Can there be a second more toned down After Hours ?

Pacing Mule

After Hours is the most popular forum on the board. My understanding is it serves as a general discussion forum and is likened to the conversations which would take place in a pub after work - a wide mix of people and opinions coming together in once place.

The thing is though, to use the analogy of a pub, after hours can be at times one hell of a ****hole with a huge splattering of what would only be described as scum bags drinking in it.

I'm not tarnishing everyone on the board here with the same brush and I would believe that the majority of regular posters in AH are reasonable nice people BUT there is a large element of posters who seem to be intent on pushing the boundries of taste to a point far beyond what I would deem acceptable.

After Hours has a reputation as being a bit of a crazy place to hang out. The amount of times someone new posts an innocent enough thread and is met with "they will eat you alive in here" is evidence of that. It is an accepted culture within AH that it's a bit off the wall.

It's just how off the wall it is that causes me to write this. There's plenty of threads to pick from to illustrate the point but I will single out this one from yesterday. Titled "Girl nine begged please don't shoot me" and dealing with a horrific incident where a nine year old girl was murdered the thread is populated with attacks on the newspaper linked to in the post (fair enough and not too bothered myself if I'm honest) but then the usual AH zany sense of humour - where a joke is posted about what happened to girl 8 which got plenty of lols obviously considering it has 30 thanks so far.

If I'm in the real world looking to socialise in a pub I woudn't in a million years want to sit down in an establishment populated by people laughing and joking about kids being killed - and you can swap this reason out for any of the stuff in AH that sparks debates like this post. I'd avoid it and go elsewhere.

The mods in AH have a very hard job in my opinion balancing off the purely distasteful with the edgy comedy - most notably seen when celebrities die etc. Also I'm very aware that my personal views on the boundries of taste shouldn't be a priority when it comes to modding the board. However it is clear even from the thread I linked to that there is a sizeable portion of posters happy with the pushing of boundries as such whilst there is also a sizeable portion genuinely appalled by it.

So my question is why not have an anything goes after hours and a seperate one (with a different name of course) that bit heavier modded. Seems to me that this would eliminate a lof of the debates about decency etc that crop up in threads like this and create a better boards.ie in general.

Tallon

Post somewhere else

Pacing Mule

Tallon wrote: »

Post somewhere else

That's what I'm getting at

Insect Overlord

Pageant Messiah wrote: »

That's what I'm getting at

The Humanities Forum should fill that niche for you. If something big comes up that you want to talk about, use it as a case study to start a discussion in that forum.

-Chris-

IMHO, After Hours is as you describe it, and "heavily modded After Hours" is the rest of boards.
Depending on whether you want to discuss the event itself, or the way it was reported, there's probably a forum where you could post it where you'll get a very considered response (Humanities or Media Coverage respectively, I'd suggest).

If you post in AH, you should expect it to be like pub talk.

Pacing Mule

-Chris- wrote: »

IMHO, After Hours is as you describe it, and "heavily modded After Hours" is the rest of boards.
Depending on whether you want to discuss the event itself, or the way it was reported, there's probably a forum where you could post it where you'll get a very considered response (Humanities or Media Coverage respectively, I'd suggest).

If you post in AH, you should expect it to be like pub talk.

How many pubs though would be full of people making jokes about the murder of a child. I genuinely don't think you would expect that.

(BTW I've feck all interest in the media coverage of it or who reported it etc)

-Chris-

Probably not many. I don't like the way topics often develop in AH, that's why I spend very little time there.

What my point is, is that this issue is already addressed and as others have said if you don't like the feeling of the AH "pub", just post elsewhere.


Edit: I don't see anyone making jokes about the murder of a child. There seem to be 3 types of posts there, those slagging off the newspaper, those condemning the act of killing the girl and those slagging off other posters for their use of language.

It's hardly a distasteful conversation imho.

Adam

looking for a serious discussion, and yet posting in a non-serious forum seems counter-intuitive. so why ask for a new forum when there are other, very specific fora that cover just about any topic you could want to discuss?

looksee

AH should be left as it is, if you don't like it, don't go there. I almost never go into AH for the reasons quoted. But Boards is for a wide range of interests and if there is a significant group who want to use AH in it's present format then it should be available to them.

I can see the argument for another toned down AH, but I don't think it would be possible to sustain interest in a tightly moderated forum with nothing very particular to say. There forums in Rec and in Soc that would cover most topics.

FlutterinBantam

What has happened here is a little microcosm of the rest of Boards.

A heinous crime is discussed and some posters decide to vent their bile on the vehicle which reports the crime rather than the crime itself.

And doing it repeatedly.

These people seem to think it's 'cool' or informed to behave like that,but in reality all they are doing is slotting themselves into the increasingly bigoted and blinkered views of a driven minority.


What most sensible and mature people need to do is out these people and expose them for what they are:

Narrowminded ,blinkered, and bigoted.

Wolfe Tone

I like AH, has a bit of everything, there are serious threads there too.



Flutter, you are talking about the daily mail there right?

Nevyn

Pageant Messiah you are not the first poster to ask for a general discussion forum with out the same level of asshattery or AHery, unfortunately I can't see it ever happening, but there are other forums which you can have discussion in but they won't be as random or as general.

-Chris-

It also depends very much on the forum - many forums have "off-topic" threads, for casual chat that's not as casual as AH, but for other forums the off-topic threads prove to be more trouble than they're worth and end up getting locked.

dr.bollocko

It would make a pleasant change if people could offer their opinions on AH without insulting the majority of posters there with inaccurate generalisations.
You know, the type of behaviour we don't allow in AH when referring to other forums or posters.
Now those of you who by your own admission never use after hours please continue painting with that brush so big it can tar everyone at once.
Salt the earth. Light the torches. Build the gallows. Yes we can. Let them eat cake. etc.

Nevyn

Hey I AH, were else can I post generally on stuff amuse myself and make people uncomfortable

looksee

dr.bollocko wrote: »

It would make a pleasant change if people could offer their opinions on AH without insulting the majority of posters there with inaccurate generalisations.
You know, the type of behaviour we don't allow in AH when referring to other forums or posters.
Now those of you who by your own admission never use after hours please continue painting with that brush so big it can tar everyone at once.
Salt the earth. Light the torches. Build the gallows. Yes we can. Let them eat cake. etc.

This is a bit of a circular argument. You are generalising about people who comment on AH by saying that 'people' make inaccurate generalisations.

I think that AH serves a useful purpose, but I choose not to go on there, not because I think all AH-ers are ... what? crude? offensive? ill-informed? but because there is always a chance that the minority will make crude/offensive/ill-informed remarks. It only needs one or two, and they are not usually going to be moderated - and rightly so, up to a fairly distant point. If they were moderated then we would not be having this discussion.

Because I cannot be bothered coping with that kind of response, justified or otherwise, to a comment I might make, I vote with my feet and don't go there. Seems like a sensible approach to me.

I also have very limited interest, ie none, in the considerable number of posts relating to bodily functions of the type that fascinate young teenage boys. So again, rather than go there and complain, I just stay away. Same goes for the 'how many different ways can we hate the Brits' threads.

So where are the insults? People go onto AH for the opportunity to say what they wish, they have a much greater chance of being insulted there than anywhere else on Boards, but they still go for the craic. Other people are simply saying, yes, it happens, if you don't like it stay away. How is that an insult?

Afterthought -it occurs to me that maybe AH has become PC, and just has polite, intelligent discussions, these days. Its a long time since I was there. Maybe they should have an open day and invite us in to view the new AH. With tea and buns of course.

Edit: Ahem! *somewhat embarassed* just discovered I posted in a very reasonable and courteous thread in AH in the last couple of days. I went direct from the 'new posts' page and didn't notice what forum I was in. *tiptoes out*

Dudess

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

What has happened here is a little microcosm of the rest of Boards.

A heinous crime is discussed and some posters decide to vent their bile on the vehicle which reports the crime rather than the crime itself.

And doing it repeatedly.

These people seem to think it's 'cool' or informed to behave like that,but in reality all they are doing is slotting themselves into the increasingly bigoted and blinkered views of a driven minority.


What most sensible and mature people need to do is out these people and expose them for what they are:

Narrowminded ,blinkered, and bigoted because they hold a different view to me.

FYP.

NeedaNewName

What is really needed is a holographic Ah along the lines of the holographic universe.

That would be good for all.

OPENROAD

Have to say I'm really starting to get bored with AH, its the same topics over and over again many just under a different title with the same views.

Political threads in AH were cracked down on pretty quickly, can't see what the difference is with other repetitive multiple threads.

LoLth

OPENROAD wrote: »

Have to say I'm really starting to get bored with AH, its the same topics over and over again many just under a different title with the same views.

Political threads in AH were cracked down on pretty quickly, can't see what the difference is with other repetitive multiple threads.

Perhaps you should start a new thread on a toopic that interests you?

as for the politics threads/other multiple, from my own , non AH, sometimes the link between threads is quite tenuous of doesnt actually become apparent until later on in the threads life and by then, the thread has enough backstory to warrant leaving alone.

OP: what happens when the original AH hits a quiet spell and calms down while the new AH hits a busy spell and goes mental with everyone jumping in to give their 2c on everything and anything? We'll end up with two identical after hours fora that will probably be too big to merge.

As already posted by others: AH is the moshpit of discussion. If you want calmer more focussed threads, there are plenty of fora with dedicated themes in the other categories (and quite a few in Rec). If you're tired of bad jokes / insensitive comments then I would suggest you either dont read them (easier said than done, i know) or you identify the most frequent sources and put them on ignore so their comments no longer get displayed to you.

stovelid

The thing that annoys me about AH is that thousands of people thsat post there are sadly not au courant with what I expect to see there.

Can I have my own AH so that all the posts and opinions exactly mirror mine? It gets tiring having to constantly point out that everybody is wrong so it would be more convenient just to force them to be right.

LoLth

stovelid wrote: »

The thing that annoys me about AH is that thousands of people thsat post there are sadly not au courant with what I expect to see there.

Can I have my own AH so that all the posts and opinions exactly mirror mine? It gets tiring having to constantly point out that everybody is wrong so it would be more convenient just to force them to be right.

yes. yes you can. If you are on windows:

Me:
see Vista

XP
click start
click Run
type in notepad.exe
click OK
post away to your hearts content


Vista:
hahahahahahahahhhahahahahahahahahhaaaaaaaa<breathes in>hahahahahahahahahahahahhaahaha

Win7 (or vista SP1 as it is known)
click the start button that no longer says start
type "notepad" into the box
click notepad.exe in the program menu
post away to your hearts content


Ubuntu:
open up a bash shell.
type "nano my-very-own-ah"
post away to your hearts content

other versions of linux:
see ubuntu but replace nano with vi if you prefer

Mac OSX:
check which version of mac osX you have.
tell windows people what version it is and then explain to them how you could post to your own version of AH if you could be bothered but you're too busy doing cool stuff and looking cool while doing it to be bothered.
Please rememebr to ensure that you do this over a standard, non-video non-webcam, phone so they cannot tell you are lying.

Android:
create a new contact with your own mobile number
send text to the new contact
reply to text
argue with viewpoint
"ban" the contact by deleting it off your phone and barring that number.

iPhone:
see mac but be more flamboyant about it (seriously, never used one. dont feel the urge to but have nothign against them really).

Pageant Messiah

Pageant Messiah wrote: »

It's just how off the wall it is that causes me to write this. There's plenty of threads to pick from to illustrate the point but I will single out this one from yesterday. Titled "Girl nine begged please don't shoot me" and dealing with a horrific incident where a nine year old girl was murdered the thread is populated with attacks on the newspaper linked to in the post (fair enough and not too bothered myself if I'm honest) but then the usual AH zany sense of humour - where a joke is posted about what happened to girl 8 which got plenty of lols obviously considering it has 30 thanks so far.

If I'm in the real world looking to socialise in a pub I woudn't in a million years want to sit down in an establishment populated by people laughing and joking about kids being killed -.

Making fun of the thread title is not laughing about kids being killed, you're being a bit dramatic
If someone says in the pub "a nine year old girl was murdered" I'd say that's terrible but nobody is going to announce "girl nine was murdered"

If you want to go discuss how terrible crime is with no jokes and with sad faces only, pick a different forum on boards, there are plenty

Tar.Aldarion

bluewolf wrote: »

Making fun of the thread title is not laughing about kids being killed, you're being a bit dramatic
If someone says in the pub "a nine year old girl was murdered" I'd say that's terrible but nobody is going to announce "girl nine was murdered"

If you want to go discuss how terrible crime is with no jokes and with sad faces only, pick a different forum on boards, there are plenty

I want to know what happened to 7 of 9, she was hot :mad:
It's obvious your post made fun of the title but well, I guess, somebody has to think of the children.

stovelid

LoLth wrote: »

Android:
create a new contact with your own mobile number
send text to the new contact
reply to text
argue with viewpoint
"ban" the contact by deleting it off your phone and barring that number.
.

Done.

AckwelFoley

AH is one of the more popular forums for a reason, you may not like the reason, post in another forum.

I tend to just glance at the forum, pick on a thread that may interest me and post in it. 90% of the threads are repeats of a thread that was posted 2 week earlier..

If i want a more serious debate, i got to the other forums that will discuss the topic on a more serious note

Super-Rush

dr.bollocko wrote: »

It would make a pleasant change if people could offer their opinions on AH without insulting the majority of posters there with inaccurate generalisations.
You know, the type of behaviour we don't allow in AH when referring to other forums or posters.
Now those of you who by your own admission never use after hours please continue painting with that brush so big it can tar everyone at once.
Salt the earth. Light the torches. Build the gallows. Yes we can. Let them eat cake. etc.

This pretty much sums up how i've been feeling since i started modding AH.

What really pisses me off is that we(AH mods) are always banfracting people for slagging off other forums but its always open season when the roles are reversed, and i'm referring to other mod's as well as ordinary posters.

looksee

Why is it such a big deal if AH-ers slag off other forums? So long as what they are saying is not personal attack/racist/all the other usual issues, I can't see why a bit of criticism or humour is out of place.

Pacing Mule

bluewolf wrote: »

Making fun of the thread title is not laughing about kids being killed, you're being a bit dramatic
If someone says in the pub "a nine year old girl was murdered" I'd say that's terrible but nobody is going to announce "girl nine was murdered"

If you want to go discuss how terrible crime is with no jokes and with sad faces only, pick a different forum on boards, there are plenty

On reflection you're right and I apologise for using your joke as an example.

Overheal

looksee wrote: »

Why is it such a big deal if AH-ers slag off other forums? So long as what they are saying is not personal attack/racist/all the other usual issues, I can't see why a bit of criticism or humour is out of place.

Usually because said posters who make said comments have typically been banfracted (catchy!) from said forums. Oftentimes they will go to after hours under the general discussion atmosphere to circumvent their ban. If not to slag the forum then to start a new topic in AH on the same topic in said forum just so said poster can have said cake.

looksee

Overheal wrote: »

Usually because said posters who make said comments have typically been banfracted (catchy!) from said forums. Oftentimes they will go to after hours under the general discussion atmosphere to circumvent their ban. If not to slag the forum then to start a new topic in AH on the same topic in said forum just so said poster can have said cake.

Is there not a slight bit of vindictiveness there? A topic may not be appropriate in another forum, but appropriate in AH?

looksee

This topic has raised an issue that I have been casually thinking about for a while. I joined in 2006 and after about a year of agist, sexist, racist remarks - because I was in AH and had not copped that there were other forums to contribute to - I got fed up with it and opted out.

I came back after about 2 years or so and got more involved with other forums and found I liked the chat. Over the past 12 months other, older members of Boards have started 'coming out' and it is obvious there is now an older demographic - in their 30s and 40s, (and up to the 60s and 70s,) who are a strong force on Boards.

These are some of the people who started Boards in their late teens and twenties and enjoyed the opportunity to be anarchic, outrageous and sometimes disgusting. They have now moved into the next phase of their lives and have different interests and attitudes, but there is always a new generation, coming in with the same anarchic and argumentative attitudes. So why not leave a section of Boards where they can be that without imposing too many 'grown-up' rules? Possibly with younger mods - that isn't a dig at the mods, but many of them would have been mods when they were much younger, and managed fine.

I know there are legal implications and basic standards of language that need to be considered, but I would not like to see AH 'tidied up' to an extent that will alienate the new/younger Boardsies who will eventually grow into the site and extend their interests.

Overheal

looksee wrote: »

Is there not a slight bit of vindictiveness there? A topic may not be appropriate in another forum, but appropriate in AH?

when its inappropriate for another forum it usually stays in AH. Most tabloid news stays in AH for example, you don't see US Violence News littering the US Politics forum as it doesn't belong there, unless you want to start a thread on gun control and/or the 2nd Amendment.

The example I am thinking of is say a user gets banned from soccer so because now they cant post in soccer they try to start a match thread in AH.

looksee

Overheal wrote: »

when its inappropriate for another forum it usually stays in AH. Most tabloid news stays in AH for example, you don't see US Violence News littering the US Politics forum as it doesn't belong there, unless you want to start a thread on gun control and/or the 2nd Amendment.

The example I am thinking of is say a user gets banned from soccer so because now they cant post in soccer they try to start a match thread in AH.

Ah, right, fair enough.

Nevyn

looksee wrote: »

This topic has raised an issue that I have been casually thinking about for a while. I joined in 2006 and after about a year of agist, sexist, racist remarks - because I was in AH and had not copped that there were other forums to contribute to - I got fed up with it and opted out.

I came back after about 2 years or so and got more involved with other forums and found I liked the chat. Over the past 12 months other, older members of Boards have started 'coming out' and it is obvious there is now an older demographic - in their 30s and 40s, (and up to the 60s and 70s,) who are a strong force on Boards.

These are some of the people who started Boards in their late teens and twenties and enjoyed the opportunity to be anarchic, outrageous and sometimes disgusting. They have now moved into the next phase of their lives and have different interests and attitudes, but there is always a new generation, coming in with the same anarchic and argumentative attitudes. So why not leave a section of Boards where they can be that without imposing too many 'grown-up' rules? Possibly with younger mods - that isn't a dig at the mods, but many of them would have been mods when they were much younger, and managed fine.

I know there are legal implications and basic standards of language that need to be considered, but I would not like to see AH 'tidied up' to an extent that will alienate the new/younger Boardsies who will eventually grow into the site and extend their interests.

We have that already, it's the Clearasil & Hormones forum.

But as you pointed out there are people who are in thier 30 or who are older who want a general causal forum which is the remit of AH but with out the style and 'wit' of AH.

pickarooney

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

I want to know what happened to 7 of 9, she was hot :mad:
It's obvious your post made fun of the title but well, I guess, somebody has to think of the children.

Did you miss all the Jeri Ryan threads over the past six months?

looksee

Thaedydal wrote: »

We have that already, it's the Clearasil & Hormones forum.But as you pointed out there are people who are in thier 30 or who are older who want a general causal forum which is the remit of AH but with out the style and 'wit' of AH.

OK, so why not send the 'problematic' threads - those that are too robust/vulgar/pointless - to C&H and continue with the upgrading of AH. It would not take too long for the posters who want that style to catch on to the fact that it is to be found in C&H.

I think it would be a pity to make the entire site 'grow up' with its members though, it would eventually alienate the younger or more casual posters and just die of inertia.

Nevyn

Becuause you are confusing immaturity with age.
I have seen more civil and intresting discussions at time in C&H on certain topics then in AH.

Insect Overlord

looksee wrote: »

OK, so why not send the 'problematic' threads - those that are too robust/vulgar/pointless - to C&H and continue with the upgrading of AH. It would not take too long for the posters who want that style to catch on to the fact that it is to be found in C&H.

I think it would be a pity to make the entire site 'grow up' with its members though, it would eventually alienate the younger or more casual posters and just die of inertia.

That is a horrible misrepresentation of the C&H forum.

If you want vulgarity, use Enclyopedia Dramatica or Sickipedia.
You'll find pointless threads on every forum, but you'll find very, very few in C&H.

If you want decent, mature discussion with the younger section of the Boards user-base, then you'll find it in C&H. Mess with it at your peril.

Pacing Mule

Insect Overlord wrote: »

That is a horrible misrepresentation of the C&H forum.

If you want vulgarity, use Enclyopedia Dramatica or Sickipedia.
You'll find pointless threads on every forum, but you'll find very, very few in C&H.

If you want decent, mature discussion with the younger section of the Boards user-base, then you'll find it in C&H. Mess with it at your peril.

I'd agree there. I don't believe that the type of humour I referred to in my OP is confined to a youthful element of the site and therefore the solution isn't about throwing the trash into C&H.

looksee

Ok, I havent been into C&H, but I was responding to what Thaedydal said - which seems contradictory to what he/she said later.

I am not talking about language and attitudes that are entirely not acceptable, I am talking about subject matters and responses that other 16 year olds would find hilarious and people who are no longer in their teens might have grown out of.

I don't care how it is worked out, or what the forum is called, I am simply saying don't remove all opportunities for 'immature' (I can't think of any way of putting that) input. No doubt some of the people who post in that way also post more mature material on other forums, but leave the door open for people to get started on boards.

Fight_Night

After hours is fairly tame, I don't understand why people post something with the sentiment of ''you'll be eaten alive'' when somebody makes a 'stupid' thread. It's modded too heavily for anything bad to happen in the forum, you're not even allowed to insult someone. Does it have its fair share of loud annoying idiots? Yes, but so do the majority of forums on the ol' internets.

Wibbs

Fight_Night wrote: »

After hours is fairly tame, I don't understand why people post something with the sentiment of ''you'll be eaten alive'' when somebody makes a 'stupid' thread. It's modded too heavily for anything bad to happen in the forum, you're not even allowed to insult someone. Does it have its fair share of loud annoying idiots? Yes, but so do the majority of forums on the ol' internets.

This pretty much. Dont see the problem with AH at all. One of my fave forums on the site (and I wouldnt be next nor near the age demographic of the Clearasil & Hormones forum*. ) Its got wide ranging subjects goin on. That's what I love about it. It's got one of the best mod teams and communities on this site. You'd want to be a real sensitive soul to get hot under the collar with the place.

"Mature" chat. Well there's humanities, a great little forum, the gentlemans club/ladies lounge, or any number of other forums out there. I would agree that down the line a specific "old geezers" forum would be a great idea(and has its own thread in forum requests)







*I agree with IO, I wouldnt associate vulgarity around the C&H forum at all.