7 day satellite EPG

PauloMN

I think I know the answer to this question already but I'll ask anyway. I'm looking to ditch my Sky sub and replace the setup with a DTT/Sat combo PVR box.

What I'm looking for is basically as close as I can get to the Sky box features: recording, live pause, series link, 7 day EPG etc.. I have an aerial for DTT which works fine as I've a TV with a DTT tuner, and of course I have the Sky dish.

From what I read, I think I'm covered for everything except the 7 day EPG on satellite, and consequently any form of series link I guess. So to my question - are there any combo boxes around the €200 price range that will provide a 7 day EPG on both DTT and satellite? Seems crazy that it's not standard across the boxes when obviously the data is there, or am I missing something?

If there's no boxes around that price range with the 7 day EPG, what sort of money am I looking at for a box with it on both DTT and satellite?

STB

€470 give or take. This includes the Sundtek USB Dvb-t stick. Three tuners (2xdvbs2). You need a hard drive as well.

Thats how much it costs for what you are asking. And its Linux based.

VU+ Duo.

watty

Freesat & Sky UK both use proprietary EPG methods.

The main markets for Combo is outside UK.

watty

Someone needs to get a Dual tuner USB stick working on VU+ Duo. Maybe by May we need dual DTT tuner for PVR.

PauloMN

Thanks guys, appreciate the feedback. Too much money for me at the moment, think I'll stick with a €200 box and make do with the EPG on DTT for the time being. If the better boxes become cheaper in future I might consider one then.

Just wondering why the feature is only available on much dearer boxes? Surely the technology isn't that expensive.

watty

The €200 box isn't a "real" PVR the difference in cost isn't the software. maybe eventually the €200 box might have the SW.

The Vu+ Duo is better value for a PVR. There may even be a Dual USB tuner stick now for it. With Set-box you only buy the accessories already supported.

STB

PauloMN wrote: »

Thanks guys, appreciate the feedback. Too much money for me at the moment, think I'll stick with a €200 box and make do with the EPG on DTT for the time being. If the better boxes become cheaper in future I might consider one then.

Just wondering why the feature is only available on much dearer boxes? Surely the technology isn't that expensive.

The hardware is there and at the price you are looking for.

Its software developers that are the problem.

The Qbox HD Mini, the Optibox Alligator and a handful of others all are linux in or around the 200 mark. In order to get the 7 day epg you really need to be running Enigma II which needs to ported over to the box. In order to do that you have to get the drivers and start writing kernels etc. There just isnt the teams out there and anyone worth their salt are doing it on the higher priced boxes. The VU Duo team only exists because it has a similar level hardware profile to the double the price Dreamboxes. Hence a good hack community mainly ex dreambox coders.

By the way you dont need dual dvb-t once the channels are on the one mux (and we only have one mux at present). So you can record all the channels off the one mux or record one and watch another anyway afaik.

The in's and outs of the VU are discussed in the foreign satellite forum. Many are using the dvb-t sticks with them.

watty

There will be 2x mux in less than 6 months though.

All else very well explained. You have it in a nutshell STB.

There is at least one Dual tuner USB stick working on desktop linux, so porting it to qbox, Optibox or VU+ isn't impossible

Sadly the maker of the chipsets in the otherwise excellent DVB-t dual tuner I have on XP/Win7 won't release tech info, so it definately doesn't work on any Linux platform.

slegs

watty wrote: »

Someone needs to get a Dual tuner USB stick working on VU+ Duo. Maybe by May we need dual DTT tuner for PVR.

Shouldnt need to be dual tuner at the moment as all channels are on same Mux it shouldbe able to watch one record another from the same tuner.

Edit: as you say Watty will be needed when they release the second Mux

PauloMN

One final question - is it possible that some of the boxes which currently don't support the 7 day EPG on satellite could possibly do in future via a software update? Any I've seen all seem to have the ability to update the software via RS232 or USB, so is it possible that these boxes will in future have the software to enable the 7 day EPG?

Is there any of the €200-ish boxes better than others with regard to future-proofing?

Thanks for all the help.

spudmuncher

Is anyone familiar with the AB IPBox 99HD in Ireland?
It runs Enigma2 and seems to be around the E200 mark on ebay with extra DVB-T tuner.
In particular, I'm wondering if anyone has set up CrossEPG to get 7-day satellite EPG?
Is it possible to series link programs or is that asking too much?

spudmuncher

It doesn't look like there is much support or knowedge out there regarding the IPBox. I think that I might be safer to go with something that has its bugs (or at least most of them) ironed out already.

Basic requirement is for a HD combo box (DVB-S2 & DVB-T) that can provide a seemless EPG with data for at least the rest of the day for both DTT and freeview channels. Series link would be nice.

So far, I've come across the following boxes that can be set up to do this

a) VU+ Duo (E398 without DVB-T)

b) Technomate TM-6902 Combo Super (E286)

c) Duolabs Qbox HD mini (E263 including DVB-T tuner)

The VU+ looks a little steep and the need for a usb stick is clunky but the solution seems to be well supported.
The hardware on the TM-6902 seems excellent thought I think that reflashing seems to be necessary to get satellite epgs.
The Qbox looks to have great potential but gets mixed reviews though a lot of the bad ones seem to relate to earlier bugs.

my question -> are there any other contenders that I should consider before making my mind up?

PauloMN

Still have my Sky for the moment, I held off buying a combo-box when I opened this thread as I was hoping by now we'd be seeing sub €200 boxes with full EPG implementation for both DTT and Freesat. I'd happily get rid of Sky, but the most useful feature is recording from the EPG and series link.

STB

spudmuncher wrote: »

It doesn't look like there is much support or knowedge out there regarding the IPBox. I think that I might be safer to go with something that has its bugs (or at least most of them) ironed out already.

Basic requirement is for a HD combo box (DVB-S2 & DVB-T) that can provide a seemless EPG with data for at least the rest of the day for both DTT and freeview channels. Series link would be nice.

So far, I've come across the following boxes that can be set up to do this

a) VU+ Duo (E398 without DVB-T)

b) Technomate TM-6902 Combo Super (E286)

c) Duolabs Qbox HD mini (E263 including DVB-T tuner)

The VU+ looks a little steep and the need for a usb stick is clunky but the solution seems to be well supported.
The hardware on the TM-6902 seems excellent thought I think that reflashing seems to be necessary to get satellite epgs.
The Qbox looks to have great potential but gets mixed reviews though a lot of the bad ones seem to relate to earlier bugs.

my question -> are there any other contenders that I should consider before making my mind up?

The AB IPBox HD99 from Cuberevo (but actually based on the Qbox - DGS didnt make it) does run E2 but is not a UK box so doesnt have firmware written for it specifically - its more European support. Language barriers. Same goes for the Optibox Alligator.

QBox: The Mini (1 dvb-t and 1 dvb-s2 tuner). The Qbox HD (triple tuner) will work via Enigma. Apogee's review is in here

Technomate: 6900/6902 (1 x dvb-t, 1xdvb-s2 - the 6902 has a dvb-t2 tuner). There is a triple tuner version on the technomates caled the (7100 and 7102 - the 2 versions has the dvb-t2 tuner instead of dvb-t). Non Linux - but have phantom patches that grab the transponder info off Sky Openepg transponder. There are also German version of this box under the name Clarke-Tech 6600ST - made by the same OEM in Hubtech.

The VuDuo+. 2 DVB-S2 tuners and DVB-T via USB DVB-T stick (so a triple tuner). Runs Enigma2 and has 7 day epg via various supported plugins. UK Support pretty good.

Apogee

My review of the QBox on that thread is a bit out of date as there have been a number of firmware updates since, so dual/triple tuner support is OK now and recording of multiple channels on the same mux is now fine. You can also get full EPG with CrossEPG, so it will do what you want it to do. Qbox Mini is a different issue however.

Having said that, the firmware on the VU+ is far superior and the EPG layout is much better. It's probably as close as you'll get to a Sky+ box currently (barring a HTPC), without getting an actual Sky+ box. You can get 7 day Sky EPG via crossepg or you can let it pick up the Freesat EPG automatically OTA - this is particularly convenient if the user is technophobic - just turn on the machine and the EPG is automatically populated.

In terms of price the Vu+ Solo (1x DVB-S, external HDD) and you add on 1x or 2x DVB-T using USB dongles comes in at €220 on ebay.

VU+ Duo (2x DVB-S2, internal HDD) comes in at €340 delivered.

Zardoz

my question -> are there any other contenders that I should consider before making my mind up?

Is there any of the €200-ish boxes better than others with regard to future-proofing?

Why dont people consider a clone Dm800 ?
The new clones are very stable and the tuner issues have been resolved with the Rev M tuner.
You can also add a fully supported dtt tuner for a fiver .

Dm800 has a 7 day epg for sat and dtt,can pause live tv,recording,supports timeshifting ,series link ,enigma2 .
Supports usb wifi adapter (under a tenner).
Huge software base and massive amount of plugins.
Dreamboxes have by far the largest support base.

You can pick up new clones for under 140 euro ,best box by a mile in its price range.

Apogee

I guess there may be a certain reluctance in recommending clones when you don't know what the quality of the components may be.

A couple of Q's:

1. Where can you get one for €140?
2. Are all clones of equal quality?
3. Can you identify the 'better' quality clones?
4. Does only the Dream Elite image support USB DVB-T? Does it support 2x DVB-T?
5. How is the EPG implemented? Plugin or built into firmware? Is is the Sky EPG data or Freesat?
6. How is series link implemented?

A few screenshots of the EPG would be useful!

STB

And the most important Question of all, does the unofficial firmware actually work on the clones.....

Zardoz

Apogee wrote: »

I guess there may be a certain reluctance in recommending clones when you don't know what the quality of the components may be.

A couple of Q's:

1. Where can you get one for €140?
2. Are all clones of equal quality?
3. Can you identify the 'better' quality clones?
4. Does only the Dream Elite image support USB DVB-T? Does it support 2x DVB-T?
5. How is the EPG implemented? Plugin or built into firmware? Is is the Sky EPG data or Freesat?
6. How is series link implemented?

A few screenshots of the EPG would be useful!

You can buy them off AlibabaExpress for just over 120 euro .
Obviously customs charges could bring the cost up .
Alternatively they can be bought off local sellers for a higher price but still less than 200 euro.

No not all clones are of equal quality.
The earlier 800 clones suffered tuner issues and overheating problems.
These have been sorted out with the new Rev M Alps tuner and the bootloader R82 and Sim 2.10.
These newer units are extremely stable and well built.
If buying a clone 800 make sure that it has all the above.

As regards DTT ,other images besides the Dream Elite support it.
I am not sure if 2 x DVB-T are supported ,I havent seen it mentioned.

The EPG is generally implemented via a plugin but its built into some images (Dream Elite).It downloads the listings from a web based server.
There are a number of options for 28e,Rytec and Satmate are the best two.Only takes 30 secs to download a weeks listings and this can be automated.
There are listings for lots of other providors too ,Sky Italia,Sky Germany,Nova,Canal FR etc.
I also use quick zap which works like a Sky box as it allows you to scroll through other channel listings at the bottom of the screen while watching the present channel full screen.Very handy.
Series link works via a plugin.

And the most important Question of all, does the unofficial firmware actually work on the clones....

Yes ,of course ,nearly all of the original images are patched for the clones and there are alot of images specifically for clones which are better than original images.

I like the 800 ,its a nice box,only flaws are it takes about 3 minutes to fully boot and can get a bit hot but apart from that its really nice.
Can be customised with skins ,has lots of good plugins ,I'm always playing around with mine.

spudmuncher

Apogee wrote: »

Qbox Mini is a different issue however.

Thanks for the helpful info.
Are there still reasons why one might avoid the Qbox Mini?

Apogee

spudmuncher wrote: »

Thanks for the helpful info.
Are there still reasons why one might avoid the Qbox Mini?

Owners of the Qbox Mini on here were reporting problems with stability and recording etc - these problems were not present on the Qbox. No idea if they have been fixed in the Mini since or not.

Apogee

Zardoz wrote: »

You can buy them off AlibabaExpress for just over 120 euro .
Obviously customs charges could bring the cost up .
Alternatively they can be bought off local sellers for a higher price but still less than 200 euro.

IME customs are very quick to open packages from China at the moment.

As regards DTT ,other images besides the Dream Elite support it.
I am not sure if 2 x DVB-T are supported ,I havent seen it mentioned.

Do you know which other images - does Pli? Their images used to have the Freesat EPG reader embedded in the past.

The EPG is generally implemented via a plugin but its built into some images (Dream Elite).It downloads the listings from a web based server.
There are a number of options for 28e,Rytec and Satmate are the best two.Only takes 30 secs to download a weeks listings and this can be automated.

Is this CrossEPG or some other plugin?

Series link works via a plugin.

Which plugin and any idea how it works? Is it searching for programme names or picking up series link info from the web server?

Zardoz

Apogee wrote: »

IME customs are very quick to open packages from China at the moment.
Thats probably true allright but most of the receivers are valued at a low amount so the charges arent high.


Do you know which other images - does Pli? Their images used to have the Freesat EPG reader embedded in the past.

Pli does yes, via the XMLTV plugin.
http://www.rytec.be/
Gemini are also supported .

Is this CrossEPG or some other plugin?

Dream Elite has the epg plugins built in ,there is a vast choice.
Just press blue button then red for epg to customise .
CrossEpg is also possible and the XMLTV plugin.

Which plugin and any idea how it works? Is it searching for programme names or picking up series link info from the web server?

Its called autotimer and works on Pli and Nabilo,I could not get it to install on Dream Elite.
I believe it searches the epg listings for series data but it is customisable.

I will post some screenshots tomorrow if I get a chance.

spudmuncher

Well, I bit the bullet and ordered.
I went for the VU+ Solo and an AverTV Volar which came to E261 including shipping.

The main thing that swung it for me in the end was how active the user community around the Vu+ appears to be.

spudmuncher

Bugger, its only been a day since I ordered and now I've found another contender that looks slightly cheaper (<E200) and a lot more powerful.

The Xtrend ET5000 seems to be a lot like the VU+ Solo featurewise - they are both single DVB-S2 tuner boxes that needs a usb stick to get the DTT channels. They both run Enigma 2. The ET5000 also seems to be well supported with alternative images such as ViX etc.

The ET5000 seems to be well ahead powerwise. It runs on a BCM7405 chip which has the same core as the 7413 on the new Uno with a performance figure of 1100 DMIPs. The Solo runs on a BCM7325 which can do 525DMIPs.

I'd imagine that twice the processing power means faster boot times and faster channel switching. Ah well, c'est la vie.

Apogee

Can you link where you see it for under €200?

spudmuncher

Apogee wrote: »

Can you link where you see it for under €200?

http://www.willisat.de/a-111162/?ReferrerID=10 E192.60 ,shipping E14.90

ps: you get the discounted E192.60 price if you search for et5000 on idealo.de and follow their link

http://www.smartcard24.com/xtrend-et-5000-hd-linux-sat-receiver-a12127.html E199 ,shipping&paypal fee E20.89

http://www.ac-sat-corner.eu/Xtrend-ET-5000-HD-Linux-HDTV-USB-PVR-Ready E199 ,shipping E20

http://www.cs-multimedia.de/Xtrend-ET-5000-HDTV-Sat-Receiver-Linux E199 ,shipping E28.90
.

Apogee

Thanks!!

The_rock

Hi i just seen this thread i'm looking for the same as the op something similar to sky thats easiest to use.I have only used sky boxes so don't know anything about linux boxes.I hope somebody can help me would i be better getting a dm800 clone or qbox mini or whats the best for what i want?I have tried searching the forum but simply don't understand what people are talking about with tuners and things

JHet

Apogee wrote: »

In terms of price the Vu+ Solo (1x DVB-S, external HDD) and you add on 1x or 2x DVB-T using USB dongles comes in at €220 on ebay.

VU+ Duo (2x DVB-S2, internal HDD) comes in at €340 delivered.

Where can you get a VU DUO for 340 delivered?

Apogee

JHet wrote: »

Where can you get a VU DUO for 340 delivered?

http://cgi.ebay.ie/VU-DUO-TWIN-HD-PVR-LAN-USB-Linux-Satellite-Receiver-NEW-Warranty-Best-price-/330613928155?pt=UK_ConEle_SatCableFreeview_RL&hash=item4cfa2030db