of you guys must know, and couldn't...

Anyway, here's my question, the answer may prove to be very valuable to everyone trying to sell music from Ireland.

First, my band is releasing it's debut single, via Tunecore, that seems like the easy part, they provide a decent return, give it to almost everyone and will provide an IRSC and Barcode for free (as far as I can tell..).

We're also going to sending it, via a PR company, to radio in Ireland AND the UK (it's going out to 80+ stations at this point)

AND

We're finalising a deal to have the music used in a few UK TV shows.

So, what do I need to do?

If I set up a label, as a Partnership, do I need to register it with Revenue, or..? What?

Do I need to do that to license music in the UK/Ireland?

Does everyone that's uses Tunecore have their own label?

Any info on this would be hugely appreciated.

Next question, the agency that's representing us, in the UK, wants an PRO number... can I just use IMRO stuff?

Finally, How do I register exactly the contribution members make to both the writing of songs and the recording?

In the States I know how to do this, a bit better, but here I feel like I'm starting all over.

Thank in advance... hope this helps others as well!

Malice

Good idea for a thread. If you get the questions answered I'll update the resources thread with the information.

Fandango

Im not familiar with Tunecore but i would think IMRO should cover pretty much everything you are asking about. I havent really checked them out in a while as the songs i was involved in arent getting enough airplay anymore to warrant the effort but when they were getting played, IMRO looked after foreign royalties (well, the UK anyway) as well as domestic. Also, im pretty sure you can put the percentage for each member for each song on their website if your registered there. As i said, i havent looked into that side of things for about 8 years so might well have changed.

Malice

THeSeahooks is banned for a week for insulting another user. If you have a problem with a post or a poster please discuss it with me off-thread, don't derail this one.

MilanPan!c

So quickly putting aside the haters... LOL...

I asked around and was told, via the Twitter account of IMRO, that IMRO coverage extends internationally.


So then I called IMRO, talked to someone in their Membership Signup department named Claire, who was incredibly helpful.

What I learned.

IMRO membership is basically step one.

When you become a member you get kind of commercial artist number, which can be used in Ireland and the UK (and Europe I believe).

You can also register all your tunes with IMRO, an basically assign songwriting credits per song. However, each listed songwriter needs a to be a member of an Org like IMRO (like PRS in the UK).

Now.

Once that has happened, you can go to tunecore, etc. and upload the songs. You'll need to tell IMRO that the songs are on tunecore, iTunes etc. In fact, I was told I needed to tell IMRO anywhere the songs are being used, like commercials, tv shows etc.

The one caveat to all of this is that to be an IMRO member you'll need to prove you're a commercial artist. There's a list of ways to prove that on their website.

If anyone has any questions ask... I prolly forgot something.


I guess my main advice is this, if you have questions relate to this stuff, call the IMRO.


Hope this helps.

Oh and IMRO membership is free.

discobeaker

Hey Milanpanic.

This really is an interesting topic that the mods should make as a sticky for all the musicians that are getting down to the business side of things.

I would recommend maybe picking up this book,its pretty much the music business 101 for every musician. We used it in college when doing contract law. Its called "All you need to know about the music business" by Donald Passman. The newest edition is the 7th edition and its about 25 euro to get in easons.

Have a read through that before you sign any contracts as it tells you all you need to know and look out for.

Im abit off your topic but i hope its helpful mate

MilanPan!c

Also thanks for the other suggestions folks. That book sounds interesting!

discobeaker

MilanPan!c wrote: »

Also thanks for the other suggestions folks. That book sounds interesting!

Its pretty much like the music industry for dummys kinda book and tells it all broken down into easier terms. The 7th edition will probably deal more indepth about downloading your tracks and stuff cos the laws seem to change every week on it.

I have my one ordered from easons and its 20 pounds sterling so thats about 25-30 euro. Hopefully you enjoy it mate

Malice

discobeaker wrote: »

This really is an interesting topic that the mods should make as a sticky for all the musicians that are getting down to the business side of things.

If you read the second post on this thread you'll see what I intend to do with the information once all the questions are answered.

discobeaker

My bad,was kinda watching the news about whats happened in Japan and post at the same time and i wasnt paying attention. Im so thick!!!!

Malice

discobeaker wrote: »

My bad,was kinda watching the news about whats happened in Japan and post at the same time and i wasnt paying attention. Im so thick!!!!

No worries, the tsunami stuff is captivating for sure .

MilanPan!c

That whirlpool thing was so freaking scary looking!

--

another quick tidbit, I asked this question on the FMC homepage and they invited me in to have someone explain the process, etc. Like a quick sitdown.

How cool is that?

Def seems like they're also responsive! Worth a look!

jus_tin4

Okay question, i recently broke up wit my band, and they have tracks i recorded on.how do i claim royalities etc? the band split was in bad blood lets just say and i no longer communicate with them

Waking-Dreams

Recording alone doesn't get you squat. You have to be one of the songwriters, lyrics (50%), main melody (50%).

MilanPan!c

jus_tin4 wrote: »

Okay question, i recently broke up wit my band, and they have tracks i recorded on.how do i claim royalities etc? the band split was in bad blood lets just say and i no longer communicate with them

This is not legal advice:

IMO you need to find out if the songs you helped write hve been registered with the IMRO or another similar ORG. If they have and you're not a listed songwriter I think you either need to appeal to the listed songwriters to ammend the record or consider calling someone like IMRO and asking their advice.

Hopefully, for your sake, they haven't been registered ad you can take the initiative at this point to register with IMRO or an equivalent and discuss with them how to protect yourself.

At the end of the day, my advice is call the IMRO, find I the songs are in their database and ask for advice.

That's my opinion only, but I hope it's helpful.

MilanPan!c

Waking-Dreams wrote: »

Recording alone doesn't get you squat. You have to be one of the songwriters, lyrics (50%), main melody (50%).

I think that's not quite true. There's another orginisation called RAAP that looks after the players on tracks. I don't know what they money involved is, but it def exists! Google it.

EDIT:

http://www.raap.ie/index.php?go=introduction-to-raap

January 1st 2001 New Legislation introduced into Ireland has meant that ALL Irish Artists and Performers, Featured and Non Featured are entitled to a payment when a Sound Recording that they have contributed to is Publicly Broadcast in Ireland.This Right has existed in other countries for quite some time.

Waking-Dreams

That’s a nice change. It used to be quid pro quo or with session musicians, a daily rate. The only money musicians who didn't write any songs could look to was touring splits or merch.

Though, the problem with this person’s situation is that it could all be verbal agreements and the band have not registered their songs or maybe they have, but have only listed the songwriters.

To be honest, they’ve only given us a snap-snot of the situation: “Split with band; we don’t talk; what can I get?”

Need more info, or yeah, talk to IMRO or an entertainment lawyer about it if you really think you’re going to be missing out on lots of money (which unless this band are very popular, is unlikely).

Fandango

MilanPan!c wrote: »

I think that's not quite true. There's another orginisation called RAAP that looks after the players on tracks. I don't know what they money involved is, but it def exists! Google it.

EDIT:

http://www.raap.ie/index.php?go=introduction-to-raap

January 1st 2001 New Legislation introduced into Ireland has meant that ALL Irish Artists and Performers, Featured and Non Featured are entitled to a payment when a Sound Recording that they have contributed to is Publicly Broadcast in Ireland.This Right has existed in other countries for quite some time.

Id say the money involved is very small. I would also imagine it only applies if the session player or whatever actually wrote the guitar/bass/drum line they recorded on the track. If your paid as a session player for recording it on the day and didnt actually write any part of the music, i dont see why you would be entitled to any royalties.

As for the person whos band broke up. I would suggest trying to sort it out between yourselves first before bringing in lawyers etc. If your not on the best of terms, even do it through email (and keep copies of the emails for proof!) and if that fails then try a more official route. Unless the tracks are getting serious airplay tho, it wouldnt really be worth the hassle. Of course if there is a good chance that they may see airplay in future, it would be worth doing it now

MilanPan!c

Fandango wrote: »

Id say the money involved is very small. I would also imagine it only applies if the session player or whatever actually wrote the guitar/bass/drum line they recorded on the track. If your paid as a session player for recording it on the day and didnt actually write any part of the music, i dont see why you would be entitled to any royalties.

As for the person whos band broke up. I would suggest trying to sort it out between yourselves first before bringing in lawyers etc. If your not on the best of terms, even do it through email (and keep copies of the emails for proof!) and if that fails then try a more official route. Unless the tracks are getting serious airplay tho, it wouldnt really be worth the hassle. Of course if there is a good chance that they may see airplay in future, it would be worth doing it now

Def not true about the writing the lines. It's a purely a performance credit and related royalties. This is def the norm in the states and I was very surprised to learn it was only recently the case here.

It isn't much money, that's true.

I think though, that musicians can lose those rights by agreeing to a flat fee, that's my understanding of how it works in the US.

Anyway, writing and performance are def separate credits in the states and apparently here and most places.

Def worth calling RAAP and IMRO though, for clarificationn.

trad

I bought a copy of Passman's Book "All you need to know about the Music Business, Seventh edition" in Waterstones Newry on Friday £20stg. I'm a couple of chapters in. Good reading.