Plane increase?

caseyann

Hey guys,i was just wondering why there seems to be alot of plane activity in what looks like the same areas around Dublin and Wicklow mountains.
I know to the eyes Planes can seem very low but are actually far away.
Although when you have the eyeline of the hills and mountains in the focus to measure each of their apparent contrails,they seem very close to eachother and traveling very close behind eachother.
I recently saw in the sky 8 planes travel in one direction with contrails? coming from the back of them.
Can you enlighten me why i am seeing it more often than i did before.
Also one of the planes on one occasion seemed to change direction and catch up to two planes going entirely different direction.
It is a conspiracy theory that we are being sprayed with chemtrails.Is there any pilots or air traffickers who would know how many planes are allowed to fly in same area in what seems so close proximity to eachother.
Also why is there more in the morning than afternoon?
Thanks

iPlop

caseyann wrote: »

Hey guys,i was just wondering why there seems to be alot of plane activity in what looks like the same areas around Dublin and Wicklow mountains.
I know to the eyes Planes can seem very low but are actually far away.
Although when you have the eyeline of the hills and mountains in the focus to measure each of their apparent contrails,they seem very close to eachother and traveling very close behind eachother.
I recently saw in the sky 8 planes travel in one direction with contrails? coming from the back of them.
Can you enlighten me why i am seeing it more often than i did before.
Also one of the planes on one occasion seemed to change direction and catch up to two planes going entirely different direction.
It is a conspiracy theory that we are being sprayed with chemtrails.Is there any pilots or air traffickers who would know how many planes are allowed to fly in same area in what seems so close proximity to eachother.
Also why is there more in the morning than afternoon?
Thanks

What you're looking at is basically the M50 for aircraft in the sky ,there are a lot of planes in the morning and we have had very clear mornings over the last few days.I live in Wicklow and I have seen this but it's a normal flightpath for aircraft travelling over the atlantic

donkey balls

Since 2000 the IAA introduced RVSM(reduced vertical seperation minimun) which means that aircraft can fly a thousand feet apart verticaly,Just say you have a aicraft heading towards the USA at 35,000ft you could also have one eading towards Europe at 36,000ft.

Samba

Ello,

We decided we would infiltrate the aviation forum to try and get a few professional opinions on a certain topic.

Persistent contrails.


http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...3&searchtype=a


Contrails are described as:

According to the Schmidt–Appleman criterion [1,10], contrail formation is expected thermodynamically due to the increase
in relative humidity (RH) that occurs in the engine plume as a result of mixing of heat and water vapour between the warm and
moist exhaust and the cool ambient air, and as a consequence of the non-linear increase of saturation humidity with temperature,
see Fig. 1. When the ambient atmosphere is cold enough, with temperature below a threshold temperature, humidity may reach
liquid saturation in the young plume behind the aircraft. Then liquid water droplets form, by condensation of water vapour
mainly on soot and volatile particles in the exhaust plume. Saturation with respect to ice is not sufficient for contrail formation
[10–15]. Many of the liquid droplets freeze soon thereafter and form ice particles

And the persistent forms are described as:

Contrails are short-lived when the ambient air is dry, with relative humidity below saturation over an ice surface so that the
ice particles forming in the contrail evaporate. Often, contrails disappear after seconds to minutes, between one and several ten
kilometres behind the aircraft.
Contrails persist if the ambient humidity is larger than saturation humidity over ice surfaces (relative humidity over ice RHi
larger than 100%). In such ice-supersaturated air masses, the ice particles within the contrails grow by deposition of water
vapour molecules from the ambient air. Contrails may persist as long as the ambient air in which the contrail forms stays
ice-supersaturated [32].

So we're in agreement so far?

O.k so then when you read about the following can this simply be explained by the above definition of persistent contrails or might she have a point?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTxvWLrUeE8&

(it's a long one I know but she makes decent case, at a glance anyway)

I've no idea if i'm honest but i would love to hear the aviation forums take on the matter.

EchoIndia

Life is too short to get involved in debates with conspiracy theorists. Nothing will ever convince them they are wrong.

xflyer

The last couple of days have been very conducive to contrails with the current low temperatures on the ground. That's why they are more obvious. It was even mentioned on the weather forecast last night.

I won't even dignify the chemtrail nonsense with a reply. This has been done to death over the years and is utter nonsense.

As for seeing a gaggle of aircraft apparently flying together, the reasons are simple, scheduling. Everyone wants to arrive at the same time. People really don't want to arrive in New York at three in the morning or some other unsuitable time. So there's a morning rush hour. Equally in the other direction the sky is filled with airliners arriving in Europe early in the morning.

Another reason are the North Atlantic tracks which are effectively highways in the sky. These change daily depending on wind direction and the position of the jetstream. No one wants to fly into a 200 mile an hour headwind but they definitely would like to fly with a 200 mile an hour tailwind.

This is the main reason why one day they morning sky is full of contrails and other days nothing. We in Ireland are directly under the path of most transatlantic flights.

Ignore the chemtrail nonsense, caseyann. Very strange people have been peddling this idea for years. With zero evidence.

shanman

The North Atlantic Tracks vary on a daily basis depending on oceanic winds. As Ireland is on the the Great Circle Track when the winds are fairly neutral the bulk of NAT traffic Eastbound & Westbound cross Irish airspace.

uprising2

Anybody here ever hear of this patent?


" One technique proposed to seed the metallic particles was to add the tiny particles to the fuel of jet airliners, so that the particles would be emitted from the jet engine exhaust while the airliner was at its cruising altitude."
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=5003186.PN.&OS=PN/5003186&RS=PN/5003186

This patent was granted to Hughes Aircraft Company under the umbrella of GM Hughes Electronics, until GM sold its assets to Raytheon in 1997.

Raytheon is a major American defense contractor and industrial corporation with core manufacturing concentrations in defense systems and defense and commercial electronics.
It was previously involved in corporate and special-mission aircraft until early 2007.

Maybe you should look into Project Cloverleaf also.

There's plenty of evidence this patent hasn't amounted to nothing.

A320-200

For the love of god. Can you get this crap off the aviation forum please. Keep all this nonsense to the conspiracy forum.

Samba

A320-200 wrote: »

For the love of god. Can you get this crap off the aviation forum please. Keep all this nonsense to the conspiracy forum.

I hold my hand up, sorry I feared the discussion would spill over but it certainly wasn't my intention.

I wanted to hear the professional opinion of those within the industry as opposed to those who think they are experts so i felt this was a suitable place to post.

I think from the few posts made i've got a good idea of what the general consensus is

If anyone wants to argue please take it back to the CT forum please. The purpose of my post was to establish that persistent contrails have and always will be a part of aviation based on scientific fact and nothing more.

Thank you

Qantas

Give Jim Corr a ring he'll explain it all:D:D:p

moss.ie

Qantas wrote: »

Give Jim Corr a ring he'll explain it all:D:D:p

WITHDRAW! WITHDRAW! WITHDRAW!