Golf Lesson Query.... Left arm role in swing

Achilles24

evening all,

I have been playing golf for the past couple of years and am now playing off 15... i recently went for a lesson to get back in the swing of things for the new year with a pro i have not been to before....
i worked on my irons and he got me to focus completely on using my left arm predominantly in the swing....(i have been to two other pros who never put a focus on this)... this was completely alien to me as i probably drove most of my swing with my right hand (im right handed)....

it took a lot of distance off my shots (i have a fairly long hit usually) and also gave me a much lower ball flight and was pretty accurate when i could hit it (which was rare as it was so new to me)

i have been to the range since and have got some decent results during the session but i have lost serious distance trying to get this right.... i can see that it does acheive results but at this cost,
if it is the right way to do things then i will persevere until i start getting results, but,

is it the right thing to do putting so much focus on the left arm in the swing???? should this be the dominant arm?? and if it is, do you have any drills that may improve my technique and help me regain some distance?

i'd appreciate any feedback......thanks in advance....

Waesfjord

Achilles24 wrote: »

evening all,

I have been playing golf for the past couple of years and am now playing off 15... i recently went for a lesson to get back in the swing of things for the new year with a pro i have not been to before....
i worked on my irons and he got me to focus completely on using my left arm predominantly in the swing....(i have been to two other pros who never put a focus on this)... this was completely alien to me as i probably drove most of my swing with my right hand (im right handed)....

it took a lot of distance off my shots (i have a fairly long hit usually) and also gave me a much lower ball flight and was pretty accurate when i could hit it (which was rare as it was so new to me)

i have been to the range since and have got some decent results during the session but i have lost serious distance trying to get this right.... i can see that it does acheive results but at this cost,
if it is the right way to do things then i will persevere until i start getting results, but,

is it the right thing to do putting so much focus on the left arm in the swing???? should this be the dominant arm?? and if it is, do you have any drills that may improve my technique and help me regain some distance?

i'd appreciate any feedback......thanks in advance....

here's my twopence worth, I'll let the forum judge if my understanding is correct. I'm no great golfer, but make ssense to me

for a right hander, the left arm should be dominant. The left arm should stay straight from ball address, throughout backswing and then through downswing until after ball strike, then breaks. As left arm remains straight, this means that the club head shoudd return precisely back to same correct position as at address to ensure accurate ball strike (basically your left shoulder is a fulcrum around which you rotate, you left arm length + club length is a constant length throughout the back & downswing). The right hand therefore is the one that provides increased balance throughout swing, allowing this swing to be completed at a higher tempo, hence further distance.

If you try swinging the club using your left hand only, with right hand behind your back, you should be able to hit the ball on sweet spot handy enough, however will not be able to generate very fast swing speed.

Achilles24

Thats pretty much on the lines of what he was describing Brian but he also wanted me to move the wrists, particulary in a flicking motion through contact...
Using ur advise i will try to gain speed by increasing the left arm speed while supporting with the right....

Fore Iron

OP, just from reading your post and the fact that you say your ball flight is lower it may just be that your release has been affected by trying to use your left arm more in the swing. If you are making a very conscious effort to use your left arm you can develop quite a bit of tension in your arm and wrist and that can mean you won't release the club through the ball quite as aggressively.

I would say be careful to avoid constantly adding little fixes here and there to fix problems. Give it a little time with the new idea first and see what happens. I would expect that in a short time you can have your left arm drive your swing without it being such a conscious effort and your release will improve.

In the meantime, maybe just try to feel your left arm is more in control but Be careful not to add excess tension in the process. Try to keep your grip as light as you can to keep everything light and nimble!

Good luck!

Achilles24

Thanks for the advise Fore Iron, il keep it in mind on the range... i have no doubt i have been adding tension while concentrating on the changes... il continue to work at it...

heavyballs

Achilles24 wrote: »

i have been to the range since and have got some decent results during the
is it the right thing to do putting so much focus on the left arm in the swing???? should this be the dominant arm?? and if it is, do you have any drills that may improve my technique and help me regain some distance?

i'd appreciate any feedback......thanks in advance....

i think he's putting too much emphasis on the left arm

a poster above said the left arm should stay straight all the way through the swing,don't agree
you won't be able to release and get your timimg right just thinking about your left arm through the swing and you'll lose mph in your swing and as a result the ball will travel flatter
imo instead of your arms(in your case arm)swinging the club back feel the weight of the club in your hands and let the club swing your arms back(hope that makes sence)
this will also releive any tension you may have in your arms

Fore Iron

Just to add to heavyballs post, maybe that's an interesting way forward - think of your left hand, rather than your left arm, leading the swing and see how that feels. I certainly think tension is the only reason you are hitting it a little shorter and lower.

On the other hand, I personally most definitely have a straight left arm all the way through to beyond impact. Not rigidly straight but comfortably straight.

Either way just be sure to give your pros ideas a chance to work. Thinking about any one new thing in particular will almost always make your swing worse before it makes it better. You won't see any possible benefits usually until you have reached a stage where you can - in your case - lead with your left arm without giving it so much thought.

stockdam

Anyone I knew who was left handed but played right handed were great strikers of the ball and good players.

Fore Iron

stockdam wrote: »

Anyone I knew who was left handed but played right handed were great strikers of the ball and good players.

Really? Wow! That's interesting. So the OP may well be on the right track.....

Might have a look at the Left Handed clubs next time I'm in the shop!

Icepickle

Went for a few lessons myself last year for the first time & during one of them the pro put the swing in simple terms for me to understand.

He said that what you do with the left hand side of the body dictates where the ball will go & that the right hand side then brings through the power to that direction.

Achilles24

thanks for all the advise folks.... plenty of work on the range for me over the next couple of weeks

Irishvillian

http://www.golfpro-online.com/tuition/lking/nine.html

kagni

There is a guy called Noel Thomas who has an e-book that promotes a left side controlled swing. He focuses on using the lead shoulder to control the entire swing.

The e-book is only about €4 from here, you'll get an email with the book attached.
http://www.golfswingmasterkey.com/worldwide_online_ordering.html

There is also a DVD but from what I've read about it - it's crap.
I have the e-book and found it a lot more use that most books 10 times the price.

G1032

Just as an aside.......................

Johnny Miller was left handed but played golf right handed. He could hit a ball 160 yards with a 6 iron using his left arm only!! Probably still can!!

heavyballs

G1032 wrote: »

Just as an aside.......................

Johnny Miller was left handed but played golf right handed. He could hit a ball 160 yards with a 6 iron using his left arm only!! Probably still can!!

it's not unusual at all,two of my mates and myself are LH but play RH

Achilles24

Interesting reading irish villain....

mr.mickels

I am just back at golf after a 15 year absence, used play to a reasonable level 15 years ago when I was a teenager. Was at the range a few times in the last few weeks and I find it amusing to see dozens of other players at the range suffering from exactly the same problems as 15 years ago, nothing has changed in that regard, I am still amazed at the changes in the equipment though.

I can hit the ball reasonably long and relatively straight, can carry the soft range balls over the 300 yard marker using a 10 year old driver, get at least 10 yards more with a modern TaylorMade I hit a few shots with, obviously many wayward too after a 15 year break. The bays at the range are fairly open so everyone can see what everyone else is doing. Was this guy at the bay behind me last week hitting the ball terribly, and I was hitting it quite well by comparison, so eventually he asks what I think, I told him his weight transfer was non-existant, costing him power and his left arm position was costing him more power. So he tells me that he is after a lesson with the pro and was told to work on straightening his left arm. He thought he was doing it quite well but what he felt and what he was actually doing weren't the same. Perhaps you have the same issue he had. I say this cos many faults are common and I had him do a drill once which instantly gave him a perfect left-arm position without even concentrating on his left arm. Its very simple really, but the real problem with the left-arm teaching is that it almost never tells you that the left arm position is actually controlled by the right arm. Your right arm is in the wrong position, and as a result so is your left arm, and afterall doesn't that make sense since they both hold the club together and your backswing is to your right side and you have a stronger right arm. Think of a ballroom dance, the male leads but both have to go together in harmony. Right arm leads but both go together in harmony.


This very simple drill will demonstrate. Go outside where you can take a full backswing. Now take the normal address position and hold the club very lightly with your left hand with your left hand at the top of the grip as if you were to play a normal shot, just enough grip pressure to keep hold of it with the left arm totally relaxed (just for the purpose of the drill obviously). Now lower your right hand till its halfway off the grip and over the bare shaft, will be a large gap between both your hands. From here lift/swing the club using the right hand only, as far back from the target as you can, when you do this your left arm will not only be parallel to the ground, it will be straight and extended nicely from the body without any effort, this is a clear demonstration of the left arm being lead to a good positon by the right, many people don't extend the left arm when they are working on straightening it and thus lose the wide arc they would have got if they focused on the right side taking the club back low and slow, this is why you lose power, you have lost the width of the swing that you used have when you used the right hand more. You should repeat that drill many times til you have trained your left hand as to what position it should be in. Then when you feel you have it you need to recreate the same position of the left arm in the nice extended and straight position but this time 1-handed, with your right arm behind your back, this will also help get a smoother backswing and will strengthen your left side. Then put your 2 hands on the club and you will feel both arms working better together. Then start again with the grip split, then one handed again and so on.
Both arms need to work together, not 1 independant of the other, but I would say that the right side definitely does lead the left side and when the right side doesn't find the correct position it is easy to see that the left arm is both not extended fully and not straight, but that is only because its alot more difficult to actually see that the right arm is in the wrong position. So then people tell you your problem is your left arm, when actually your left arm is the result, not the cause of the problem.

When it comes to it ALL power players will have a straight left arm that is clearly visible and the right side is much harder to gauge, but it is their right arms that are leading the backswing giving them the wider arc that generates more power, and it is the right forearm that gives the extra "punching power" thru impact. You could say right arm for the backswing, left arm for the downswing as a general guideline, but both arms have to work together but with the right taking a leading role in the all important backswing. You are swinging to your right hand side after all in the backswing.

Also I would say that you shouldn't really focus on the hands in the swing at all, at least that is after you have taken a correct grip, its the arms you should be focusing on more. Hope this helps.

mr.mickels

Achilles24 wrote: »

Thats pretty much on the lines of what he was describing Brian but he also wanted me to move the wrists, particulary in a flicking motion through contact...

I would definitely NOT attempt to practice that, could ruin your chances of hitting the ball straight for the rest of your life, you would need the timing of Ben Hogan to do it effectively enough to make a real difference and even Hogan had to dedicate his entire life to it and he still hit wayward shots. You can manipulate the wrist angle or wrist cock of the club on the backswing, as it is a relatively slow and controlled swing. The downswing is much too fast to have any chance whatsoever of consistently controlling the wrist movement and keeping a wide arc. I can be certain that even if you get reasonably good at the wrist-cock, or late-release as it is often refered, you will have alot of wayward shots AND you will have lost alot of the width of the arc of your swing on the downswing. Let the wrists uncock naturally on the downswing. If you improve your backswing you will find for sure that the wrist release improves all by itself. In fact Jack Nicklaus said he always felt he was throwing the club from the top, the opposite of the late release and Jack was one of the best ever drivers of a ball and a huge hitter of his time. Now Jack wasn't actually throwing the club early, he felt he was throwing it early. The downswing is moving so fast that when he gives the signal to release the club his hands have already travelled quite a distance and are in the correct position to release. Plus he spent endless hours everyday working on perfecting it.

Keep it simple, and I will suggest you test this yourself. Hit a handful of shots the way your pro told you, and then do as I suggest not only letting the right side lead the backswing but also throw/release the club quite early in the downswing, not quite at the top but still early, you will likely hit it just as far, maybe farther cos you kept a wider arc, and you will have a far better chance of hitting it straight. You will also feel more confident of increasing the speed of your downswing this way as it isn't so dependant of a split-second perfect flicking or late-release of the wrists that you are trying to control, but can't control cos the downswing is too fast.

However when making a golf swing I think the wrists should only be considered on the backswing if at all. Just let them release naturally on the downswing. I hit the ball reasonably far and years ago when I played alot I tried every method. Working on the wrists on the downswing is not a good idea. Once you get it into your head that this is a help to extra yards you will have this idea in your mind both on the range and on the course. Not only will you mis-time shots this way, but you will start leading the downswing with the left shoulder in an effort to hang onto the wrist angle, which will lead to a host of other problems, a likely one being your head moving to the left before impact.

Keep the width in the backswing, means concentrate on a low slow takeaway with the right side, this should help keep the left arm straighter. A wide arc is easy to work on, the wrist cock isn't and should be a natural release anyway.

Also work on strengthening your left side physically so it equals the right, remember very small changes in the swing make a big difference and any change can be easily overdone, so don't confuse the need to strenghten your left side with a need to control the entire swing with the left side.

mr.mickels

G1032 wrote: »

Johnny Miller was left handed but played golf right handed.

So is Tom Watson. Phil Mickelson is right handed and plays with left handed clubs. However that doesn't mean anything whatsoever, Tom started playing right handed cos those were the clubs he could get his hands on when he started playing, for Phil it was sort of the opposite, he was mirroring a right-handed swing which is obviously a left handed swing, those guys are the exception and would have been top players if they had started their golfing lives playing the other way around. Almost every other great player you name was right-handed playing right handed!!!!!!

heavyballs

mr.mickels wrote: »

.

can carry the soft range balls over the 300 yard marker using a 10 year old driver, .

congrats,by my calculations you have a swing speed of approx 135mph,with a ten year old driver.........using range balls.........with i presume a pretty normal length shaft?????????????

mr.mickels

heavyballs wrote: »

congrats,by my calculations you have a swing speed of approx 135mph,with a ten year old driver.........using range balls.........with i presume a pretty normal length shaft?????????????

I couldn't tell you what the swing speed actually is, I would doubt its quite that fast. I know the super long drivers reach over 150mph with a good one and the pros reach about 130, but thats on the course, on the ranges I assume they can go faster. Its a stiff shafted club but I guess its regular length, its a castaway from my brother who has the disease of needing every new gadget that comes on the market, mind you he hits it farther than I do, or at least he used to, is many years since I played golf with him, he is a small fella too, I am 6 foot tall, he his only about 5 9.

dolby

Had a good read of this forum and I tried to introduce it today in my game, Im a 16hcp really happy with hitting my irons i.e consistent and accurate, my issue is my driving I hit across the ball, like cutting at it! hitting well but get a bad fade to right

In my mind I know what im doing wrong but cant fix it, I popped a few today keeping in mind my left arm and I felt a was flexing it on my backswing, I introduced the straight left arm and just slowed my swing speed concentrating on hitting square! massive improvement was shocked,

Thanks all, few hours at the range should put consistency in my swing..