Trouble with a car

Snowman81

Hi,

I hope somebody can help. I recently purchased a 2004 BMW and I found out today that there is at least 3,000 euro of work to be done, to make it drivable again. With regret now, I purchased the car which came with a three month labour only gaurantee. Do I have any come back on the garage surely they can't sell a car that has a fault? I only have the car two months and due to the weather I have only put approximatley 500kms on the clock. Any help or advice would be great.

Run_to_da_hills

You would probably get a better response in the Motoring forum.

P. Breathnach

In general, the law gives you little cover on second-hand goods. There is a particular exception in relation to motor vehicles that might be helpful to your cause:

there is an implied condition that at the time of delivery of the vehicle under the contract it is free from any defect which would render it a danger to the public, including persons travelling in the vehicle.

Source: http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0013.html

Read the words carefully in their full context, and see if that might be used.

Del2005

Snowman81 wrote: »

Hi,

I hope somebody can help. I recently purchased a 2004 BMW and I found out today that there is at least 3,000 euro of work to be done, to make it drivable again. With regret now, I purchased the car which came with a three month labour only gaurantee. Do I have any come back on the garage surely they can't sell a car that has a fault? I only have the car two months and due to the weather I have only put approximatley 500kms on the clock. Any help or advice would be great.

What type of work is needed? The garage may not have been aware of the issue and believe it or not you can do a lot of damage to a car in 500kms. Did you get the car checked out by a mechanic/the AA before buying?

Your best bet is to contact the garage and see if they'll offer to pay for all/part of the work. If you get nowhere then look into other options.

dudara

Agreed - Moving this one to Motors

dudara

andyseadog

did youbuy it from a simi registered garage? if so you're well within your rights to take the car back to them and ask for the repairs to be done or for your cash (and/ or) trade in back if its possible.

what work needs doing out of interest?

Snowman81

Del2005 wrote: »

What type of work is needed? The garage may not have been aware of the issue and believe it or not you can do a lot of damage to a car in 500kms. Did you get the car checked out by a mechanic/the AA before buying?

Your best bet is to contact the garage and see if they'll offer to pay for all/part of the work. If you get nowhere then look into other options.

No didn't get it checked which now I deeply regret. The car has been in no way driven hard. Its hardly been driven with all the snow. i only have it 6 weeks. From what i know the two cat's need to be changed, Turbo is on the way out and manifold is also crack I could be looking at the best part of €5k. I'd be very surprised if they didn't know. but impossible for me to prove at this stage. I have made contact their initial reaction was to say that they gave me the car in perfect working order! Not a great start. They will cover labour cost but not the parts which are likely to be 3/4 times the cost of the labour

Snowman81

andyseadog wrote: »

did youbuy it from a simi registered garage? if so you're well within your rights to take the car back to them and ask for the repairs to be done or for your cash (and/ or) trade in back if its possible.

what work needs doing out of interest?

No I don't think they are SIMI registered. Can't find them on website but they could be trading under a different name? List of work required on previous post. sick is not the word!

andyseadog

head straight to the citizens advice bureau. garages are simply not allowed to shaft people with no mechanical knowledge like that, im not to well up on the exact laws, but there are laws in place to prevent this.

i had a friend previously bought a car, thought it was great, i had a look over it and it needed close to 2 grand spending on it to make it roadworthy, he took it back to the dealer who said they didnt want to hear about it.

he went to the citizens advice, who told him his rights and exactly where he stood, he threatened the garage with legal action, and within days the garage rang him back to offer him a full cash refund.

id be confident you will get sorted if you go about this the right way.

but i would suggest you use the car as little as possible so they cant chalk up all the extra wear and tear to you

Snowman81

andyseadog wrote: »

head straight to the citizens advice bureau. garages are simply not allowed to shaft people with no mechanical knowledge like that, im not to well up on the exact laws, but there are laws in place to prevent this.

i had a friend previously bought a car, thought it was great, i had a look over it and it needed close to 2 grand spending on it to make it roadworthy, he took it back to the dealer who said they didnt want to hear about it.

he went to the citizens advice, who told him his rights and exactly where he stood, he threatened the garage with legal action, and within days the garage rang him back to offer him a full cash refund.

id be confident you will get sorted if you go about this the right way.

but i would suggest you use the car as little as possible so they cant chalk up all the extra wear and tear to you

Thanks. The car currently won't drive so I won't be putting any miles on it anytime soon.

Snowman81

in your opinion what would be the best way of going about this?

andyseadog

google 'citizens advice' in ireland, find out where the nearest center to you is (all meetings with them are free of charge) see when they are open next and go in as soon as is possible (the longer you leave this the harder it is to prove).

they will tell you exactly where to go from there, and guide you along the way, they are there to help with situations like this.

andyseadog

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer_affairs/motoring/advice_on_buying_a_used_car_in_ireland.html

From a garage or car dealer

In this situation you, as a consumer, are protected by the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act 1980 as you are buying a car for your personal use from a person whose normal business it is to sell cars. As a consumer you have the same rights if you buy an item second hand as if it is new. In this case if you find a fault with the car after you have bought it the dealer is the person who must set matters right. If you buy a commercial vehicle or a tractor from a dealer you may not have the same protection under the law. If you are offered an extended warranty on a used car think about the cost of the warranty versus the cost of repairs that the car is likely to need.

Sellers have responsibilities such as giving accurate and truthful answers to the questions you ask. Information on a seller's responsibilities in car deals is available on the National Consumer Agency's website

and

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/Guides-to-Consumer-Law/Buying-a-car/responsibilities.html

Sellers' responsibilities
It is an offence under both road traffic legislation and the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act to sell a car to a consumer which is not roadworthy
The Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act 1980 also requires that any car sold by a dealer - whether new or used - should be:
Of merchantable quality (this means a reasonable, acceptable quality given what was said about it and taking into account the age and history of the vehicle)
Fit for the purpose it is intended to be used for
As described
Roadworthy
Misleading information

It is an offence under consumer legislation to provide false or misleading information to consumers in commercial transactions.
A car dealer must not give misleading material information in relation to any aspect of the car, including its history (such as if the car has been in a crash or "clocked"), its specification, the need for any repair or other work required and so on.
A dealer must also not give misleading information about themselves, such as information about:
Any after-sales assistance they will provide
Any approval, authorisation or endorsement they claim to have
Their commitment to a code of practice
Withholding, omitting or concealing any material information regarding the main characteristics of a car is also an offence. These offences amount to added protection for consumers if they already know what questions to ask.

the garage simply hasnt got a choice here but to look after you! i cant see a 2004 3 series being cheap either so its not like were talking about an insignificant amount of money here.

find your nearest center and call in...
http://findaddress.citizensinformation.ie/service_finder/

post back here any updates

Snowman81

Snowman81 wrote: »

I purchased the car which came with a three month labour only gaurantee.

A 3 month labour only guarantee ?

Snowman81

andyseadog wrote: »

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer_affairs/motoring/advice_on_buying_a_used_car_in_ireland.html



and

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/Guides-to-Consumer-Law/Buying-a-car/responsibilities.html



the garage simply hasnt got a choice here but to look after you! i cant see a 2004 3 series being cheap either so its not like were talking about an insignificant amount of money here.

find your nearest center and call in...
http://findaddress.citizensinformation.ie/service_finder/

post back here any updates

Fair play, very grateful for the help.

Snowman81

RoverJames wrote: »

A 3 month labour only guarantee ?

yep????

andyseadog

Snowman81 wrote: »

yep????

thats total nonsense though, they are just taking a chance, its not legal.

Snowman81

andyseadog wrote: »

thats total nonsense though, they are just taking a chance, its not legal.

What makes you say that?

colm1234

trade law states that the item must be fit for the purpose intended, your lucky its from a dealership ring citizens advice for more info, as far as im aware they will have to give you a refund or replacement provided you did not sign anything acknowledging the problems with the car and they stated the car was a1

andyseadog

colm1234 wrote: »

trade law states that the item must be fit for the purpose intended, your lucky its from a dealership ring citizens advice for more info, as far as im aware they will have to give you a refund or replacement provided you did not sign anything acknowledging the problems with the car and they stated the car was a1

x2. they just cant do that. they will have to repair or refund.

Tell this garage you want the car repaired to the condition it should be in, also tell them you will be getting it inspected after they do the work (no offence but you don't seem overly knowledgeable on cars and an 04 diesel Bimmer is a sophisticated enough yoke). Let them respond, you may not have to involve any 3rd parties. I'd be hankering after a full refund though as the car sounds like a crock of sh1t

Snowman81

colm1234 wrote: »

trade law states that the item must be fit for the purpose intended, your lucky its from a dealership ring citizens advice for more info, as far as im aware they will have to give you a refund or replacement provided you did not sign anything acknowledging the problems with the car and they stated the car was a1

They told me the Car was perfect!

andyseadog

Snowman81 wrote: »

What makes you say that?

read ALL of my massive post on the previous page.

in very simple terms; they sold you an item which they knew wasn't fit for purpose without informing you. consumer laws make that 100% illegal. doesnt matter if its socks or a toaster or a b.m.w. they cant do that, go to citizens advice or the gardai and you will get an outcome in your favour in the form of either a repair to the car or a refund.

MagicMarker

I wouldn't be asking for it to be repaired, I'd be asking for my money back.

andyseadog

andyseadog wrote: »

go to citizens advice or the gardai

Gardai :eek: Doubt they'll be overly interested, not really their cup of tea in fairness.

colm1234

Snowman81 wrote: »

They told me the Car was perfect!

in that case by law they have to repair or replace it go to citizens advice they will send the car dealership a solicitor style letter for you I did this myself before, trust me they wont want it to go any further, and next time take a mechanic with you before buying :-) for sake of few quid saves all this trouble

ironside

If people accept dodgy cars from equally dodgy dealers then the gangsters will continue to rip off innocent car buyers. While the outside and interior of a car may look terrific it's what's going on under the bonnet that matters. Every car, no matter who it is bought from should be independently checked by the AA or a qualified mechanic.

andyseadog

RoverJames wrote: »

Gardai :eek: Doubt they'll be overly interested, not really their cup of tea in fairness.

if i'd been shafted out of 6 or 7 grand i wouldn't care who i'd be bothering, i'd be getting my money back. i know its extreme measures, but if the garage is unwilling to help, your clearly up against extreme con artists/ idiots.

ironside

ironside wrote: »

Every car, no matter who it is bought from should be independently checked by the AA or a qualified mechanic.

:eek:

Ah come on, loads of folks who aren't mechanics are more than capable of checking out a car. And loads and loads of garages are 99% reputable.

andyseadog

andyseadog wrote: »

if i'd been shafted out of 6 or 7 grand i wouldn't care who i'd be bothering, i'd be getting my money back. i know its extreme measures, but if the garage is unwilling to help, your clearly up against extreme con artists/ idiots.

It's nothing to do with the Gardai though, they won't get involved

colm1234

took herself to buy a car today they guranteed me the car was perfect, got there and the engine managment light was on they said "oh sure that came on and the mechanic replaced a part and it did not go off, fair enough, so i take off the oil cap FOAM GUNK my god the head gasket was well gone left idle for a while an guess what OVERHEATING. my point being they seemed like lovely people but trust no one always bring a mechanic or someone in the know