Power City incompetence

RipItUp

I recently bought a Philips 42PFL5405H/05 after viewing it on the (well-lit) shop floor in the Power City outlet at Fonthill. I took it home that evening, set it up a few days later and, after a few hours of watching, noticed a lot of back-light bleeding around all of the corners and the far and left and right sides of the screen.

After research, I have found out that this is a common problem with the TV - one article called it "infamous".

I wasn't able to go up to Dublin to return it myself, personally, so my friend went up and could not convince the "customer relations" person, as he called himself on the phone, that there was an issue with the back-light.

I am livid, as I KNOW there is a serious issue with back-light leakage on this particular model, yet the guy in Power City won't acknowledge it.

What are my rights here?

I have to take HIS WORD that there is NO PROBLEM with the TV, when there clearly is!!!

Am I stuck with the TV?

I'm considering going up myself to get the problem sorted. I want a full refund now as I never want to deal with them again - the guy was uncaring to our problem and for a "customer relations" person who has been in his job "three or four years" he didn't seem to know how to handle people at all.

I don't even know what his qualifications are regarding electronics.

Nonoperational

How do you know there is a problem with set?

RipItUp

gpf101 wrote: »

How do you know there is a problem with set?

I've had it running and I can see very patchy back-light bleeding.

godtabh

many tvs have backlight problems. TV still operates as it should so you might find it difficult to get a refund.

And besides cant they offer you a repair and replacement as well? You cant demand one or the other

RipItUp

godtabh wrote: »

And besides cant they offer you a repair and replacement as well? You cant demand one or the other

They didn't offer a repair or a replacement - they said there is no back-light issue at all.

tommy21

Clearly you will have to bring it in and show them, they are hardly just going to take your word for it over the phone. They could have been much nicer about it though from the sounds of it.

RipItUp

tommy21 wrote: »

Clearly you will have to bring it in and show them, they are hardly just going to take your word for it over the phone. They could have been much nicer about it though from the sounds of it.

I did bring it in though and they would not believe that there was a back-light issue.

tommy21

RipItUp wrote: »

I did bring it in though and they would not believe that there was a back-light issue.

Ah I get you. Hmm well its the usual I'm afraid. Write a nice polite letter to the store manager asking them to rectify the problem in a reasonable time. Send it by registered post. Wait 10 days. Apply to Small Claims Court.

RipItUp

tommy21 wrote: »

Ah I get you. Hmm well its the usual I'm afraid. Write a nice polite letter to the store manager asking them to rectify the problem in a reasonable time. Send it by registered post. Wait 10 days. Apply to Small Claims Court.

So much bloody hassle. You think you're getting a deal sometimes, only to be shafted.

Thanks for the help, fella.

watty

Does it do RTE2 HD on Digital via aerial, and the new style text? If not they have to replace or refund. Do the 10 radio stations on Digital TV via aerial work?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=69907301#post69907301

RipItUp

watty wrote: »

Does it do RTE2 HD on Digital via aerial, and the new style text? If not they have to replace or refund. Do the 10 radio stations on Digital TV via aerial work?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=69907301#post69907301

Thanks for that Watty!

I only plugged in a coaxial ariel and I received no RTE HD or digital radio stations and I couldn't see the new style text - I don't think it's MHEG5. Should I receive them through the coaxial??

watty

If it's an aerial and not UPC.

You went to setup and selected UK as Country and did a Digital Scan?

See also http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=56
Someone there can tell if it's a compatible TV.

RipItUp

watty wrote: »

If it's an aerial and not UPC.

You went to setup and selected UK as Country and did a Digital Scan?

See also http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=56
Someone there can tell if it's a compatible TV.

Yes it was an aerial.

I put in Ireland as my country and it did a scan. I'll have the TV back here this evening and I'll do a scan with it set to the UK. I think I can still get it refunded as it's a 2008 model and that article you linked me said that if it's a TV over a year old, then I'm entitled to a refund.

Thanks so much.

bungler

Having dealt with Powercity a number of times i cant see them looking fater you, in my opinion they dont give a toss once you buy something even when items are faulty its like getting blood from a stone.

Try ringing their head office in Bray and get through to the manager there thats the only way i ever got stuff sorted

RipItUp

bungler wrote: »

Having dealt with Powercity a number of times i cant see them looking fater you, in my opinion they dont give a toss once you buy something even when items are faulty its like getting blood from a stone.

Try ringing their head office in Bray and get through to the manager there thats the only way i ever got stuff sorted

Having experienced nothing but bad-mannered treatment from them over this, I shall never be dealing with them again and will urge friends not to either.

cast_iron

I can't see the big consumer issue really. They don't advertise "no backlight" on the box do they? Alot of TVs have backlight - it's buyer beware. That's how Philips manufactured it - and every last one of that model will be the same. No repair will fix it as the set is not faulty.

If there was two Philips hoovers, both 1000 watt in the shop, and one had better suction than the other for whatever reason - you couldn't reasonably demand the less powerful one to be "fixed" to the same level as the stronger one, as that's the way they were designed. A case of buyer beware if you as me!

Of course...a better and probably newer set won't have that issue, but that's another issue.

RipItUp

cast_iron wrote: »

I can't see the big consumer issue really. They don't advertise "no backlight" on the box do they? Alot of TVs have backlight - it's buyer beware. That's how Philips manufactured it - and every last one of that model will be the same. No repair will fix it as the set is not faulty.

If there was two Philips hoovers, both 1000 watt in the shop, and one had better suction than the other for whatever reason - you couldn't reasonably demand the less powerful one to be "fixed" to the same level as the stronger one, as that's the way they were designed. A case of buyer beware if you as me!

Of course...a better and probably newer set won't have that issue, but that's another issue.

It's hard to find reviews on every single TV set, though; granted, this set has some reviews available, but some I read passed off the back-light issue as something you can grow to ignore - I don't see why consumers should have to put up with this. It was only later that I found some scathing reviews, and this was by typing "Philips back light leakage" into google - how can I possibly do that for every TV I've looked at in the three months that I've researched a possible TV to buy. My income is finite and I took my time looking around, but you'd be addled reading all the reviews.

I realise the back-light issue is Philips' fault - but why do DID, Power City et al. stock such shoddy ****e?
Because it will sell, they'll put up a fuss when you try to return it and at most, you'll get store credit.

Well this is one buyer who is now more aware; more aware of the sort of cowboys (Father Ted reference) Power City et al. are.

cast_iron

It's ****e to you, but most buyers won't care so much, or as you say, learned to live with it. My own has terrible back light issues, but I said to myself after I realised, well it was cheapish for a reason, and probably notorious for it anyway if I'd done the research. But like yourself, I've more to be doing.

You say yourself it's Philips fault, but you assign most of the blame to Powercity! If they stock ****e, people buy ****e, and then complain it's ****e, where exactly have they been the terrible demons in this?

Edit: You claimed you couldn't find too much detail on this backlight issue, but Powercity should be in-depth googling this for every model instead?

RipItUp

cast_iron wrote: »

It's ****e to you, but most buyers won't care so much, or as you say, learned to live with it. My own has terrible back light issues, but I said to myself after I realised, well it was cheapish for a reason, and probably notorious for it anyway if I'd done the research. But like yourself, I've more to be doing.

You say yourself it's Philips fault, but you assign most of the blame to Powercity! If the stock ****e, people buy ****e, and then complain it's ****e, where exactly have they been the terrible demons in this?

They treated me like ****e when I was talking to them today, so yes, I am allowed to criticise them.

I blame the management for stocking sub-par products (but, I suppose that'll never stop) and I blame some of the staff for the way they treated me.

axer

RipItUp wrote: »

I blame the management for stocking sub-par products

and blame yourself for not reading up on the model before purchasing?

If the TV is not of merchantable quality you will have to get a third party expert report backing you up and bring them to the small claims court (that is if they are unwilling to do something out of court). Just because it is a bad model of tv doesn't mean it is not of merchantable quality though.

watty

It depends how poor the suck of the vacuum cleaner is, or how much backlight leaks. All non-CRT, non-Plasma flat screens have a backlight. They don't work otherwise. You should not see it at edge.

Bad product DESIGNS do get to market, that sometimes are not of merchantable quality. Entire Model recalls do happen. I can't comment if this is the case here. If they won't agree, then you do need an expert report and then if it backs up your opinion show it them and then Small Claims court if not sorted then. If the expert doesn't back you, you lose the fee. If he does back you then the shop can be liable for the report cost.

Up till about 2 or 3 years ago I would not have touched ANY consumer LCD or Plasma with barge pole. Many were abysmal compared to CRT. Now LCDs are better than Plasmas and nearly about par on colour and contrast gradation with CRT.

Yes, on one hand "buyer beware", on the other hand some actual models may not be "fit for purpose". If it doesn't do Irish Digital TV properly, that's a different way to take it back.
If it's not "fit" then they are not obliged to refund. They can replace or "repair". You are not obliged to take a credit note. Refund, repair or replace (their choice) are the options.

davo10

I cant see what the consumer issue is with this, the TV was advertised at a low price, you should know you are not getting the most up to date, high quality product. Every sector of business does this, you lower the price to sell old stock so you can replace with new stock. If the TV is such that this lighting issue is the norm then so be it, if you were willing to spend a bit more then you would have probably gotten a better TV. As for recieving digital stations, if they did not advertise that it was compatible then they have done nothing wrong and you have no right to a refund, the TV does what it says on the spec leaflet. Another poster brought a TV back to Argos and got a refund but that is because Argos have a good policy about these issues, they can afford to as they are a huge company, smaller retailers are under no obligation to have the same policy.

Sometimes if something seems like a great bargain, there is a catch, the quality may not be great, it may not be as reliable as other products but as another poster said, its buyer beware.

Incidently, when you brought the TV back, did you ask them to set it up in the shop next to the display unit on the same channel and point out the difference in picture quality?

reprazant

RipItUp wrote: »

I recently bought a Philips 42PFL5405H/05 after viewing it on the (well-lit) shop floor in the Power City outlet at Fonthill.

RipItUp wrote: »

I did bring it in though and they would not believe that there was a back-light issue.

You looked at it in the shop, probably beside lots of other tv's and saw nothing wrong with it. Now you are complaining that the person in the shop can't see the problem that you also did not see?

RipItUp

reprazant wrote: »

You looked at it in the shop, probably beside lots of other tv's and saw nothing wrong with it. Now you are complaining that the person in the shop can't see the problem that you also did not see?

As I said, I saw it on the shop floor which was very brightly-lit; this masked the problem. The guy then set the TV up in a brighter than average room and told my friend that he couldn't see a problem. I told him on the phone, while my friend was there with him, that it is a problem that becomes more apparent in a lamp-lit room. He barked at me that there "was nothing wrong with the backlight" and treated me like I was a charlatan.

I've worked in retail for years in the past and I would never have treated a customer in this way; Power City seem to tolerate this kind of behaviour and I have the right to report it to the public, as I am doing.

dudara

Posters - this analogue versus digital discussion is seriously off-topic and clogging up the OP's thread. Once I get to my laptop I will move all these posts to the discussion thread on this topic.

In the meantime, the only replies to this thread should be in relation to the original issue!!

dudara

killbillvol2

RipItUp wrote: »

Yes it was an aerial.

I put in Ireland as my country and it did a scan. I'll have the TV back here this evening and I'll do a scan with it set to the UK. I think I can still get it refunded as it's a 2008 model and that article you linked me said that if it's a TV over a year old, then I'm entitled to a refund.

Thanks so much.

It's not a 2008 model. They were launched in May 2010. In fact they were mentioned on a thread here. They're also compatible with Irish digital TV.

And I'd be grateful if you could point us to a review of that particular TV that refers to issues with backlight leakage - a google search certainly doesn't.

watty

Indeed it's a 2010 model and appears to be CFL version 42PFL5405H/05 of 42PFL5605H/05 LED backlit. CFL backlit is fatter, but better colour than most "ordinary" LED backlit. Only R, G & B LED back lit LCD TVs give better colour than CFL, they are usually about twice the price of ordinary LED backlit, to even x3 the price of CFL backlit.


It's a highly regarded model with no indication I can find of backlight issues. If you are in properly lit area for TV viewing you should set backlight at 30% to 50%. The higher settings are for bright/daylight. If the room has no lighting is may need to be at 25%!

The TV is basically compatible with Irish Digital TV. If any issues, set UK as Country not Ireland. It may need a firmware update to fix some incompatibilities with Irish TV

Philips 42PFL5405H/05
The guy in the store told me it was MPEG4 compatible and it says it on the box.

I registered the product on Philips.co.uk using the model number. Then it gave me a dedicated page with Support/Drivers etc. Zip file download for the driver, onto USB stick which I inserted into the TV and that was it.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=69250508&postcount=1509

Phillips 5000 Series
42PFL5405H/05
Great TV, 100Hz, 1080p, MPEG4 Tuner.
From Dwyers in Cork. 630euro

I can only conclude you have the Backlight set too high for more subdued lighting of you room than the Showroom.

ted1

i have this model. Yes it's digital compatible.
I notice a small bit me leakage in the middle it only appears when the screen is completly black so basically when i'm not0actually watching some thing.
It is a great tele.
Op you need to stop looking for negatives and start looking at what you have in front of
you. What setting do you keep it in? I use cinema most of the time.

killbillvol2

killbillvol2 wrote: »

And I'd be grateful if you could point us to a review of that particular TV that refers to issues with backlight leakage - a google search certainly doesn't.

The OP is strangely silent...

dudara

killbillvol2 wrote: »

The OP is strangely silent...

The OP could simply have forgotten about this thread, or a myriad of other things. Don't make assumptions that add nothing to the thread.

dudara

Forest Master

cast_iron wrote: »

If there was two Philips hoovers

Vacuum Cleaners - Hoover is a brand. Sorry - personal irk of mine.

killbillvol2

dudara wrote: »

The OP could simply have forgotten about this thread, or a myriad of other things. Don't make assumptions that add nothing to the thread.

dudara

Actually I had a genuine reason for asking, but could have phrased it better. I bought tha 37" version of that model after a lot of research and found no mention of backlight issues. It's an excellent TV IMHO.

RipItUp

killbillvol2 wrote: »

Actually I had a genuine reason for asking, but could have phrased it better. I bought tha 37" version of that model after a lot of research and found no mention of backlight issues. It's an excellent TV IMHO.

OP was busy this week.

Ok, so I was wrong about it being a 2008 model - my info was incorrect. You may well find that your 37" has no back-light issues, but that's a whole other story. I might check out the 37" one if it has no issues.

It may be a rule of thumb, that the larger a screen gets, the harder it is to have it evenly lit - but I've seen poorly lit small LGs, so they come in all sizes.

I'll check out the 37", but I won't be buying it from Power City.

slimjimmc

Out of curiosity have you checked the brightness level as suggest by Watty in post 27 and what was the outcome?