Green party

caseyann

I am curious why the green party took such a hit in elections,yet people are still voting FF.Surely it should have been other way around few greens in and no FF?

I feel bad for Gormley,i actually think they did not deserve to take the brunt of the hit,FF should have.FG sat back and watched all the **** happen also.Yet they were rewarded Irish people you dismay me how much you like to be taken for suckers.:(

ei.sdraob

see parallel green threads

dsmythy

Both of their support dropped. The problem for the Green Party was that they didn't have 70+ seats to begin with and so are consigned to history for now.

caseyann

dsmythy wrote: »

Both of their support dropped. The problem for the Green Party was that they didn't have 70+ seats to begin with and so are consigned to history for now.

How long were the green party in coalition with FF,yet they take the biggest hit?
I dont get the Irish thinking.
They did not create the problem nor did they stay when they were shown to have been lied to by FF also.
Yet they are literally gone and FF still is still in.
Were the greens policies that bad?
Because cant possibly be the ff policies that kept them in.

I look forward to greens back,SF in and independents.

dsmythy

caseyann wrote: »

How long were the green party in coalition with FF,yet they take the biggest hit?
I dont get the Irish thinking.
They did not create the problem nor did they stay when they were shown to have been lied to by FF also.
Yet they are literally gone and FF still is still in.
Were the greens policies that bad?
Because cant possibly be the ff policies that kept them in.

It took them too long to pull the plug on the Fianna Fail government. They may have kept some seats if they pulled it early last year.

gcgirl

You know the way when James bond falls in love with a girl they always get killed at the end well that's like any one FF get in to bed with

caseyann

dsmythy wrote: »

It took them too long to pull the plug on the Fianna Fail government. They may have kept some seats if they pulled it early last year.

Wasnt it seen as they had been lied to all along? So how could they pull the plug when they didnt know.But FG knew

gcgirl wrote: »

You know the way when James bond falls in love with a girl they always get killed at the end well that's like any one FF get in to bed with

That would have to be one of the best descriptions ever gcgirl
I do wish greens had of saved some seats and FF lost all

dsmythy

caseyann wrote: »

Wasnt it seen as they had been lied to all along? So how could they pull the plug when they didnt know.But FG knew

It stuck in people's minds that they propped up a deeply unpopular government. Fine Gael couldn't force their hand. The Greens could have but chose not to. They supported Fianna Fáil in all their actions and are now gone. Every party has a green agenda these days.

damonjewel

caseyann wrote: »

They did not create the problem nor did they stay when they were shown to have been lied to by FF also.

but they stayed through all the other stuff and left when only the last straw came which was that Brian Cowen didnt tell them he was stepping down, and the greens patience with FF had run out, thats hardly a lie.

The PD's suffered a similar end for supporting FF. Labour nearly did too back in the 90's.

Also FF have not been rewarded with 18 seats, its a total humiliation to the biggest political party in Ireland.

gcgirl

Indeed 1997 the spring tide went out solely because they got in to bed with FF

caseyann

damonjewel wrote: »

but they stayed through all the other stuff and left when only the last straw came which was that Brian Cowen didnt tell them he was stepping down, and the greens patience with FF had run out, thats hardly a lie.

The PD's suffered a similar end for supporting FF. Labour nearly did too back in the 90's.

Also FF have not been rewarded with 18 seats, its a total humiliation to the biggest political party in Ireland.

They shouldnt have even got one seat in the door way.

dvpower

caseyann wrote: »

I am curious why the green party took such a hit in elections,yet people are still voting FF.Surely it should have been other way around few greens in and no FF?

I feel bad for Gormley,i actually think they did not deserve to take the brunt of the hit,FF should have.FG sat back and watched all the **** happen also.Yet they were rewarded Irish people you dismay me how much you like to be taken for suckers.:(

The swing against them wasn't that great. They were fortunate to have as many seats as they did in the last Dáil given their % of the vote. Very difficult for smaller parties to translate votes into seats.

Its a pity they were all wiped out 'though. Some of the green TDs were amongst the smartest in the Dáil, but probably not politically smart enough to dump FF a long time ago.

caseyann

dvpower wrote: »

The swing against them wasn't that great. They were fortunate to have as many seats as they did in the last Dáil given their % of the vote. Very difficult for smaller parties to translate votes into seats.

Its a pity they were all wiped out 'though. Some of the green TDs were amongst the smartest in the Dáil, but probably not politically smart enough to dump FF a long time ago.

It is an awful shame they aligned themselves to them.I was personally shocked they lost all their seats.What were they thinking.
Whats next for them now.They see the very people who created this and lied to the Irish people and protected the bankers and developers etc.. and they are still in the door.
Sickens me they can get even 1 seat with their policies and their lies.By just changing the leader of the party.

Violafy

Because there are many people in Ireland who are narrow minded and stupid enough to vote FF no matter how much they destroy the country. They've been around for much longer than the Greens, and therefore have a number of followers who are too set in their ways to change their minds. I actually heard someone on the radio who was interviewed for RTE's exit poll say he was voting FF because he had always voted for them and because he thought "they'd done a good job".......?!
Also, some people just don't care about the environment/animal welfare and look down on the Greens for wanting to make a difference So yes OP, I despair too.
Hopefully they'll learn from their mistakes and get some seats in the next election.

K-9

gcgirl wrote: »

Indeed 1997 the spring tide went out solely because they got in to bed with FF

Ah I don't know on that one, they did after all jump ship and had longer in the Rainbow coalition.

I think I remember seeing somewhere that Labour lose seats after coalitions with FG!

As for the Greens, they'd a low base anyway and did well last time. They suffer because there is an anti Green agenda and FF and other parties have focussed on them as the reason for carbon tax etc. People don't focus on the savings many have made because of the road tax!

They really did pick the wrong time to go in Government and probably should have went a year ago but they knew they'd get hammered anyway, pulling the plug or not.

I actually like most of their policies on tax, education, social policy etc.

syklops

I feel bad for Gormley,i actually think they did not deserve to take the brunt of the hit,FF should have.FG sat back and watched all the **** happen also.Yet they were rewarded

The opposition has got very little power. Hardly any in fact. I don't know what you were expecting Enda Kenny et al to do while they sat in opposition. All they can do is ask difficult questions of those in power. During the good times, when Enda was asking difficult questions most people were going "That enda kenny, no charisma, no charm, what a failure hahahah".

In the last months of 2010 when the dogs in the street knew that FF's day were numbered, when Economics and Poli Sci students around the country and around the world knew that both the nation and the EU were waiting for stability and that that stability could only come from a change in government, and after repeated votes of no-confidence in the government, the Green party, who had the power to dissolve the government and force a general election, did not. They waited until the eleventh hour to do so, and cost the country time and money in doing so.

gcgirl

K-9 wrote: »

Ah I don't know on that one, they did after all jump ship and had longer in the Rainbow coalition.

I think I remember seeing somewhere that Labour lose seats after coalitions with FG!

As for the Greens, they'd a low base anyway and did well last time. They suffer because there is an anti Green agenda and FF and other parties have focussed on them as the reason for carbon tax etc. People don't focus on the savings many have made because of the road tax!

They really did pick the wrong time to go in Government and probably should have went a year ago but they knew they'd get hammered anyway, pulling the plug or not.

I actually like most of their policies on tax, education, social policy etc.

It was deffo the FF factor when you consider late 80's on labour did not do too badly after being in bed with FG, labour got a good vote in 92 because people did not want FF in and then labour fecked up and got in with FF, the rainbow government was good would have handled things better if giving the chance in 97 but labour paid a price !

bunny shooter

erm..................carbon tax................stag hunting bill & interferring with country sports.................fleecing commercial vehicle owners for extra road tax.............. and refusing to pull the plug on the most corrupt government we have ever seen !!!!!

Greens won't screw us culchies again :cool:

K-9

gcgirl wrote: »

It was deffo the FF factor when you consider late 80's on labour did not do too badly after being in bed with FG, labour got a good vote in 92 because people did not want FF in and then labour fecked up and got in with FF, the rainbow government was good would have handled things better if giving the chance in 97 but labour paid a price !

Ah but they lost seats in 87 IIRC, directly after a coalition with FG, same with 77 and I'd say if you went back, same thing applies.

97 was different as the FF factor was there but may have been balanced by leaving FF high and dry.

I don't think 92 is a fair comparison as that was after a FF/PD Government, you'd expect Labour gains, they just did very well.

Off topic, but they must dread years with 7 in them! 77, 87 and 97! They'll be thankful the next election can't be 17! I feel old!

Violafy

bunny shooter wrote: »

erm..................carbon tax................stag hunting bill & interferring with country sports.................fleecing commercial vehicle owners for extra road tax.............. and refusing to pull the plug on the most corrupt government we have ever seen !!!!!

Greens won't screw us culchies again :cool:

Ahh stag hunting, the fun "sport". If attempting to eliminate disgusting cruelty is "screwing over the culchies", then I hope they're back to screw you over again very soon! Funny how you all complain about the Greens putting themselves before the country. Your post contains nothing but selfishness and a complete lack of consideration for the environment of Ireland other than your own interests.

i57dwun4yb1pt8

Violafy wrote: »

Also, some people just don't care about the environment/animal welfare and look down on the Greens for wanting to make a difference .

I helped to remove them , and i care about the environment and animals
( i dont eat any - do you ??? )

They never made a difference , they were a power hungry bunch of middle class pseudo hippie fakesters - and were shown up to be the wasters they are.

Trevor sargent was probably the only true green , but thems the breaks.

Bistoman

Sorry, But Who?? Green?

ToadVine

It's a bit like this ...

FF are the slapper ... the girl you know will cheat on you ... you know she'll definitely do the dirty ... but hey, you'll have a hell of a time with her and a massive hangover in the morning. You dont expect much, and you know she has no loyalty, but what a hell of a night!

The Green Party are the nice girl next door ... you are in love with her, and she with you ... she is a lovely girl who has met your parents. You trust her, and she promises to be forever faithful. Then you find her taking it up the a** from the guy down the road who you hate. And she never took it up the a** from you!!

You might forgive the slapper ... you'll never, ever forgive the girl next door.

jellybeans

Violafy wrote: »

Because there are many people in Ireland who are narrow minded and stupid enough to vote FF no matter how much they destroy the country. They've been around for much longer than the Greens, and therefore have a number of followers who are too set in their ways to change their minds. I actually heard someone on the radio who was interviewed for RTE's exit poll say he was voting FF because he had always voted for them and because he thought "they'd done a good job".......?!
Also, some people just don't care about the environment/animal welfare and look down on the Greens for wanting to make a difference So yes OP, I despair too.
Hopefully they'll learn from their mistakes and get some seats in the next election.

My Granddad has voted FF all his life and when you talk to him about what they did he blames the opposition!! He will defend FF till the day he dies, even when you talk about all the brown envelopes, he still says "no it's them bloomin shower of Fina Gael", even when you say but what about Bertie...no no it's that other shower! it would be funny it wasn't true!

dsmythy

At least the green party can now be placed into the 'others' section.

Spacedog

Gormley stayed in government just long enough to get his pention. so he can suck my balls if he wants me to feel sorry for him.

Violafy

DaDumTish wrote: »

I helped to remove them , and i care about the environment and animals
( i dont eat any - do you ??? )

They never made a difference , they were a power hungry bunch of middle class pseudo hippie fakesters - and were shown up to be the wasters they are.

Trevor sargent was probably the only true green , but thems the breaks.

Nope, I don't eat any animals and also don't wear any.
I disagree with the second part though - I think the Greens have much better intentions than the likes of FF, who are as corrupt as hell and I'm still annoyed that they actually managed to get 18 seats. :mad: I'm a big enthusiast for animal welfare and the environment (probably like yourself judging by what you said), but I want there to be a represantative for these values in the Dáil, no matter how bad the recession is. None of these values are currently represented thanks to the Greens wipe-out, and this is what I'm unhappy with.

jellybeans

ToadVine wrote: »

It's a bit like this ...

FF are the slapper ... the girl you know will cheat on you ... you know she'll definitely do the dirty ... but hey, you'll have a hell of a time with her and a massive hangover in the morning. You dont expect much, and you know she has no loyalty, but what a hell of a night!

The Green Party are the nice girl next door ... you are in love with her, and she with you ... she is a lovely girl who has met your parents. You trust her, and she promises to be forever faithful. Then you find her taking it up the a** from the guy down the road who you hate. And she never took it up the a** from you!!

You might forgive the slapper ... you'll never, ever forgive the girl next door.

:D:D:D:D

Violafy

jellybeans wrote: »

My Granddad has voted FF all his life and when you talk to him about what they did he blames the opposition!! He will defend FF till the day he dies, even when you talk about all the brown envelopes, he still says "no it's them bloomin shower of Fina Gael", even when you say but what about Bertie...no no it's that other shower! it would be funny it wasn't true!

No offence, but this narrowminded loyalty is one of the reasons that Ireland is in such a mess. I know may be biased as a Greens supporter, but there's actually no way I could see a way for all of the blame to be put on them. There were what, less than ten of them in the Dail? FF are to blame for this. As for blaming the opposition.... That;s just ridiculous, sorry. All they can really do is make it difficult and act as an irritant, but FF always made the ultimate decisions. The Greens did have faults as they were inexperienced and misguided at times, but I hate how they've suffered much more than FF have. :mad: We can only hope that they'll learn from this and come back stronger!

Bistoman

caseyann wrote: »

How long were the green party in coalition with FF,yet they take the biggest hit?
I dont get the Irish thinking.
They did not create the problem nor did they stay when they were shown to have been lied to by FF also.
Yet they are literally gone and FF still is still in.
Were the greens policies that bad?
Because cant possibly be the ff policies that kept them in.

I look forward to greens back,SF in and independents.

At what point do You Think the Greens ware shown to have been lied to By FF?
Everyone else in the Country knew the FF ware lying, What was Gormless problem? Didn't He hear or see the protest marches? Did He Believe that We ware all wrong and FF had the monopoly in the Truth?

Gormless was the Biggest protester in the Dail before 07, He would point out everything that was wrong with Berties FF, He would let them away with nothing. Then He gets into power and suddinley FF cant do any wrong, The Banks collapse, He supports FF, The Opposition Scream out for an Election and He still supports FF. Bankers walk free, Regulators get big fat payoffs, Quangos and cronyism is rampant and still Gormless seyes NOYHING.
That is why the greens are Gone, They went into Government with FF and Forgot Why the people voted for them in the first place, The honesty and not letting a farcical Government continue.

c_man

Violafy wrote: »

a complete lack of consideration for the environment of Ireland other than your own interests.

Thank god for the Greens. Tens of thousands forced to leave, the hundreds of thousands who have no jobs to go and the shutting down of thousands of small businesses... all helps to reduce the carbon emissions of the country.

bonerjams03

Maybe somewhat ironically the lack of a list system, which they are in favour of means that they are not represented.

Proportional representation is only so proportional. The Socialist party got 1.2% of Votes and have two representatives, the Greens 1.8 and nothing. Yes, I know this on a constituency basis but I think it's time there was a dynamic of elections that looked beyond a constituency vote.

I will dearly miss the Greens. Sargent and Ryan especially.

Violafy

c_man wrote: »

Thank god for the Greens. Tens of thousands forced to leave, the hundreds of thousands who have no jobs to go and the shutting down of thousands of small businesses... all helps to reduce the carbon emissions of the country.

Yes, because the majority of the blame really lies with the Greens rather than FF.

amiable

The fact is the people didn't want them back so they must have been doing something terribly wrong.
The people have spoken and they have said cheerio

c_man

Violafy wrote: »

Yes, because the majority of the blame really lies with the Greens rather than FF.

I blame both. There's a lot of revisionism going on in Green circles about being 'naive' and FF somehow fooling them until they saw sense and pulled out... wait no, said they'd pull out in a lil while. They were an integral part of the worst government to ever be inflicted on this country!

I wish FF got no seats either.



On a related issue I am finding it quite amusing to see Greens who were cheering the demise of the PDs not that long ago, acting incensed at the unfairness of it all (not directed at anyone here).

K-9

I'm in stitches at that analogy, great sattire and as with all great comedy, there is some truth in it.

Violafy wrote: »

No offence, but this narrowminded loyalty is one of the reasons that Ireland is in such a mess. I know may be biased as a Greens supporter, but there's actually no way I could see a way for all of the blame to be put on them. There were what, less than ten of them in the Dail? FF are to blame for this. As for blaming the opposition.... That;s just ridiculous, sorry. All they can really do is make it difficult and act as an irritant, but FF always made the ultimate decisions. The Greens did have faults as they were inexperienced and misguided at times, but I hate how they've suffered much more than FF have. :mad: We can only hope that they'll learn from this and come back stronger!

I agree with the blame etc.

The Greens didn't know the scale of the problem facing them in 07 so I give them a pass there. The problem was the endless litany of mistakes from FF. At some stage they should have just upped and left.

NAMA sums it up for me. They added good loans to it and the benefit of that has been shown recently with NAMA making money on some loans.

Was it the morally right thing to do, make sure NAMA made the banks pay and take not just the bad loans of them? Undoubtedly Yes!

Was it the economically correct thing to do? Absolutely No.

It complicated it too much and delayed it so much that they are still transferring loans to it. The banks suddenly had a vested interest in keeping certain loans and lying about loans!

If it had been bad loans only, the banks would have had an interest in getting rid of the bad loans of the books.

I get the impression the Greens just left the big economic decisions to FF, except on NAMA. The guarantee being the big one. Probably fell for the idea that these FF guys must have some idea of Government seeing as they are bloody long enough at it!

Side Show Bob

Violafy wrote: »

No offence, but this narrowminded loyalty is one of the reasons that Ireland is in such a mess. I know may be biased as a Greens supporter, but there's actually no way I could see a way for all of the blame to be put on them. There were what, less than ten of them in the Dail? FF are to blame for this. As for blaming the opposition.... That;s just ridiculous, sorry. All they can really do is make it difficult and act as an irritant, but FF always made the ultimate decisions. The Greens did have faults as they were inexperienced and misguided at times, but I hate how they've suffered much more than FF have. :mad: We can only hope that they'll learn from this and come back stronger!

The greens held the government to ransom for 3 of the most important weeks of the outgoing governments term, why to ban 20 men & women on horseback in North Dublin and to impose their opinions on country life,

Both of the above mean nothing to me as I’m not a supporter of either sport, but what does bother me is that the greens think rural Ireland is Disney land for the bread of culture that they align themselves to.

Rural Ireland is not for sandal wearing Go&****s who don’t want to pay for anything in rural Ireland, these people want to come to the country with their packed veggie lunch, walk the hills and the land, pay nothing, stop an old man drive home from the pub or the bingo with a pint or two,

They would have us all on bicycles, eating lettuce, sending their Dublin 4 waste to rural Ireland for landfill while spending BILLIONS on stopping the “not in the green’s back garden” insinuator.

So john, trevor, eamon, and the beautiful mary on yer bikes and £uck the hell off and rural Ireland hopes that you will never call again

last man standing

caseyann wrote: »

I am curious why the green party took such a hit in elections,yet people are still voting FF.Surely it should have been other way around few greens in and no FF?

I feel bad for Gormley,i actually think they did not deserve to take the brunt of the hit,FF should have.FG sat back and watched all the **** happen also.Yet they were rewarded Irish people you dismay me how much you like to be taken for suckers.:(

Most people in this country know what is meant by the term "Cute Hoor "and let us not forget that we "as a country" voted in FF and we a knew that they where Cute hoors. The greens where voted in, just like the PDs were, to set a balance on them and they showed that they where not capable of doing this. In fact the Greens became party to their cute hoorism.
If we are all to be honest, FF should have been voted out in the elaction
before this one but a lot of us bought into the ME Me Me attitude which the likes of Mary Harney and Bertie promoted. Sorry to say but the greens
got what they deserved. I do think when i watched Dan Boyle on TV
sometimes, i could see he was very uneasy with Gormley but maybe
i was reading that wrong.

bunny shooter

Violafy wrote: »

Ahh stag hunting, the fun "sport". If attempting to eliminate disgusting cruelty is "screwing over the culchies", then I hope they're back to screw you over again very soon! Funny how you all complain about the Greens putting themselves before the country. Your post contains nothing but selfishness and a complete lack of consideration for the environment of Ireland other than your own interests.

I reckon NOW the Greens realise that to allow a small minority of fur huggers to dictate policy is not a good idea. The wake up call they and the other parties have recieved in relation to fieldsports is refreshing:)

Fine Gael openly said they'll revoke the stag hunting ban and Labour have stated their support for fieldsports and look how they came out of the election compared to FF & of course the Greens :cool:

I don't think they''ll be back anytime soon and no other major party will entertain the fur huggers either :cool:

The environment...................try living in it for a while and you'll see that it is f**ked beyond repair :mad:

Greens .............. a shower of urbanites who live in a bubble. Try reality out in the sticks for a while and then whinge to me :P

Of course I'm selfish..............................but I'm not a fool who thinks by cycling to work I'll save the planet

jellybeans

Violafy wrote: »

No offence, but this narrowminded loyalty is one of the reasons that Ireland is in such a mess. I know may be biased as a Greens supporter, but there's actually no way I could see a way for all of the blame to be put on them. There were what, less than ten of them in the Dail? FF are to blame for this. As for blaming the opposition.... That;s just ridiculous, sorry. All they can really do is make it difficult and act as an irritant, but FF always made the ultimate decisions. The Greens did have faults as they were inexperienced and misguided at times, but I hate how they've suffered much more than FF have. :mad: We can only hope that they'll learn from this and come back stronger!

I know I agree, my grandmother told me not to bother that he would "die for the party" jaysus!!!! I voted for the greens coz i do believe they have a conscience and Im sorry they suffered so badly. At the same time though when everything was breaking there was a time when I was asking myself "eh where's the greens" they did feck all but I trust their ethics.