Official Garda Numbers Released

WilcoOut

as of 25th January, there are 11,822 members of Garda rank according to Minister Brian Lenihan

see for yourselves in Table 3

http://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2011-01-25.568.0&s=garda+recruitment#g570.0.r

Fr Dougal Mcguire

Would be very interesting to see what the figures were over the last number of years and how much they have decreased to date.

Of that 11,00 how many are actually involved in policing and not doing a desk job or some other job that could easily be done by a civilian civil servant

Turner

There are no Gardai in the College as far as i know. So you can expect those numbers to decline.

I can see more posts here on boards of people complaining of 5+ hours waiting time to report their house broken into / wing mirror kicked off their car / sat nav taken and window smashed in their car etc etc...

There will always be units for priority 1 calls but its the people who call in the above calls who do all the whining about the Gardai response time.

Zambia

No gardai coming on stream at all ??

Whats the rate of Attrition? As in how many leave roughly each month due to retirement and resignation. Even though from memory not many Gardai retire.

seanybiker

Chief--- wrote: »

There are no Gardai in the College as far as i know.

Twin brother is going back in in April for the last few weeks then passing out. Don't think there is any lined up after that.

congo_90

its late (early?) am i reading this correctly that there are no garda trainees?
slight unrelated but what is priority 1 etc?

Geansai

As per the national recovery plan Garda numbers must be reduced to 13,000 by 2014. As per the Ministers answer there are over 14,500 members of all ranks at present.

Geri Boyle

congo_90 wrote: »

its late (early?) am i reading this correctly that there are no garda trainees? slight unrelated but what is priority 1 etc?

Last intake of garda trainees was May 2009, which was a relatively small intake of just 100 or so. The moratorium on public sector recruitment kicked in after that, during which time we have seen raised levels of senior gardai retire due to the threat of taxation on their lump sum, and a further large number express interest in early retirement. Due to the lead in time to get a garda trainee to the stage of being fully attested we are very likely to see a substantial drop in garda numbers over the coming years. There is a panel of approx 160 approved candidates waiting for a phone call to start in templemore. The vast majority of whom applied for the position in may 2008, and who have been left waiting ever since.

source

Geansai wrote: »

As per the national recovery plan Garda numbers must be reduced to 13,500 by 2014. As per the Ministers answer there are over 14,500 members of all ranks at present.

Yes but all ranks don't investigate crime, that is done by those at Garda rank, anything after that is seen as management and involved in the background running of units and stations, pushing pieces of paper around. So while the complete size of the force is 14,500 members the figure of 11,822 is the number of members available for investigating crime.

However if you take out the number in specialist units who do not respond to calls but would be support services for Gardai on the front line you can probably take out another thousand give or take a few hundred.

Then you have the members who are doing duties in the admin etc etc etc, and you quickly see the effective numbers dwindling.

The 1500 the minister wants to get rid of by 2014, will not be management, they will be the feet on the street, so between the 1500, and the natural rate of attrition over the next few years I can see the effective numbers dropping below 11,000. Yes i know that a lot of the 1500 will be members retiring, but there are quite a number who have their 30 done and are looking to jump ship while the going is still somewhat good.

Geansai

foinse wrote: »

The 1500 the minister wants to get rid of by 2014, will not be management, they will be the feet on the street, so between the 1500, and the natural rate of attrition over the next few years I can see the effective numbers dropping below 11,000. Yes i know that a lot of the 1500 will be members retiring, but there are quite a number who have their 30 done and are looking to jump ship while the going is still somewhat good.

I fully agree. If cuts are to be made it will be to numbers on the ground. I'm not saying it's correct, but it is the plan that the current government have put in place.

Basically by stopping recruitment, the will let the numbers dwindle, but retirements and natural wastage, until they have reached a satisfactory level.

Given the numbers of candidates waiting to be recruitment (450 on the existing panel and over 15,000 having expressed interest in joining), it is extremely unlikely that they will drop any further, if they even drop that far.

A new Government however may mean new promises and a new strategy.

WilcoOut

Geansai wrote: »

A new Government however will mean new promises and a new strategy.

iv had a look at FG and Labour websites and theres no promises or policies containing garda recruitment

i didnt waste my time with SF

Turner

WilcoOut wrote: »

iv had a look at FG and Labour websites and theres no promises or policies containing garda recruitment

i didnt waste my time with SF

Well we all know what Sinn Fein think of the Gardai....and what they think of the people who murder Gardai performing their duty.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/sinn-fein-backs-ferris-role-in-mccabe-killers-release-1879121.html

foinse

foinse wrote: »

Yes but all ranks don't investigate crime, that is done by those at Garda rank, anything after that is seen as management and involved in the background running of units and stations, pushing pieces of paper around. So while the complete size of the force is 14,500 members the figure of 11,822 is the number of members available for investigating crime.

However if you take out the number in specialist units who do not respond to calls but would be support services for Gardai on the front line you can probably take out another thousand give or take a few hundred.

Then you have the members who are doing duties in the admin etc etc etc, and you quickly see the effective numbers dwindling.

The 1500 the minister wants to get rid of by 2014, will not be management, they will be the feet on the street, so between the 1500, and the natural rate of attrition over the next few years I can see the effective numbers dropping below 11,000. Yes i know that a lot of the 1500 will be members retiring, but there are quite a number who have their 30 done and are looking to jump ship while the going is still somewhat good.

Add to that the numbers doing usless posts like the Dail and driving around ministers, those too old to actually go on the beat/patrol and there are a lot less gardaí available to deal with crime than people think and the figure of 11000 leads you to believe.

eroo

For all the giving out people have done about the public service.. it wont nearly be as bad when someone calls in saying thir car was stolen, and they end up waiting 2-3 hours for someone to respond. It's bad enough now.

Unfortunately, the safety of Gardai is also being put at major risk. Less Gardai on the ground means less members to respond to urgent assistance calls. Scary times ahead.

congo_90

Im guessing this all part and parcel with the 4 year plan? would it not be better to reduce the paper pushers as opposed to those beating the street?

discus

congo_90 wrote: »

Im guessing this all part and parcel with the 4 year plan? would it not be better to reduce the paper pushers as opposed to those beating the street?

Not a bad idea. Let's see how the Dept. of Health and HSE managed... Oh.

WilcoOut

eroo wrote: »

Unfortunately, the safety of Gardai is also being put at major risk. Less Gardai on the ground means less members to respond to urgent assistance calls. Scary times ahead.

typical of the Irish way of doing things, its all alright until someone gets hurt

mcgarrett

Those figures are also from the 3rd quarter of 2010, so all the retirements since 1st Oct are not included.

There was a substantial exodus in Dec.

Zambia

eroo wrote: »

For all the giving out people have done about the public service.. it wont nearly be as bad when someone calls in saying thir car was stolen, and they end up waiting 2-3 hours for someone to respond. It's bad enough now.

Unfortunately, the safety of Gardai is also being put at major risk. Less Gardai on the ground means less members to respond to urgent assistance calls. Scary times ahead.

Good piont

There will also need to be a change in expectations. Like what you described above , people need to realise that not every crime requires the area car to attend.

If you walk out of your house one morning and your car is gone. Well all the area car is going to do is give you a "There there" so these types of calls will in time not warrant a response at all. You quite possibly do these reports over the phone.

Last time I was burgled here the cops just rang me, took detials and the next day a Dectective came out and had a look.

msg11

eroo wrote: »

Unfortunately, the safety of Gardai is also being put at major risk. Less Gardai on the ground means less members to respond to urgent assistance calls. Scary times ahead.

Someone asked what a priority 1 call is, this would be one. (At leased I hope it is)

Safety is defiantly been put at risk, only expected. I am countless times now seeing one Garda walking around on foot. There should be two, one is just too risky and in my option extremely dangerous. Garda are human not superhuman, if they find themselves in a tricky situation that gets out of hand. How long will backup take to arrive ? Would it be too late ? In a pair it would be much better.

Also you have myself who would help a Garda out in a situation, once my own safety wasn't put at risk . Also, would I get charged by the scum attacking them? These questions run threw peoples minds.

Sure last year on the quays what happened to that Garda ? Not one member of the public helped, instead started filming the beating. Which IMO was sicking. Plenty of people there that could have stopped that.

And the government want to cut numbers ? Sure nothing is usually good with what decision they make, it's a case of until something happens to a Minister in there own home then they might see things differently.

WilcoOut

msg11 wrote: »

Sure last year on the quays what happened to that Garda ? Not one member of the public helped, instead started filming the beating. Which IMO was sicking. Plenty of people there that could have stopped that.

.

what happened?

Geansai

WilcoOut wrote: »

what happened?

http://www.herald.ie/national-news/city-news/savage-attack-on-woman-garda-1782039.html

WilcoOut

thanks for that.

bastards

CB19Kevo

Geansai wrote: »

http://www.herald.ie/national-news/city-news/savage-attack-on-woman-garda-1782039.html

I know this incident was discussed in detail before but i still cant get over how people can just stand by and watch as a guard is beaten.
Ok maybe some people may be too afraid to help if they were on there own and facing 3 attackers, However this was not the case here and some intervention should have been made. If not to serve justice on the young aggressors but at least to help the garda get away:mad:

Tefral

This is actually a National Disgrace! The fact that there is none even coming through from Templemore is worse.

Isnt there anecdotal evidence where there is a resession there is increased crime? This is the time the Gardai numbers should be bumped up.

I also work doing alot of work for doing up Garda Stations and while there is slow investement in them, some of the stations these Gardai have to work in are a shambles!

Criminals will make a mockery of this state with the fact there are not enough Gardai to stop crime happening or at least investigate it. I mean even the opportunist theif who steals a motorbike or car can now know there is a good chance he/she will get away with it, worst of it all then is if you catch some scut breaking into your car and give him a hiding youll be arrested for assault. Im sure the Gardai would love nothing more than to hear you beat the crap out of someone for stealing your stuff but their hands would be tied!

I think this topic should be brought up to every candidate that calls to your door looking for a vote.

shampon

cronin_j wrote: »

Im sure the Gardai would love nothing more than to hear you beat the crap out of someone for stealing your stuff but their hands would be tied.

Because beating the crap out people solves every problem known to man. I forgot we lived in the Wild West.

Zambia

cronin_j wrote: »

I mean even the opportunist theif who steals a motorbike or car can now know there is a good chance he/she will get away with it, worst of it all then is if you catch some scut breaking into your car and give him a hiding youll be arrested for assault.

Actually so far no-one has given up a case where that has happened. If you know of one please include it below. Slightly different but I would be interested to hear it.


http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056022182

No one is entitled to beat the crap out of anyone for no or unlawful purpose

goldie fish

Remember in the last two elections, when we were promised Extra Gardai? Now all I am hearing is further PS cuts, and as we know that includes gardai.

I'm looking forward to hearing from a political party who wants to increase garda numbers to that which was promised. A party that will not introduce taxes that would make it prudent for a 50 year old garda to retire early, rather than lose his pension entitlement if he stayed. A Party that will have no hesitation in increasing a garda budget to allow them tackle organised crime, when recorded crime increases year on year.

I wait to hear from them.

source

goldie fish wrote: »

Remember in the last two elections, when we were promised Extra Gardai? Now all I am hearing is further PS cuts, and as we know that includes gardai.

I'm looking forward to hearing from a political party who wants to increase garda numbers to that which was promised. A party that will not introduce taxes that would make it prudent for a 50 year old garda to retire early, rather than lose his pension entitlement if he stayed. A Party that will have no hesitation in increasing a garda budget to allow them tackle organised crime, when recorded crime increases year on year.

I wait to hear from them.

Keep waiting, they're not going to come knocking.