Can work take annual leave away that's booked?

borriszan

Hey all,
Hope you can help.
Ive the 31st and 1st booked off for wel over a month now.
In work there are only teams of two people per shift.
The other chap is now out sick and ive been told i have to go into work, that "HR" said they can make me.

Anyone know if this is possible? I would have thought that they would have to give more notice than 2 days?

Thanks,

si_guru

That's a tricky one.

I am sure they are not breaking any law, but it does seem a little unreasonable - what if you were abroad on holiday?

(maybe you are .... )

borriszan

They know im not, but i stated that to them alight.
Not exactly my "fault" the other guy is out sick.

Ive to cancel plans tell people they cant stay over if im working.

LegacyUser

if you are the only person that can cover the job (due to technical expertise etc) then an employer can consider themselves reasonable to expect you to work. If there is anyone else who could cover it (prehaps from another team) then I would argue that one. there is also the option of being 'sick' yourself .....
Check your contract too, there might be something in there ...

tenchi-fan

I doubt the legality of cancelling AL at the last minute. Your employer can tell you when to take leave, but they must consider your need for rest and your plans.

Your employer is obliged to tell you your annual leave days in writing, either by putting a rota on the wall or giving your written notice. If you have this notice, just take the days off. If you have no evidence that you were granted these days off, there's not a whole lot you can do about 1st January.

It should be a little easier to get a day off on 31st December. What is your company's annual leave year?

If it's 1st Jan to 31st December and you haven't used all your annual leave days, you can simply NOT TURN UP on 31st December and your employer will not be allowed to fire you! Carrying days forward is by YOUR agreement only, simply tell your employer you wish to use up your AL requirement before year end as you do not consent to carrying the days forward. You could also use this mechanism to take off 30th December too. edit: probably, you might want to talk to an employment rights lawyer first!

Tell your employer if they want you to be available for 31st and 1st you will expect compensation for your inconvenience.

Easier said than done! Try not to be bullied, and let the goons in HR know that you know your rights.

borriszan

Yeah im going to look for compensation from them.
Im really the only one who can cover it, the rest of the team said no to covering it on there days off. Rightly so too.

They have already messed us around this year by making us change to a 12hr shift day.. and a lot of other bs that im not going to go into.

Theres a meeting already setup with her and hr tomorrow. going to have to record that one..

LegacyUser

you say above

"Im really the only one who can cover it, the rest of the team said no to covering it on there days off. Rightly so too."

Is that you're the only person who can do this because your the only one with the technical skills to cover it? Or because everyone else has already said no to doing it.

You need to be clear on which this is because IMO its very important.

If your the only one with technical skills then I'd say its fair enough them asking you but if its because everyone else has already said no to them then I'd stick to your original position and tell them you appreciate they are stuck however you had agreed these dates off in adv for annual leave for a reason so they are going to have to go back to the other people who said no already and make one of them do it.

Don't let them pressure you into working it (unless your the only person with technical skills). If its a job any one can do it then its only fair they make someone who didn't book the dates off on annual leave work it.

tatli_lokma

tenchi-fan wrote: »

I
If it's 1st Jan to 31st December and you haven't used all your annual leave days, you can simply NOT TURN UP on 31st December and your employer will not be allowed to fire you! Carrying days forward is by YOUR agreement only, simply tell your employer you wish to use up your AL requirement before year end as you do not consent to carrying the days forward. You could also use this mechanism to take off 30th December too. edit: probably, you might want to talk to an employment rights lawyer first!

I wouldn't be so sure about this - check your contract. Most contracts I have seen say that unused holidays are forfeited unless the employer agrees to them being carried over. Using your leave before it runs out is your responsibility, so by booking these 2 days off you are doing your bit, by cancelling them the employer would be kind of obliged to allow you to use these days elsewhere, or should pay you double time.

OP - I know its a bit unfair, but if you genuinely are the only person able to cover for someone who is genuinely sick then I wouldn't make too much of a big deal of it. If you have some very important plans made that cannot be unmade, then fair enough, stand your ground, but if its just a pain, an inconvenience I wouldn't push it. Instead, use it to your advantage, make it clear that you are doing this for the 'team', but that in return for your give, you expect to be able to take at a later date. This could work to your advantage if played right, and you might have some nice little brownie points stored up for later on. Might be very useful come review time, or contract negotiation......

I would however make sure that I get written confirmation that they have requested you cancel your AL and work instead. That way you have proof of your willingness to accommodate your employer.

tenchi-fan

Little Ted wrote: »

I wouldn't be so sure about this - check your contract. Most contracts I have seen say that unused holidays are forfeited SNIP

I can't even begin to tell you how untrue this is!
Maybe you misread the contracts?

tatli_lokma

tenchi-fan wrote: »

I can't even begin to tell you how untrue this is!
Maybe you misread the contracts?

thanks, but my ability to read is quite good:rolleyes:

The holiday year is from x to y. All holiday entitlement must be taken in this period. With the line manager’s consent, employees may carry over up to five days’ (pro rata for part time employees) holiday entitlement from one year to the following year

this is standard wording for most contracts. I see a lot of contracts as my work involves payroll and new starters admin, so I see a lot of contracts from across our company and also our outsourced companies. All of the contracts have this or similar wording. Most companies state that your AL must be used in the given year, if not its lost. The allowance of carrying it over is 'with managers/employers/etc consent'. it is not automatic. The only time when it will be paid instead of being taken is when an employee leaves the company.

If one were to do as you suggest and simply not turn up there may be severe consequences for OP and to suggest they simply do not turn up is irresponsible.

tenchi-fan

Little Ted wrote: »

thanks, but my ability to read is quite good:rolleyes:




this is standard wording for most contracts. I see a lot of contracts as my work involves payroll and new starters admin, so I see a lot of contracts from across our company and also our outsourced companies. All of the contracts have this or similar wording. Most companies state that your AL must be used in the given year, if not its lost. The allowance of carrying it over is 'with managers/employers/etc consent'. it is not automatic. The only time when it will be paid instead of being taken is when an employee leaves the company.

If one were to do as you suggest and simply not turn up there may be severe consequences for OP and to suggest they simply do not turn up is irresponsible.

The bit in bold is wrong.

Your ability to read is fine. But you're taking the wrong meaning from that paragraph. The days aren't forfeited.

Employers must ensure the employee takes all their annual leave in a year. If the employee does not agree specific dates for annual leave, the dates would be imposed on them.

With the consent of the employee and employer, some annual leave may be carried forward provided it is used within the first 6 months of the following year.

Therefore, today is 30th December. If the AL year runs from 1Jan to 31Dec and if the employee still has 10 days annual leave left to take, the employer has actually broken the law and leaves themselves open to legal action unless the employee agreed to carry these days forward. The employee could take the employer to court and seek compensation.

NWPat

Its all here from the Organisation of working time act 1997

Times and pay for annual leave.

20.—(1) The times at which annual leave is granted to an employee shall be determined by his or her employer having regard to work requirements and subject—
(a) to the employer taking into account—
(i) the need for the employee to reconcile work and any family responsibilities,
(ii) the opportunities for rest and recreation available to the employee,
(b) to the employer having consulted the employee or the trade union (if any) of which he or she is a member, not later than 1 month before the day on which the annual leave or, as the case may be, the portion thereof concerned is due to commence, and
(c) to the leave being granted within the leave year to which it relates or, with the consent of the employee, within the 6 months thereafter.
(2) The pay in respect of an employee's annual leave shall—
(a) be paid to the employee in advance of his or her taking the leave,
(b) be at the normal weekly rate or, as the case may be, at a rate which is proportionate to the normal weekly rate, and
(c) in a case in which board or lodging or, as the case may be, both board and lodging constitute part of the employee's remuneration, include compensation, calculated at the prescribed rate, for any such board or lodging as will not be received by the employee whilst on annual leave.
(3) Nothing in this section shall prevent an employer and employee from entering into arrangements that are more favourable to the employee with regard to the times of, and the pay in respect of, his or her annual leave.
(4) In this section “normal weekly rate” means the normal weekly rate of the employee concerned's pay determined in accordance with regulations made by the Minister for the purposes of this section.