Pets and Social Welfare/Affordability

forensic

Following on from a post over on the State Benefits forum I have a question for all the pet owners here. Has anyone ever been told, not advised or suggested to think about it, but actually told to get rid of their pets by Social Welfare?

Sorry, don't know how to link posts but pasted below is my own post on the subject of begrudgery and the social welfare.

"Social welfare told me I should get rid of my pets as I obviously can't afford them.....

I was shocked to say the least. I don't have kids because they're a HUGE responsibility and WAY too expensive. But if i did have a child, prior to availing of social welfare, and then my circumstances changed, would the SW be saying to me to get rid of the child?

I'd imagine anyone here that does have children would feed and clothe them before feeding and clothing themselves, and ask anyone with a pet, who they consider a member of the family, and they would probably say the same thing.

I'd go without food, heat, dentist/doctor visits, before I'd not feed my pets or bring them to the vet.

Pets, just like children, can't look after themselves so its OUR responsibility as the grown ups to look after them as far as I'm concerned.

The list of so called luxuries goes on. Internet access, bus tickets, contraception (believe it or not!)

The mind boggles...... "

Has anyone else in the unfortunate situation of finding themselves reliant upon social welfare been told this?

I honestly couldn't believe it. I was told out straight to get rid of my pets! I should point out I have 2 cats, not an entire menagerie of animals.

I'm just curious to know.

The Sweeper

Telling people in an economic downturn to get rid of their pets is a false economy.

Yes, so you don't have to feed them any more, and have no risk of vet bills.

However, pets do a lot for people spiritually and emotionally. They are their own furry support network. Dogs provide a reason to exercise outside the home and give companionship and a distraction from sad times. Cats are comforting and can be highly entertaining in their compulsory 45 minutes of madness in the evenings.

The attachment people have to their pets should never be underestimated and the benefit that attachment brings should also never be underestimated.

It's also none of the social welfare's business if you have pets. If you can afford them, fair enough. There's no 'pet benefit' that I know of. You can't claim for them. It's not like the taxpayers are paying for your pets. I might advise an unemployed person not to go out and get a pet where they didn't have one before, but I wouldn't be telling them to give up their pets. It's your own business - if you can afford to feed it and look after it, keep your pet and screw them.

Noo

I heard you can get about €12 a week extra from social welfare if you have a dog, apparently people are buying licences for dogs they dont have just to get the extra few quid a week...please correct me if i'm wrong about this, just something i heard.

If it is true how can they tell you to get rid of certain animals then pay support for others??

Asking someone to get rid of their pets is absolutely ridiculous and so depressing, talk about kicking someone when theyre down. You can guarantee the person asking you to do it doesnt have any pets!

ISDW

Noo wrote: »

I heard you can get about €12 a week extra from social welfare if you have a dog, apparently people are buying licences for dogs they dont have just to get the extra few quid a week...please correct me if i'm wrong about this, just something i heard.

If it is true how can they tell you to get rid of certain animals then pay support for others??

Asking someone to get rid of their pets is absolutely ridiculous and so depressing, talk about kicking someone when theyre down. You can guarantee the person asking you to do it doesnt have any pets!

No, that is not true, I don't know where on earth that myth started, but its done the rounds a good bit.

lorebringer

As far as I am aware, social welfare cannot tell you what to spend your money on - they can advise you, but they cannot outright force you to do anything with the money you receive. If you were to (hypothetically!) decide to spend it all on alcohol one week (or whatever), there is absolutely nothing they can do about it. What you do with your money is your business.

planetX

I don't understand how it would ever come up with social welfare - why would they care if you have pets or not? As stated above there is no allowance, if someone chooses to go without heat so that they can pay a vets bill whose business is it? I've had to do that this winter, and I will again because I need my pets to keep me sane, they are not a luxury.

Noo

yeah i had a feeling the extra payment was a bit strange alright.

What are they going to do if you refuse? Deny your payment? I would love to see "Person has two cats" as a reason for refusal. Or come along and physically pry the cats from your hands? As someone already said what you spend your money on is your own business. I'd be pretty confident you'd win an appeal against them if this is the only reasons they are giving.

Another question...did you get an inspector around or something? How did they know you had cats? I've filled out loads of welfare stuff and i could have a zoo and they wouldnt know about it, i never got asked about animals.

Cookie_Monster

Those cats probably ratted him out, you know what cats are like, sly buggers

forensic

lorebringer wrote: »

As far as I am aware, social welfare cannot tell you what to spend your money on - they can advise you, but they cannot outright force you to do anything with the money you receive. If you were to (hypothetically!) decide to spend it all on alcohol one week (or whatever), there is absolutely nothing they can do about it. What you do with your money is your business.

yep i totally agree.....chance would be a fine thing regarding the alcohol

planetX wrote: »

I don't understand how it would ever come up with social welfare - why would they care if you have pets or not? As stated above there is no allowance, if someone chooses to go without heat so that they can pay a vets bill whose business is it? I've had to do that this winter, and I will again because I need my pets to keep me sane, they are not a luxury.

My pets are my family as far as I'm concerned, and they certainly keep me more sane than my "actual" family. I'd be lost without them.

Noo wrote: »

What are they going to do if you refuse? Deny your payment? I would love to see "Person has two cats" as a reason for refusal. Or come along and physically pry the cats from your hands? As someone already said what you spend your money on is your own business. I'd be pretty confident you'd win an appeal against them if this is the only reasons they are giving.

Another question...did you get an inspector around or something? How did they know you had cats? I've filled out loads of welfare stuff and i could have a zoo and they wouldnt know about it, i never got asked about animals.

No, not an inspector visit, it came about from me being in the local SW office enquiring about a very long delay in a long awaited and much needed (and totally deserved) payment (not JB if that makes any difference), then the ensuing questions about income and expenditure, and "surely there must be somewhere you could cut back a bit more" question. I was shocked when I was told "sure nobody needs to keep 2 cats, they're a bit of an unecessary expense don't you think? You should just get rid of them and save a few quid every week, then you wouldn't be in here complaining to us"

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Those cats probably ratted him out, you know what cats are like, sly buggers

Ah my 2 know which side their bread is buttered, they wouldn't dare

Anyway like i said I was just curious if this scenario had been put to anyone else and what their response/reaction was.

Cherry Blossom

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056201359

<Cross posted with your last post>

I don't drink, I don't smoke, I have a virtually non-existant social life, moved back in with my mother so I don't have to pay rent. If I feel like spending €3 on a bale of hay to feed my horses for a day and have beans on toast myself instead of a roast chicken dinner I bloody well will.

But that's my decision, I don't feel hard done by for doing it nor do I whine about the cost of things. I can't imagine it would cost much to feed 2 cats in all honesty, certainly not enough to be worth mentioning in a conversation about how expensive every is, did this person actually ask if you had pets or did you bring it up? €10 a month feeds my cat-sized dog

mikemac

They don't tell you how to spend your money

How this started probably was people going to the Community Welfare Officer and asking for once off payments. Like to settle vet bills for example

And getting refused

You can ask the CWO for money for anything, whether you get it or not is another matter

forensic

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056201359

OP - did you go into the SW office enquiring about extra money (the imaginary €12 per week) for your pets or as others have said how did they know you have cats?

No I didn't, bit confused actually as to why you might have thought that based on my post in state benefits It was about a payment that i have been very patiently waiting for, not the dole, not any kind of supplementary allowance, nothing like that. (And the bit in that post about bus tickets and contraception, that is also true, and I was told both were a waste of money!)

Edited to add: sorry adrenalinjunkie, just realised the confusion, I mentioned "anyone reliant upon social welfare", I actually didn't mean me, I'm not reliant as such, but figured it was easier to pose the question to those that would be dealing with the SW on a regular basis (through no fault of there own I might add) I'm just dealing with them to chase up something i should have received a long time ago, and they wanted to know why i was so impatient about it, was i short of money, tell us you expenditure, sure if you got rid of the cats then you wouldn't be spending that money on them and you could be a bit more patient with us in here and wait longer for the money!

feelingstressed wrote: »

They don't tell you how to spend your money

How this started probably was people going to the Community Welfare Officer and asking for once off payments. Like to settle vet bills for example

And getting refused

You can ask the CWO for money for anything, whether you get it or not is another matter

No it wasn't the CWO, it all came up during an enquiry I made in the local SW office regarding a payment I have been waiting for. Nothing to do with a "handout" of any kind.

I'll be honest with you, it wasn't a pleasant experience going in, but it was a simple follow up enquiry, and nothing to do with weekly payments or anything like that, so I was quite surprised when I was asked all the questions about income and expenditure, but I answered honestly, and was then accused of complaining (which I honestly wasn't) and "wasting" money by having 2 cats.

I feel like this is all going slightly off topic.
I originally wanted to know if anyone else had ever been told anything similar by anyone from social welfare about keeping pets and the cost element of it.

Cherry Blossom

forensic wrote: »

I originally wanted to know if anyone else had ever been told anything similar by anyone from social welfare about keeping pets and the cost element of it.

To be honest I find them extremely condescending every time I have to deal with them and avoid any unnecessary conversations with them at all costs

forensic

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

To be honest I find them extremely condescending every time I have to deal with them and avoid any unnecessary conversations with them at all costs

yeah I know what you mean
some of them are great, and so understanding and helpful, but like anything else we only seem to talk about and hear about the bad experiences.

like I said, I'm just really curious, I can't imagine I'm the only one that has had that experience! I'm just not that special

angelfire9

They never said anything to me and I had a welfare officer out to visit me at the end of summer last year
(i had to go abroad for a family wedding and had told them I was on holiday from x date to x date and on the day I was due back in the country they called to the house to make sure i'd come home before they re-instated my payment)
(Like i was going to move abroad with zero money and a hubby & child in Ireland and I was even pregnant at the time)

But anyway I digress

Social Welfare officer called to the house
Cat attacked social welfare officer
Social Welfare officer left house :rolleyes:

Was never asked to get rid of slightly psycho kitty

hdowney

(good kitty :D)

seriously though that is beyond obnoxious. they have NO right to tell you to get rid of your pets. that is something cruel and ...... if they said that to me :eek: slap!

as long as you feel that whatever money you have coming in can be used to pay for the things that are necessary - the roof over your head etc - and can still pay all the kitty bills then there shouldn't be a problem.

i can possibly understand them refusing to take pet expenses into account as an outgoing expense when determining your eligiblity for a certain level of payment (like they do your rent etc) because pets, unlike children CAN if necessary (although I never would) be rehomed. if you have children, you have children, end of, and of course the social pay for you and your kids.

but if you were to put down, oh i have (for figures sake) 200 euro of pet expenses per month, next to rent and food etc, i can see them refusing to take that into account for their calculations.

but actually telling you the animals were a waste of space and money and to get rid!!!

i did have someone tell me before that i probably should get rid of my animals as they were an expense i couldn't really afford at the time. can't remember who it was but i just looked at them like they were martians. as you say, i would starve before giving them up