What are the REAL issues in #GE11

FoxT

1- Yes, the economy. Must negotiate a reduction in our debt ( by 'burning bondholders') and , MUCH more importantly, by getting better terms from EU/IMF.

2 - Must put structures in place which will ensure we have professional economic mgt of the country so the wheels dont fall off the wagon again.

3 - Must reduce the # of TDS. 100 or so, would be grand, thanks.

4 - MUST NOT abolish the senate. TDs want to do this, because in the long run it gives them more power. This would be bad. The senate MUST be retained but - reduce seats, eliminate taoiseach & NUI nominees, AND all senators to be elected via popular vote, ie none of this NUI graduate elitist bull****.

5 MUST retain multiseat constituencies. If you eliminate these, you will eliminate smaller parties & independents. If you think things are bad now, how much worse would the have been if FF had been in power on its own for the past 15 years?

6 HEALTH is NOT the biggest problem in the state, although it is a big problem. Lets look at these:

EDUCATION: Class sizes esp in primary school, are too big. Secondary schools are inefficient - transition year, in particular is an expensive waste of time & resources. In third level, Colleges are systematically dumbing down degrees, while at the same time, charging more for them, and churning out graduates who are amazed to find they cannot get employment. Dots need to be joined here!

There is absolutely NO accountability any where in the entire system.

THE LAW:
If you want to buy a house, why do you need a solicitor?
Why does it take YEARS for a citizen to be able to get an appeal to the Supreme court?
Why does it cost millions to do this?
Why do we put up with it?

HEALTH:
Incredibly expensive & inefficient. Where is the get-well plan? Why are citizens mugged at every stage in the process, from health insurance, to poor GP access, to waiting lists, to pharmacy costs, etc.
Why can't I take a prescription into tesco or supervalu? Most are prepackaged & need no preparation.

MY OVERALL POINT- There is an institutionalised lack of repect for the citizen in all departments. This must be fixed. Even the simple stuff like driving licenses, is a joke, and has been for 40 years. Govt depts need to be taken & shaken, and a new ethos put in place, throughout.


HOUSING:
- National public database of all house sales & prices needed ASAP.
- Legal protection of buyers from 'phantom' bidders needed ASAP.
- Eliminate mortgage interest tax relief, and 1st time buyer relief, and stamp duty, these all distort the market and/or result in lumpy exchequer returns. Inefficient & bad.
- BUT, put in some kind of plan/structure to offer relief to citizens who are underwater as a result of house purchase/rising interest rates, etc.
- 2nd BUT -> Anybody who buys a house from now on, is on their own. No reliefs , no supports, no nothing, from the taxpayer.

- Immediate introduction of a flat rate property tax based on sq footage of house, regardless of location. Initial rate 25c per sq foot. Can be ramped up & fine tuned over time. Anybody who has paid stamp duty in the past 15 years gets some kind of sliding scale relief.
- Immediate tightening/strangulation/abolition of section 23 & any other similar property reliefs.
- Simplify the entire tax code. Eliminate all levies, USC, and PRSI. Go to a simple, 3 level income tax system at 20%, 40%, and 65%. Offer relief on pensions etc at 40%, even to 20% taxpayers.


SO, What are your GE11 issues?

Manach

No extra taxes, esp. property - (BTW I don't own a house).

Re: law, I'd agree somewhat with the OP though. The court system does seem clogged up, yet increasing spending on it is not feasible in this economic climate. Perhaps doing away with the law society's monopoly on entrance into the law, and making it a state run licensing system, ie more people in the profession to drive down the prices.

mgmt

FoxT wrote: »

4 - MUST NOT abolish the senate. TDs want to do this, because in the long run it gives them more power. This would be bad. The senate MUST be retained but - reduce seats, eliminate taoiseach & NUI nominees, AND all senators to be elected via popular vote, ie none of this NUI graduate elitist bull****.

You are missing the point of the Senate if you introduce popular vote. It is supposed to be an expert talking house, representatives from different professions and bodies. The country does not need more Jackie-Healy Raes in a different house. If the Senate had more of Shane Ross's, David Norris's and perhaps add in David McWilliams or others I would be in favour of keeping it. Reduce the numbers and stop it from just being a rubber stamp.

5 MUST retain multiseat constituencies. If you eliminate these, you will eliminate smaller parties & independents. If you think things are bad now, how much worse would the have been if FF had been in power on its own for the past 15 years?

I'd prefer 1st past the post system. Look what PR-STV gave us - the Green Party and Jackie Healy Rae.

FoxT

I think we are better off with PDs, GP, Jackie Healy Rae, Tony Gregory etc.... than with a single party govt. If FF or FG ever achieved power on their own, it would be a disaster. In fact, the model now is not bad when you think of it - a junior coalition partner helps curb the excesses of the main party in power, and in the process, gets wiped out, only to be replaced by another junior partner. So, McDowell got thrown out , and now Gormley & co are out, before either of them could do any lasting damage. While at the same time, both of them prevented worse things from happening.

Liam Byrne

FoxT wrote: »

So, McDowell got thrown out , and now Gormley & co are out, before either of them could do any lasting damage. While at the same time, both of them prevented worse things from happening.

Why ? What do you reckon FF would have done WITHOUT the Greens backing them to the hilt ? :eek:

Oasis_Dublin

1. Increased jobs.

2. Build the Dublin Metro.

3. Strenghten the Seanad, do not get rid of it.
3.2 Introduce a proper committee system - if the tax payer is going to pay for people to go to 3rd level in education, then these "experts" should be using their knowledge to create legislation as opposed to former Gardaí and teachers. Also, allow Michael O'Leary and David McWilliams to put their collective wads of cash where their mouths are.

3. Prevent the Irish language being sold down the swanny.

4. DO NOT get rid of TY, a fantastic way of exposing young Irish people to new experiences. It definitely improved me as a person.

5. Health system - break the power of the consultant. Highest paid in Europe for their 37 hours of work and then being allowed to use public hospitals for their private patients. They are more arrogant and corrupt than the politicians.

Oasis_Dublin

Wait. Jaysus, I nearly forgot the most important issue... there is a pothole outside the house that needs fixing

FoxT

mgmt wrote: »

You are missing the point of the Senate if you introduce popular vote. It is supposed to be an expert talking house, representatives from different professions and bodies. The country does not need more Jackie-Healy Raes in a different house. If the Senate had more of Shane Ross's, David Norris's and perhaps add in David McWilliams or others I would be in favour of keeping it. Reduce the numbers and stop it from just being a rubber stamp.

I see where you are coming from -but I am not missing the point. Taoisigh have consistently used the senate for their own party political purposes with no regard for the various professions etc - they have abused it to the point where it is not even recognised as abuse anymore! I say - NUI graduates are no better informed than IT graduates or any other well educated citizen - so let the citizens choose - and remove both the NUI & the taoiseach prerogatives,b/c they have been abused.

FoxT

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

1. Increased jobs.

2. Build the Dublin Metro.

3. Strenghten the Seanad, do not get rid of it.
3.2 Introduce a proper committee system - if the tax payer is going to pay for people to go to 3rd level in education, then these "experts" should be using their knowledge to create legislation as opposed to former Gardaí and teachers. Also, allow Michael O'Leary and David McWilliams to put their collective wads of cash where their mouths are.

3. Prevent the Irish language being sold down the swanny.

4. DO NOT get rid of TY, a fantastic way of exposing young Irish people to new experiences. It definitely improved me as a person.

5. Health system - break the power of the consultant. Highest paid in Europe for their 37 hours of work and then being allowed to use public hospitals for their private patients. They are more arrogant and corrupt than the politicians.

1 - how?
2 - Why? 70% of Irish people dont live in Dublin.
3 - I agree with you
4 - Parents should be given an informed choice on TY. It suits some young people & is disastrous for others. Like the metro - it shouldn't be compulsory just b/c you want it:D Overall it is wasteful, and needs to be corrected.
5 - I agree that consultant costs are part of the problem , but pharmacists are as bad, or even worse. To be fair to consultants, they are in general,highly committed pros who deliver best possible healthcare interventions - once you get to the top of the list.
Pharmacists OTOH, deliver no added value whatsoever, and work hard to maintain a closed shop & high margins.
I repeat - If I have a scrip for some common medicine from my GP, which is prepacked, why do I need to pay a pharmacist a margin for that? I should be able to buy it in Dunnes,Tescos, supervalu or the post office!

nesf

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

5. Health system - break the power of the consultant. Highest paid in Europe for their 37 hours of work and then being allowed to use public hospitals for their private patients. They are more arrogant and corrupt than the politicians.

I'm really getting sick of the words corruption and corrupt being thrown around this forum with such casual abandon. How the hell are consultants in general corrupt? Seriously. Benefitting financially from the private healthcare system or earning high wages does not make them corrupt.

Oasis_Dublin

FoxT wrote: »

1 - how?
2 - Why? 70% of Irish people dont live in Dublin.
3 - I agree with you
4 - Parents should be given an informed choice on TY. It suits some young people & is disastrous for others. Like the metro - it shouldn't be compulsory just b/c you want it:D Overall it is wasteful, and needs to be corrected.
5 - I agree that consultant costs are part of the problem , but pharmacists are as bad, or even worse. To be fair to consultants, they are in general,highly committed pros who deliver best possible healthcare interventions - once you get to the top of the list.
Pharmacists OTOH, deliver no added value whatsoever, and work hard to maintain a closed shop & high margins.
I repeat - If I have a scrip for some common medicine from my GP, which is prepacked, why do I need to pay a pharmacist a margin for that? I should be able to buy it in Dunnes,Tescos, supervalu or the post office!

1. I didn't realise I had to draw up a policy report! Maybe building a metro might create some jobs
2. 80% of Irish people don't live in Ireland! The Metro needs to be built. It would turn over a profit, as the LUAS does. It has been badly needed for many years now.
4. Just because you didn't like it, doesn't mean it should be scrapped Many people in my year enjoyed the experience and it brought them out of their shells. School is not all about what is in the books.
5. I have no problem with them being well payed, they have an extremely difficult job that has taken them many years of intensive training to achieve. My only problem is them being paid by private patients to use public hospitals. Surely this gives them the power to make public waiting lists longer, encouraging more people to go private, thus increasing their own customer base. The hospitals are usually paid for by the government so in effect, the tax payer subsidises the lenghtening of public waiting lists in hospitals.

Ghost Estate

FoxT wrote: »

- Immediate introduction of a flat rate property tax based on sq footage of house, regardless of location. Initial rate 25c per sq foot. Can be ramped up & fine tuned over time. Anybody who has paid stamp duty in the past 15 years gets some kind of sliding scale relief.

Oh god no, I'll vote for anyone who vows to not introduce this sh1te of having to continue making annual payments on your house even after its completely yours. Property tax is the worst kind of tax

Zubeneschamali

The real issue is simple:

Fianna Fáil: in or out?

mgmt

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

2. Build the Dublin Metro.

I discussed this in the infastructure forum, but I'll mention this here since I disagree that it should be built.

The RPA predict the following passenger numbers of Metro North (using moderate growth rates)


http://www.rpa.ie/Documents/Metro%20North/Metro%20North%20Redacted%20Business%20Case/MNDBC_FinalRDCTClean.pdf

The 1st two stops were cut in the planning application, so subtract 666 from those figures.

Now bear in mind there is currently a good bus service to Dublin Airport and Swords with a journey time of 25min and 30-35min respectively (using the Port Tunnel).

The figures really do not justify a 3billion vanity project.

Ghost Estate

FoxT, can you explain to me please why you want to pay the government every year for the privilege of being allowed to stay in the home that is fully yours?

Why does it need to be based on square footage? do you have a bone to pick with people living in a bigger house than yours even though it might be a rotten old dump worth nothing?

Sad Professor

mgmt wrote: »

I'd prefer 1st past the post system. Look what PR-STV gave us - the Green Party and Jackie Healy Rae.

Dev tried to bring in FPTP twice and failed. It would just create a two party system that would benefit FF and FG. I'd much rather some form of list system, but FG will never go for that despite all their waffle about setting up a commission to look into it.

It's too bad, because I really don't see anything about Irish politics changing until something is done about the electoral system. STV is a joke.

bluecatmorgana

I would like to see a government working on attracting business for research and development as I see this as a great way of making long lasting jobs for graduates.

bleg

FoxT wrote: »

Pharmacists OTOH, deliver no added value whatsoever, and work hard to maintain a closed shop & high margins.
I repeat - If I have a scrip for some common medicine from my GP, which is prepacked, why do I need to pay a pharmacist a margin for that? I should be able to buy it in Dunnes,Tescos, supervalu or the post office!

Doctors make mistakes. Pharmacy is not a closed shop. We actually have the most open pharmacy system in Europe, It's completely deregulated.

bleg

bluecatmorgana wrote: »

I would like to see a government working on attracting business for research and development as I see this as a great way of making long lasting jobs for graduates.

This is one of the most important aspects of this election. None of the parties have outlined a credible plan for attracting more research investment. This is a policy that they could actually make progress on. Instead they are debating about economic issues that they will have no control over and reeling off spin about how they will create hundreds of thousands of jobs.

bmaxi

Sad Professor wrote: »

Dev tried to bring in FPTP twice and failed. It would just create a two party system that would benefit FF and FG. I'd much rather some form of list system, but FG will never go for that despite all their waffle about setting up a commission to look into it.

It's too bad, because I really don't see anything about Irish politics changing until something is done about the electoral system. STV is a joke.

If I remember correctly, Fine Gael opposed the proposal to change the voting system because it would have meant FF in power indefinitely. At that time FF regularly received 47%+ of the vote so in effect it would have turned Ireland into a single party state. Not like FF to be so devious Although it leaves a lot to be desired, STV is infinitely better than the straight vote.

irishh_bob

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

1. I didn't realise I had to draw up a policy report! Maybe building a metro might create some jobs
2. 80% of Irish people don't live in Ireland! The Metro needs to be built. It would turn over a profit, as the LUAS does. It has been badly needed for many years now.
4. Just because you didn't like it, doesn't mean it should be scrapped Many people in my year enjoyed the experience and it brought them out of their shells. School is not all about what is in the books.
5. I have no problem with them being well payed, they have an extremely difficult job that has taken them many years of intensive training to achieve. My only problem is them being paid by private patients to use public hospitals. Surely this gives them the power to make public waiting lists longer, encouraging more people to go private, thus increasing their own customer base. The hospitals are usually paid for by the government so in effect, the tax payer subsidises the lenghtening of public waiting lists in hospitals.

the reason consultants are so well paid is down to the fact that (like GP,s) thier is a cap on the number who enter the profession, tackling the sheltered sectors of the economy should be a key policy of the next goverment

Oasis_Dublin

mgmt wrote: »

I discussed this in the infastructure forum, but I'll mention this here since I disagree that it should be built.

The RPA predict the following passenger numbers of Metro North (using moderate growth rates)


http://www.rpa.ie/Documents/Metro%20North/Metro%20North%20Redacted%20Business%20Case/MNDBC_FinalRDCTClean.pdf

The 1st two stops were cut in the planning application, so subtract 666 from those figures.

Now bear in mind there is currently a good bus service to Dublin Airport and Swords with a journey time of 25min and 30-35min respectively (using the Port Tunnel).

The figures really do not justify a 3billion vanity project.

I disagree that there is a good bus service. If I'm travelling at 5 in the morning I can get out to the airport in about 45 minutes on the aircoach. If I'm traveling during the day however, it can take 2 hours. A metro would get me from here to the airport in 40 minutes.

It is needed for a city of Dublin's size, it could also be done for a far cheaper price than the one being proposed by the Transport 21 proposals (see the recent examples of Lisbon). The LUAS also makes money, something which can be said of very few Bus routes. There is a also a plan to build a bus service, which could run on the LUAS tracks as well to connect the DART and the LUAS. All far off in the distance admittedly but it is a good idea and one which a city like Dublin needs.

mgmt

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

I disagree that there is a good bus service. If I'm travelling at 5 in the morning I can get out to the airport in about 45 minutes on the aircoach. If I'm traveling during the day however, it can take 2 hours. A metro would get me from here to the airport in 40 minutes.

It is needed for a city of Dublin's size, it could also be done for a far cheaper price than the one being proposed by the Transport 21 proposals (see the recent examples of Lisbon). The LUAS also makes money, something which can be said of very few Bus routes. There is a also a plan to build a bus service, which could run on the LUAS tracks as well to connect the DART and the LUAS. All far off in the distance admittedly but it is a good idea and one which a city like Dublin needs.

You plucked those journey times out of the sky. I get the Bus to Belfast that goes via the Airport from Busaras through the Port Tunnel, all the time at all hours. The route 748 Airlink goes the same route. It is scheduled to take and only takes about 20 minutes to get from Busaras to the Airport.

The predicted passenger figures indicate that Metro North would barely justify a light rail system, not an underground metro.

Oasis_Dublin

mgmt wrote: »

You plucked those journey times out of the sky. I get the Bus to Belfast that goes via the Airport from Busaras through the Port Tunnel, all the time at all hours. The route 748 Airlink goes the same route. It is scheduled to take and only takes about 20 minutes to get from Busaras to the Airport.

The predicted passenger figures indicate that Metro North would barely justify a light rail system, not an underground metro.

Goatstown to the airport. I'm not sure how I can prove it unless you are willing to pay for a return ticket!

The metro is barely underground. Only for a kilometre or two in the city centre.

FoxT

Ghost Estate wrote: »

FoxT, can you explain to me please why you want to pay the government every year for the privilege of being allowed to stay in the home that is fully yours?

Why does it need to be based on square footage? do you have a bone to pick with people living in a bigger house than yours even though it might be a rotten old dump worth nothing?

I've just re-read my post again - I should have specified : ABOLISH STAMP DUTY, AND THEN impose a property tax. I suggested basing it on sq footage initially as a way of getting it done quickly.

I am not madly in favour of property tax - but I am very strongly in favour of stamp duty abolition. Stamp duty is ineffective (because it does not deliver a constistent revenue stream), wasteful (because it is generally paid for with borrowed money) , and unfair ( it taxes people who are moving house) .

A property tax is not unreasonable because property is a form of wealth, and so ought to be taxed appropriately.

And, finally, it doesnt bother me how big your house is, really....;)

Ghost Estate

FoxT wrote: »

Stamp duty is ineffective (because it does not deliver a constistent revenue stream)

So we are being punished again because the government squandered the money when stamp duty income was high. We are expected to drip-feed them annually because they don't have the cop on to spend a large sum wisely? If so they shouldn't be in government in the first place.

wasteful (because it is generally paid for with borrowed money)

that is up to the individual to decide, whether they will borrow for it or save up more. anyway 100% mortgages are gone and it's better to throw the banks this little bit of a 'bone' than spend billions on bailing them out.

, and unfair ( it taxes people who are moving house) .

Now this is the real big one; people who are moving house can afford to move house.
If you can't afford it you stay put.

You seem to think its fairer to tax everybody whether they can afford it or not.

Instead of people staying put because they can't afford some people will be forced to move because they can't keep paying the property tax. Now that is even more wasteful because there is already a huge expense attached to simply moving house.

A property tax is not unreasonable because property is a form of wealth, and so ought to be taxed appropriately.

But it is not a source of income (unless you rent it out). So it should not have a recurring tax on it. A big house does not necessarily mean a high income although you could end up creating this situation.

However if the income goes for any reason people will have to sell up even if the mortgage is paid off because a certain percentage of houses will have too much tax on them for anyone on the dole or minimum wage to hold on to. Particularly when you consider that larger houses are more expensive to maintain anyway.

InReality

The most important thing is a govt team that will stand up to the germans and french and negotiate aggressively with them.
The rest is all routine stuff. If we don't remove the bank debt from the goverment books and move it to an eu-wide fund we are f**ed. totally.

An interest rate cut would be nice but the sheer amount of debt is no 1.
and yes we will still have to have massive cutbacks in govt spending and fix the money pit of the hse and sw.