Merry Christmas... have another bank.

later12

Well preliminary steps were being taken for the nationalisation and delisting of AIB tonight. What a perfect stocking filler.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2010/1223/1224286171076.html

THE GOVERNMENT was last night taking the first steps to effectively nationalise Allied Irish Banks and take a fourth institution into State control as it made legal preparations for a further bailout of the troubled bank...

A court application, which can be held in private, is expected to be made under the new Credit Institutions (Stabilisation) Act, seeking a court order. This will pave the way for the latest bailout, with another capital injection to be made before the end of February.
The Government may seek to “de-list” AIB from the Irish Stock Exchange as a condition of the bailout in the court application.
Spokespersons for the Department of Finance and AIB had no comment to make last night.

This comes at a very significant time as politicians are in their home constituencies; my prediction is that the most serious outcome in the immediate future shall be a successful FF leadership challenge in the coming weeks

ilovesleep

Does this mean that they are using up the 25billion thats left over from the 35billion already.

senordingdong

Thought the dail broke for their xmas break?

Noreen1

ilovesleep wrote: »

Does this mean that they are using up the 25billion thats left over from the 35billion already.

No, they're using money from the NPRF (pensions reserve fund).
I believe we are obliged to use our reserves first (all of the pension fund), before we are allowed to draw on the IMF/EU "bailout funds".

IMO, that ensures that the EU/IMF have greater control over our finances, since we don't have the option of using that money to fund any projects that might provide an economic stimulus - or use that money for emergency funding in the event of a default..........

In short, every time comical (I wish!) Lenny decides to pour more NPRF funding into the banks, he ensures that the noose tightens more around our necks - unless he can find the money for any such stimulus packages by more "austerity measures" - which I don't believe he can do without plunging us into a depression.
Then again, we may well enter a depression anyway - ever hear the saying "You can't "cut" your way out of a recession"?..........

I'm beginning to seriously wonder whether he intends to pour all of the NPRF funds into the banks before the election, just so the next Government is well and truly hamstrung............

Noreen

melekalikimaka

Noreen1 wrote: »

I'm beginning to seriously wonder whether he intends to pour all of the NPRF funds into the banks before the election, just so the next Government is well and truly hamstrung............

Noreen

i don't think there is an alternative, I think the sooner the banks get this money and get things in order, the sooner we will be out of all this mess...

ei.sdraob

yep the writing for AIB has been on the wall for sometime now

ei.sdraob wrote: »

LostinBlanch wrote: »

Yeah, but wait and see what happens between now and the new year. I wouldn't put it past Lendahand to try and pull a fast one over the holidays.

AIB nationalised that's where it seems to be leading

flutered

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i don't think there is an alternative, I think the sooner the banks get this money and get things in order, the sooner we will be out of all this mess...

will the banks ever be in order, we had the ecb stress test which claimed all was well, then we had this elderfield bloke doing another stress test it showed we only needed a little cash injection, now we have to nationalise our banks, elderfield should be ran out of the country, minus any pension or other entitlements, we need an honost acessment of what is going on, for the dunce to agree to our liquid assets to be first to go is treason, in any banking transaction one never ever get rid of you money before you draw a loan.

pauric1

what does this actually mean for shareholders. i have a few shares in aib but does this mean they are gone now or does the govt buy them from me.

thanks
P

Cookie_Monster

flutered wrote: »

will the banks ever be in order, we had the ecb stress test which claimed all was well, then we had this elderfield bloke doing another stress test it showed we only needed a little cash injection, now we have to nationalise our banks, elderfield should be ran out of the country, minus any pension or other entitlements, we need an honost acessment of what is going on, for the dunce to agree to our liquid assets to be first to go is treason, in any banking transaction one never ever get rid of you money before you draw a loan.

the ECB are upping the cash ratios required from 8% to 12% in March or so, causing the difficulty now. AIB / BOI met he 8% when tested but do not meet the 12% hence the need for additional funding.

later12

pauric1 wrote: »

what does this actually mean for shareholders. i have a few shares in aib but does this mean they are gone now or does the govt buy them from me.

thanks
P

You still have your shares, but the credit institutions bill meant that the Govt could bypass shareholder approval for this move to delist and nationalise.

You will have access to the Enterprise Securities Market with your shares, if you keep them you will receive some minor compensation.

Out of interest, why did you keep the shares?

Noreen1

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i don't think there is an alternative, I think the sooner the banks get this money and get things in order, the sooner we will be out of all this mess...

If I believed that throwing more money at the banks would get us out of this mess, then I'd agree with you.

The truth is, guaranteeing the banks is what left us unable to borrow on the Bond markets.
Our budget deficit was manageable, until Lenihan decided to write a blank cheque........ Yes, austerity measures would have been required, but we could have managed to balance the books within a few years.

Instead, we guaranteed the banks, and the truth is, we still have no idea how much it will end up costing when mortgage defaults are factored in.

Noreen

jmayo

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i don't think there is an alternative, I think the sooner the banks get this money and get things in order, the sooner we will be out of all this mess...

Funny I have been hearing those same words before over the last couple of years :rolleyes:
Oh yeah I heard them over the last 2 years from all the pro bankers.
There is never an alternative. :rolleyes:
The sooner they get the money the sooner they get in order. :rolleyes:
The sooner they are out of this mess the sooner we are all out of the mess. :rolleyes:

We have been hearing those very same statements around every corner for the last 2 years, yet we are still pouring money into the banks and if anything we are all in an even bigger mess.

flutered wrote: »

will the banks ever be in order, we had the ecb stress test which claimed all was well, then we had this elderfield bloke doing another stress test it showed we only needed a little cash injection, now we have to nationalise our banks, elderfield should be ran out of the country, minus any pension or other entitlements, we need an honost acessment of what is going on, for the dunce to agree to our liquid assets to be first to go is treason, in any banking transaction one never ever get rid of you money before you draw a loan.

I would not blame Matthew Elderfield on this.
He has been a breath of fresh air in the toxic inbred inept world of Irish financial regulation.

There is more at play behind the scenes than him alone.
I think our banks have been economical to say the least with information and the truth.

pauric1

later10

i kept them cos i bought €1000 at 43c and i reckon they should do a hell of a lot better than that at some stage (i hope). i also got €1000 of BOI shares at 34c and i'm in no major hurry to turn them around. never bought shares before and have no experience so it was a gamble.

maybe i did the wrong thing, i'm not sure

P

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

pauric1

no i never thought they would hit anywhere near the €20 mark again but i thought if things went right they could reach €5 or €10 which would still be a nice turnover for my initial outlay.

isnt that the idea behind buying when prices are down, you are hoping prices will rise.

cheers
P

feicim

Can anybody shed light on why the government owns four separate banks? i.e. Four sets of staff, overheads - all doing one job - for the one owner?

Surely it would make sense to bundle the services these 4 banks are providing into a single bank...

I thought the whole idea behind Nama was that it was supposed to be the bad bank.

Now we seem to have 5 bad banks along with 5 duplicate sets of staff+ overheads?

Am I missing something, or is this not as mental as it seems?

maninasia

pauric1 wrote: »

no i never thought they would hit anywhere near the €20 mark again but i thought if things went right they could reach €5 or €10 which would still be a nice turnover for my initial outlay.

isnt that the idea behind buying when prices are down, you are hoping prices will rise.

cheers
P

It was always a risky bet which was why the shares were priced so low, not it looks the end of the line has been reached i.e. nationalisation. Throwing a 1000 euro in wasn't a bad idea given the potential pay-off though...win some/lose some.