Spit in the face over a stolen wallet

LegacyUser

First off, im 27 and my friend is 23. Im just in from town now and I feel really guilty. Its like i've reached a new low. Yet in my head it should be somewhat justified. I understand that the majority of people here will label me as a dickhead or what not, but at least take into consideration that im sharing this experience with you asking your opinion, not a slagging match or an eBrawl.

My friend and i were out having a couple of drinks. Literally only had 2/3 each between the hours of 8-2, a very slow paced night. My friends GF joined up with us and we were all hanging out, great fun. the night ended and we went to a chipper to get some chips, as you do...

In walks 2 fellas and a girl, all about 18-20. I think the two fellas were together, one of them went on shouting and screaming, with a 2 liter plastic bottle of whatever mixture under his arm. They were climbing up on the tables n stuff, acting the complete Muppet. Very loud, drawing alot of attention to themselves. I was very quickly irritated by this. I ignored it, but it was niggling away at me. I saw them being motioned out of the chipper and as they were leaving them bumped into our table.

They said sorry, my friend said "you're alright don't worry about it". As they got to the door, i see the chap who served me my chips hurdle the counter and run after them, grabbing the girl by the arm and yanking something off of her. It was my friends GF's wallet. I didn't realize until he came up to us and handed us the wallet, it didn't dawn on my friends gf that it was her wallet, but when the penny dropped, and she said that was her wallet, i put down my fork and walked out of the establishment and went after the 3 of them as one of them danced over a car, LITERALLY. He climbed up and walked over the the thing like it was nothing.

I stay walking behind them, and the chap who walked over the car turns and goes 'how are ye?'. My response was "what the fk do you think you're playing at?". he played dumb. I told him they stole my friends wallet and they kept saying i was telling lies. Now, without sounding like a hard chap, i have a very mean look when im angry, and the two fellas read this right away. So much so when they realised i wasnt messing around their voices started to temble and their faces went white.

Wow, im a big chap eh, scarying people 10 years younger than me. I havnt hit anyone since i was in 6th class and i wasnt going to start with them, but i was really holding back.

I told them straight come back and apologize to the girl, and everything will be ok. The two lads still played dumb. The girl however got very lippy and was laughing at the whole situation, while the two fellas knew i wasn't playing around, which i wasn't. My friend had joined up at this point and the girl was busy laughing at him and the fellas then started to get lippy with him. He wasnt having it. What seemed like years of aggression erupted out of him as he hurled his can of coke to the ground which splashed all over everyone, screaming at them through his teeth, asking them to stop being smart and stop fking about. the two guys who were already worried really looked scared, yet the girl laughed in his face, then squared up to him and was asking me "Wha ye gonna do, i din do fk all".

I reitterated my previous request of an apology, the lads again said they didnt do anything, the girl however laughed.

My friend flipped.

He threatened her, she laughed, a random passer by said "you wont do **** to her", when he realized the state my friend was in, he soon backed off, but stood by. The girl laughed again and geered him on.

He grabbed her by her jacket and around her jaw, pulled her a few feet from the two lads and spat in her face. At this point the other chap went at my friend and i grabbed him by the chest, moving him backwards, looked him in the eye and told him "fk off, she stole his gfs wallet". The chap backed down. Im positive he realized the situation and understood that we didn't want a fight from how it came on.

Now, there's a big part of me here saying that that group needed that. Its a lesson in life and they would have gotten it a lot worse off of another group of people. I went after them, i asked 3/4 times for them to say sorry, all i got in return was grief. I didn't go near the girl, yet i feel like the scum of the earth for how it played out. Bullsht like that cannot be tolerated.

Im not asking for justification, im not trying to start an argument. I just have to get this off my chest. I feel absolutely horrible.

If you have something negative to say, please don't bother posting, try keep it constructive.

Distorted

This is how wars start. (Relatively) small incidents exacerbated by expressions of pride.

IMHO stealing a wallet is less serious than assault on a person. What they did was wrong but you and your friend should have felt satisfied by catching up with them and insulting them. Assault is way more serious and makes you by doing it morally more in the wrong than they. Spitting in someone's face is absolutely disgusting. Its the way animals behave. In fact its worse, because with most animals, they socially connect mainly on threats which are only rarely carried out.

Imagine if one of you had had a knife. When would you have stopped?

Will it deter them from stealing wallets again? I very much doubt it.

moco

Things went too far but I don't think you should feel too bad about it. The girl here is a total tramp. To steal someones wallet then act the way she did is disgusting. She kept squaring up to your friend because she felt safe as a girl that she wouldn't get hit. Spitting in someones face is horrible, but after the way she behaved she deserved something really.

It's an unfortunate situation, and you probably should feel bad about being aggressive, but I'd let it go if I were you. You were stuck between a rock and a hard place. This type of thing happens all the time, especially the whole thing where some mouthy girl starts on lads because she thinks having a vagina makes her untouchable. In my book, you should never hit/assault/spit at a woman - UNLESS she starts it. I've seen stuff like this a good few times and it really annoys me. I'm a girl, and if I stole someones wallet, got caught, then proceeded to purposely aggravate the person, get in their face, I wouldn't feel surprised if I got grabbed by the jacket and the jaw. In fact I wouldn't act surprised if I got the life beaten out of me.

As for the spitting thing, in my opinion the only time someone should spit is into their bathroom sink. Even when guys spit on the road I think it's disgusting. But in the case of your friend, it was a better outcome than beating her up. Hopefully she's learnt some kind of lesson, and is at least a bit shook up about it.

Long story short let it go and don't do it again, you were in a no win situation

Wonderwall

Aside from your mate spitting at the girl, I see no problems with how that played out. I can understand your friend's frustration even if spitting is a scummy thing to do.

What other option did you have other than confront them, honestly? Letting them walk away knowing they've taken your friend's wallet is bull****. If you called the guards they wouldn't have gotten there in time.

I am not attacking the poster above me but this sentence is hilarious:

'What they did was wrong but you and your friend should have felt satisfied by catching up with them and insulting them'

That's so laughable that it actually baffles the mind. Insults don't regain stolen property.

I would have most definitely confronted them.

Cheap Thrills!

I'm a woman and it sickens me to see how some little scumbags like that girl think they can do anything they want with total impunity because they are women.

I wouldn't have went after her because you can't reason with scum. But sometimes these things happen.

She got a spit in the face. If she carries on the way she is going she will get a lot worse no doubt some day.

It's always better not to retaliate though OP. It really is just not worth it.
You don't get any saftisfaction as you have learned.

Just put it down to experience. I don't condone what your friend did, but neither do I have one ounce of symapthy for the thief girl.

zxcvbnm1

OK - obviously the lads were absolute idiots. And they do deserve a kick up the arse.

Saying that i dont know what the point was in you demanding an apology.
Like - it completely enflamed the situation for no gain to anyone.

It was pointless demanding them to say the word 'Sorry'.

Suffice to say you should have been able to control yourself better than that.
It was madness really on your part.

Distorted

Wonderwall wrote: »

'What they did was wrong but you and your friend should have felt satisfied by catching up with them and insulting them'

That's so laughable that it actually baffles the mind. Insults don't regain stolen property.

I would have most definitely confronted them.

Is your mind so baffled you were unable to read that they got the stolen wallet back long before this? The proprietor of the restaurant got it back for them before they even left the premises to go after the theives.

You can laugh and be baffled all you like, personally I prefer to be civilised. And avoid a criminal record over matters that are not life and death.

I think the OP's mate went just a little too far. Not completely OTT but just a little bit too far.

spinandscribble

Tbh I don't think the OP should feel like scum, he's not the one to spit on someone's face. Standing there with a cold look shouldn't get you called scum considering the circumstances.
I've a "friend" that announces on facebook when he slaps/hits some guy he doesn't know that was annoying in town, students ect ect every so often; thats scummy to me, almost like he's looking for praise because he can't keep his fists to himself.
What I would say is don't let this become a habit (like above), dealing out "justice" ect because you know thats not what happened here. A small bitter part of me, who is sick of girls like the one who tried to steal the wallet, partly feels she deserved a direct insult like the spit but I think it brought your friend down to her level.

Also maybe this is off topic but well done on the chipper man!

santana75

knackerfight wrote: »

I feel absolutely horrible.

Why do you feel horrible? You're being way too civilised man. Reading the start of your post I thought you were gonna say you knee-capped somebody. But you did nothing to feel horrible about. Its great to be a civilised person and all but we dont live in world were everybody plays by a moral code. And when people who arent civilised mess with you, you gotta protect yourself, let them know that you wont tolerate any crap.
I actually think you let them off easy. Dont give this incident another thought, from somenone who grew up in a relatively rough area, let me tell you that what you described sounds like a tea party compared to some of the things I've seen(and that was before I was even 12years old). You sound like a decent bloke(maybe too decent)stop judging yourself so harshly.

JKM

I really wouldn't feel bad if I were you OP. We all are capable of doing uncharacteristic things when provoked. I'm sure you're friend and his girlfriend are grateful that you stood up for yourself and them. Also, if I was the owner of that car i'd be thanking you. Scumbags like that need to be stood up to every now and again. If it makes them think twice the next time, then job well done IMO.
My little brothers friend was involved in a unprovoked attack in town last weekend (idiot who started it was arrested thankfully), but my brothers friend was in bits over it. The poor fella was really terrified as the guy treatened to slit his throat! Now i've no doubt he had no intention of carrying out such a threat but it scared the life out of the young fella all the same.
These a******s are holding a lot of towns and good people to ransom because noone is willing to stand up to them (including the gaurds a lot of the time).
For those of you who are saying spitting is disgusting, i agree, but think in this case was justified. A taste of their own medicine and all that.

Zen65

zxcvbnm1 wrote: »

Saying that i dont know what the point was in you demanding an apology.
Like - it completely enflamed the situation for no gain to anyone.

I teach self-defence & martial arts (as a hobby) and this is a point that I am almost tired of reinforcing: Nothing good can come from confusing self-defence with retaliation. In the event that this girl were to make a complaint to the Gardaí (perhaps unlikely in this instance, but not impossible) about your friend's behaviour (and yours) she would have the law on her side. You are not entitled to seek an apology except through the courts, and certainly not through threat of force. I understand why you did this, and my own blood can boil easily enough with provocation, but the law is very straight-forward about such matters and your actions amounted to an assault (or rather, your friend's action amount to physical assault and yours to verbal assault).

Purely from a safety point of view you should never give chase. You don't know whether these people may have been carrying a knife, and knife crime is very much on the increase. Your ten years seniority offers no protection against a knife!

No point dwelling on it, we all make mistakes. Just bear in mind should something like this happen again, do not give chase to a thief or an attacker unless there is a life depending on it. The life you risk in doing so is too valuable to gamble with.

Be at peace,

Z

discus

Fair play OP, although mind how you go about these things in future - these scumbags know the law, and they'll have you done!

dudara

IMHO, you were a fupping eejit for continuing and escalating the situation. It could have just as quickly turned against you and your friend.

Like a previous poster, I've been involved in the martial arts community and the biggest part of learning how to be intimidating is also knowing when to use it. Using it with scum outside a chipper is not the smartest idea. Remember the polish lads who ended up stabbed through the temple with screwdrivers?

Scum are scum - they don't act by the same moral standards as better parts of society and demanding an apology from them would have taught them nothing, zilch, zero. It just dragged out a situtation that should have been let die.

The biggest part of valour is discretion - in this case you should have known to leave it go.

bohsboy

Good enough for her.

She'll think twice about going through someone's pockets again.

kevin99

You restrained yourself. You simply asked for an apology. Your mate could get himself in trouble. Remember there are CCTV cameras all over Dublin city these days and the cops could have arrived on the scene pretty sharpish.
Spitting is a horribe, disgusting thing to do. Just look at the furore a few weeks ago when golfer, Tiger Woods was seen by millions of TV viewers spitting on the green.
The people who stole your wallet and walked over a car are scumbags. My advice is never, ever get into a conflict with other people you don't know. And certainly not at that hour of the morning. People have drink taken and perhaps have also consumed drugs. They could be carrying a concealed weapon on their person.
You could have ended up being stabbed or bludgeoned.
If you were seeking revenge or retribution you should have called the gardai and let them deal with the situation.
But well done on your own discipline. You could have thrown a few punches at them but instead you restrained yourself. Next time let the gardai deal with such crimes.

LegacyUser

was it the girl who stole the wallet?

If so, she absolutely deserved a flem in the face.
It's all very well saying, this is how animals behave ect, but these are the type of people who go around TERRIFYING people, damaging property, ect ect.

You sensed that, and you wanted to defend your innocent girlfriend. You did right.



Clear your conscience.

LegacyUser

if everybody was willing to take a stand against this sort of stuff and behaviour it simply wouldnt happen.

Look if they didnt want hassle all they had to say was sorry and walk away, I know from abroad that the people wont stand for this sort of abuse people get when out at night in Ireland, but it doesnt happen as much because of it. The scum know its not acceptable, its like a bully in the classroom they quicklly change once they realise nobodies on their side.

LegacyUser

I dont think bullies really care about people being on their side or not TBH.
I fail to see how this is a case of *its like the classroom*

I'd Say it's more a case of *like the jungle*

Two gangs, one member of one gang, offended another.
Gang A stands up to Gang B.

LegacyUser

samefaggggg wrote: »

I dont think bullies really care about people being on their side or not TBH.
I fail to see how this is a case of *its like the classroom*

I'd Say it's more a case of *like the jungle*

Two gangs, one member of one gang, offended another.
Gang A stands up to Gang B.

look Im not going to argue semantics with you as its pathetic tbh but gangs....hardly the guy feels guilty not exactly the people who normally start fights on streets. Id say it just got too much for him and he felt like he had to act but then again who are we to judge, its not like we were there

GoldRush4821

Although they deserved what came to them (and more), it seem like you shouldn't have gotten involved in the first place. I could understand you getting involved if:

1. It was your gf whose wallet was stolen

and

2. They walked out with it and it didn't get handed back.

In this case, the wallet was returned without too much aggro. I think you should have left it at that. You don't know how differently things could have gone down if they had a weapon (unlikely I know) or the girl turned around and called the gardai on your friend for assault. And believe me, they'd take that complaint seriously when they would've done **** all about the stolen wallet. You have no reason to feel guilty or anything, but perhaps you should take into consideration the fact that these people will more than likely not learn any lessons from this experience. They're clearly brazen (especially the girl) and thought the whole thing was great craic (except for getting spat at of course). Also, ask yourself; would you have chased them if they acted the same way but weren't so much younger? These are all things you can learn from anyway, so I wouldn't feel bad about how you handled the situation.

doughef

Hi OP

you and your friends seem like nice people,

I see no problem in what your mate did.. I wouldnt class this person as a girl.. There all just scumbags.. their gender doesnt matter a shi*..

As someone else said.. you did well not to start a fight, and a spit in the face is the least this little knacker deserves,..

Fu** them all and well done,... dont sweat it

LegacyUser

Stealing someone's wallet is very serious in my eyes, it could contain a lot of money, all your credit cards, and in this day and age that could be devastating to someone. So for this girl to get away with just a bit of spit in her face she was lucky. The fact it was returned is neither here nor their, you dont get off criminal charges of theft even if you give the items back, whats done is done, a crime is commited no matter what. She deserved a few slaps to be honest.

dudara

shocked11 wrote: »

Stealing someone's wallet is very serious in my eyes ... She deserved a few slaps to be honest.

Striking or injuring someone, no matter the cause, is also very serious.

I'm actually quite surprised at the amount of people who are advocating violence here, which is against the policy in Personal Issues.

Thread closed.

dudara