Nearly new diesel, help me choose..

Stevie Dakota

Mulling over a potential change and have it narrowed down to these three, what do you think?

Car will be used as family transport with 2 kids, 12,000 miles a year, mostly motorway.

Mondeo for me, Octavia is a rotten looking car I reckon. C5 I love but the Mondeo should be easier to sell in years to come. If it wasn't for that I'd go for the C5.

r3nu4l

I'd say Mondeo first, then the Skoda but only because I believe the Skoda would hold value better than the Citreon.

lukester

+1

I like Citroens but they depreciate like a stone and there are ongoing concerns about reliability.

Don't like the Octavia either, and the 1.9 TDI engine is ancient. Reliable but ancient.

I'm also not a huge fan of Ford, but out of those three it's the clear winner- gets very good reviews, easy to resell, the 2.0 TDCI is supposed to be a very nice engine.

Antomus Prime

The Citroen C5 was named as one of the worst cars ever built, and it depreciates at an alarming rate!

Not too keen on the Octavia's, basically a cheaply made passat.

I have an 02 diesel mondeo and it's a great machine, and i've heard nothing but good things about the newer ones.

What about a cdti accord??? They are supposed to be bulletproof!!!

Stevie Dakota

anthonyk.is wrote: »

The Citroen C5 was named as one of the worst cars ever built

The current model? By who?!

EPM

RoverJames wrote: »

Mondeo for me, Octavia is a rotten looking car I reckon. C5 I love but the Mondeo should be easier to sell in years to come. If it wasn't for that I'd go for the C5.

+1

I really like the C5 but cant help but think the engine would be lost in the car. If it was a 2 litre then it would be a tougher choice.

The Octavia isn't a patch on the others.

I would go with the Mondeo. My dad has a Titanium X petrol and it really is a very comfortable car for covering ground in. The spec is pretty impressive too. A buddy has over 100k miles on an early new model 2 litre TDCi Mondeo and the car is running faultlessly, no rattles or wear at all on the car.

EPM

anthonyk.is wrote: »

The Citroen C5 was named as one of the worst cars ever built, and it depreciates at an alarming rate!

Not too keen on the Octavia's, basically a cheaply made passat.

You're thinking about the older model C5 I'd imagine.

Also, the Octavia isn't a cheaply made car or Passat based. It's based on the Golf platform so more comparable to a Jetta.

bladespin

Mondeo, great car; loads of space, cheap to run for such a big car, relaible, great handling etc. etc.

I have no experience of the Octavia bar thinking they're fugly, if they're anything like a Passat then the Mondeo is a far better car.

Antomus Prime

Stevie Dakota wrote: »

The current model? By who?!

When i was buying my car i saw a 06 one in the garage and when i asked the sales guy about it he told me.

It probably wasn't an official thing but thats what he told me.
It was very surprising considering it was one of his cars for sale!!

EPM

anthonyk.is wrote: »

When i was buying my car i saw a 06 one in the garage and when i asked the sales guy about it he told me.

It probably wasn't an official thing but thats what he told me.
It was very surprising considering it was one of his cars for sale!!

Old model so;)

unkel

If you can get the C5 new model with hydropneumatic suspension, go for it and be married to it!

If not, then pick the Mondeo. Good allrounder. The Octavia is good value new, but not so much so nearly new and it is outclassed and outsized by the other two choices.

Antomus Prime

EPM wrote: »

You're thinking about the older model C5 I'd imagine.

Also, the Octavia isn't a cheaply made car or Passat based. It's based on the Golf platform so more comparable to a Jetta.

I still wouldnt go near one if the older model had such a bad rep, also my dad has a citroen c8 and it breaks down every 2 weeks.

Thanks for the correction on the octavia, i'd still go for a VW over a skoda anyday!

colm_mcm

I'd go for the mondeo out of those 3

Surprised the subaru legacy and laguna 3 isn't in there.

shamwari

Mondy for me as well. It's better than that Octavia, and I reckon the C5 wil struggle with a 1.6 pulling that much weight

Leonard Hofstadter

I also think the C5 would struggle with a little 1.6.

If it was a Hydropneumatic 2.0 though, I think it would depend on the mood I was in buying the car. I like supremely comfortable cars a lot, but I also love cars that are enjoyable to drive.

Ultimately it depends on what the OP prefers, but both are a great choice when a proper one with toys and a decent engine is chosen.

coffeenuts

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Alfa-Romeo/159/1.9-JTDm/201034199324599/advert?channel=CARS

Why does the Alfa JTD engine never get a mention for a quality engine.

I'd have the 159 over the mondeo or octavia any day of the week.



Out of the options given though yeah the Mondeo is the best choice.

Although according to Taxi men/women the Octavia is the best car on the planet!!! :rolleyes:

shamwari

coffeenuts wrote: »

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Alfa-Romeo/159/1.9-JTDm/201034199324599/advert?channel=CARS

Why does the Alfa JTD engine never get a mention for a quality engine.

I'd have the 159 over the mondeo or octavia any day of the week.



Out of the options given though yeah the Mondeo is the best choice.

Although according to Taxi men/women the Octavia is the best car on the planet!!! :rolleyes:

I agree, re the Alfa. A seriously underrated car if there ever was one.

Divorce Referendum

anthonyk.is wrote: »

I still wouldnt go near one if the older model had such a bad rep, also my dad has a citroen c8 and it breaks down every 2 weeks.

Thanks for the correction on the octavia, i'd still go for a VW over a skoda anyday!

Why exactly? Is it only looks?

Antomus Prime

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

Why exactly? Is it only looks?

Looks plays alot into it but i've been told by a few people (including salesmen and mechanics) that although Skoda use VW engines, the likes of the clutches, drive trains, gearboxes ect are a lot softer than the VW and are more prone to problems.

You always hear people say that a Skoda is just a VW with a different badge, but surely if this was the case then they would just stick a VW badge on them and sell them at the same price.

Now I cant speak from experience as I've never owned a Skoda, it's just by what i've been told.

EPM

anthonyk.is wrote: »

Looks plays alot into it but i've been told by a few people (including salesmen and mechanics) that although Skoda use VW engines, the likes of the clutches, drive trains, gearboxes ect are a lot softer than the VW and are more prone to problems.

You always hear people say that a Skoda is just a VW with a different badge, but surely if this was the case then they would just stick a VW badge on them and sell them at the same price.

Now I cant speak from experience as I've never owned a Skoda, it's just by what i've been told.

Of course salemen say that when they're trying to sell you something else. The parts under the skin are identical and come from the same suppliers.

Antomus Prime

EPM wrote: »

Of course salemen say that when they're trying to sell you something else. The parts under the skin are identical and come from the same suppliers.

It wasn't in a sales situation, he's a friend of my brothers. And I work in sales (qualified plumber though, marvelous econemy, but tis a job at least) so I know all about the sales pitches. And I wasn't looking to buy a Skoda or a VW, i was buying a Mondeo.

bladespin

coffeenuts wrote: »

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Alfa-Romeo/159/1.9-JTDm/201034199324599/advert?channel=CARS

Why does the Alfa JTD engine never get a mention for a quality engine.

I'd have the 159 over the mondeo or octavia any day of the week.

shamwari wrote: »

I agree, re the Alfa. A seriously underrated car if there ever was one.

The Mondeo is a much better car, the Alfa engine is the best diesel engine in the class IMO though, I miss my Alfa

EPM

EPM wrote: »

Of course salemen say that when they're trying to sell you something else. The parts under the skin are identical and come from the same suppliers.

anthonyk.is wrote: »

It wasn't in a sales situation, he's a friend of my brothers. And I work in sales (qualified plumber though, marvelous econemy, but tis a job at least) so I know all about the sales pitches. And I wasn't looking to buy a Skoda or a VW, i was buying a Mondeo.

If it wasn't a sales pitch the chap may genuinely believe it himself, lots of folk in the car sales business are clueless enough about cars. At the peak of things there was some right numpties employed.

Antomus Prime

RoverJames wrote: »

If it wasn't a sales pitch the chap may genuinely believe it himself, lots of folk in the car sales business are clueless enough about cars. At the peak of things there was some right numpties employed.

Very true, any clown could get a sales job without knowing anything about cars or marketing. But my bro's friend has never let me down when looking for car buying advice so i tend to trust his judgment. But obviously not everybody is rite all the time

Divorce Referendum

anthonyk.is wrote: »

Looks plays alot into it but i've been told by a few people (including salesmen and mechanics) that although Skoda use VW engines, the likes of the clutches, drive trains, gearboxes ect are a lot softer than the VW and are more prone to problems.

You always hear people say that a Skoda is just a VW with a different badge, but surely if this was the case then they would just stick a VW badge on them and sell them at the same price.

Now I cant speak from experience as I've never owned a Skoda, it's just by what i've been told.

Definitely not true. As another poster said they use the very same parts but if you look at reliability index skoda do really well yet volkswagen are mediocre. It would suggest that skoda build their cars better in their czech plant.

In regards to just sticking a vw badge on it, skoda were never meant to as good or anywhere near vw in regards quality and price and they were meant to be an alternate cheaper enty level option but judging by the article below they have caused quite a problem by outperforming them on roadtests in some of their models. I would go for a skoda in most cases of their models as they are a fantastic car for the money. Paying 3,000 extra for a vw doesnt make sense to me

http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,682530,00.html

Leonard Hofstadter

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

Definitely not true. As another poster said they use the very same parts but if you look at reliability index skoda do really well yet volkswagen are mediocre. It would suggest that skoda build their cars better in their czech plant.

In regards to just sticking a vw badge on it, skoda were never meant to as good or anywhere near vw in regards quality and price and they were meant to be an alternate cheaper enty level option but judging by the article below they have caused quite a problem by outperforming them on roadtests in some of their models. I would go for a skoda in most cases of their models as they are a fantastic car for the money. Paying 3,000 extra for a vw doesnt make sense to me

http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,682530,00.html

Skodas are much closer to what a VW is supposed to be about than VW themselves.

They have been making better cars for ages than VW, the Superb is built far better than the Passat and Skoda regularly does far beter than VW in reliability surveys.

VW are not happy about this at all, and are going to make future Skodas less opulent inside. Silicone damped grab handles won't be allowed in future Skodas, for instance.

Nothing like being the victim of one's own success really.

Zubeneschamali

anthonyk.is wrote: »

You always hear people say that a Skoda is just a VW with a different badge, but surely if this was the case then they would just stick a VW badge on them and sell them at the same price.

They can make them for less as they are made in Czechland instead of Germany, so they can sell them for less and still make money.

Since badge snobs will pay more for German cars, VW can stay in business, charge more and make money too!

bazz26

I'd have the Mondeo over the other two. A much better car dynamically, roomier, parts and servicing are relatively cheap and the Titanium X is well equipped for the money.

Antomus Prime

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

Definitely not true. As another poster said they use the very same parts but if you look at reliability index skoda do really well yet volkswagen are mediocre. It would suggest that skoda build their cars better in their czech plant.

In regards to just sticking a vw badge on it, skoda were never meant to as good or anywhere near vw in regards quality and price and they were meant to be an alternate cheaper enty level option but judging by the article below they have caused quite a problem by outperforming them on roadtests in some of their models. I would go for a skoda in most cases of their models as they are a fantastic car for the money. Paying 3,000 extra for a vw doesnt make sense to me

http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,682530,00.html

Quite an eye opening article there. My opinion on Skodas has just moved up the ladder

But I'd still pick the Mondeo over an Octavia in relation to this topic.

Cheers for the info DR

R.O.R

It's no contest with those 3 Stevie, Mondeo all the way.

I like the look of the C5, but as has been mentioned above, it's a wedding ring. I also don't like driving them due to the seating position and stupid steering wheel.

Octavia is a good car, but it's not as good as the Mondeo - in any area in the versions you are considering.

Alfa is definately worth a look. Still no issues with the ones we have on fleet (same can be said for the new model C5 as well), but the rear seat space is tighter than the Mondeo. I also find the seat base on the Alfa's is a bit too long for my little legs making it just a bit uncomfortable.

Duckjob

coffeenuts wrote: »

Although according to Taxi men/women the Octavia is the best car on the planet!!! :rolleyes:

Everybody knows taxi drivers expertise isn't with cars - it lies with fixing the economic and social ills of the country

OT, Mondeo for me everytime. Smooth effortless performance and reliable. Equally a nice comfortable drive or a surprisingly spirited one when you feel like it.

Tea 1000

Is it just these 3? It'd be the Mondeo out of those for me, hate that 1.9 VAG engine and 1.6 is underpowered in the C5. Mondeo is ugly though, inside and outside. And I was never a fan of any of the Ford diesels. Is the 2 litre in the new Mondeo PSA or Ford?
I'd add the 159 and Legacy to the mix as was said, and also the Mazda 6 2.2. Mazda is better hanlding slightly than the Mondeo, which is number one for me. Old model Legacy would be the other best bet.

Antomus Prime

Does no one else agree that the Honda Accord ctdi should be in there??

Tea 1000

anthonyk.is wrote: »

Does no one else agree that the Honda Accord ctdi should be in there??

Yes, but it's very pricey and is more than likely over budget.

johnos1984

The Superb is whats missing

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Skoda/Superb/GREENLIN/201046200293117/advert?channel=CARS

Plug

anthonyk.is wrote: »

Does no one else agree that the Honda Accord ctdi should be in there??

Are them engines are trouble, the diesels?

Antomus Prime

Tea 1000 wrote: »

Yes, but it's very pricey and is more than likely over budget.

Just had a look on Carzone there and there isn't that much in the difference between the Mondeo and the Accord

EPM

Old model accords most likely.

I can't believe the Octavias getting so many votes. I know it's the old favourite here but it would be a big step down from your Focus imo...

Divorce Referendum

EPM wrote: »

Old model accords most likely.

I can't believe the Octavias getting so many votes. I know it's the old favourite here but it would be a big step down from your Focus imo...

How would that be so? I own a focus by the way and the other half has an octavia:). IMO would have to say very little difference between the two. I probably prefer driving the octavia.

Antomus Prime

EPM wrote: »

Old model accords most likely.

I can't believe the Octavias getting so many votes. I know it's the old favourite here but it would be a big step down from your Focus imo...

Max of one year in the difference. Some 08 diesel Accords are going for only a few hundred yo-yo's more than the mondeos

EPM

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

How would that be so? I own a focus by the way and the other half has an octavia:). IMO would have to say very little difference between the two. I probably prefer driving the octavia.

IIRC the OP has a 2 litre titanium spec Focus. That's basically the top spec focus with the best diesel. The 1.9 Octavia can't compete with that at all imo

Divorce Referendum

EPM wrote: »

IIRC the OP has a 2 litre titanium spec Focus. That's basically the top spec focus with the best diesel. The 1.9 Octavia can't compete with that at all imo

Well he is looking to buy the octavia elegance which is the top spec in its model as well. Take a look yourself i dont see too much difference:

http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/equipment/Detail.aspx?deriv=42079

http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/equipment/Detail.aspx?deriv=38987

As regards the engine the focus has a little more torque and horsepower but not a huge amount. The key may be that the focus has a dpf fitted and it also isnt as economical but that may matter to some and not to others. Hardly a huge step down as you suggested.

Stevie Dakota

EPM wrote: »

IIRC the OP has a 2 litre titanium spec Focus. That's basically the top spec focus with the best diesel. The 1.9 Octavia can't compete with that at all imo

Well remembered! This would be a replacement for our other car.

159 is out, just not as family friendly as the others and not impressed with the ride or seat comfort. Stunning looking though.

Accord does not really appeal.

Mazda 6 of that era have the dodgy diesels so they are out.

Mondeo, while not the sexiest is just such a well rounded package.

By the way, am looking in the UK and all these will be €16K with 30,000 miles or thereabouts all in.

Stevie Dakota

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

The key may be that the focus has a dpf fitted and it also isnt as economical but that may matter to some and not to others. Hardly a huge step down as you suggested.

The 2.0TDCi Focus does not have the DPF thankfully. Drove the Octavia and was surprised at how brisk it was, not a million miles off the Focus. In Elegance spec it's not wanting for much either and post 2009 it has a pretty nice interior.

EPM

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

Well he is looking to buy the octavia elegance which is the top spec in its model as well. Take a look yourself i dont see too much difference:

http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/equipment/Detail.aspx?deriv=42079

http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/equipment/Detail.aspx?deriv=38987

As regards the engine the focus has a little more torque and horsepower but not a huge amount. The key may be that the focus has a dpf fitted and it also isnt as economical but that may matter to some and not to others. Hardly a huge step down as you suggested.

Not a huge difference at all in terms of spec, completely agree but the 136 brake engine compared to 105 in octavia would make a big difference. Plus the focus would be quieter (although the VAG 1.9 racket doesn't bother me tbh). I still think the octavia would be a very noticeable step down unless you got a better engine. Doesn't matter now as it's not the car being changed

Padraig Mor

I think the new model C5 is a fantastic car (I'd want to - I bought one!) but based strictly on the list presented I'd go for the Mondeo. VTR (not VTR +, right?) is base spec on the c5 and can't compete with the Titanium. Make it a 2 litre Exclusive spec though and I'd say c5 all the way.

Stevie Dakota

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Make it a 2 litre Exclusive spec though and I'd say c5 all the way.

Brilliant version of a very good car, but I can't help thinking it will be more fragile long term than the Ford. Higher Co2 also counts against it.

Lex Luthor

Mondeo of the 3, but zzzzzZZZZZZZZZ on the looks. C5 looks the best but is the reliability & depreciation enough to take a punt on it.
Octavia is just the no brainer choice and will probably sell the easiest

Look outside the box and a few good suggestions...159/Legacy would be my 2. Alfa needs leather though and Legacy is rare

Padraig Mor

Stevie Dakota wrote: »

Brilliant version of a very good car, but I can't help thinking it will be more fragile long term than the Ford. Higher Co2 also counts against it.

Off the top of my head I think the 08 2 litre diesels of both c5 and mondeo are the same CO2 group? The 450 ish euro group iirc.they are the same engine after all! Spend enough and a late 09 of either moves down one or two groups I think. As for bring more fragile - hard to call really. I had no major problems in two years with mine.