Tirzah Ireland Anti-Trafficking Event

neuro-praxis

Hi fellow Christians.

I'm a volunteer with Christian NGO Tirzah Ireland. Our mission is to "Stop all forms of human trafficking in Ireland by creating awareness of the issue, seeking to change attitudes which allow this injustice to flourish, and campaigning for legislative change." Tirzah is an organisation based on prayer and committed to the church making a response to this injustice.

We are holding an event in support of the Not For Sale Campaign and Freedom Sunday to raise awareness of the plight of those being trafficked in Ireland, and to offer responses to help.

We will be on O'Connell Street in Dublin outside the GPO at 3pm on Sunday March 13th. There will be brief speakers on the topic of trafficking, as well as some music and entertainment.

Come along to speak up for those who have no voice, and wear ORANGE which is our 'freedom colour'.

Hope to see some of you there. Please invite your churches!

Seaneh

Hey, Myself and the church I am a member of are pretty active in this area, we hosted a benifit for Free For Life Ministries in July 09 and I'm going to be part of a 1 year missions trip that does a lot of work in the field so I'll definitely come along and show my support.

If there is anything I can do to help in any way at all, send me a pm here and I'll try my best to make it happen!

Fanny Cradock

Make sure to give this a bump nearer the time, neuro-praxis. Out of site, out of mind.

PDN

Would love to be there - but the timing seriously conflicts with some of our services.

neuro-praxis

Just giving this a little bump, as advised. May do so again next week.

Seaneh

just thought I'd save N.P. Bumping this and remind people it is this day next week!

Brown Bomber

neuro-praxis wrote: »

Hi fellow Christians.

I'm a volunteer with Christian NGO Tirzah Ireland. Our mission is to "Stop all forms of human trafficking in Ireland by creating awareness of the issue, seeking to change attitudes which allow this injustice to flourish, and campaigning for legislative change." Tirzah is an organisation based on prayer and committed to the church making a response to this injustice.

We are holding an event in support of the Not For Sale Campaign and Freedom Sunday to raise awareness of the plight of those being trafficked in Ireland, and to offer responses to help.

We will be on O'Connell Street in Dublin outside the GPO at 3pm on Sunday March 13th. There will be brief speakers on the topic of trafficking, as well as some music and entertainment.

Come along to speak up for those who have no voice, and wear ORANGE which is our 'freedom colour'.

Hope to see some of you there. Please invite your churches!

It goes without saying that what you and your organisation are doing is highly commendable and I wish you the very best of luck with it.

However, it beggars belief that you would choose a Hebrew word for an anti-human-trafficking group when Israel, and Tel Aviv in particular is a hub for prostitution (2 billion dollars yearly http://www.havocscope.com/prostitution-in-israel/ and the final destination for many of these victims and the lucrative human-trafficking trade is dominated by the Jewish-Russian Mafiya.

Fanny Cradock

Brown Bomber wrote: »

However, it beggars belief that you would choose a Hebrew word for an anti-human-trafficking...

You are correct - we shouldn't be using the word Tirzah because all Hebrew (both ancient and modern) is inherently evil.

I just don't understands some people.

Seaneh

Brown Bomber wrote: »

It goes without saying that what you and your organisation are doing is highly commendable and I wish you the very best of luck with it.

However, it beggars belief that you would choose a Hebrew word for an anti-human-trafficking group when Israel, and Tel Aviv in particular is a hub for prostitution (2 billion dollars yearly http://www.havocscope.com/prostitution-in-israel/ and the final destination for many of these victims and the lucrative human-trafficking trade is dominated by the Jewish-Russian Mafiya.

By that token we shouldn't use any english, irish, german, french, spanish, italian, portuguese, arabic, scottish, welsh, basque, catalan, swahili, urdu, hindu, etc. Words either?



Ireland is also massive affected by human trafficking and is used as a hub to enter the EU because of our crap border control.



The Hebrew language in itself is not evil, why not use a word from ancient hebrew?

Brown Bomber

Seaneh wrote: »

By that token we shouldn't use any english, irish, german, french, spanish, italian, portuguese, arabic, scottish, welsh, basque, catalan, swahili, urdu, hindu, etc. Words either?



Ireland is also massive affected by human trafficking and is used as a hub to enter the EU because of our crap border control.



The Hebrew language in itself is not evil, why not use a word from ancient hebrew?

For the same reason you wouldn't use a Japanese word (unless you were a Japanese group) for your organisation if you were fighting against whale hunting.

It would make you appear out of touch with the realities of the situation.

I assume you know that prostitution is legal in Israel? And that human-trafficking itself only became illegal very, very recently? That Tel-Aviv is choc-o-bloc with brothels with trafficked women from China, Moldova, Ukraine and everywhere else that there is poverty? That Israel itself is a safe-haven for the traffickers themselves and their criminal bosses arising from a combination of the right of return and no extradition from Israel?

The question is. assuming you were aware of the above. WHY Hebrew?

Seaneh

Because it is a biblical word being used by a christian organisation.

I'm well aware of what goes on in Israel.

Are you as aware that ireland isn't far behind it?

PDN

I find more than a whiff of racism to this idea that we should demonise entire languages because we disagree with the policies of a modern nation state.

Tirzah is a biblical word, and the founders of this organisation have drawn their values and inspiration from the Bible (over half of which was written in Hebrew).

neuro-praxis

Frankly I'm glad that you've come in with your racist nonsense Brown Bomber. It's given this thread a little more traffic...if you'll pardon the pun.

In other news, Lucinda Creighton will be giving an address at the event and Discovery Gospel Choir will be providing some choons. Hope to see you all there. I'll be the one in orange... :pac:

JimiTime

Brown Bomber wrote: »

For the same reason you wouldn't use a Japanese word (unless you were a Japanese group) for your organisation if you were fighting against whale hunting.

Why not? Words have meaning, and if the japanese word meant 'We hate whale hunting', then there's no issue.

It would make you appear out of touch with the realities of the situation.

Only to an idiot tbh. 'He said he's against whale hunting', 'yeah, but he said it in Japanese. Get him'. Makes no sense whatsoever.

I assume you know that prostitution is legal in Israel? And that human-trafficking itself only became illegal very, very recently? That Tel-Aviv is choc-o-bloc with brothels with trafficked women from China, Moldova, Ukraine and everywhere else that there is poverty? That Israel itself is a safe-haven for the traffickers themselves and their criminal bosses arising from a combination of the right of return and no extradition from Israel?

The question is. assuming you were aware of the above. WHY Hebrew?

I could hazard a guess, that Hebrew is the language of the fathers of our faith, and the original language of the old testament. Also, its the meaning of the word, rather than the language its spoken thats relevant. Just the same as the work that this organisation is doing is what is relevant.

Humans eh!

Crazy how a promotional post turned into a row over semantics.

I'm atheist and fully support your endeavour as would many non religious people and wish you all the best.
Our current legislation must be tightened up regarding human trafficking and more awareness should be promoted to end this disgusting practice, which demeans the entire human race.
Good luck.

Brown Bomber

neuro-praxis wrote: »

your racist nonsense Brown Bomber.

PDN wrote: »

a whiff of racism

I mention Israel ipso facto I am a racist. Got it.

If you want to know about racism in relation to human trafficking I suggest you look into why the brothels are full of non-Jews in the Jewish homeland.

Somehow I don't expect this to be in your presentations.

What's the problem here anyway? Are you's disputing the fact that Israel is inextricably linked to human trafficking or that the Hebrew language is inectricably linked to a state that is front and centre when it comes to committing the abhorrent crime of human trafficking.

Seems you want to highlight the crime without highlighting the criminal. Kind of pointless in my humble opinion.

Honestly I have nothing bur praise and respect for your organisation that is giving a voice to voiceless I just think the name was a faux pas despite the denialism.

And again the very best of luck-

Brown Bomber

...

neuro-praxis wrote: »

Hi fellow Christians.

I'm a volunteer with Christian NGO Tirzah Ireland. Our mission is to "Stop all forms of human trafficking in Ireland by creating awareness of the issue, seeking to change attitudes which allow this injustice to flourish, and campaigning for legislative change." Tirzah is an organisation based on prayer and committed to the church making a response to this injustice.

We are holding an event in support of the Not For Sale Campaign and Freedom Sunday to raise awareness of the plight of those being trafficked in Ireland, and to offer responses to help.

We will be on O'Connell Street in Dublin outside the GPO at 3pm on Sunday March 13th. There will be brief speakers on the topic of trafficking, as well as some music and entertainment.

Come along to speak up for those who have no voice, and wear ORANGE which is our 'freedom colour'.

Hope to see some of you there. Please invite your churches!

Fanny Cradock

Brown Bomber wrote: »

I mention Israel ipso facto I am a racist. Got it.

If you want to know about racism in relation to human trafficking I suggest you look into why the brothels are full of non-Jews in the Jewish homeland.

Somehow I don't expect this to be in your presentations.

What's the problem here anyway? Are you's disputing the fact that Israel is inextricably linked to human trafficking or that the Hebrew language is inectricably linked to a state that is front and centre when it comes to committing the abhorrent crime of human trafficking.

Seems you want to highlight the crime without highlighting the criminal. Kind of pointless in my humble opinion.

Honestly I have nothing bur praise and respect for your organisation that is giving a voice to voiceless I just think the name was a faux pas despite the denialism.

And again the very best of luck-

Do you actually suppose that Tirzah the organisation is supporting the human trafficking that goes on in Israel - which I hardly think is sanctioned by the State - because they happened to use a Hebrew word that means beloved?

Let's apply the same logic to other countries where human trafficking occurs. It happens in Ireland so that means that Gaelic and English are out. It happens throughout the UK which rules out Welsh and Scots Gaelic. French is out. As is German and Spanish. So too are the various Scandinavian languages. Need I go on?

I've tried but I can not see the point behind your initial post.

neuro-praxis

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

I've tried but I can not see the point behind your initial post.

His point seems to be that because human trafficking takes place in the secular state of Israel, the official language of that state is therefore irredeemably evil and as such should not be spoken by anyone who wishes to bring human trafficking to an end. It was, I think, a reactionary point made by someone (justifiably) very angry with Israel, and now he is struggling to detract it. I don't want to put words in your mouth Brown Bomber (unfortunate name given the subject matter...) but I am trying hard to understand your position and this is the only thing that makes sense to me.

TIrzah is a Christian NGO. Our inspiration for what we do comes from the Scriptures, which as has already been highlighted, were originally written largely in Hebrew. Should we therefore abandon the bible too?

Perhaps it was you, Brown Bomber, and not us, who committed the faux pas on this topic.

Brown Bomber

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Do you actually suppose that Tirzah the organisation is supporting the human trafficking that goes on in Israel - which I hardly think is sanctioned by the State - because they happened to use a Hebrew word that means beloved?

Let's apply the same logic to other countries where human trafficking occurs. It happens in Ireland so that means that Gaelic and English are out. It happens throughout the UK which rules out Welsh and Scots Gaelic. French is out. As is German and Spanish. So too are the various Scandinavian languages. Need I go on?

I've tried but I can not see the point behind your initial post.[/QUOTE]

OK I see where you are coming from but my point is that Israel is at the centre of human trafficking; not merely somewhere "human traffic occurs". Human trafficking doesn¨t just occur, it is made to happen.

From Amnesty International:

Trafficking in Human Beings (Article 6)

Amnesty International published a report on the trafficking of women into Israel’s sex industry in 2000.(17) Trafficking of women for forced prostitution has occurred over a number of years but appears to have been compounded in the past 15 years by several factors, including increased links between traffickers in Israel and former Soviet republics, in the wake of the large wave of immigration of citizens of these countries to Israel, following of the break-up of the Soviet Union. These combined factors seemingly resulted in an increase in the vulnerability of women from this region to trafficking, and in an increase in the demand for such sex workers in Israel.(18)


Many women are lured to work in Israel under false pretence and are then forced into the sex industry. While many are reportedly aware that they will be working as sex workers, they are not aware they will be subject to violent and exploitative environments, working seven days a week and up to 18 hours a day for extremely low salaries or no salaries at all. Many are subjected to other serious human rights violations, including rape, deprivation of their liberty and debt-bondage. Women forced to work as sex workers are reportedly also frequently subjected to threats of abuse and even murder. Half the women interviewed by the Hotline for Migrant Workers were effectively incarcerated by their "pimps" and, according to a 2003 survey, almost half of all women "sold" to pimps reported that policemen were among their clients.(19)

According to a report by the Parliamentary Committee of Inquiry on the Trafficking in Women (Summary Report) issued in early 2005, some 3,000 to 5,000 women are brought annually into Israel and forced to work as sex workers and some 10,000 were estimated to be currently in the country. Israeli Police sources, however were quoted as rejecting these figures and contending that "not more than 2,000 such women are in the country".(20)

Most of the women known to have been trafficked into Israel are from Ukraine, Moldova, Uzbekistan and Russia and are brought into Israel through the Egyptian-Israeli border. In the course of their journey many are reportedly raped before traffickers sell them for $8,000 - $10,000. Cases of Ethiopian women trafficked across the border with Egypt to serve as "slaves" in families, including for sexual purposes, have also been reported. Thousands of male and female migrant workers who enter Israel illegally to work in various sectors also enter the country through the Egyptian-Israeli border.

Given that the border between Egypt and Israel is known to be well guarded to prevent the possible entry into Israel of people who may intend to carry out attacks in Israel (in the context of the ongoing Israeli-Palestinians conflict), the relative ease with which tens of thousands of people have been smuggled into the country from this border may seem surprising. Israeli sources working on trafficked women and foreign workers have told Amnesty International that they have received testimonies from Israeli soldiers and border guards that the smuggling of individuals or groups of foreign workers, including sex workers, is tolerated, so long as the smugglers are known not to bring into the country individuals who may pose a threat to Israel’s security.
http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/asset/MDE15/037/2005/en/e51798ab-d4de-11dd-8a23-d58a49c0d652/mde150372005en.html

From the BBC, 2007

According to a report last year by UNODC...Thailand, Japan, Israel, Belgium, the Netherlands, Germany, Italy, Turkey and the US were the most common destinations, the report said.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6497799.stm

This is the Godfather of the Red Mafia who dominate the human trafficking industry an Israeli passport holder Semion Mogilevich
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semion_Mogilevich#cite_note-alive-19

I honestly believe that adopting a Hebrew title is showing tacit aproval by giving a tip of the hat to these Israeli criminals.

Not that I think there is anything intentionally sinister at all.

I wonder if it is at all to do with the (unhealthy IMO) alliance between Evangelicals and Zionism.

A recent example here is God TV sponsoring the ethnic cleansing of the Beduoin in the Negev.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ao7jJfvmOyE

Is Tirzah predominately dispensationalist?

Brown Bomber

neuro-praxis wrote: »

His point seems to be that because human trafficking takes place in the secular state of Israel, the official language of that state is therefore irredeemably evil and as such should not be spoken by anyone who wishes to bring human trafficking to an end. It was, I think, a reactionary point made by someone (justifiably) very angry with Israel, and now he is struggling to detract it. I don't want to put words in your mouth Brown Bomber (unfortunate name given the subject matter...) but I am trying hard to understand your position and this is the only thing that makes sense to me.

TIrzah is a Christian NGO. Our inspiration for what we do comes from the Scriptures, which as has already been highlighted, were originally written largely in Hebrew. Should we therefore abandon the bible too?

Perhaps it was you, Brown Bomber, and not us, who committed the faux pas on this topic.

I appreciate your mild-mannered response and I apologise taking the thread off course from something highly important to something not important at all and really just amounts to me thinking out loud.

However, the Bible does actually condone slavery.

Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, [shall be] of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.

Fanny Cradock

Brown Bomber wrote: »

OK I see where you are coming from but my point is that Israel is at the centre of human trafficking; not merely somewhere "human traffic occurs". Human trafficking doesn¨t just occur, it is made to happen.

Well, I think the point is that there is no centre to slavery. How could there be when it is estimated that there are some 27 million people held in some form of captivity? There might well be hubs but it is very much a global problem.

Considering the Amnesty report you quoted mentioned a number of other countries aside from Israel, would you be objecting if Tirzah decided to call themselves "Geliebte" or "Amato"? (German and Italian respectively.)

An organisation like Amnesty International - a source you are happy to quote - obviously don't see any problem with using Hebrew. I think this is because most people don't consider a nation or its people inherently evil because of the actions of a few. That organisations like Amnesty International, Greenpeace, Tirzah and whoever else don't share your concerns about using Hebrew should prompt yourself to ask why this is.

I think you really miss the point when you bypass the meaning of the word Tirzah and imagine that in using Hebrew people are tacitly approving of trafficking. The whole point is that a woman who is held in captivity is "beloved" because she has inherent worth as a human. That is to say, she has value beyond what her captors and "clients" can extract from her. It is strange that you want to append your political agenda onto a word because it's in a language of a Nation that so obviously doesn't meet your approval.

BTW, I have it on good authority that there is a trafficker in Russia who wears runners. I also saw somebody from Concern wearing them yesterday. Conspiracy? If not it's tacit support for evil! :P

Brown Bomber wrote: »

]Is Tirzah predominately dispensationalist?

AFAIK, it's non-denominational.

BTW, I'm not speaking as an official Tirzah representative.

Fanny Cradock

Brown Bomber wrote: »

However, the Bible does actually condone slavery.

And yet Christian organisations and individuals have often been at the forefront of abolishing slavery and promoting civil rights. Perhaps it's a little more complex than googling "Bible verses that support slavery".

neuro-praxis

This event is taking place tomorrow.

We are very privileged to have the Discovery Gospel Choir and George Ann sing on the day, as well as hear short presentations from Jeanne Whelan, Tirzah Coordinator, Reuben Coulter, CEO of Tearfund, Senator Ronan Mullan and TD Lucinda Creighton.

neuro-praxis

Thanks to everyone who turned up! /end thread

himnextdoor

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Do you actually suppose that Tirzah the organisation is supporting the human trafficking that goes on in Israel - which I hardly think is sanctioned by the State - because they happened to use a Hebrew word that means beloved?

No but using a Hebrew word to represent this particular cause could give the impression that Israel is champion-ing this cause which, as I think Brown Bomber is suggesting, it isn't.

The pen is mightier than the sword; words wound. One has to show sensitivity. That's all Mr. Bomber was saying.

I hope the event went well.