stopped by custom officers

kincaid

My mate was driving a uk reg car which he just purchased out of a Cavan petrol station last week and was tailed by custom officers they followed him for 5 miles and as he was heading for county Fermanagh.. .
As he was about 2 miles from the border
He could see in the mirror one of the guy putting on the yellow jacket .. then they put a light on roof and car and started flashing the lights like no tomorrow.. my mate pulled over to the side and they pulled up and reversed to block him in.. he had no ID on him and as there was some letters on the passenger seat they lifted these and looked through them and looked in glovebook they then asked him questions then rang up the office to check the info and all was ok.. checked his diesel and all was fine…

My mate said the if he had the wrong diesel he would not have stopped and was have put the foot down and in to the north,,, but had they the right to go thru his letters and did he have to stop for these guys in the first place as they were in a ordinary unmarked car.. they could have been anyone

mike65

..and your point is caller?

Owen

This one'll end well [Gets popcorn]

wee truck big driver

whats the difference between this and an unmarked garda car sure he supposed to stop but nobody has to do anything although its not unknown for customs to ram cars they are chasing

Atlantic Dawn

They have more power in this regard to Gardai and can break in to property or vehicles if they suspect anything dodgy, not sure what rights they have to search you personally in a public place though.

kincaid

my point is had they the rights to go thru his stuff and did he have to stop for them in the first place.. like i said 2 guys in an ordinary car flashing the lights etc on a quiet country road.. could have out to steal the car etc who knows, he was on his own

robtri

looks like customs where doing there job....

nice to see that in a Public Servant these days

wee truck big driver

robtri wrote: »

looks like customs where doing there job....

nice to see that in a Public Servant these days

sure this money will help to pay there wages

miju

robtri wrote: »

looks like customs where doing there job....

nice to see that in a Public Servant these days

There'd be war if the unions heard about a public servant actually working :eek::eek:

kincaid

€2500 pretty tough first time fine
can they follow into Northern Ireland ?

Matt Simis

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

They have more power in this regard to Gardai and can break in to property or vehicles if they suspect anything dodgy, not sure what rights they have to search you personally in a public place though.

My understanding was Customs require Gardai to actually pull someone over. I for one will not be stopping for some guy that I see putting on a (store bought) yellow reflector uniform and an ebay special flashy light to the roof in my mirror. I mean come on.
Personally you would would be a pretty easy mark to do so, ripe for a car jacking, tiger kidnap etc.

If they can ID themselves to me and Im happy with that, thats different. How do they do that from one moving car to another is their problem. I might drive to a populated area (ie not just pull over on mu own on a dark emtpy backroad for an unmarked car).

What would have happened if your friend was a drug runner for any of the terrorist groups and pulled a shotgun on them? Stupidity all round in that story IMO..

wee truck big driver wrote: »

whats the difference between this and an unmarked garda car sure he supposed to stop but nobody has to do anything although its not unknown for customs to ram cars they are chasing

Got a source for that? I was of the opinion even the Garda here refrain from that..

knifey_spoonie

To answer your question, yes they have every right to look at any documents which may help their investigation (ie your mates unreg' car).

Also by the sounds of it they may have had the right to take the car off your mate, so he is lucky they didnt.

squod

Matt Simis wrote: »

What would have happened if your friend was a drug runner for any of the terrorist groups and pulled a shotgun on them? Stupidity all round in that story IMO..

Good point. Don't think I'd have stopped in that situation.

si_guru

Was it an Octavia? ...there was his first mistake!

knifey_spoonie

si_guru wrote: »

Was it an Octavia? ...there was his first mistake!

Dont be silly, if it was an octavia they would have never been able to keep up with him for 5 miles.

jaffa20

knifey_spoonie wrote: »

Dont be silly, if it was an octavia they would have never been able to keep up with him for 5 miles.

But sure the boot would still be spotted from 5 miles...

Voodoomelon

Matt Simis wrote: »

My understanding was Customs require Gardai to actually pull someone over.

I'm not an authority on this, but surely that can't be right going by the amount of stories (including in the media) regarding customs taking cars off people and leaving the owner on the side of the road?

kincaid

I dont think they have a right to take the car as he lived in the north anyway and was taxed and tested too.. he just had no ID on him at the time... as stated above he would not have stopped had he the green diesel in it .( id would have floored her and make it across the border as they wouldnt have got past him as was a narrow bendy country road and they were in a black avensis car)...bloody hell a €2500 fine its nearly the price of the car he said...it used to be €1500 a year ago.. that some rise

mickdw

So he was rightfully driving here?
What fine are you referring to?

kincaid

well he only purchased the car and he didnt know what the last driver was driving on-could have been green diesel so my friend if stopped and found to have illegal diesel in car would have been fined €2500 ... he was driving it so he's liable... he was lucky ... he should have drove on..

Limerick Bandit

I wouldn't stop for any unmarked car that was flashing head lights too many nut jobs out there :cool:

Matt Simis

Voodoomelon wrote: »

I'm not an authority on this, but surely that can't be right going by the amount of stories (including in the media) regarding customs taking cars off people and leaving the owner on the side of the road?

Well I dont know the facts either way, but those stories were all when people either pulled over themselves or were stopped at petrol stations/car parks/traffic lights etc were they not?

Matt Simis

OSI wrote: »

http://www.revenue.ie/en/about/foi/s16/customs/enforcement/chapter-3-powers.pdf

It would help if you put in what point you are trying to make.
That doesnt directly answer that Revenue can stop moving cars, merely that cars "must be kept stationary" nor does it address the what requirements Revenue have to legally and appropiate identify themselves.

Regardless, there is the letter of the law and there is common sense. Common sense says pulling over, well out of public view cos an unidentified stranger demands it is a stupid thing to do.

OSI wrote: »

Your mate was willing to run from an unmarked car with lights and siren into the north?
10 years ago your mate would have been lucky not to be shot when he reached the border.

Thank god he wasnt driving a Delorean and has only minimal chance of going back in time over a decade!

Limerick Bandit

OSI wrote: »

Your mate was willing to run from an unmarked car with lights and siren into the north?

10 years ago your mate would have been lucky not to be shot when he reached the border.

What lights and siren's? didnt he say they just flashed the head lights

Matt Simis

OSI wrote: »

That document answers every question the OP and several posters have asked.
*Ahem*
*Ahem*
*Ahem*
*Ahem*
*Ahem*

Your faith in rulebooks is disheartening, I hope this is the result of theory over practice.


Clearly those guidelines are written from the viewpoint that an "Officer" is outside the vehicle and can be identified as a Revenue Official by a motorist, not someone who is seen donning a uniform once you get to a secluded back road.

Put down the book and think, are you actually advocating we stop and pull over when someone in a florescent dog walking jacket flashes their car lights (or detachable roof light) at us on some backroad? On the border counties of all places?

stephendevlin

When stopped by these crooks lock all doors and talk through 10mm of open window space. You are safe and they can still communicate.

Matt Simis

stephendevlin wrote: »

When stopped by these crooks lock all doors and talk through 10mm of open window space. You are safe and they can still communicate.

If that are car-jacking you that 3mm of glass with your face behind it offers little protection. Or if its a case of mistaken identity on a "hit" they will shoot first check later.

OSI wrote: »

They're not guidlines, they are written into legally binding legislation. Whether you like it or not.
Do you want to go threw the Irish statute book and pull out every relevant act for you?

Lol if you do I wont have to reply anymore, you will have proven without doubt the difference between common sense and a law book! My god you are classic, like a Chat Bot for statutes. We need more thinking people in such positions and less drones.

Limerick Bandit

stephendevlin wrote: »

When stopped by these crooks lock all doors and talk through 10mm of open window space. You are safe and they can still communicate.

your being sarcastic aint you

Matt Simis

OSI wrote: »

Fair enough, you try that in court when decided you didn't need to stop for an unmarked car. See how far it gets you.

"Sorry judge, I didn't stop cause I thought it was some randomer trying to rob me"

Actually I said I prolly drive to a more populated, less murder prone area, which from Googling online, seems to be an accepted and sometimes endorsed response to unmarked cars.

Whats interesting is reading online this is a rare occurance in most other places as they dont have an elite Revenue squad cracking down on lone drivers with the audacity not to buy those blue and white reg plates. They just have real Police in marked cars doing you know, real police work.
From what I have read, UK and US police forces do not like to use unmarked cars for pulling people over for obvious reasons.

Limerick Bandit

OSI wrote: »

Fair enough, you try that in court when decided you didn't need to stop for an unmarked car. See how far it gets you.

"Sorry judge, I didn't stop cause I thought it was some randomer trying to rob me"

You don't have to stop for for a car that flashes their lights!

timogen

OSI wrote: »

Fair enough, you try that in court when decided you didn't need to stop for an unmarked car. See how far it gets you.

"Sorry judge, I didn't stop cause I thought it was some randomer trying to rob me"

That has worked for my cousin (female) brought to court on a failure to stop.It was 2.30am on a dark back road when an unmarked tried to pull her in but she drove to her home which was about 3 miles away and her husband was there.
She was breath tested and so on,which was all clear.
Judge through it out and said she had done the right thing

stephendevlin

Matt Simis wrote: »

If that are car-jacking you that 3mm of glass with your face behind it offers little protection. Or if its a case of mistaken identity on a "hit" they will shoot first check later.
.

Its protection enough if someone doesnt have a gun but would like to overpower you.

Who needs a gun if all you say is ... Me Customs .. You out of car now... we seize car ... BYE BYE


Ive yet to hear of car jackings with guns being a big problem in Ireland... If someone told me to get out of the car I would ask for a uniformed Gardai before I get out customs or no customs

I would provide my identification and when the gardai came I would know its safer to come out.

Seems like a fair deal. Why deny me my safety.

Anan1

Matt Simis wrote: »

Your faith in rulebooks is disheartening, I hope this is the result of theory over practice.


Clearly those guidelines are written from the viewpoint that an "Officer" is outside the vehicle and can be identified as a Revenue Official by a motorist, not someone who is seen donning a uniform once you get to a secluded back road.

Put down the book and think, are you actually advocating we stop and pull over when someone in a florescent dog walking jacket flashes their car lights (or detachable roof light) at us on some backroad? On the border counties of all places?

In fairness, the OP's questions:

kincaid wrote: »

but had they the right to go thru his letters and did he have to stop for these guys in the first place as they were in a ordinary unmarked car.. they could have been anyone

have both been answered in the affirmative.;)

Matt Simis

Anan1 wrote: »

In fairness, the OP's questions:have both been answered in the affirmative.;)

Perhaps! I was really talking to the later answers from some people that jumped to "of course you should stop" without considering the dangers.

stephendevlin wrote: »

Its protection enough if someone doesnt have a gun but would like to overpower you.

A Hammer?

Limerick Bandit

Side windows of a car are designed to break in case you end up under water so they will break easy with a good punch

EPM

OP's questions have been dealt with so no need to keep this going. If there's a valid reason for going on PM a mod.