Common law power of arrest in Criminal Damage Act 1991

xE

I noticed in the Criminal Damage Act 1991 (as posted in the Election Poster thread) that it states in Section 12, subsection 2 that:

(2) Any person may arrest without warrant anyone who is or whom he, with reasonable cause, suspects to be in the act of committing an offence to which this section applies

So can this be interpreted to mean that any citizen who witnesses an act of criminal damage, in which a individual may be likely to flee, place the person under citizen's arrest until Gardai arrive?

Also, out of curiosity how does someone actually effect an "citizens arrest"?

Hooch

xE wrote: »

I noticed in the Criminal Damage Act 1991 (as posted in the Election Poster thread) that it states in Section 12, subsection 2 that:



So can this be interpreted to mean that any citizen who witnesses an act of criminal damage, in which a individual may be likely to flee, place the person under citizen's arrest until Gardai arrive?

Also, out of curiosity how does someone actually effect an "citizens arrest"?

Criminal Damage is an arrestable offence, in that it carries a sentence of 5years or more.

It is not advisable to actually effect a citizens arrest......where as AGS are protected by the DPP and the state when being sued.....you as a citizen are not and in effect can loose everything....house, car, money...the lot.

xE

nice guy always wrote: »

Criminal Damage is an arrestable offence, in that it carries a sentence of 5years or more.

It is not advisable to actually effect a citizens arrest......where as AGS are protected by the DPP and the state when being sued.....you as a citizen are not and in effect can loose everything....house, car, money...the lot.

So even if you witness an act of criminal damage from which the person responsible is likely to flee before the Gardai arrive, it would be better to do nothing rather than possibly face a tort case for a form of false arrest?

Hooch

xE wrote: »

So even if you witness an act of criminal damage from which the person responsible is likely to flee before the Gardai arrive, it would be better to do nothing rather than possibly face a tort case for a form of false arrest?

You can do what you want......my advise would be not to make a citizens arrest.

I wouldnt stand back.....but even when off duty...I have my powers and are acting for the DPP etc.

Its up to you whether you want to run the risk of heading up the steps

xE

nice guy always wrote: »

You can do what you want......my advise would be not to make a citizens arrest.

I wouldnt stand back.....but even when off duty...I have my powers and are acting for the DPP etc.

Its up to you whether you want to run the risk of heading up the steps

No I understand that, I'm purely coming from an hypothetical position out of academic curiosity. Obviously there would be easier ways to ensure that the person responsible was caught without having to put yourself at risk of suit.

As a further matter, do you know if Reserve members are covered both on and off duty or what is the current position with that?

Hooch

xE wrote: »

No I understand that, I'm purely coming from an hypothetical position out of academic curiosity. Obviously there would be easier ways to ensure that the person responsible was caught without having to put yourself at risk of suit.

As a further matter, do you know if Reserve members are covered both on and off duty or what is the current position with that?

One of the resident legal eagles will answer that better than I can, from an academic point of view.

No reserves are not covered whatsoever to use any powers conferred on them unless they are on duty and in uniform. They can use normal citizen powers etc.

Reserves are only on duty when they sign on. Their uniform and ID card must remain at the station, they are not permitted to carry such home with them.

xE

nice guy always wrote: »

No reserves are not covered whatsoever to use any powers conferred on them unless they are on duty and in uniform. They can use normal citizen powers etc.

Reserves are only on duty when they sign on. Their uniform and ID card must remain at the station, they are not permitted to carry such home with them.

Grand, that's what I was expecting.

Do they have the required training and cover to use equipment (truncheon, handcuffs, etc.) when on duty? I noticed on a recent Nationwide on RTE1 that a Reserve member had what appeared to be a non-ASP truncheon on his duty belt.

Potential-Monke

xE wrote: »

Grand, that's what I was expecting.

Do they have the required training and cover to use equipment (truncheon, handcuffs, etc.) when on duty? I noticed on a recent Nationwide on RTE1 that a Reserve member had what appeared to be a non-ASP truncheon on his duty belt.

They are trained in the use of handcuffs, but i believe they do not have access to, nor are trained in the sue of, Asp's (batons) or pepper spray. Anyone, even full members of AGS, who use equipment that is not issued runs a risk...

pa990

xE wrote: »

Grand, that's what I was expecting.

Do they have the required training and cover to use equipment (truncheon, handcuffs, etc.) when on duty? I noticed on a recent Nationwide on RTE1 that a Reserve member had what appeared to be a non-ASP truncheon on his duty belt.

there was lots of things done on that tv show.. that were done purely for show.

I was in knots laughing at it, as were my collegues

twas actually 'ear to the ground'

http://www.rte.ie/player/#v=1089901

Wolfe Tone

xE wrote: »

So even if you witness an act of criminal damage from which the person responsible is likely to flee before the Gardai arrive, it would be better to do nothing rather than possibly face a tort case for a form of false arrest?

You have to be 100% sure the person you catch is guilty and that you have proof of that, otherwise you could be screwed

Zambia

xE wrote: »

So even if you witness an act of criminal damage from which the person responsible is likely to flee before the Gardai arrive, it would be better to do nothing rather than possibly face a tort case for a form of false arrest?

With the greatest of respect its an election poster and quite frankly not worth the effort of an Arrest.

bath handle

If you don't know difference between a statutory power and a common law power you should not even think of arresting anybody. Make a movie with your phone and show it to the guards.

xoxemma89xox

NGA wrote: »

One of the resident legal eagles will answer that better than I can, from an academic point of view.

No reserves are not covered whatsoever to use any powers conferred on them unless they are on duty and in uniform. They can use normal citizen powers etc.

Reserves are only on duty when they sign on. Their uniform and ID card must remain at the station, they are not permitted to carry such home with them.

I notice how you say Uniforms and badges must be handed back, however, this is not the case. I have a number of friends in the reserve's and they all have there uniforms and badges on them. For some reason they call it a disco pass! I think this is truly outrageous because they hold the exact same powers as a normal citizen. The reserves are scabs, waste of time and of no use to the normal gardai if anything they are a liability!!

Reloc8

As opposed to those who take the time to register so as to make troll posts, who are utterly productive members of society.

xoxemma89xox wrote: »

I have a number of friends in the reserve's and they all have there uniforms and badges on them. For some reason they call it a disco pass!

Sound bunch you hang out with there.

MagicSean

xoxemma89xox wrote: »

I notice how you say Uniforms and badges must be handed back, however, this is not the case. I have a number of friends in the reserve's and they all have there uniforms and badges on them. For some reason they call it a disco pass! I think this is truly outrageous because they hold the exact same powers as a normal citizen. The reserves are scabs, waste of time and of no use to the normal gardai if anything they are a liability!!

I disagree. I've found them to be quite useful for the most part.

the_syco

xE wrote: »

I'm purely coming from an hypothetical position out of academic curiosity. Obviously there would be easier ways to ensure that the person responsible was caught without having to put yourself at risk of suit.

I'm no lawyer, but here's my take...

Hypothetically I am doing no wrong, have a better lawyer than you, and sue for slander, unlawful arrest, defamation of character, assault, bodily harm, and possibly trespass if you had to enter my land to arrest me...
If any or all are wrong, I'll blame American TV shows :P
Best to ring the Gardai, and give evidence.

spurs2010

A citizen of this great and impecunious land has a common law power of arrest where they catch an offender red handed, the power is only such that you use reasonable force in all the circumstances and you should ordinarly state you are making a citizens arrest by placing your hand on the offender and get the Gardai. You can detain until the cops arrive but you should just remain next to the offender........ not always possible.

If the offender resists you are entilted to use reasonale force depending on the circumstances to prevent the commission of a crime and protect life limb and property of the general public.

Statute law such as the criminal law act of 1997 gives an express power of arrest ag common law lines but as the previous poster says it does not prevent you from being sued. My advice is call the Gardai or follow the offender from a safe distance and let the boys in blue take over.

ViP3r

k_mac wrote: »

I disagree. I've found them to be quite useful for the most part.

"make the tea damn it!"

bath handle

spurs2010 wrote: »

A citizen of this great and impecunious land has a common law power of arrest where they catch an offender red handed

Statute law

A citizen has no common law power of arrest. Any powers of arrest are statutory only. Even the garde have very limited powers of arrest under common law.