Stride length, road vs hill runners ?

ThisRegard

This one has been on the back of my mind for a while now. Last summer I was doing a hill/interval session with a PT instructor and he mentioned in passing that road runners should try not to do too many hill sessions (for example hills such as those around the Magazine Fort, not hills like the Military Road a lot of people would be familiar with from the various races in the Phoenix Park) as it tends to shorten your stride over time affecting your pace. I'm beginning to think there's some truth to this.

I do very little running on the flat and road, last road race I did was the Great Ireland Run last year, every race since has either been an IMRA one or off road as part of a multisport race and most training is also off road where I try to bring hills into it. I would say my fitness is much better than what it was this time last year so would imagine when I run the equivalent 10k I should be doing it faster, this does not seem to be the case. However I do think I'm better in the hills and for example was quite happy with my time/position on Annagh Hill the other week.

So what I have now been doing is consciously lengthening my strides on the flat and not do some form of the hill shuffle.

What do you guys think, is it just a placebo affect that was planted in my head by this comment or is there some truth to it, does your running style change to suit the conditions your run most of the time ?

catweazle

Seems very different from what I have been trying, I have been actively trying to reduce my stride length and take more steps per minute in an effort to increase my pace. It seems to be working when i concentrate on it, I am not any faster but I feel the pace is slightly easier to hold

ThisRegard

I briefly read over the cadence thread and thought this one would cross over into it all right. Maybe then I should just move my legs that bit quicker and leave my stride length as is !?! It's hard to know, when I'm feeling good I can take good long strides and keep a decent pace for a while, short strides to me give the impression of a slow trudge.

catweazle

The book I have been leafing through says elite runners run with a high cadence whether they are going fast or slow - when they go fast the cadence is more or less the same its just they increase their stride length

So it seems from that we are both right

donothoponpop

I've been looking into this too- uphill running is something I'm very weak on. Have ben advised to keep the stride very short- baby steps- with higher turnover of the legs. Keep the motor ticking over as you "bounce" up the mountain. Use your arms more to drive upwards, and keep your breathing under control. The last part is very important, because once you are gasping, you're struggling to get enough oxygen to your muscles, which then die a death.

Previously, I had taken larger strides on uphills, using a "hands on knees" walk as I got wrecked. Invariably, the short-step guys just keep bouncing away ahead of me, increasing their distance. The few times I have managed to keep up by using a walk-run strategy, I've been wrecked at the summit, and they're just arrived ready for action.

Krusty_Clown

I would hazard a guess that most road runners incorporate some form of pretty regular hill-work into their training. Didn't Ryan Hall mention in his MarathonTalk interview that his favourite session is a a 6 mile uphill run at 80% effort (or something along those lines? From Kiwirunner's reports from Iten, Hill-work seems to be a regular factor also.

Obviously, if you spend all of your time in the hills at a steep gradient, you're building a predisposition for hill running (possibly shortening your stride), so you have to mix it up a bit. Does your stride not lengthen when you return down those same hills (except where the terrain doesn't support this (such as T-Runners fell running scree video)?

ThisRegard

Your stride would lengthen on long down hills but gravity would have an affect so what would be a long stride on a down hill wouldn't translate into the same length on the flat, imo.

token56

I've had the pleasure to watch and train with some pretty fantastic runners during hill sessions and talking to them they were always of the opinion that incorporating hills into your session is definitely a good thing and when I was training hard I'd have to agree with them. It was amazing sometimes to watch the speed to could go up some pretty serious hills.

I was also advised the same technique going up hills as DP outlined and I think once you are incorporating an appropriate amount of flat running in your sessions your stride length wont really be affected. Hill running only ever increased strength and power in my legs and never affected my stride negatively. I actually found the opposite that I had a slightly longer stride on the flat when I was strong on hills because of the extra strength in my legs. I think it was actually going down hills that helped this because I got used to opening up my stride and gliding down the hills, there is technique in doing this too and for me it built strength too. I would not have been the strongest going up hills in my group but the strong I got on them the better I could run during flat sessions.

T runner

ThisRegard wrote: »

Your stride would lengthen on long down hills but gravity would have an affect so what would be a long stride on a down hill wouldn't translate into the same length on the flat, imo.

Speed = stride lenght X stride frequency


Hill running should increase your stride lenght because your legs are getting stronger: so each push off should land you further on the flat road. Your knees are lifting higher to get up the hill which conditions the quads for faster running

Speed drills, reps etc should increase frequency cadence.


There are different ways to run up a hill, however.

Flat runners should run with more exagerated knee lift, or at a higher pace than hill runners and for shorter reps. Some of these hill sessions are beneficial to supplement hill running but a hill runner is interested in building climbing endurance initially through longer reps and long runs in the hills.


Too much hill work will slow your speed (by affecting your cadence) just as too much cycling will.

Kenny Stuart never ran more than 25% of weekly mileage on hill ground. I believe John Lenihan never more than twice a week on it.

Stuart always recoghnised the importance of maintaining legspeed for hill runners. Ive attached an interview with him containing a typical winter and summer hill schedules and a similar 2 weeks when he was marathon training.

The format for his hill schedule is: Long hill run, tempo run, intervals and hill reps.

Again only 2 runs on the hills. For lower weekly mileages, this can be broken down further to a schedule with a long run, a tempo run and Either long intervals OR short intervals.

One of Tempo, Long or short intervals to involve hills each week. Eg

Week 1: Long, Race, 4 by 5 mins intervals with 2 mins off.
Week 2: Long, 25 mins fast run, 8 by 90 secs hill reps.

Easy running in between.
Strides, particularly on a slight grassy downhill will help preserve cadence. This is particularly helpful if you cycle to help your hill running.