Throw the bloody key away!

Quentinkrisp

Just came across this one in today's daily telegraph; it's pretty ****ing vile and nasty. The 2 teens responsible don't deserve to be called human and nor do they deserve to taste freedom again:mad::mad:


Former public school girl jailed for seven years over gay killing

A former public schoolgirl who kicked and stamped on a gay civil servant during a deadly homophobic attack has been jailed for seven years for his manslaughter.





3:47PM GMT 26 Jan 2011

Ruby Thomas, 19, hurled obscene abuse at 62-year-old Ian Baynham during the drink-fuelled assault in London's Trafalgar Square in September 2009.

Mr Baynham died 18 days later in hospital. Police found his blood smeared on Thomas's handbag and the ballet pumps she was wearing as she kicked him.

The Old Bailey heard how she screamed ''f****** ******s'', and smiled as she ''put the boot into'' Mr Baynham after he was knocked to the ground by another teenager, Joel Alexander.

Thomas's ex-boyfriend Declan Seavers told the court that the teenager, of Anerley, south east London, was ''not the type of girl'' to have done it.

But jurors did not agree and convicted her of manslaughter, along with Alexander, 20, of Thornton Heath, south east London, at the end of their trial last month.



Not the type of girl to have done it? my arse!Incidents like these deserve mandatory life sentences, nothing less IMO.

Cavehill Red

Quentinkrisp wrote: »

Incidents like these deserve mandatory life sentences, nothing less IMO.

Mandatory life sentences for manslaughter would actually incentivise murder, since there would be no greater sentence for deliberately killing someone.
Would you feel the same way if a gay activist had assaulted Fred Phelps in this manner, leading to his death?
It's a disgusting case, but precedent indicates that this is a fairly stiff sentence. Yes, she'll get out one day and her victim will still be dead. But that's how justice works, because you can't bring people back from the dead. All you can hope to do is rehabilitate those who have done wrong.

Doop

[HTML][/HTML]I saw this on sky news earlier, pretty sick stuff.

Seem like light enough sentences, why cant they be prosecuted for murder? seeing as that it what they did, or is it somehow classed as manslaughter cos its not pre-meditated?

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Ruby-Thomas-Teen-Jailed-For-Manslaughter-Of-Ian-Baynham-After-Homophobic-Trafalgar-Square-Attack/Article/201101415911927?lpos=UK_News_First_Home_Article_Teaser_Region_2&lid=ARTICLE_15911927_Ruby_Thomas:_Teen_Jailed_For_Manslaughter_Of_Ian_Baynham_After_Homophobic_Trafalgar_Square_Attack

Quentinkrisp

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Mandatory life sentences for manslaughter would actually incentivise murder, since there would be no greater sentence for deliberately killing someone.

ok, typo on my part: by life sentence i meant actual life sentences i.e jailed for life

Would you feel the same way if a gay activist had assaulted Fred Phelps in this manner, leading to his death?

as much as i despise the phelps family and want them to fuck off to a remote desert island until the end of time, i realise that assaulting and murdering fred phelps would be equally unwanted, since they are nothing but a pathetic freakshow who should not be taken seriously.

if, as you put it, a gay activist murdered fred phelps then i would think of that person in the same way i think of the murdering bitch in the article above: and stupid as well, because, they took their hate figures seriously and saw them as a threat. the last thing the american lgbt community want is to play straight into the hands of the opposition, and vice versa.

The gay man who got murdered was no more of a threat to that young girl than fred phelps is to gay people. why? because as i said before, the phelps' are nothing more than a pathetic freakshow who should never be taken seriously by anyone.ever.

Basically, what i'm trying to say is that murdering out of hatred is wrong. two wrongs dont make a right.

It's a disgusting case, but precedent indicates that this is a fairly stiff sentence. Yes, she'll get out one day and her victim will still be dead. But that's how justice works, because you can't bring people back from the dead. All you can hope to do is rehabilitate those who have done wrong.

all i can say here is that she would have to be subject to some stringent, non optional and thorough rehabilitation before she can ever step foot in society again.

diddlybit

Some of the coverage of the case appears to be passively homophobic, in which they are defended her by the fact that her childhood was troubled and that in fact she was not your typical public schoolgirl. I'm not sure if the circumstances of this case were different i.e. it wasn't a hate crime (specifically based on sexuality), that she would get the same sympathy.

http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/news/8817070.BECKENHAM__The_bleak_childhood_of_Ian_Baynham_killer_Ruby_Thomas/

Plenty of people with bad upbringings that do not end up killing someone by stamping on their head.

I also detest the defence that she wasn't the type of girl to do something like that, because obviously the simple fact that she did it proves otherwise.

gmale

In our judicial system (exactly the same as the UK), there is no way this case could have been tried as Murder. Murder involves a pre-meditation i.e. the person planned to murder. She didnt plan it, she was drunk, while she was drunk she turned into a monster and did something that she had never done before (as far as we know).

In the states, there are various degress of Murder and Man-Slaughter and she would have gotten a much tougher sentence over there. I always thought it a shame that here we have only Murder OR Manslaughter. She deserves a much harsher sentence than 7 years, most likely, on good behaviour she will be out in 5.

Yes, rehabilitation is important and when she re-enters society she should do so as a sober, reliable and safe human being. But I believe she should serve a sentence that matches the severity of her actions, 15 years minmum! That is, 15 years in prison until the possibility of release.

Cant help but think that if I was in a worse mood I would be calling for the death penalty. I could never be a good judge :rolleyes:

iguana

gmale wrote: »

I always thought it a shame that here we have only Murder OR Manslaughter.

There are two types of manslaughter. Voluntary and involuntary. This crime could potentially have been prosecuted as murder as in English law killing someone where there was intention to cause GBH counts as murder. You don't have to have plotted it or intended to cause death. But I suspect that the CPS chose to bring a manslaughter case (voluntary, I assume?) because being drunk can actually be used as a defence against a murder charge and they wanted to secure a conviction.

Aishae

thats horiffic... but... the 'public' schoolgirl struck me... why did they say that? or even mention she used to be a schoolgirl, most people who arent male, used to be a schoolgirl. is this an effort to make her appear more young and innocent on the media's part? she's 19. ive seen 19 yr old male murderers called MEN and im sure i mustve seen female ones called women
not entirely relevant.
between this and the Uganda case i dunno what the world is coming to. so much for progress.

iguana

Aishae wrote: »

thats horiffic... but... the 'public' schoolgirl struck me... why did they say that?

Presumably because they wanted to point out that she was someone from a reasonably privileged background (financially).

Quentinkrisp

Actually, just after doing a bit more research on the phelps family - i now take back anything i stated in my previous post in this thread, and i just want to say that, the next time they have one of their disgusting little protests, i hope someone just goes the whole hog and mows the whole Fucking lot of them with a car:mad: Sorry, but they just deserve to be wiped off the planet.no more no less. there's nothing human about them.

I was about to say 7 years is ok for assault til I realised it was a killing :rolleyes:

I suppose I understand lesser conviction vs higher chance of freedom, but jesus.