Fg and Lab are obliged to put before electorate a joint programme for government

scr123

The polls are clearly indicating the next government will be a FG/labour Coalition. There is widespread evidence the two parties are deeply divided over many issues. Surely it is only right and proper the two parties put before the electorate a joint programme for government ?

Avns1s

I am not aware of any precedent for this. If they form the next government it will be because the electorate on balance decided in favour of their policies so regardless of their differing positions at this point, it is safe to presume that the compromised position on any policies would be equally acceptable.

Laminations

scr123 wrote: »

Surely it is only right and proper the two parties put before the electorate a joint programme for government ?

You have some gall talk about what is only right and proper.
You almost top my list of FFapologists in the media (Fappers)

outandabout

This has never been done in my experience.

They'll both run on their own manifestos and if they have the numbers will then enter talks on a joint programme.

Of course they'll have their differences but their will be compromise on both sides.

steof1984

This was never asked of Finna Fail and the Progressive Democrats, or Finna Fail and the Greens.

We wont know until after the election, the make up of the parties and what’s exactly needed to make a majority.

Regardless of how it looks in the polls, I’m sure both parties are out with the goal of obtaining a single majority. The negotiations and compromise will come after the election just like it has been done in all previous elections.

To say that there obliged to do this is just nonsense

scr123

The same two parties entered government in 1982 on the same platform as today, condemnation of FF. In last 18 months 4 FG Ministers and the Taoiseach of that government have gone on record as saying they found it impossible to make decisions that were overall good for the country. We all know that in recent months there have been bitter exchanges between FG and Labour which do not bode well for future government. There may be no precedent for a pre-election joint programme but the same two parties are making the claim these are unprecedented times. Personally I would not be looking for a full joint programme but an outline of joint policies in certain areas has to be a must

Avns1s

scr123 wrote: »

The same two parties entered government in 1982 on the same platform as today, condemnation of FF. In last 18 months 4 FG Ministers and the Taoiseach of that government have gone on record as saying they found it impossible to make decisions that were overall good for the country. We all know that in recent months there have been bitter exchanges between FG and Labour which do not bode well for future government. There may be no precedent for a pre-election joint programme but the same two parties are making the claim these are unprecedented times. Personally I would not be looking for a full joint programme but an outline of joint policies in certain areas has to be a must

Cowen, get back to the Dail, Leaders Questions starting in 40 minutes!!!!

Biggins

scr123 wrote: »

The polls are clearly indicating the next government will be a FG/labour Coalition. There is widespread evidence the two parties are deeply divided over many issues. Surely it is only right and proper the two parties put before the electorate a joint programme for government ?

Each party represents itself based on its ideology and members, always at election time.
This has been done since democratic time began.

If they decided later to come together to have a meeting of minds, fair enough but until then the electorate should be allowed on voting day, to have a clearer understand of difference between parties.

Despite Fianna Fail supporters looking for just perhaps more ammunition in order to fire at any opposition, maybe they should also consider owning up to their own mistakes - all of them and telling us how they are going to go about changing them!
A bit of information and forth coming honesty from them for once would be nice too.

Whats that quote about removing a splinter from one own eye before trying to remove it from another?

Bottle_of_Smoke

Whilst it is likely FG and Labour will make up the next government, it is much more difficult to estimate what the composition of the government ie how many Labour TDs and many FG TDs.

The bigger the party's seat number the more they can set the stage. Therefore they cannot commit to pre-election programmes.

Manach

But would it be more transparent to the electorate to know which of there polices are core and which might have some leeway for negotiation? For example in the recent UK elections, the Liberal party's seemly cast-iron pledge on tuition fees was altered as part of the coalition discussions.

Biggins

Manach wrote: »

But would it be more transparent to the electorate to know which of there polices are core and which might have some leeway for negotiation? For example in the recent UK elections, the Liberal party's seemly cast-iron pledge on tuition fees was altered as part of the coalition discussions.

If the electorate are that interested as to where parties agree - supposing there might be a joint programme - all they have to do is compare party litrature.
Lord knows there will be enough of it coming through our letter boxes and in the various forms of media.

To ask parties to predict the future on something that has yet to be even decided, is like asking for the top numbers of dice that already haven't been rolled yet.

We have to get to stage one, before we can move on to stage two.

Monty Burnz

I look forward to Fianna Fail's joint programme for government with Sinn Fein, the Greens and whatever dregs are left in the Dail when you take out FG and Lab.

Liam Byrne

scr123 wrote: »

The polls are clearly indicating the next government will be a FG/labour Coalition. There is widespread evidence the two parties are deeply divided over many issues. Surely it is only right and proper the two parties put before the electorate a joint programme for government ?

Are these the same polls that are showing FF at 14% and are being summarily dismissed by FFers because "only one poll counts, on election day" ?

The double-standards continue, I see. :rolleyes:

Sierra Oscar

Such divisions, like in the past, can be dealt with during the creation of a programme of government.

the groutch

there's no joint programme because both believe that they can win enough seats form a government without the other

fly_agaric

Biggins wrote: »

Whats that quote about removing a splinter from one own eye before trying to remove it from another?

It's "beams" & "motes" isn't it? In FF's case they'll need some big yellow machines because they've a forest to extract.

Liam Byrne

Can I suggest that the mods change the thread title to reflect the fact that this is a question, rather than a statement / fact ?

CoalBucket

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Can I suggest that the mods change the thread title to reflect the fact that this is a question, rather than a statement / fact ?

I agree, and also add some smiley faces for the hilarity of the idea.

imme

They've decided to fight the election on their own. They aren't obliged to set anything before the electorate. The electorate will then decide and the numbers of seats won by each party after the election will determine who's in government.

That's how it'll be.

Coillte_Bhoy

the groutch wrote: »

there's no joint programme because both believe that they can win enough seats form a government without the other

Nonsense, whatever delusions FG have of getting an overall majority, Labour certainly dont and in fact i doubt they will have more than 70 candidates.

Shea O'Meara

scr123 wrote: »

The polls are clearly indicating the next government will be a FG/labour Coalition. There is widespread evidence the two parties are deeply divided over many issues. Surely it is only right and proper the two parties put before the electorate a joint programme for government ?

They are independent of each other. If the votes fall a particular way and if they form a government, only then are they obliged to provide a joint programme for government. Doing so now would make no sense and be jumping the gun ahead of the electorate.

gandalf

It is a bit presumptuous at this stage to decide the make up of the next Dail is it not? Even for a staunch FF supporter

Dirk Gently

the groutch wrote: »

there's no joint programme because both believe that they can win enough seats form a government without the other

It's not necessarily about getting an overall majority. Neither want, or should commit to any concessions without knowing the full strength of their hand. Only after the election will they know the numbers. I dont think either party think they'll do it alone but both will be hoping to be the larger of the coalition partners, therefore strengthening their mandate while negotiating.

Ideally it would be nice to have a programme to vote for but realistically it's just FF spin that one is necessary.The programmes for government are what ever FG and Lab put out individually. How many votes each lab and FG programme will get will determine what likely percentage of the compromise programme after the election will be Lab or FG. The situation would be helped if FG and FF just merged, then people would have a real choice and real chance to elect either a one party labour government or a one party FG/FF government. The civil war politics of the 2 and a half party system has stagnated Irish politics for far too long. We desperately need either new parties or FF to disband and their rank and file merge with which ever of FG or Lab they feel closest to.

johnnyskeleton

The joint policy of a 70%/30% FG/Lab government will be vastly different to a 30/70 split or a 50/50 split or any other combination that might arise.

They can't agree a joint programme because they don't know which of the two parties will be dominant.