Training Contract - UK or Ireland??

stixbrix

Hi everyone,

Thought I'd seek some badly needed advice about my personal dilemma - where is the better place to qualify - UK or Ireland??

I graduated June 2010 and was extremely lucky to get a TC with one of the big 5 firms in Dublin commencing May 2012.. Knowing how tough it is out there, I accepted straight away, eventhough marrying into the big scary corporate world wasnt what I originally had in mind.

Having been given a fair bit of time to stretch my legs before starting, I moved to London where I've been living since my finals.

With the looming prospect of the returning home this summer to do the dreaded FE1's, I've been giving some serious thought to trying to get a TC in the UK instead..

My main conerns are -

My law degree has a substantial international element to it, and I'm worried that an Irish firm wont give me any opportunities to put that to good use, esp when you consider that a lot of the large UK firms are international practices that regularly send their trainees abroad for secondments etc.

On the downside, applying so late for a TC in the UK (applications this summer would be for jobs in 2013/2014) would mean I would be qualified several years later.

All that aside, I love London and everything that goes with it, so leaving is gonna be a serious heartbreaker..

Would love to hear from anyone who has already made the move across the pond or is merely thinking about it..

Apologies for the long post, any advice at this stage is a godsend

crystalmice

First off I will disclaim I have not made the move across the pond so I cant give any direct comparison!

Bear in mind that if you go to a big firm (magic circle sort of thing) the qualifying time can actually be alot shorter as some of them do there own LPC courses that are only 6 months, so alot shorter than blackhall, and no Fe1s! so in terms of the time thing I wouldnt let that be too much of a factor.
If you were good enough to get a top 5 TC you may have a good shot at the magic circle or there abouts, I know a fair few Irish people after gettting TCs in the top few and it really is another level in terms of prestige/quality of work/pay.

You would obviously get more international exposure in those firms but do bear in mind that some of the top 5 (not all, depends which one you would be going with) have a very international focus, not necessarily travelling abroad but working with foreign clients on big multi jurisdictional transactions ect!

The only thing is that since you seem reluctant to do the big corporate firm thing then the magic circle ect may not appeal to you, so the point about a shorter LPC mightnt apply if your looking at a small firm!

stixbrix

Crystalmice thanks for your speedy response!

There's a lot of food for thought there.. Strictly professionally speaking, I guess it's a given that London firms are going to look better on paper, especially if aiming for a career which isnt restricted to a single legal system (my degree is in French & Irish Law)

But I have heard all the horror stories about the magic circle firms in the UK and the semi-slavery they have been reported to put their trainees through (sleeping pods in the office? really?!)., and I dont know if I'm prepared to put myself through that? (if I even get one at all)..

Also, interned with the firm I'm due to be training with, and to my great suprise I really enjoyed it - my first internship in another firm had put me off the solicitor route entirely.

I know a lot of Irish people who are going for TC's in London esp considering chances of a job at the end of training in Ireland are looking pretty slim - I dont plan on staying in Ireland once qualified anyway but Im worried that a TC from an Irish firm, no matter how prestigious in the homeland, isnt really worth much anywhere else.

There's also the cost factor - training in the UK going to set me back thousands in LPC fees, textbooks, rent, living expenses, money I definitely don't have.. whereas my firm here are prepared to cover most expenses.
Then theres the fact that the training itself in Ireland involves a pretty nice amount of time spent attending lectures, whereas in London you're straight into the office for the full two years..

Ive written about 6 pros/cons lists and still cant get my head around it.

Thoughts welcome

bob_lob_law

stixbrix wrote: »

Crystalmice thanks for your speedy response!

There's a lot of food for thought there.. Strictly professionally speaking, I guess it's a given that London firms are going to look better on paper, especially if aiming for a career which isnt restricted to a single legal system (my degree is in French & Irish Law)

But I have heard all the horror stories about the magic circle firms in the UK and the semi-slavery they have been reported to put their trainees through (sleeping pods in the office? really?!)., and I dont know if I'm prepared to put myself through that? (if I even get one at all)..

Also, interned with the firm I'm due to be training with, and to my great suprise I really enjoyed it - my first internship in another firm had put me off the solicitor route entirely.

I know a lot of Irish people who are going for TC's in London esp considering chances of a job at the end of training in Ireland are looking pretty slim - I dont plan on staying in Ireland once qualified anyway but Im worried that a TC from an Irish firm, no matter how prestigious in the homeland, isnt really worth much anywhere else.

There's also the cost factor - training in the UK going to set me back thousands in LPC fees, textbooks, rent, living expenses, money I definitely don't have.. whereas my firm here are prepared to cover most expenses.
Then theres the fact that the training itself in Ireland involves a pretty nice amount of time spent attending lectures, whereas in London you're straight into the office for the full two years..

Ive written about 6 pros/cons lists and still cant get my head around it.

Thoughts welcome

I also had my heart set on going down the London route, I did a vac scheme with a firm last year and really enjoyed it but didn't get offered a TC. I did the milk rounds with the Dublin firms this year and got a 2012 place so I decided to take it. As you said yourself, London firms are already recruiting for 2013/14, and I'm not getting any younger nor can I face doing any more applications, so I just decided to take it.

First off you need to be sure that you have the necessary requirements for doing the LPC (English land law springs to mind) otherwise you may have to do a module of the GDL. You might be able to do this in tandem with the LPC, I'm not sure. My advice would be to pursue both avenues and if you get a TC in London you can decide then if you would like to take it. You have missed the closing dates for vacation schemes so you'll have to do straight TC applications (which are bizarrely less competitive than the vac schemes), closing dates for these are around the 31st of July, though it would be advisable to get them in a soon as possible. A volley of PFOs may change your attitude to the whole process.

Other things that quickly spring to mind, firms will pay for your LPC and give you a stipend for living expenses so I wouldn't worry about that. If you don't think the magic circle firms are for you I wouldn't waste your time applying (A&O has the sleeping pods). Research on the following sites for other firms: Lawcareers.net and rollonfriday.com. You shouldn't have a problem moving over when you're qualified if that's what you want to do, you'll get beasted with work whatever firm you're with be it London, Dublin, Magic Circle or below. The international thing seems like a bit of a moot point to me also, if you're in a Magic Circle firm in Paris it will all be similar corporate stuff you'll be doing. There's nothing to say you won't do work with a significant international dimension here, there are no magic circle/international firms here so anything related to Ireland will get referred across. This would also go some way addressing the prestige/reputation issue you mentioned. Not forgetting NAMA, the banking crisis, bailout etc and other associated issues that are largely unprecedented and would no doubt look impressive on the cv.

Finally, I don't know if you've completed the application forms for any London firms before but the Dublin ones are a proverbial wet dream by comparison. They're considerably longer and ask a myriad of rubbish questions, the WF one is the only one to come close I think.

That's all I can think of really - good luck!