Skipping Gears, Bad idea?

C4Kid

Does skipping gears, ie, going from 1-3-5 damage the gearbox in anyway?
I don't know if it would but I'm open to correction. I only skip gears to avoid excessive clutching as my car has done 140,000 miles and the clutch will probably go soon!

O.A.P

I never do on the way up through the gears, its hard on everything engine and transmission. Sometimes on the way down though (third to first) if I know its not going to dog the gear box.
Thats what I do could be that others on here know better.

Bazzo

I asked my driving instructor about this when I was first learning to drive, and he was a well qualified guy(in both England and Ireland).

He said that it's called block changing and it's an acceptable practice. Not too sure about skiping second though, might wanna reconsider that one.

EDIT: You can pretty much disregard my entire post, I misread a small but crucial part of the OP...

L1011

Block shifting is perfectly fine. Just don't do it in a driving test.

TheUsual

Yeah it's ok, once you have some driving experience under your belt, and you are not a sad boy racer trying to make noise and get some attention.

Also in cold damp weather like now, remember at higher revs when you skip a gear changing down you are putting more torque into the tyres and they will break traction easier, so watch the conditions.

Esel

You wouldn't use this technique when changing down. People use it when changing up in the hope of improving fuel consumption. Just be sure the revs are enough for the higher gear, as lugging the engine will damage your big-end and/or main bearings pretty quickly.

C4Kid

Hey Guys,

Thanks very much for all Your detailed feedback, it's much appreciated:D

I don't downshift anymore but coast and brake to a stop. I read somewhere that replacing the brake pads is less expense then a tranmission and clutch.

People use it when changing up in the hope of improving fuel consumption

Well thats is actually partly the reason also:)

lugging the engine will damage your big-end and/or main bearings pretty quickly.

Yeah even going from say 3rd to 5th the engine might go to 2500 rpm and back to about 1500 when engaged in 5th. I recently discovered lugging and having too low rpm is bad for the engine but I'd often wondered about that.:cool:

Not too sure about skiping second though, might wanna reconsider that one.

Good point, It's seldom enough that I go 1 to 3 as I've only been block shifting the last week and thought I'd consult the forum to see was I doing more damage then good!

Cookie_Monster

MYOB wrote: »

Block shifting is perfectly fine. Just don't do it in a driving test.

block shifting down in a test is perfectly fine, is it not?
I'm pretty sure I did it during my test at some point

opinion guy

esel wrote: »

You wouldn't use this technique when changing down. People use it when changing up in the hope of improving fuel consumption. Just be sure the revs are enough for the higher gear, as lugging the engine will damage your big-end and/or main bearings pretty quickly.

Does skipping gears when changing up actually help fuel consumption so ? Do the hypermilers do it ?

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

block shifting down in a test is perfectly fine, is it not?
I'm pretty sure I did it during my test at some point

Ha. I did 35 in a 30 zone in my test and passed so I wouldn't take the fact that you did it in a test to mean anything.

stevenmu

I'm pretty sure the hypermilers don't, a big part if hypermiling us keeping revs down,to block shift 1st to 3rd you would have to rev much higher than needed in first; or risk bogging the engine down if the revs were too low for 3rd which is a big fuel saving no-no.

Henry Ford III

C4Kid wrote: »

I don't downshift anymore but coast and brake to a stop. I read somewhere that replacing the brake pads is less expense then a tranmission and clutch.

Don't coast - the car isn't in control fully.

In addition if a car didn't need 5 (or more) forward gears do you think the makers would include them for the craic?

Mycroft H

I often go from 4th to 2nd when de-accelerating, I've done this since I learnt from an instructor on how to drive.


I sometimes go from 3rd to fifth when overtaking as I need the extra acceleration from 3rd and then I don't need 4th so I skip to fifth.

Tigger

As above fifth to third to overtake then back to fifth when done

And fourth to second especially at a junction as long as you match gears it's fine

argosy2006

More of a diesel car thing,,
more torque, or commercials, ie big van,,start in 2nd then into 4th,if a decline on road, if not 3rd,
depends on how loaded ur car or van is
if u have a big diesel car with only urself in it, and road is flat, ie not climbing a big hill then skipping gears is fine, starting in second on tiny decline is fine to, if u know what ur doing,
its a slower take off, cant just slap up clutch like in first, need to get car moving then release fully yet slowly,once clutch up rev on

Ghost Train

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Don't coast - the car isn't in control fully.

In addition if a car didn't need 5 (or more) forward gears do you think the makers would include them for the craic?

I've read the same about engine braking not really being needed with modern brakes and brake pads being cheaper to replace than clutch and gearbox. I guess it depends on the situation though (how much braking distance you give yourself, road conditions, if you have abs or not). Don't drive manual car at the moment so not something I worry about anyway

C4Kid

In addition if a car didn't need 5 (or more) forward gears do you think the makers would include them for the craic?

To be honest though, I don't want mechanics having the craic when they are charging me for a new gearbox.

opinion guy

Ghost Train wrote: »

I've read the same about engine braking not really being needed with modern brakes and brake pads being cheaper to replace than clutch and gearbox. I guess it depends on the situation though (how much braking distance you give yourself, road conditions, if you have abs or not). Don't drive manual car at the moment so not something I worry about anyway

If you coast out of gear you are using up fuel to keep the engine ticking over. In modern cars if you engine break your fuel consumption during that time is 0.0.

kirving

Unlikely you'll need a new gearbox from going through the gears in sequence. It's all down to the stresses(torque) your putting through the gearbox and clutch, keeping everything as smooth as possible. Changing speed quickly will increase the stresses along the drive train.

Probably a bad analagy, but think of it as an adult slowly stepping on a scales .vs. A child jumping on the scales. The needle will rise slowly for the adult, but if the child jumps on it, the needly may suddenly rise to more than when the adult stepped on it. I hope that makes sense!

That said, skipping down gears, or up when necessary wouldn't really cause any damage to a modern car.

djimi

I change 5th>>3rd and 4th>>2nd all the time. I dont think I have ever skipped a gear going up the gears tho; I might short shift 3rd sometimes if Im trying to keep my speed down but I dont think Ive ever shifted straight from 2nd to 4th.

djimi

C4Kid wrote: »

To be honest though, I don't want mechanics having the craic when they are charging me for a new gearbox.

I dont really see how using your gearbox as it intended to be used is going to put extra wear and tear on it to the point of it needing to be changed. If anything I would have thought that using it in a way other than its intended use would be putting it under extra risk?

Ghost Train

opinion guy wrote: »

If you coast out of gear you are using up fuel to keep the engine ticking over. In modern cars if you engine break your fuel consumption during that time is 0.0.

don't see why there would be any great difference

I'm really just talking about the down shifting, why use the gearbox, clutch an extra 25% when the brakes do the same job. It's no worse than using the gears and clutch accelerating but just a bit more wear on the clutch and gears because you're using them more.

Breaking in forth or fifth gear it's only the last few meters where you press in the clutch and come to a stop, don't know if coasting is the right description for it. Driving down a hill would downshift of course

On the original topic, I wouldn't skip gears going up, more force being put through the gearbox over a wider range, would rather fix a clutch problem than have the gearbox give trouble

dr.fuzzenstein

esel wrote: »

You wouldn't use this technique when changing down. People use it when changing up in the hope of improving fuel consumption. Just be sure the revs are enough for the higher gear, as lugging the engine will damage your big-end and/or main bearings pretty quickly.

Course you would, changing from 5th to 3rd when approaching a turn or junction. No need to bother 4th for that.
Or changing 4th to 2nd.
Had a Kia rental once, would not engage 3rd from 5th, was like stirring a bucket of manure, my Focus no problem, nice, firm positive box.
Never 3rd to 1st, 1st isn't really meant to be engaged at anything over a crawl or standstill.
Never do it on the way up, the high drop in revs feels wrong somehow.

Alanstrainor

MYOB wrote: »

Block shifting is perfectly fine. Just don't do it in a driving test.

It's perfectly fine for your driving test too. Most instructors would recommend block changing from 4th to 2nd.

I'd imagine block changing up through the gears would be a different story though. (I'm not too sure why you'd want to either?)

sentient_6

I sometimes skip from 4th to 6th going up when i wouldn't be looking to then accelerate, i.e 4th to 6th then hold at 80kmph. if my target speed was say 120 joining a motorway id be going 4th, 5th, 6th.

I skip coming down all the time, 5th or 6th to 3rd, 4th to 2nd.

Avns1s

argosy2006 wrote: »

More of a diesel car thing,,
more torque, or commercials, ie big van,,start in 2nd then into 4th,if a decline on road, if not 3rd,
depends on how loaded ur car or van is
if u have a big diesel car with only urself in it, and road is flat, ie not climbing a big hill then skipping gears is fine, starting in second on tiny decline is fine to, if u know what ur doing,
its a slower take off, cant just slap up clutch like in first, need to get car moving then release fully yet slowly,once clutch up rev on

You should never start in 2nd, those who do are the ones who are in the garage looking for their clutches to be replaced.

C4Kid

I dont really see how using your gearbox as it intended to be used is going to put extra wear and tear on it to the point of it needing to be changed. If anything I would have thought that using it in a way other than its intended use would be putting it under extra risk?

What i'm saying is using 3 gear changes instead of 5 to get from 0-60, would this extend the life of the parts, thats why I asked is it a good idea or not.

djimi

C4Kid wrote: »

What i'm saying is using 3 gear changes instead of 5 to get from 0-60, would this extend the life of the parts, thats why I asked is it a good idea or not.

I wouldnt imagine it would extent the life of the parts in any meaningful way, no. Certainly not enough to warrant changing your driving style.