Them there modern diesels (Insignia CDTi to be specific)

Spent the last 4 days and 300 miles in a rented Insignia CDTi over in the UK, as most regular posters / readers on here know I drive cheap ole yokes so I wouldn't consider spending wads of euro on a new car, but many folk do and a few recent threads have mentioned the Insignia.

Initial impressions
- rotten looking, fat hatchback, 17" alloys look like marbles under the thing.
- Nice sporty seats, dash well laid out if a bit of a blandfest, huge improvement over the Vectra, seems a class above it really.
- loads of space, 4 adults and their luggage swallowed up in comfort.

Normal diesel noise when cold, when hot and on the go very refined so no issue with that. Good yoke to go (don't know what exact bhp or anything it was, three different engines available in CDTi guise but this one was a 6 speed so probably not the boggo one I'd imagine), pulls away happily in 5th and 6th from 2000rpm, 6th gear allows for 2500rpm at hugely illegal speeds which the car gets to quite respectably and without fuss). Very decent handling which surprised me, not much leaning at all on the twisties and I felt quite happy pushing her along unfamiliar rural roads at night.

Easy to be out of the torque band or whatever the motor journo folk call it with the 6 speed box. To be expected with a 6 speed diesel though and as the miles clocked up I got more accustomed to her so no doubt my fault too. For an 11,000 miler there was a disconcerting noise from the steering at times when turning at low speeds, not a clue what it was.

Over the 300 miles it returned 37mpg which wasn't overly fantastic, fair enough I gave it a spirited drive but I drove my 2005 90bhp Mondeo as hard when I was a rep and rarely saw below 45mpg. I drove from the airport in Birmingham to Gloucester and the needle didn't drop so I reckon she well brimmed when I picked her up so I'd have faith in that mpg return.

Throw in the depreciation, niggles over DMF issues in the future along with the other modern diesel probs that may or may not occur and I wouldn't fancy one. If I was a rep I wouldn't be overly keen on having one thrown at me either to be honest.

The ZT was lovely driving to the shop this evening :pac:

Mr Benevolent

37mpg? Shocking if true for a modern diesel - unless you were truly thrashing the poor car - a rental is there to be thrashed after all. I don't agree about the looks, I think it's the best looking sub-exec car out at the moment. According to Wikipedia the manual is a six-speed regardless.

What toys did it have?

Wasn't fully loaded, no parking sensors, no auto wipes, it had auto lights which are fairly nifty. Orange light flicked on the dash when over steer occurred so traction control or something was at work, had cruise control too of course. I did thrash it but nothing I wouldn't do in my own car.

Paulw

RoverJames wrote: »

Good yoke to go (don't know what exact bhp or anything it was, three different engines available in CDTi guise but this one was a 6 speed so probably not the boggo one I'd imagine),

All the Insignia are 6 speed.

The diesel comes in 130 and 160bhp.

EPM

I think if the CDTi badge on the back has black lettering it's the 160 brake, otherwise it's the 130 model.

Paulw

EPM wrote: »

I think if the CDTi badge on the back has black lettering it's the 160 brake, otherwise it's the 130 model.

I think it's if the "i" is black, it's the 130bhp model, but if the "Ti" are black it's the 160bhp.

knipex

Confab wrote: »

37mpg? Shocking if true for a modern diesel - unless you were truly thrashing the poor car - a rental is there to be thrashed after all.

untill I had a couple of thousand km up on it mine was the same. About 45mpg now and while I dont trash it I dont exactly drive economically either.

Confab wrote: »

I don't agree about the looks, I think it's the best looking sub-exec car out at the moment.

Agreed

RoverJames wrote: »

Wasn't fully loaded, no parking sensors, no auto wipes, it had auto lights which are fairly nifty. Orange light flicked on the dash when over steer occurred so traction control or something was at work, had cruise control too of course. I did thrash it but nothing I wouldn't do in my own car.

Auto lights, traction control and cruise control all standard kit.

STForSale

On a similar note I had a '08 astra for 2 weeks recently and found it massively disappointing. How anyone bought one of these over a golf or focus I will never know.

knipex

STForSale wrote: »

On a similar note I had a '08 astra for 2 weeks recently and found it massively disappointing. How anyone bought one of these over a golf or focus I will never know.

I have to agree the last astra (indeed all the astras) were very sub par. The interior, equipment levels and driving experience were very poor.

The new Astra appears to be a huge improvement. Interior is far better, much more Insignia like, quality appears better, they look much better and from a limited drive (about 60 miles) appears to be much more fun to drive.

Opel finally seem to have gotten their stuff together.

R.O.R

knipex wrote: »

I have to agree the last astra (indeed all the astras) were very sub par. The interior, equipment levels and driving experience were very poor.

The new Astra appears to be a huge improvement. Interior is far better, much more Insignia like, quality appears better, they look much better and from a limited drive (about 60 miles) appears to be much more fun to drive.

Opel finally seem to have gotten their stuff together.

I drove a 2.0CDTi 160ps SRi a couple of weeks ago, and by god was I dissapointed. I'd come straight out of a Giulietta 1.6Tdi 105ps that was much more responsive to drive, had a nicer cabin layout and seating position, and is cheaper to buy.

Lag on the 2.0CDTi is almost as bad as the 1.7Tdi versions. Hopefully it will get looser as the engine beds in (24km on the clock when I set off).

Still - better than the 1.4 version. Supplied one in March this year - driver called back in to us 2 weeks later complaining that it's down on power :P

Zubeneschamali

I have an Insignia diesel as a rental right now. I won't have it long enough to do a proper mpg measurement, but the trip computer shows 6.0, which is 45 mpg. 6th is noticebaly taller than in my S-Max 6 speeder.

Other impressions of the Insignia: easy to get in, get comfortable and drive away. I could do serious miles in this without any problem. Steering is a bit too light for me.

Visibility is rubbish with thick pillars, tiny mirrors and a letterbox rear screen. Blobby sides mean none of the corners are visible even in the mirrors.

Interior plastics are not great, and the sound system in this basic model isn't the best. The instruments and even radio display reflect in the windscreen at night. That's just idiotic design.

Oh, and electric handbrakes are a stupid invention.

R.O.R

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Oh, and electric handbrakes are a stupid invention.

It's actually much better than the manual handbrake used to be, as that took up the space on the armrest that you actually rest your arm on :rolleyes: Thankfully, all models since about this time last year (I think) now have the electonic handbrake - and therefore, usuable arm rest.

Zubeneschamali

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

The instruments and even radio display reflect in the windscreen at night. That's just idiotic design.

Oh, and electric handbrakes are a stupid invention.

Didn't notice the instruments and radio display refecting to be honest, may be related to position of the seat or something

I found the handbrake a rotten yoke too. Onboard thing showed 45mpg for me for lots of the time too, got it down to 4 / 5 mpg often enough though :pac:

Zubeneschamali

R.O.R wrote: »

It's actually much better than the manual handbrake used to be, as that took up the space on the armrest that you actually rest your arm on

It's perfectly possible to design a proper manual handbrake, though, rather than this pointless gadget. The only thing I can see this yoke doing which a manual one won't is failing expensively when the car is a few years older.

I remember a Merc of long ago, where the passenger side door mirror was electrically controlled, but the drivers side one used a mechanical linkage: it's right there on the drivers door beside your hand, why do you need motors, switches and wires to move it?

Zubeneschamali

One more thing I forgot: too much wind noise from the drivers door at motorway cruising speeds.

Zubeneschamali

RoverJames wrote: »

Didn't notice the instruments and radio display refecting to be honest, may be related to position of the seat or something

How hard is it to make the cowl over the illuminated bits block reflections? It also follows that summer sun is going to hit the instruments more than it should, making the radio and computer readouts illegible.

knipex

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Other impressions of the Insignia: easy to get in, get comfortable and drive away. I could do serious miles in this without any problem. Steering is a bit too light for me.

100% agree although you do get used to lighter steering.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Visibility is rubbish with thick pillars, tiny mirrors and a letterbox rear screen. Blobby sides mean none of the corners are visible even in the mirrors.

And it doesn't get better with use. Its a bloody nightmare to park. Until this car I always said parking sensors were for those who could not drive. I would advise anyone getting an Insignia to tick them in the option list.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Interior plastics are not great, and the sound system in this basic model isn't the best. The instruments and even radio display reflect in the windscreen at night. That's just idiotic design.

Cannot agree I'm afraid. I love the interior, think quality is way above its competitors and no problem at all with reflection on screen.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Oh, and electric handbrakes are a stupid invention.

Again 100% agree which is why I insisted on manual. I'm tall so seat is back and dont have any issues with arm rest.

galwaytt

RoverJames wrote: »

Spent the last 4 days and 300 miles in a rented Insignia CDTi over in the UK,..........Normal diesel noise when cold, when hot and on the go very refined so no issue with that. Good yoke to go.............Easy to be out of the torque band or whatever the motor journo folk call it with the 6 speed box. ........Over the 300 miles it returned 37mpg which wasn't overly fantastic, fair enough I gave it a spirited drive but I drove my 2005 90bhp Mondeo as hard when I was a rep and rarely saw below 45mpg. .........Throw in the depreciation, niggles over DMF issues in the future along with the other modern diesel probs that may or may not occur and I wouldn't fancy one.

....well that if it's still FIAT based engine, then it has never been short of poke, and is smoother than the VAG tractor series engine anyway. Yes, it's not as light on juice as the VAG's either, but in my Saab we get, on mix of driving, about 44mpg. 46-47 on a run. And no-one EVER drives a rental gently, so I wouldn't go much by the mpg from that spin !

As for reliability etc - I've never heard anyone mention any DMF or DPF issues on the Cdti range, in fairness. If it was a VAG, mind, that'd be a whole different kettle-o-fish......

Yeah, depreciation.......fact of life, really. Not much can be done about that, though.

galwaytt

galwaytt wrote: »

....well that if it's still FIAT based engine, then it has never been short of poke, and is smoother than the VAG tractor series engine anyway. Yes, it's not as light on juice as the VAG's either, but in my Saab we get, on mix of driving, about 44mpg. 46-47 on a run. And no-one EVER drives a rental gently, so I wouldn't go much by the mpg from that spin !

As for reliability etc - I've never heard anyone mention any DMF or DPF issues on the Cdti range, in fairness. If it was a VAG, mind, that'd be a whole different kettle-o-fish......

Yeah, depreciation.......fact of life, really. Not much can be done about that, though.

Well it's a 2.0 not a 1.9, were the Fiat ones not 1.9 ?. It may well be related to the 1.9 fiat yoke.I never said it was short of poke, I said the opposite. If it has a DMF it will fail eventually on many of them I would think. Regarding the economy, I ragged my Mondeo to death and she never returned that low a figure except for a week of solely urban driving.

knipex

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

One more thing I forgot: too much wind noise from the drivers door at motorway cruising speeds.

There was a recall on door seals due to water being trapped in door sills. After mine were replaced I had the same issue until i went back to the dealer and they solved it.

Paulw

knipex wrote: »

There was a recall on door seals due to water being trapped in door sills. After mine were replaced I had the same issue until i went back to the dealer and they solved it.

Really? I wasn't aware of that, and we do notice water pooling in the door area after rain (a nice gush of water when you open the door). Never heard about a recall nor fix. Mind you, it's extra insulation to keep the noise out.

knipex wrote: »

Cannot agree I'm afraid. I love the interior, think quality is way above its competitors and no problem at all with reflection on screen.

I like the interior of the car too, and have never had any problems with reflections. I think the lights and displays are very clear.

knipex

Paulw wrote: »

Really? I wasn't aware of that, and we do notice water pooling in the door area after rain (a nice gush of water when you open the door). Never heard about a recall nor fix. Mind you, it's extra insulation to keep the noise out.

Its only done in the event of a customer complaint. I got tired of getting my shoes wet every time I opened a rear door.

Also have a look at you back brake disks. A supply of pads were faulty and put small scores on the rear disks. I case of customer complaint pads and disks are replaced under warranty.

There are a few recalls (cannot remember from the top of my head) that are only performed in the event of customer complaint. (same is true for all car manufacturers) There is a list on one of the UK based sites.

Tabnabs

knipex wrote: »

There are a few recalls (cannot remember from the top of my head) that are only performed in the event of customer complaint. (same is true for all car manufacturers) There is a list on one of the UK based sites.

Not true for Honda, they hunted us down and wouldn't leave us alone until we got the issue fixed by a local dealer. Impressive stalking skills

knipex

Dyflin wrote: »

Not true for Honda, they hunted us down and wouldn't leave us alone until we got the issue fixed by a local dealer. Impressive stalking skills

Oh I had the same for other recalls. However there are allways one or two "warrently issues" (looking back recall was not the correct pherase to use) that only offered when you complain.

I know VW and Ford are similar as I had similar experiences in the past.

No personal experience with honda though.

saltcoats

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I have an Insignia diesel as a rental right now. I won't have it long enough to do a proper mpg measurement, but the trip computer shows 6.0, which is 45 mpg. 6th is noticebaly taller than in my S-Max 6 speeder.

Other impressions of the Insignia: easy to get in, get comfortable and drive away. I could do serious miles in this without any problem. Steering is a bit too light for me.

Visibility is rubbish with thick pillars, tiny mirrors and a letterbox rear screen. Blobby sides mean none of the corners are visible even in the mirrors.

Interior plastics are not great, and the sound system in this basic model isn't the best. The instruments and even radio display reflect in the windscreen at night. That's just idiotic design.

Oh, and electric handbrakes are a stupid invention.

So , you don't like it then?

Zubeneschamali

saltcoats wrote: »

So , you don't like it then?

I wouldn't buy one.

But I think a lot of them are going to be company/reps cars, right?

Zubeneschamali

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I wouldn't buy one.

But I think a lot of them are going to be company/reps cars, right?

Nor I, hence the thread

bazz26

RoverJames wrote: »

Well it's a 2.0 not a 1.9, were the Fiat ones not 1.9 ?. It may well be related to the 1.9 fiat yoke.I never said it was short of poke, I said the opposite. If it has a DMF it will fail eventually on many of them I would think. Regarding the economy, I ragged my Mondeo to death and she never returned that low a figure except for a week of solely urban driving.

2.0 litre is derived from the 1.9 litre unit afaik. I heard that improvements are on the way for the MY11 Insignia including better refinement and sound proofing of the engine bay.

Zubeneschamali

knipex wrote: »

Also have a look at you back brake disks.

Took a look over the weekend, and sure enough, the front discs are nice and flat, the rears are scored to sh!te.

Ah well, giving it back shortly with any luck.