Interview on The Last Word...

zuroph

Today with two of the lads from daft.

They talked about boards, adverts, and boards deals. Matt asked what sold on adverts, then asked how they make money from it. they replied that they intend to monetize adverts once they have built up its popularity???

Is this well known amongst people, like the mods on there, and the regular posters and users? Because to me it seems a bit underhanded to use free help from volunteers, with the end intention of turning around a perfectly good free service and starting to charge for it. I don't know a huge amount about the history of adverts, but did it not spring up in reply to charged ad services?

Could someone clarify?

Tallon

They've already started to charge for it.

A lot of users and a few mods were not happy about the decision

AlmightyCushion

zuroph wrote: »

Today with two of the lads from daft.

They talked about boards, adverts, and boards deals. Matt asked what sold on adverts, then asked how they make money from it. they replied that they intend to monetize adverts once they have built up its popularity???

Is this well known amongst people, like the mods on there, and the regular posters and users? Because to me it seems a bit underhanded to use free help from volunteers, with the end intention of turning around a perfectly good free service and starting to charge for it. I don't know a huge amount about the history of adverts, but did it not spring up in reply to charged ad services?

Could someone clarify?

I can't see them charging for it as that would rub the community up the wrong way. They could start allowing traders and charging them for it. So people like you and me could buy and sell for free but someone from a company would have to pay, not sure how much money that would bring in though. I really hope they don't start charging average users for using it, that would suck big time.

zuroph

he mentioned the charges for bumping your ad, what other charges are there?

Tallon

Currently, thats it afaik.

Traders are obviously charged, which is fair enough, but even charging for bumps, to me, makes it feel like the community spirit is fading already.

AlmightyCushion

Tallon wrote: »

Currently, thats it afaik.

Traders are obviously charged, which is fair enough, but even charging for bumps, to me, makes it feel like the community spirit is fading already.

Yeah, traders are fair game but charging for bumps doesn't sit too well with me. How would they even monitor that.

OutlawPete

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Yeah, traders are fair game but charging for bumps doesn't sit too well with me. How would they even monitor that.

I think charging for bumps is fine.

Free to advertise and charging for bumps just means that you get some time at the top of the 'for sale' list for free but if you want your ad to appear there for longer - you need to pay for that privilege.

Free bumping and everyone would be doing it and the place would just get clogged with stuff that isn't selling.

DeVore

For the last .... ooh, year, we have been trying to keep the adverts mods abreast of the plans for Adverts. Since forever I have said that Adverts is its own vehicle and is going its own way. Its now its own company and even employs one of the old Adverts Mods (Smashey... He's their "Dav").

Adverts is an intrinsically commercial site. On it, everyone is a trader. We're trying to find ways of monetizing it so that it retains its culture but is self sufficient at the same time. The mods have been very well informed in all of this, at least as best we can with a constantly moveable feast, including having input into and preview of new designs and development (there is a programming team behind it too).

We are in the last stages of jettisoning it from Boards servers and from the boards database which will be a big plus for us as its a terrible drain on our DB speed and stability. It has its own trajectory and I wish it well (not least because I'm a director of it!) but its not Boards and that is my primary concern.

DeV.

Dymo

The Daft guys also said they owned Boards.ie, I was a aware that they bought a percentage a few years ago but I never knew they owned it outright.

Nevyn

They don't own it out right but they do have the majority share stake.
http://www.herald.ie/national-news/daft-gets-profit-jump-2359454.html

This was mentioned in After Hours a while back.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056048485

DeVore wrote: »

Thats Merc, he has an axe to grind but I'll answer questions regardless.


#1. Most of that is about Daft LTD. They are a completely different company who bought shares in Boards some time ago.

#2. Actually our company plan forcasted a loss of about 130k so a 90K loss is (kinda bizarrely) rather good in an unexpected economic collapse. We're more than happy

#3. Daft not only were happy to have paid what they paid for the first chunk of shares, but they paid the same amount again the second time.

#4. I told the Mods about this at the time because they power the site and I wanted them informed. I kept it quiet from feedback because I wanted to be able to write #5.

#5. Daft has had majority shareholding in the company for over 18 months now. Noticed much that has changed? We still make the rules, we still did what we felt was right about the poker forum debacle, despite the lose of revenue (about 10k). We are still making our own decisions. Its been 11 years now, I think I've earned the right to be trusted.

#6 The site wouldnt be here if we didnt go this route. In every meaningful metric, its triple the size it was when we first sold shares (2008). Conor and Ross have transformed us from a rickety site that ran slow and fell down into something that feel ubiquitous and rold-solid. Dav and Darragh have had a longer job of trying to bring some order to our chaos. Mostly I write essays and worry.

#6 Daft most certainly value the company at more then 3M and no, we are not in trouble, it takes a few years at 90K loss to eat through that cash
We're rock solid and in fact hope to be hiring again soon (probably another techie).

#7 I dont think people understand the breadth of my ambition... I will be happy when Boards is the ONLY irish website. I want every Irish person, every company, every politician and every journalist focused on Boards and beholden to our rules. We're about half way to completing my "vision" (yeuch!)... its only been a decade, give me a chance loike.

I am a very patient man sometimes

DeV.

zuroph

So can we have a free trading forum on boards now?

DeVore

The reason we have adverts is because a free trading forum simply was forcing a square peg into a round hole. Its not discussion and it was a nightmare to mod and it caused us a great deal of problems. Its just not "discussion", its trade. We created adverts.ie as a result.

But to answer the question you are really asking but seemingly dont want to: We can do as we please, we make the rules in Feedforward as can be seen and we apply them to the site. For example, Daft have, on occasion been banned from the Accomodation and Property section and if any mod has ever had undue pressure brought on them to reverse any such decision they can speak up here and I'll stand down as an Admin.

The only thing they ask is that where we take legal risks on their behalf, that they (and I!) have final say as to how much risk we are comfortable with. Thats only fair as its our balls in the grinder.

DeV.

Wibbs

Plus servers and staff and investment cost money. Given the scale of same over the years it's hardly a big ask and it's a separate entity to Boards.

We're getting a free service here with a pretty low level of advertisement(with the odd irritating jumpy bastard at bottom right ) It still has to pay its way so we can all have bigger and better stuff down the pike. If it does that through Adverts or other stuff external to here I don't see how it impinges on the Boards experience TBH.

zuroph

Is there plans to further monetise boards?

Nevyn

zuroph wrote: »

Is there plans to further monetise boards?

Have you some how missed the talk to forums and the official rep accounts?

DeVore

Or BoardsDeals.ie ....thats part of the Boards.ie Ltd Group.

If you are asking "will we ever have to pay for accounts here".... beyond the caveat that it might be a great way to stop reregs.... No. Afaik and as far I would be interested in being involved.... no, I dont see us charging people for accounts ever. Its certainly never been talked about.

We have our thinking hats on to see how this "thing" can be made to pay its way. At the moment, as detailed above, its not. So, like the government we need to either cut costs or raise taxes but we believe there is a third way and we're executing on that at the moment.

In the end of the day, ask Paul or Eamonn yourselves... they will say the same thing. The community is paramount. No community, no nothing. Its a symbiosis of community and company to try and build somewhere genuinely valuable to Ireland. I'm not against money, not by a long shot, its just that its not top of my list as most people presume.

DeV.

AckwelFoley

DeVore wrote: »

no, I dont see us charging people for accounts ever. Its certainly never been talked about.


DeV.

Nor should it.

Ryanair are perhaps the most successful airline in the world att he moment, and they almost dont charge for what their main mode of business is ..flights

They charge for everything else, but not what their basic function of business is

As a platform for discussion, if there was a charge for doing so, i can say without much thought that new members joining would drop by 95% and current member traffic - down id say by 70.

That makes the site in turn less of an attractive proposition for advertising.


Ive said it once, infact ive said it perhaps half a dozen tiimes now. boards is failing to claim full benefit from their members by offering a more attractive subscription package. This could be restructured for a different levels of subscription with the basic been only 10 or 15 quid for the year with basic extras, up to i would reckon 100 a year for super dooper subscription premium level packages with bells and whistles and even cake.

Think ryanair, a euro from 1000 people is better than 50 euro from 10

Yo Buddy. You still alive?

DeVore wrote: »

The reason we have adverts is because a free trading forum simply was forcing a square peg into a round hole. Its not discussion and it was a nightmare to mod and it caused us a great deal of problems. Its just not "discussion", its trade. We created adverts.ie as a result.

But to answer the question you are really asking but seemingly dont want to: We can do as we please, we make the rules in Feedforward as can be seen and we apply them to the site. For example, Daft have, on occasion been banned from the Accomodation and Property section and if any mod has ever had undue pressure brought on them to reverse any such decision they can speak up here and I'll stand down as an Admin.

The only thing they ask is that where we take legal risks on their behalf, that they (and I!) have final say as to how much risk we are comfortable with. Thats only fair as its our balls in the grinder.

DeV.

There is no #bailout

The reason you have adverts was because Cloud.ie was just doing stuff.

Esel

Money costs.

Wibbs

.... and this is where you start paying... remember ma naaame FAME! I'm gonna live forever....

DeVore

Yo Buddy. You still alive? wrote: »

There is no #bailout

The reason you have adverts was because Cloud.ie was just doing stuff.

Boy you never get tired of being wrong do you.... I chose the software for Adverts 1.0. It came from the same source as our Photo Gallery, Photopost.

http://www.photopost.com/class/

You can see it even looks like Adverts in the demo pics. I would never blame a piece of crap software like that on Cloud. He did the installing but we picked it because For Sale and Wanted were becoming unwieldy... many years before Daft were even mentioned too, you might recall.

Nice try Merc, but you are still wrong.

DeV.

zuroph

Thaedydal wrote: »

Have you some how missed the talk to forums and the official rep accounts?

no. have you some how missed the word "further" in my post?

Wibbs

Who is this merc chappy?

RoundyMooney

DeVore wrote: »

Boy you never get tired of being wrong do you.... I chose the software for Adverts 1.0. It came from the same source as our Photo Gallery, Photopost.

http://www.photopost.com/class/

You can see it even looks like Adverts in the demo pics. I would never blame a piece of crap software like that on Cloud. He did the installing but we picked it because For Sale and Wanted were becoming unwieldy... many years before Daft were even mentioned too, you might recall.

DeV.

That may be the case D, but it was never common knowledge. Cloud was always given the kudos for adverts, at least initially, but the ball was dropped, by whoever, and was left to be picked up and carried by the voluntary Amods, and latterly, the support staff (Cult in particular did a lot of hacking to keep it going in a technical sense at a time-when he was the only one in the engine room, credit where it's due).

Vexord deserves special mention, he always did his best for adverts (and everywhere and everyone else in the b.ie universe as well!).

You are spot on though, photopost was and remains a pos, but I don't think anyone would blame you for that!

Wibbs wrote: »

Who is this merc chappy?

Mercury Tilt, habitual reregger.

--

RoundyMooney, habitual curmudgeon.