Irish Blood in the British Royal Family

paky · 11-01-2011 10:28am #1

I came a cross a number of websites claiming the British Royal Family was made up of a number of nationalities including Irish. I cant seem to find any further info on this. I know the Fitzgeralds had some connection with the royal family but not sure.

paky · 11-01-2011 10:28am

sorry this was meant for the history forum

paky · 12-01-2011 6:19pm

hey mod any chance you can send this to the history and heritage section?

Poccington · 12-01-2011 10:50pm

Moved this across at users request.

who the fug · 13-01-2011 8:09am

Don't know, but love the idea that hemophilia was introduced into the royal family by Queen Victoria mum, cuckholding the Duke of Kent with a Paddy

Vicky was a plactic paddy

Fratton Fred · 13-01-2011 9:24am

who the fug wrote: »

Don't know, but love the idea that hemophilia was introduced into the royal family by Queen Victoria mum, cuckholding the Duke of Kent with a Paddy

Vicky was a plactic paddy

Queen Vic loved Ireland.

Didn't Ryan Tubridy have a tenuous link to the royal family when he did his family tree?

Judgement Day · 13-01-2011 10:15am

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Queen Vic loved Ireland.

Didn't Ryan Tubridy have a tenuous link to the royal family when he did his family tree?

Very! I prefer linking him to that cretin Todd Andrews.

GhostInTheRuins · 13-01-2011 10:20am

I read a post in a thread in after hours recently where someone claimed that the queen is a direct decendent from Brian Boru himself. If that's not Irish enough for you I don't know what is!

Snickers Man · 13-01-2011 11:09am

Ryan Tubridy turned out to be a direct descendant of Edward III but as he lived from 1312 to 1377, a hell of a long time ago, and had 18 childrenthere are probably many millions of people directly descended from him.

Plenty of Irish blood in the royal family brought in from the distaff side. Most especially, for the future of the royal family, from the late Diana Princess of Wales whose mother was called Roche and whose grandfather was Lord Fermoy.

One of her more interesting ancestors (her great great great great great great great grandfather) was a chap called William Sarsfield, brother of Patrick. So in the fullness of time, Patrick Sarsfield's great (x8) nephew will become King of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Probably in less than 20 years time.

I wonder what all the GAA clubs named after Sarsfield will make of that.

goose2005 · 13-01-2011 11:38am

GhostInTheRuins wrote: »

I read a post in a thread in after hours recently where someone claimed that the queen is a direct decendent from Brian Boru himself. If that's not Irish enough for you I don't know what is!

Of course she is, he lived a thousand years ago and probably everyone in Britain, Ireland and most Europeans can claim descent.

This ancestral line from Wikipedia:

Brian Boru
-4. Tadc mac Briain
-3. Toirdelbach Ua Briain
-2. Muirchertach Ua Briain
-1. Mor Ua Briain
0. Derbforgaill ingen Murchada
1. Murchad mac Diarmata
2. Donnchada mac Murchada
3. Enna mac Donnchada
4. Diarmaid Mac Murchadha
5. Aoife MacMurrough
6. Isabel de Clare, 4th Countess of Pembroke
7. Isabel Marshal
8. Isabella of Gloucester and Hertford
9. Robert de Brus, 6th Lord of Annandale
10. Robert I of Scotland
11. Marjorie Bruce
12. Robert II of Scotland
13. Robert III of Scotland
14. James I of Scotland
15. James II of Scotland
16. James III of Scotland
17. James IV of Scotland
18. James V of Scotland
19. Mary, Queen of Scots
James I of England/James VI of Scotland
Elizabeth of Bohemia
Sophia of Hanover
George I of Great Britain
George II of Great Britain
Frederick, Prince of Wales
George III of the United Kingdom
Prince Edward, Duke of Kent and Strathearn
Victoria of the United Kingdom
Edward VII of the United Kingdom
George V of the United Kingdom
George VI of the United Kingdom
Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom

Fratton Fred · 13-01-2011 12:43pm

Bloody Irish Imperialists!

paky · 13-01-2011 12:57pm

I just discovered that Queen Elizabeth the first is decended from the 7th earl of ormond. He was anglo irish so not sure if that counts. It would be very interesting to see if there is any gaelic irish in there.

anyway elizabeths mother was ann boleyn, the second wife of henry VIII.
ann boleyns grandmother was the daughter of the 7th earl of ormond, thomas butler making Thomad Butler Elizabeth the firsts great great grandfather.

ejmaztec · 13-01-2011 2:05pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Bloody Irish Imperialists!

The ultimate con, Irish people "invading" Ireland and pretending to be English, too sneaky for words.

InTheTrees · 13-01-2011 5:50pm

paky wrote: »

He was anglo irish so not sure if that counts. It would be very interesting to see if there is any gaelic irish in there.

(God give me strength) Why wouldnt it count?

paky · 13-01-2011 5:58pm

InTheTrees wrote: »

(God give me strength) Why wouldnt it count?

because anglo irish are more likely to marry other anglo irish or english for that matter. they are descended from the english/normans whatever you wanna call them.

is that easy enough for you to comprehend?

InTheTrees · 13-01-2011 6:16pm

paky wrote: »

is that easy enough for you to comprehend?

Ouch, Not really. So anyone with any english/norman blood is "anglo" Irish and therefore not Irish.

So you're looking for Pure Blood Gaelic Irish then? Sounds like some romantic victorian eugenic fantasy.

God luck with that.

paky · 13-01-2011 7:18pm

InTheTrees wrote: »

Ouch, Not really. So anyone with any english/norman blood is "anglo" Irish and therefore not Irish.

well its unlikely the anglo irish were even considered irish in the 16th century

InTheTrees wrote: »

So you're looking for Pure Blood Gaelic Irish then?

ya exactly. mainly someone from a prominant gaelic irish family

InTheTrees wrote: »

Sounds like some romantic victorian eugenic fantasy.
God luck with that.

does it? why dont you just take a hike then

Fratton Fred · 13-01-2011 7:32pm

paky wrote: »

well its unlikely the anglo irish were even considered irish in the 16th century

They were actually. The "Irish" fell into two categories, the Irish (generally the early Anglo Norman settlers and their descendants) and the Mere (or pure) Irish.

paky · 13-01-2011 7:39pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

They were actually. The "Irish" fell into two categories, the Irish (generally the early Anglo Norman settlers and their descendants) and the Mere (or pure) Irish.

regardless, im curious to see if the royal family is decended from any gaelic irish.

InTheTrees · 13-01-2011 8:50pm

Also the old ennobled Irish kings. The kingships were exchanged for Earldoms, Hereditary Earldoms, so a couple of generations, an expensive education and they would have been indistinguishable from english aristocracy. And that was the plan.

Snickers Man · 14-01-2011 12:14am

paky wrote: »

because anglo irish are more likely to marry other anglo irish or english for that matter. they are descended from the english/normans whatever you wanna call them.

There was a lot of intermarriage between the Anglo-Normans and the "mere" Irish back in the 14th century. So much so that the ruling powers brought in Apartheid-like legislation, called the Statutes of Kilkenny, in an attempt to stop this sort of thing.

Of course they were doomed to failure. What is likely to be the success rate of a law which tries to compel men of French origin to keep their hands off Irish women?

And as InTheTrees has also pointed out, the "Surrender and Regrant" policy of the Tudors meant that many Gaelic chieftains were ennobled with Anglo-Norman titles as long as they pledged loyalty to the Crown. Most famously "The O'Neill" becoming the Earl of Tyrone.

InTheTrees · 14-01-2011 5:40pm

Snickers Man wrote: »

Most famously "The O'Neill" becoming the Earl of Tyrone.

Which is why the "Flight Of the Earls" was such a tragedy.

It wasnt a bunch of english aristocrats running from the english, it was the last remnants of Irish royalty escaping into exile.

hivizman · 14-01-2011 11:10pm

At least one of Queen Elizabeth II's great-great-great-grandparents was born in Ireland, albeit a member of the Anglo-Irish aristocracy. This was Richard Wellesley, 1st Marquess Wellesley (1760-1842).

Wellesley's daughter Anne (1788-1875) married Lord Charles Cavendish-Bentinck, a younger son of the 3rd Duke of Portland. Their son the Rev. Charles Cavendish-Bentinck (1817-1865), married Caroline Burnaby, and their daughter Nina Cecilia Cavendish-Bentinck (1862-1938) was the mother of Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother, and hence Elizabeth II's maternal grandmother.

But, as Daniel O'Connell said about Wellesley's brother Arthur, Duke of Wellington (16 October 1843): "No, he is not an Irishman. He was born in Ireland; but being born in a stable does not make a man a horse."

Irish Blood in the British Royal Family

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