Architect's FEES

groz

Hi All,

I would appreciate your urgent advise on the following:

- How would you assess the level of your (architect's) fees for e.g. office refurbishment or a new building?

- How would you establish what percentage fee would be appropriate for one particular project?

- How would you establish a FIXED FEE?

- What are the advantages and disadvantages of the FIXED FEE?

Thank you very much in advance!

G.

observer2u

I think architects should defo have a fixed fee based on a fixed amount of work. Every architect knows that there will be variations on a job and I think it looks every bad to be making money from variations that may be down to the poor detail, specification written by the architect.

However if a client signs up to a job for 400k and half way through decides to spend an extra 20k landscaping or on joinery and asked the architect to be involved a new fee should be proposed for this scope of works.

In terms of percentages its hard. it depends on how involved you get. Is it sheel and core or everything

groz

observer2u wrote: »

In terms of percentages its hard. it depends on how involved you get. Is it sheel and core or everything

The project involves the refurbishment of an existing retail premises, including fit-out, and the construction of new stand-alone storage facilities.

I wonder how to assess the level of fees on which I would base the proposal?

I agree with you on points you made re:fixed fees and charges due to variations.

Thanks.

muffler

Some work for a fixed fee and some base their fee as a percentage of the project cost. You should ring round a couple of them that come recommended and see what you come up with.

There's a bit of tail chasing with the percentage fee insofar as you need your plans, spec etc to get the job estimated so you wont know the fee in this situation until the construction costs are finalised.

Talk to them, they dont bite

sinnerboy

First lets determine the work required.

New shopfront - planning permission required
New storage - planning permission required
IF the building is changing use - planning permission required

Internal alterations and new storage - Fire Cert required

Health and Safety PSPD ( Project Supervisor Design Process ) - required. Do you have/ will you be given an existing Safety File ?

TGDL ( Conservation of Energy ) . Do you have/ will you be given an existing BER cert ? After the works an new BER cert will be required.

All questions to be addressed before any architect can determine the workload.

For a period up to 1999 the RIAI used to publish a detailed tabulated Schedule of % Fees.

Works were broken down by
a) complexity and
b) € size of project.

From that one could read off a recommended fee %. The more complex the building type the higher the % was. Hospitals cost more than warehouses.

The higher the works € value the lower the % . Sometimes small € value projects involve a disproportionate amount of Architectural works - and vice versa.

In practice Architects never got the fee-scale % . Clients tended to see this as the start point to negotiate down from and some Architects bid under the recommended % to obtain work. I doubt any ever got paid over the % .

Updates in consumer law deemed the RIAI fee scale "anticompetitive" so - in my opinion - a useful reference guide was lost.

So using the above points to help you ask the right questions - you must shop around.

groz

Thanks very much for your replies guys - it is much appreciated.

How would you ensure that you would be paid for additional services that might be required during the project? Hourly rate? Don't have impression the clients like it...

Thanks again.

archtech

Normally with any fee proposal the scope of works included and excluded are set out in the fee proposal. In terms of variation to the scope of works, this can be done either by an hourly rate or an agreed fee prior to the commencement of the said works.

Furthermore, most fee proposals would set out terms of payments at various stages of the the project, so much on lodging of planning permission, fire cert completion of tender documents etc.

As the lads mentioned above the best way to find out is to talk to individual practices and obtain fee pros.
.

braftery

Surely Architect's fees have to be considered in two parts.

1. The time taken to preform the technical requirements of the contracted job. (ie: producing drawings, preparing applications, writing specifications, supervising construcion, etc.)

This can be determined by the amount of time taken to produce this work, comparable to an hourly rate.

And I bet there would be alot of smiling architects if they were getting paid by the hour

2. The architects skill in distilling a clients brief, delivering a building that meets that brief and in the process exceeds the clients asthetic expectations for the project.

This, in my opinion, is the crux of the issue.
How much is this skill worth ? How much is an idea worth ?

Personally, as a past client of an architect that exceeded my expectations in every area ...
this skill is invaluable and the price I paid for the ideas represented very good value to me. And since I was the client that is all that matters !

My advice, work out what it is you want the Architect to do for you. WRITE down your brief ... READ it back to yourself ... and then WRITE down the changes to it.

Then go talk to a few architects (normally the first meeting is free), present your brief to them and LISTEN to their response.

Any architect is only as good as the brief they receive.

I would hope at the end of that process it will be possible to come to a working and fee arrangement with the architect you feel suits you best.

Lastly,

Dont hire a dog and bark yourself ...

If you want someone to draw up what is in your head, hire a draughtsman !