Teagasc

LivInt20

Does anybody use the Teagasc Advisory Service?

Is it good value for money and what sort of service do they provide?

Would you recommend taking up this service?

Sam Kade

I gave up on them a few years back when they were advising farmers to get out if dairying.

blue5000

NO
NO
NO:D

LivInt20

Anybody in Suckler Farming using them?

pakalasa

blue5000 wrote: »

NO
NO
NO:D

Jazus BLUE, you were up early this morning - 4.38 AM

whelan1

i think its the same as ifa... if you are in trouble and need them they are invaluable ...... i find the discussion groups fantastic ... well worth the fee imo

5live

whelan1 wrote: »

i think its the same as ifa... if you are in trouble and need them they are invaluable ...... i find the discussion groups fantastic ... well worth the fee imo

Have to agree with whelan1. Use them to find out what you need to do and how to do it better and ignore what doesnt apply to you. They are handy for specific problems you might have. Make an appointment and go meet the guy who you will be working with and discuss what you want from the relationship and if you are happy with that and the price, try it for a year. And the discussion groups are good. There is no yard you go into that you cant learn something from

reilig

Have to agree with Whelan and 5live. Their service is invaluable. I use them for my suckler farm and am part of their discussion group. Its a great service.

There are probably only 2 reasons why people don't use them or find them useful.
1. There may be a bad advisor in their local office. At the end of the day, the service is only as good as the advisors that provide it.
or
2. Some farmers think that their advisor should be on a 1 to 1 basis with them 24/7. The reality is, that as a farmer, you need to know the schemes and options available to you and you need to plan your farm for the future. You can ask advice from your advisor and get them to check forms and applications for you. But they are an advisory service. You have to make the decisions for your farm whether they go against the advisor or not.

Based on the fact that Teagasc are an advisory service, in my local area, none of the private advisors are a patch on the Teagasc advisors. (It may differ for other areas).

The other service that they offer is a planning service. Using an example from my local area - all farmers using the Teagasc planning service are in REPS 4 (if they chose to be- they were given the option by the planner). Those not in REPS 4 all belong to private planners who did not have the wisdom and ability to ensure that the REPS 4 application was made before the deadline. And by god there are a lot of people that didn't make it in and they are certainly making a lot of noise at the moment.

adne

Agree fully with comments above - great to have them there for reference when need them, good to be able to bounce ideas off them, the fee is quiet low, well worth it IMO

snowman707

I left teagasc about 15 years mainly because of the narrow minded advise given my adviser at the time,

like all there are good and bad

in contrast to reiligs post my planner made sure all his clients (or as many as possible) got the full 5 years and 11 months from reps 4,

My planner did not look for any fees until we had received our first year's reps payments in full, Teagasc blackmailed their clients by refusing to lodge their applications until they had first received the fee

My planner's fees are about 20 to 25% less than teagasc

My planner or one of his mates are available for telephone consultation from 8.00am to 9.00pm Monday to saturday

Reilig says that the teagasc is far better in his area, here in our area is the opposite , and I reckon about 50% of people use teagasc and 50% private.



OP I think it is best to ask a few of your neighbours about the service in your area, and then chat to your local teagasc or private advisers to see what they have to offer, before you decide

BeeDI

When Brian Lenihan, has €6 billion cut out of the economy next year, (much of it in current government spending), and a further €9 billion up to 2014, there will not be a whole lot of Teagasc left in tact.
So I'd say, get ready to do without

Username John

Hello,

I was wondering the same myself for a good while. But I talked to my local advisor, who went through what they could do for me.
Its only a few weeks since I joined, but I am getting good support. Mostly its done over email, and the responses are fairly quick. Am happy enough so far I must say.

I guess it all depends on what yer current knowledge is, mine is fairly low it has to be said. So maybe tis easier to keep me happy, than others here.

My main aim is to get a bit more scentific on the way I do things, which is where I hope Teagasc will help.

I know there are comments here re REPS4 plans and planners.
Just wondering when people pay for their REPS4 plans then are they paying for the planner to make sure all is good as regards REPS, or are they paying for advice & consultancy on everything?
Or is REPS4 an additional payment on top of consultancy fees? (for private planners, it seems to be from Teagasc)

Bog Man 1

Teagasc are not very good at thinking outside the box and some of the solutions they come up with are not very helpful to farmers.They were recommending for farmers to join REPS which is all right if you are prepared to follow a plan and adhere to it .I know farmers that joined REPS and they were completely unsuitable to the scheme. A good advisor would have told them the truth and steer clear of it. Other farmers on Teagasc advise availed of the grant for pollution control and ended in financial trouble.
I use Teagasc and find them helpful and good for the Single Farm Payment. Some of the private consultants are very good and tend to be more street wise than Teagasc.

Username John

I know this is out of date, as its 2008 - and also I paid more only a few weeks ago.

But it might be interesting for the REPS figures, as I imagine those cant have changed that much, if anything, they should have reduced... just said I'd put it up when I found it.

http://www.teagasc.ie/advisory/AdvisoryChargesSummary_19Nov2008.pdf

5live

I have to agree with relig. Some guys want 24/7 service and every single decision is made by Teagasc man for them. Just back from discussion group meeting from a new group for the dairy efficiency programme. One guy takes the Teagasc line as gospel. Fine if it works but it is not always suitable. My last adviser kept telling me i could not suffer from drought but was always on hols when i enquired from him how to feed very short hay to cows and keep a 20 day rotation:rolleyes:. Find an advisor that suits YOU not him, be that private or public. For me anyway, there is a huge knowledge base in teagasc that can be called upon to find a solution to any problem you are having. I dont think many private advisors have that knowledge and experience

LivInt20

Username John wrote: »

I know this is out of date, as its 2008 - and also I paid more only a few weeks ago.

But it might be interesting for the REPS figures, as I imagine those cant have changed that much, if anything, they should have reduced... just said I'd put it up when I found it.

http://www.teagasc.ie/advisory/AdvisoryChargesSummary_19Nov2008.pdf

Thanks

When they say "Income Unit" what are the Units. Is is based on SPS entitlements, area, stock or what?

Username John

LivInt20 wrote: »

Thanks

When they say "Income Unit" what are the Units. Is is based on SPS entitlements, area, stock or what?

As far as I know one unit is equivalent to 254 euro. But am open to correction on that.
Dont know why, how, where this came from.

adne

snowman707 wrote: »

I left teagasc about 15 years mainly because of the narrow minded advise given my adviser at the time,

like all there are good and bad

True, the teagasc service has to be taken at face value as its based on the adviser that you use.

A number of years ago when i had first taken over the family farm I had a Teagasc advisor off me 600 euro a piece for 3 26 mth bullocks that weighted 500+ KG.
I knew that he was trying a fast one but i did not react as I needed his help at the time to get into REPS. I sold the bullocks in a mart 3 days later for an average of 835.
I mad sure to drop him immediately afterwards and have blackened his name where ever possible.
He is not a private Planner.

Nice Chap to employ the services of :rolleyes::rolleyes:

blue5000

pakalasa wrote: »

Jazus BLUE, you were up early this morning - 4.38 AM

Hi Pakalasa,
I got a phone call at 4am from a well known airline down under who needed help with a bit of engine trouble. Had to look up some stuff on the net and had a look at boards while I was on..... :P

trg

It is in my opinion dependant on the area, i am new to the farming scene, used them to do AEOS application and SFP application, both were an absolute disaster. The follow-up attempts at rectification have been appalling as has their attitude. The fact that AEOS is re-opening in 2011 seems to be the solution, in my view it is not. In my case I blame the management, i have dealt with them and the attitude and attempt to resolve have been shocking.

Its best that you ask around farmers in the area and seek their view as people here will have varied opinions as you can see. I did not do this and boy do i regret it.

BOND747

my experience of teagasc is that it totally depends on the advisor you have, the first guy i had told me to get out of suckling one year and the following year wanted me to build a shed costing €50grand, i totally ignored everything he said. The guy i have now is more down to earth and farmer friendly.. In my case i think they are too expensive for the service they provide me but maybe that's my fault for not using them enough

Muckit

The Teagasc office has closed here in Ballinasloe the past few years... and it's office was right beside one of the biggest Marts in the west

westlander

Muckit wrote: »

The Teagasc office has closed here in Ballinasloe the past few years... and it's office was right beside one of the biggest Marts in the west

Teagasc in Ballinasloe is still open. I'm going in there this eve to talk to an adviser !

Muckit

westlander wrote: »

Teagasc in Ballinasloe is still open. I'm going in there this eve to talk to an adviser !

God that's news to me Westlander! Was it closed for a time then ?? I thought all was moved to Athenry... My neighbour was working in there, unless he was filling me with cr*p, which could be the case
:rolleyes:

westlander

Muckit wrote: »

God that's news to me Westlander! Was it closed for a time then ?? I thought all was moved to Athenry... My neighbour was working in there, unless he was filling me with cr*p, which could be the case
:rolleyes:

Im not sure if it was open before but I've just joined fairly recently. But theres a couple of advisers there and Ballinasloe also ran the mandatory course you had to do for REPS4!

moy83

what do teagasc charge for advice is there a flat rate or is everyone different a rough idea on the price would be sound thanks

whelan1

my bill for the year is 450 euro , is that the norm?

5live

whelan1 wrote: »

my bill for the year is 450 euro , is that the norm?

Same here. Think it is standard DEP charge afaik

Muckit

westlander wrote: »

Im not sure if it was open before but I've just joined fairly recently. But theres a couple of advisers there and Ballinasloe also ran the mandatory course you had to do for REPS4!

I have to apologise Westlander. You were right. Teagasc Ballinasloe has not closed, sorry if I mislead anyone saying it was closed:o They mustn't always answer the phone!:p

I was in yesterday evening and this morning to borrow soil sampler and to leave back in soil samples for testing. €25/sample which i thought was very reasonable, what with a 50kg bag of most fertilisers being well over that.

I didn't sign up though:p

Birdnuts

The 2 offices I dealt with in the past (Naas and Belmullet) are now closed I beleive. I have a problem with alot of Teagasc's approaches to Agriculture but some good people were lost in these closures:(

johngalway

reilig wrote: »

Using an example from my local area - all farmers using the Teagasc planning service are in REPS 4 (if they chose to be- they were given the option by the planner). Those not in REPS 4 all belong to private planners who did not have the wisdom and ability to ensure that the REPS 4 application was made before the deadline. And by god there are a lot of people that didn't make it in and they are certainly making a lot of noise at the moment.

You're back to local office and quality of planner again I'm afraid to tell you. I was with Teagasc when I was in REPS 3. Before the Christmas before REPS was finished I asked my planner to get me into REPS 4. Offered to pay for the plan then and there and have it submitted, what ever it took. I knew full well what was coming down the line.

I was told, "advised" if you like, I could not jump from REPS 3 to REPS 4, under no circumstances at all. It wasn't possible. After that Christmas I had reason to talk to a more senior more experienced "adviser" who told me the same again, and that REPS 4 was to be "suspended" as the Dept. had made an absolute balls of it and it needed to be "redone".

Quite plainly I told him that would be the end of REPS. He told me "That's not possible", I :rolleyes: The next day that I met him he was the day the news broke that REPS had been closed. Told me the news like it was supposed to be news to me...

Just before the following Christmas, at a public meeting, I found out I was right all along. One of the speakers commented on how many "lucky" farmers jumped ship from REPS 3 to REPS 4. Spilled milk at that stage.

I've got other bad "advice" and bad "service" - never return a call, never answer a mobile, forgot about this, forgot about that, etc. - from them also. But, I'm sure there are members there who do know what they're talking about. Just unlucky that I am not being "advised" by someone like that.

nilhg

Birdnuts wrote: »

The 2 offices I dealt with in the past (Naas and Belmullet) are now closed I beleive. I have a problem with alot of Teagasc's approaches to Agriculture but some good people were lost in these closures:(

I was in the Naas office trying to get a digitisation issue sorted while you were typing this.;)


It should have been sold during the boom, when it was worth a fortune, now they are talking about selling it and moving out somewhere but that might never happen.

Ozzie Scott

Would you boys and girls have a requirement for a decent ag consultant or would you find the cost prohibitive, and is this one of the main reasons for using the wooly jumper brigade in Teagasc:). I was thinking of doing some consultation work along aside our busy mixed farm (beef/crops). I have the neccessary qualifications and have the experience of what farming is like when the money is coming out of your own pocket something the teagasc boys seem to forget. I would be coming from the point of wanting the farmer to teaching themselves through getting their own minds working as much as possible and not dictating to them what should be done. Currently I would rate the Teagasc advice both spoken and written, next to no good on a practical farm level. Im am not a user of their services but I have seen some of the ludicrous paths that they have lead local farmers down.

Ozzie

reilig

Ozzie Scott wrote: »

Would you boys and girls have a requirement for a decent ag consultant or would you find the cost prohibitive, and is this one of the main reasons for using the wooly jumper brigade in Teagasc:). I was thinking of doing some consultation work along aside our busy mixed farm (beef/crops). I have the neccessary qualifications and have the experience of what farming is like when the money is coming out of your own pocket something the teagasc boys seem to forget. Currently I would rate the Teagasc advice both spoken and written, next to no good on a practical farm level. Im am not a user of their services but I have seen some of the ludicrous paths that they have lead local farmers down.

Ozzie

If you made a mistake with a farm plan or missed a deadline and a farmer missed out on a payment because of this would you be covered??

Do you have the necessary experience to advise farmers with farms that might be very different to your own on what schemes or options within schemes that would best suit their farming operation and yield the most returns?

I'm not trying to be critical, but there are loads of people with qualifications to be able to be an Ag Consultant but they don't have the practical knowledge. While you may have a lot of practical knowledge from your own farm, it may not be relevant to 75% of farms in the country.

I would be coming from the point of wanting the farmer to teaching themselves through getting their own minds working as much as possible and not dictating to them what should be done.

People use Ag Consultants for this very purpose. If they knew what was best and didn't want to be told what to do and how to do it then what would be the point in using a planner at all??

For every story of Teagasc letting a farmer down, there is a story of a private planner letting a farmer down. Its quality of planner and local office rather than quality of Teagasc. I know one planner who used to work with Teagasc and who made several costly mistakes for farmers who sued Teagasc because of losses. Now this guy is a very high profile private planner and is regularly seen giving advice in media and he is very outspoken about Teagasc - and him having to leave his job with Teagasc because of mistakes that he made.

5live

Ozzie Scott wrote: »

Would you boys and girls have a requirement for a decent ag consultant or would you find the cost prohibitive, and is this one of the main reasons for using the wooly jumper brigade in Teagasc:). I was thinking of doing some consultation work along aside our busy mixed farm (beef/crops). I have the neccessary qualifications and have the experience of what farming is like when the money is coming out of your own pocket something the teagasc boys seem to forget. I would be coming from the point of wanting the farmer to teaching themselves through getting their own minds working as much as possible and not dictating to them what should be done. Currently I would rate the Teagasc advice both spoken and written, next to no good on a practical farm level. Im am not a user of their services but I have seen some of the ludicrous paths that they have lead local farmers down.

Ozzie

It would be unfair to tar ALL teagasc advisors with the same brush. There are some excellent ones out there and there are some absolutely crap ones. I have had both and just on a new one. Dont know how good bad or indifferent she is but next week will tell a lot as she is coming out. Re your advisory work, be sure you have insurance and payment sorted first. It can be a real pain following up money owed

reilig

At our last discussion group meeting one of the group members stood up to publicly thank one of the advisors for working a miracle. When the first SFP was out in October he didn't receive a payment and put it down to digitisation. By the time the second part of the payment was coming out he still had received no money so he asked the advisor to check it for him. Advisor came back to say that the farmer had not applied for his SFP. He hadn't signed and returned the form. Imagine the horror. His own fault as he liked to do all his own paperwork. Advisor told him to leave it with him.

Advisor is a "cute hoor". On closing date for SFP applications, he send off several envelopes for farmers that he had filled out the form for. He registered them all and also sent off several empty envelopes - registering them too.

Advisor contacted the Dep to say that he had sent in the form for the above farmer and had registered the envelope to prove it. Dep apologised for the mistake and said that they must have lost the form and asked him to send in a copy of the original.

Farmer had his full SFP just after christmas.

Regardless of your advisor being employed by Teagasc, a private planning company or self employed, If he or she is useless then the service provided to you will be useless.

funny man

Ozzie Scott wrote: »

Would you boys and girls have a requirement for a decent ag consultant or would you find the cost prohibitive, and is this one of the main reasons for using the wooly jumper brigade in Teagasc:). I was thinking of doing some consultation work along aside our busy mixed farm (beef/crops). I have the neccessary qualifications and have the experience of what farming is like when the money is coming out of your own pocket something the teagasc boys seem to forget. I would be coming from the point of wanting the farmer to teaching themselves through getting their own minds working as much as possible and not dictating to them what should be done. Currently I would rate the Teagasc advice both spoken and written, next to no good on a practical farm level. Im am not a user of their services but I have seen some of the ludicrous paths that they have lead local farmers down.

Ozzie

you seem to have a low opinion of teagasc and their work, i know they didn't look after beef men in the past but really that was their own fault as they never demanded more from them, on the dairy side i think they have got their act together and are finally doing some good research in johnston castle for winter milk herds because these men and women demanded it, and also in moorepark, ballydague and ballyhaise. our disscussion group visited farms in north england last year and were amazed that they were in moorepark twice that spring and had great praise for our research which they were happy to take without paying.

what fee would you have to get to provide a similar service to teagasc and would you make any contribution towards the research being done on behalf of farmers. Farmers should be careful when complaining about teagasc as it is highly subsidised by the government and if their is no demand for service it could be scrapped, i think if a advisor isn't up to scratch enquire around for the best ones, i did it, i don't use the local guy but i still go to teagasc in another county.

Ozzie Scott

reilig wrote: »

If you made a mistake with a farm plan or missed a deadline and a farmer missed out on a payment because of this would you be covered??

Do you have the necessary experience to advise farmers with farms that might be very different to your own on what schemes or options within schemes that would best suit their farming operation and yield the most returns?

I'm not trying to be critical, but there are loads of people with qualifications to be able to be an Ag Consultant but they don't have the practical knowledge. While you may have a lot of practical knowledge from your own farm, it may not be relevant to 75% of farms in the country.



People use Ag Consultants for this very purpose. If they knew what was best and didn't want to be told what to do and how to do it then what would be the point in using a planner at all??

For every story of Teagasc letting a farmer down, there is a story of a private planner letting a farmer down. Its quality of planner and local office rather than quality of Teagasc. I know one planner who used to work with Teagasc and who made several costly mistakes for farmers who sued Teagasc because of losses. Now this guy is a very high profile private planner and is regularly seen giving advice in media and he is very outspoken about Teagasc - and him having to leave his job with Teagasc because of mistakes that he made.

Easy, I havnt dipped my toe in yet, but obviously the revelant insurance is neccessary. Unfortunately people missing out on deadlines and not being up to speed on the revelant rules/regs etc, is inexcisable. I would have no interest in dealing with the REPS sides of things and becoming a planner as I feel this isnt the right road for the majority of farmers to be focusing their attention over the coming years. Thats not to say that REPS doesnt make a big contribution to many smaller farms. In my current and continuing line of business (beef) I would be on allot of farms through the southern region dealing for animals. I just see so many instances where people are making wrong decisions based on the "always done" attitude. I was talking to a local teagasc advisor one day who is out giving the line about there is money in sucklers etc. out the other side of his mouth he want to know if I was interested in buying his herd of sucklers as he said on good land they are a joke. I was more than surprised with his attitude and a little annoyed considering all the advice this guy had off loaded to farmers looking to hear something positive. Regarding the research farms their costs etc are a complete joke. They are so inaccurate its unfair on the guys taking on this advice trying to achieve the figures that Teagasc say is in the game. the amount of cheap feeds and also other inputs that some of the farms get for "research" purposes is unreal.

funny man

Ozzie Scott wrote: »

Easy, I havnt dipped my toe in yet, but obviously the revelant insurance is neccessary. Unfortunately people missing out on deadlines and not being up to speed on the revelant rules/regs etc, is inexcisable. I would have no interest in dealing with the REPS sides of things and becoming a planner as I feel this isnt the right road for the majority of farmers to be focusing their attention over the coming years. Thats not to say that REPS doesnt make a big contribution to many smaller farms. In my current and continuing line of business (beef) I would be on allot of farms through the southern region dealing for animals. I just see so many instances where people are making wrong decisions based on the "always done" attitude.

Is it from bad advise, bad advisor or a farmer who just dosn't listen!

reilig

Ozzie Scott wrote: »

I would have no interest in dealing with the REPS sides of things and becoming a planner as I feel this isnt the right road for the majority of farmers to be focusing their attention over the coming years.

I personally think that you would be flogging a dead horse then. If it wasn't for REPS, most farmers would not engage the services of an Ag Consultant. How many farmers were using Ag Consultants before REPS? Less than 30% of farmers in the country anyway.

What sort of advisory services could you provide that farmers would pay for, along with paying a REPS planner for their REPS plan?

funny man

Ozzie Scott wrote: »

Regarding the research farms their costs etc are a complete joke. They are so inaccurate its unfair on the guys taking on this advice trying to achieve the figures that Teagasc say is in the game. the amount of cheap feeds and also other inputs that some of the farms get for "research" purposes is unreal.

Have you worked on these farms or how are you in a position to rubbish their costs.
I never heard any teagasc advisor say that we have to achieve the costs of the research farms.
If you ever become an advisor seen as you won't deal with schemes and you say that farmers do things bcause they always did it, what contribution would you make to improve a farmers income and as teagasc research farms are a joke where are you going to take your (dairy and beef)research from.

dar31

very happy with the service i get from teagasc, and all that comes with it.
use them a lot.
where else would you get so much for so little.

could never bring my self to thrust the advise of just one person.

milkprofit

Has Teagasc improved
What can teagasc do to get non clients intrested
to get more people go to discussion groups or meetings
Any other comments