Laptop out of warranty, but being paid under hire purchase.

Grindylow

Hey, my mother bought a Samsung NC10 netbook 2 years ago, so as of that it's out of it's one year warranty. There's a problem after happening with the screen on it now (A fairly easy fix, but she can't afford it.). The thing is, the laptop is being paid for by hire purchase and it hasn't been fully paid yet.

From what I've read online since it's still being paid for, she doesn't own the good until the last payment has been made. As covered in the sale of goods act, any item which is being hired should be of merchantable quality. Does this still spread to HP?

Or would it still be covered under the Sale of goods and supply of services act? I know it covers some things outside of warranty, and as the fault with the laptop is a fairly common problem which has been caused from the design technique of the laptop it seems like it's a manufacturers fault, and not the consumers fault.

Any opinions would be greatly appreciated.

davo10

Consider the same situation with a car, if you crash it is the hire purchase company responcible for its repair?, I think not. How do you know it is caused by faulty design? and ask yourself if you will be able to prove it.

ch750536

Small claims wont do anything about products covered by HP.
If someone else could clarify it would be good but I think:

1. As long as you have paid for 50% of the product you can cancel the contract in writing and return the goods, then walk away.
2. You send a registered letter to the owners of the goods outlining the issue and asking them as owners of the product to sort the situation out.

I would plumb for issue 2 as I think this prompts them to call the supplier, when a finance company calls a supplier they generally do what they are told.

ch750536

ah.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/personal_finance/loans_and_credit/hire_purchase.html
What happens if the goods are faulty or damaged?

Anything you buy under a hire purchase agreement must comply with the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act, 1980 and be:

Of merchantable quality
Fit for its normal purpose, and reasonably durable
As described, whether the description is part of the advertising or wrapping, on a label or something said by the salesperson.
If goods hired under a hire purchase agreement are or become faulty, both the retailer and the owner (finance company) are responsible. A consumer can claim against either party in this situation. A claim cannot be made against the manufacturer of the goods.

If a consumer returns defective goods, he or she is entitled to a refund of any installments paid as consumer rights in this situation are the same as if the goods were purchased outright.

A guarantee under a hire purchase agreement applies in the same way as if goods were bought outright. The manufacturer makes the guarantee. If there is a fault with the goods, the consumer can choose to have the goods repaired under the guarantee or to seek a full refund or exchange from the owner.

Under a hire purchase plan the consumer has a duty to take reasonable care of the hired goods. If the goods are damaged by the consumer and returned to the owner or finance company they are entitled to send a bill for repairs to the consumer.

Galway K9

Warranty is actually valid for 3 years under new EU legislation, just threaten sdmall claims to the end and youll get your way. Good luck

davo10

Galway K9 wrote: »

Warranty is actually valid for 3 years under new EU legislation, just threaten sdmall claims to the end and youll get your way. Good luck

galway could you post link to this and is it retrospective?, also again I have to ask OP, can you prove it is defective after 2 years?

dudara

Galway K9 wrote: »

Warranty is actually valid for 3 years under new EU legislation, just threaten sdmall claims to the end and youll get your way. Good luck

Please provide a link to support this statement.

foggy_lad

The warranty is with the manufacturer who is not a party to the deal. Op's mother should contact either the finance company or the shop that sold her the laptop. If they fail to provide redress then you take one of them to the small claims court.

jahalpin

What exactly is "a problem with the screen"?

If the screen was damaged by the user, then it isn't covered by any warranties or guarantees.

If the user purchased accidental damage insurance then they may be able to get the screen fixed using the insurance, however, there may be an excess to pay

davo10

foggy_lad wrote: »

The warranty is with the manufacturer who is not a party to the deal. Op's mother should contact either the finance company or the shop that sold her the laptop. If they fail to provide redress then you take one of them to the small claims court.

Foggy, in your opinion who should OP bring to the small claims court and for what exactly?. Its out of warranty, has worked properly for two years and OP describes the problem as being easily fixable. If he takes your advice he will have to prove the machine is defective rather then damaged by user which means paying someone to look at it, and also pay the small claims court costs. It will drag on for months while the company examines the computer as is their right and gives their opinion. Then it is by no means gauranteed that OP will get satisfaction from the court.

I think you are of the opinion that once a retailer receives a court document, they will settle instantly, that's a risky assumption.

pickarooney

Galway K9 wrote: »

Warranty is actually valid for 3 years under new EU legislation, just threaten sdmall claims to the end and youll get your way. Good luck

I think it's three years and it's one of those EU directives that member states can override. If the laptop is under two years old it should be worth a shot quoting the EU regulations at them:

See page 7 of the .DOC on this page:
http://ec.europa.eu/publications/booklets/move/64/index_en.htm

Or andecdotally, here:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/may/23/tesco-consumer-guarantee

ch750536

Guys get the advice right here, small claims will not process this as the OP does not own the laptop. Forget about small claims.

They can try the retailer but it is the responsibility of the finance company to ensure the goods are fit for purpose, you need to write to them to tell them this (my link is in the previous post with the quote).

They can terminate the HP agreement by returning the laptop with a covering letter but charges may apply.

Technically one thing they can't do is get someone to repair the machine, as it is not their machine, they do not own it until the last payment is made (not that this is an issue but you could use this to your favour).

I would pressure the finance company to sort this on your behalf.

ch750536

pickarooney wrote: »

I think it's three years and it's one of those EU directives that member states can override. If the laptop is under two years old it should be worth a shot quoting the EU regulations at them:

See page 7 of the .DOC on this page:
http://ec.europa.eu/publications/booklets/move/64/index_en.htm

Or andecdotally, here:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/may/23/tesco-consumer-guarantee

In Ireland you have extra protection for up to 6 years, SOGA.

ch750536

davo10 wrote: »

Foggy, in your opinion who should OP bring to the small claims court and for what exactly?.

Normally contract is with the retailer, does not apply here due to HP agreement though.

davo10 wrote: »

Its out of warranty, has worked properly for two years and OP describes the problem as being easily fixable.

I would expect a laptop to have a life of no less than 3 years and would argue the case if less, regardless of warranty etc (warranty has no basis in law btw, it is an invented thing of no value...)[/QUOTE]

davo10 wrote: »

If he takes your advice he will have to prove the machine is defective rather then damaged by user which means paying someone to look at it, and also pay the small claims court costs.

A grey area admittedly, most places are happy to take a look at it and see what the issue is (I had an example of this recently). If you pay yourself to get the item checked and it is a manufacturing fault then I would expect the retailer to pay this cost if I had previously given them opportunity to check the item themselves.

davo10 wrote: »

also pay the small claims court costs. It will drag on for months

They have a reasonable timeframe to respond, this is an inspection, there will be no waiting for parts etc. I would expect 14 days is long enough for them to inspect. SCC is fast, 28 days to respond, €15 I think.

davo10 wrote: »

Then it is by no means gauranteed that OP will get satisfaction from the court.I think you are of the opinion that once a retailer receives a court document, they will settle instantly, that's a risky assumption.

Many companies wait till the last moment, you have to play the game to get what you are entitled to. They bank on only 2% of the population being bothered enough to jump through a few hoops so when somebody does they do tend to settle the issue before it gets to the court, even if they think they could win.

Galway K9

dudara wrote: »

Please provide a link to support this statement.

will do tomorrow.:)

dudara

ch750536 wrote: »

In Ireland you have extra protection for up to 6 years, SOGA.

You have the right to seek redress for 6 years - not 6 years on the product.

91011

why can't the OP simply go to one of the many many hundreds of small local computer repair shops and ask them to do a deal on fixing it.

If its as simple as he is suggesting, then €20 - €30 will have it fixed. - These little places are great for things like this, and certainly the ones I've used have been extremely reasonably priced.

Abelloid

If it's the white screen issue, it's easily fixed with nothing more than the correct screwdriver and some tape.

ch750536

Not the point really, they entered into an agreement for a fully working laptop and they have one that isn't, why pay when it is not your responsibility.