Is it illigal to destroy election posters?

ilovesleep

Is it illegal to destroy or remove election posters.

Is illegal to deface them by for example writing IMF, TRAITORS, DEBT SLAVERY, [SNIPPED], etc on them.

Would it be illegal to simply write Fianna Fail on the FF posters where the logos are hidden.

Avns1s

In a word "yes".

They are not your property and as much as you might like to deface them (or those they represent!!), it would be illegal to interfere with them.

MagicSean

Yes

source

Yes, it's Criminal Damage: Covered under Section 2 Criminal Damage Act 1991

2.—(1) A person who without lawful excuse damages any property belonging to another intending to damage any such property or being reckless as to whether any such property would be damaged shall be guilty of an offence.

(2) A person who without lawful excuse damages any property, whether belonging to himself or another—

(a) intending to damage any property or being reckless as to whether any property would be damaged, and

(b) intending by the damage to endanger the life of another or being reckless as to whether the life of another would be thereby endangered,

shall be guilty of an offence.

(3) A person who damages any property, whether belonging to himself or another, with intent to defraud shall be guilty of an offence.

(4) An offence committed under this section by damaging property by fire shall be charged as arson.

(5) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable—

(a) on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding £1,000 or imprisonment for a term not exceeding 12 months or both, and

(b) on conviction on indictment—

(i) in case the person is guilty of arson under subsection (1) or (3) or of an offence under subsection (2) (whether arson or not), to a fine or imprisonment for life or both, and

(ii) in case the person is guilty of any other offence under this section, to a fine not exceeding £10,000 or imprisonment for a term not exceeding 10 years or both.

(6) For the purposes of this section a person is reckless if he has foreseen that the particular kind of damage that in fact was done might be done and yet has gone on to take the risk of it.

alfa beta

rapists?

source

alfa beta wrote: »

rapists?

I kinda got taken aback by that one too, but i think he means they raped the country, seeing as the rest of his post is about outing FF politicians on their posters.

Jumpy

What if they are below the 6 foot requirement? There is one on a bike lane near to me that I want to take down.

Paulw

Jumpy wrote: »

What if they are below the 6 foot requirement? There is one on a bike lane near to me that I want to take down.

Report it to the litter warden, if it is below the required height.

ilovesleep

Thanks for the replies. I was hoping on having fun at the weekend.

What about the third option of writing Finna Fail in marker where the FF logo is tiny/hidden. What they are at there are deceiving people.

alfa beta wrote: »

rapists?

One of the definations of rape is to spoil or destroy a place. {SNIP} Mod note: This was removed as it is potentially defamatory content.

seamus

None of your options are feasible. You're damaging/defacing something which does not belong to you, hence criminal damage.

A better option to explore would be printing and hanging your own posters.

Edit: Also your definition of rape is not legally valid, i.e. is not the legal definition of rape. Going around calling politicians rapists could find you being very heavily sued.

MagicSean

Writing on the poster in any way is criminal damage.

Diary Day

Yes but they shoudlnt' be allowed put up posters in the 1st place. I'm not allowed advertise my business like that!! Another example of them making the rules to suit themselves!

PaulieBoy

I just love the way you all jump in with your criminal damage bull!
I would say it's not criminal damage but lawful protest, further, the posters are not on private property but ( for the most part ) on public property and once you stick your poster out in the public domain you loose the right to control it's content. If you want to enforce that right place it on private property or keep it in your back garden shed!!

FreudianSlippers

This thread has most certainly run its course.

I can't really tell if this an attempt at trolling or if the OP is seriously asking whether it is legal or not to destroy private property... but a bit of common sense would not go lacking.

In any event, OP you got your answer - your "point" about Fianna Fáil is manifestly irrelevant to your question and this is not the forum for your soapboxing.:rolleyes:

FreudianSlippers

Diary Day wrote: »

Yes but they shoudlnt' be allowed put up posters in the 1st place. I'm not allowed advertise my business like that!! Another example of them making the rules to suit themselves!

PaulieBoy wrote: »

I just love the way you all jump in with your criminal damage bull!
I would say it's not criminal damage but lawful protest, further, the posters are not on private property but ( for the most part ) on public property and once you stick your poster out in the public domain you loose the right to control it's content. If you want to enforce that right place it on private property or keep it in your back garden shed!!

They are lawfully erected and remain the property of those who erect them.

seamus

PaulieBoy wrote: »

once you stick your poster out in the public domain you loose the right to control it's content.

By that definition, I should be allowed spraypaint all over the Spin 103.8 cars when they're parked in public, right? Or smash the window of a car who has a competitor's sticker in their window?

the_syco

If the OP moved the poster up, or posted it back to the owner, would that be allowed?

seamus

I doubt either are technically legal as you are still interfering with property. I'll use the example of the car again. Would it be OK to roll someone's car down the street to a new parking spot, or to get a pickup truck and bring it back to the person's house?

I suspect not and the only people permitted to interfere with the posters would be council workers where the posters are causing a hazard or are below the minimum height.

Het-Field

PaulieBoy wrote: »

I just love the way you all jump in with your criminal damage bull!
I would say it's not criminal damage but lawful protest, further, the posters are not on private property but ( for the most part ) on public property and once you stick your poster out in the public domain you loose the right to control it's content. If you want to enforce that right place it on private property or keep it in your back garden shed!!

Obviously you have no knowledge of the law. Your ideology simply wont stand up as a valid reason for destroying the property of another.

Taxi for Paulie !

Manach

What is the scenario is if the poster is correctly situation on a post, but is overhanging a persons property?

The landowner has the right to airspace over his/her property (subject to the limitations of the Baron Bernstein case). So as previous posters mentioned, whilst one cannot damage another's election poster- but can rent be charged as per Anchor Brewhouse v. Berkley House 1987?

Our man in Havana

I doubt very many are lawfully erected in the first place as the ESB and Eircom prohibit election posters from being put on their poles. They frequently remove them and destroy them.

FreudianSlippers

When I went to work this morning there was an MLMcD poster on EVERY pole on my street. Thankfully when I got home 80% of them were taken down.

Reloc8

That must have been a bit upsetting for our eastern european friends oh hang on

xE

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

They are lawfully erected and remain the property of those who erect them.

Precisely, and having known a previous candidate, they are subject to be fined like anyone else if they breach the appropriate legislation. So those who want to moan about how unfair it is that politicians can put up posters, there is a balance there in terms of right/responsibility to remove them after election and ensure they're not causing an obstruction.

FreudianSlippers wrote:

When I went to work this morning there was an MLMcD poster on EVERY pole on my street. Thankfully when I got home 80% of them were taken down.

Now, now. Subjective political discussions for Politics forum, objective legal discussion for Legal Discussion forum. :P

FreudianSlippers

xE wrote: »

Precisely, and having known a previous candidate, they are subject to be fined like anyone else if they breach the appropriate legislation. So those who want to moan about how unfair it is that politicians can put up posters, there is a balance there in terms of right/responsibility to remove them after election and ensure they're not causing an obstruction.

Now, now. Subjective political discussions for Politics forum, objective legal discussion for Legal Discussion forum. :P

lol :P fair enough. It wasn't that it was her posters, any posters on every pole would have warranted the same response... but point taken

Johnny Utah

Funny, the boys in blue were only too eager to rip off all the posters from a protester's teleporter outside the Dail only a few weeks ago...... one rule for them, one rule for us!

Killer Pigeon

What if you accidentally splashed paint all over a couple of hundred of them.

Laisurg

Well if you don't get caught then it doesn't matter

Dinner

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

What if you accidentally splashed paint all over a couple of hundred of them.

Then you should be given a packet of crayons because you clearly dont have the motor skills to be trusted with paint.

They're posters, I agree that the world would be a happier place if they werent there but thats not the situation. Drawing a beard on every Mary Lou McDonald poster may be amusing (the first time) but it is far from productive or, as has been pointed out, legal. You don't like FF or feel they have 'raped' the country? Then go and campaign for another party or person. At least that way you would actually be contributing something useful.

FreudianSlippers

Johnny Utah wrote: »

Funny, the boys in blue were only too eager to rip off all the posters from a protester's teleporter outside the Dail only a few weeks ago...... one rule for them, one rule for us!

Totally different situation... election posters are governed by legislation that allows them to be put up at specific times and with specific rules and exceptions.

To suggest that these 2 types of events are in any way related is silly at best.

Mike 1972

What about erecting parody/satire posters or ones own pre-defaced versions

xE

Mike 1972 wrote: »

What about erecting parody/satire posters or ones own pre-defaced versions

I suppose it would be alright, although if we're technical about it, it could be classed as litter as it would be unlikely to feature a real Dail candidate.

The "pre-defaced" posters would depend on:

1. How did it come into your possession? Did you get it printed yourself?
2. Defamation depending on what's on the poster

Not sure if it could be counted as impersonation, I believe there is now precedent from a case involving a party who impersonated a celebrity on a social networking site. I imagine it could be, certainly if your actions "in persona" were detrimental to the impersonated person.

chem

What about the Mr. Tatyo posters afew years ago? He was not running in the elections, yet his posters were up? If I filled every lamp post in my town, with my own "Vote for Pedro" or "Vote for fluffy the goldfish" posters can they be removed? Or if they were can I follow up on the party who removed them? As they would be my property?

wyndham

chem wrote: »

What about the Mr. Tatyo posters afew years ago? He was not running in the elections, yet his posters were up? If I filled every lamp post in my town, with my own "Vote for Pedro" or "Vote for fluffy the goldfish" posters can they be removed? Or if they were can I follow up on the party who removed them? As they would be my property?

They were fined for littering in several towns around the country for those posters. Have you not read The Man Inside The Jacket?

http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/DON39T-FINE-ME-URGES-WILLIE.2938760.jp?articlepage=1

Johnny Utah

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Totally different situation... election posters are governed by legislation that allows them to be put up at specific times and with specific rules and exceptions.

To suggest that these 2 types of events are in any way related is silly at best.

How is it different?

Are you suggesting it's perfectly okay to destroy a protestor's poster, but illegal to destroy an election poster?

Johnny Utah

Johnny Utah wrote: »

How is it different?

Are you suggesting it's perfectly okay to destroy a protestor's poster, but illegal to destroy an election poster?

I'd imagine he is suggesting that the protester was acting illegally, which he was, and therefore removing both the protester and his banners was perfectly legal.

However in the latter instance election posters are specifically provided for by legislation and can only be left up for a very strict time period. They are an element of our democratic process and have been regulated to ensure they do not become a nuisance. Any person interfering with the posters as outlined above would likely be guilty of criminal damage.

The one thing I don't understand about this thread is what exactly is people's problem with the posters? The candidates are making themselves available to everyone in their area on a daily basis. Go and give out to them! If you want to go and tell your local FF politician what you think of him/her then GO AND TELL THEM rather than making a, frankly, churlish and thoroughly unproductive "political point" which is, ultimately, just vandalism.

MagicSean

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd imagine he is suggesting that the protester was acting illegally, which he was, and therefore removing both the protester and his banners was perfectly legal.

However in the latter instance election posters are specifically provided for by legislation and can only be left up for a very strict time period. They are an element of our democratic process and have been regulated to ensure they do not become a nuisance. Any person interfering with the posters as outlined above would likely be guilty of criminal damage.

The one thing I don't understand about this thread is what exactly is people's problem with the posters? The candidates are making themselves available to everyone in their area on a daily basis. Go and give out to them! If you want to go and tell your local FF politician what you think of him/her then GO AND TELL THEM rather than making a, frankly, churlish and thoroughly unproductive "political point" which is, ultimately, just vandalism.

That would require a spine and would have to be backed up by a competent thought process. It is much easier to rant anonymously and act out in a juvenile manner.

Cicero

I heard on the radio the other morning that anyone can actually put up a poster thoughout the defined election period...some artists are putting up "arty" non-political posters on lampposts- you can see some of them around Dublin city...this might be a way for you to express your views OP?
On a side note, the radio programme also stated that election posters could not be placed on pedestrian bridges (along with a list of other places)....so the litter wardens should have a field day in Palmerston so...the bridge there is covered in them...

Wolfe Tone

What are the regulations for the height they have to be placed at etc?

seamus

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

What are the regulations for the height they have to be placed at etc?

They vary from council to council. The rules for Dublin City Council (or maybe it's SDCC) are that the posters must be at a minimum height of 2.3 m. This is 7.5 feet, so if the posters do or even nearly hit your head, they are too low.

They must also not be placed in such a position that they would pose a danger to pedestrians or cyclists, and they must not obscure or block road signs or traffic lights.

I imagine most councils have the same rules.

Greenmachine

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Totally different situation... election posters are governed by legislation that allows them to be put up at specific times and with specific rules and exceptions.

To suggest that these 2 types of events are in any way related is silly at best.

What if said person put poster in his window instead. Totally disagree with cops reaction in the later. Climbing to remove the poster. Sure if he fell he would have sued for criminal negligence. Remove the vehicle sure but remove the poster reek of a scum reaction IMHO.

Reloc8

Hmmmm.

Generally the opportunity (provided for in law) to put up election posters as part of an election campaign is sort of, what's the word, oh yes, inherent to a functional democracy.

Generally, defacing an opponents electoral posters, could be considered as, what's the word, oh yes anti-democratic.

I think although I could be wrong that the more sort of, what's the word, oh yes, mature way to deal with political opponents or candidates that you don't like is through debate or, what do you call it again, oh yes, voting against them

And if its the case that certain materials displease a given person by way of offending their basic fundamental sense of decency and integrity, then that person will surely be unconcerned by whether their act of defacing/damaging the materials is against the silly old law.

Of course, if they just want to drawn moustaches and cartoon bollixes on then what they really need is something to fill up their spare time.

(edit : community service ! perfect ! scribble away !)