5min Interview with Chris Bangle

-Chris-

This is a video from a design blog rather than a car blog, but it's still interesting to listen to him imho.

I'm fascinated by the influence of Bangle (like it or not) on BMW and all their competitors.

Maybe this'll be of interest to someone else too.

http://www.inframe.tv/filmProject.aspx?id=27

Mr.David

Interesting alright.

As an engineer working in a car company though, designers can be so frustrating. Bangle touched on it talking about marketing heads creating an environment of "no, no, no" and said that "life cannot be born under an environment of no".

Which is grand, but they can get all arty and fairy like with their designs often to the detriment of engineering.

Its a difficult balance in every car company - there are always compromises to be made and often it comes down to a choice between style and function and its never easy!

Voodoomelon

I still don't "get" a lot of his designs. The E90 3 series, E60 5 series, E65 7 series, they just aren't good looking cars. He'd probably argue that they're not supposed to be but whats the point in that?

I don't like the idea that a cars design has to "grow on you" before you start to like it, it should be a good looking car the moment you lay eyes on it. Thats the way everyone else sees your car when they see it driving down the street. I remember the first time I saw the E90 in 2005 and I was appalled by it. Same goes for the E65. Both have progressed since with facelifts and are the better for it, but their design is still compromised I feel by what he has done.

The E60 5 series is a mish-mash of conflicting designs; I dont know enough about to design to put it into words properly, but the overall shape doesn't work collectively. The rear end doesn't compliment the front and the shoulder line is too high leaving the windows too small. It has a very voluptuous bulky outline that looks awful with small alloys and its just not a good looking car from most angles. The M5 E60 looks well, but i'm not sure if its the performance characteristics that influence my thoughts on it or whether it is actually the small design cues that improve its overall looks.

pajo1981

What a cool cool guy.

Mr.David

I actually really like the E60 5 Series but hated it when it was released.

The E90 3 series however still hasnt grown on me. Its ok, but thats about it. And in 316i form with 16" alloys it just looks awful.

I think Clarkson referred to it as a couch on coasters and its v true.

Sometimes I think designers focus too much on the high end versions with big wheels and then the base model suffers and looks terrible.

pajo1981

Voodoomelon wrote: »

I don't like the idea that a cars design has to "grow on you" before you start to like it, it should be a good looking car the moment you lay eyes on it.

I hated the E90 when I first saw it.

And then, after some time, it started to grow on me...

Then it grew on me some more.... and I bought one!

Somehow this process has made me feel 'closer' to the car?

Sad sad sad... :rolleyes:

Mr Benevolent

Funny, the E90 coupe is one of the best looking cars I've ever seen. I've always considered the 4 door 3 series ugly, regardless of it being an E90 or E46. The black rubber trim around the doors - ugh.

pajo1981

Confab wrote: »

Funny, the E90 coupe is one of the best looking cars I've ever seen. I've always considered the 4 door 3 series ugly, regardless of it being an E90 or E46. The black rubber trim around the doors - ugh.

You can specify chomre trim as an option - it really improves the look.

And yes, the coupe is sex.

Voodoomelon

Agreed, the E90 coupe looks very well.

Seweryn

Voodoomelon wrote: »

The E60 5 series is a mish-mash of conflicting designs; I dont know enough about to design to put it into words properly, but the overall shape doesn't work collectively. The rear end doesn't compliment the front and the shoulder line is too high leaving the windows too small. It has a very voluptuous bulky outline that looks awful with small alloys and its just not a good looking car from most angles.

You are right, but this car looks even worse if you sit inside. You must work really hard or just love this thing to accept its awful dashboard.

Voodoomelon

So true! I HATE the dash in them! I was actually considering a facelifted E65 sport as my next car but the dash is friggin awful. That, the iDrive and dash mounted gear lever, what a disaster...

Eric Cartman

if he has any responsibility for the iDrive system i wish terrible things upon him , the e46, e38 and e39 were perfect cars , the dash was nice , you could change the stereo or use bmw's nice enough navigation system , everything worked well and the layout was modular, then comes along idrive and f*cks everything up for everyone and its a terrible interface

pajo1981

The new idrive is supposed to be very good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdnOjevfWIE

Eric Cartman

pajo1981 wrote: »

The new idrive is supposed to be very good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdnOjevfWIE

personally not a fan of it , that wheel never did much for me , I like the touch screen nav in my car , far easier for entering addresses . my biggest problem is the lack of ability to change the stereo, most jap cars (with the exception of lexus) you can put any stereo single or double DIN that you want into it . On these BMW's you cant anymore, they e39 was great because you could use bmw's alright navigation if you wanted , or you could put in your own stereo with an adaptor, with the iDrive your trapped, so when the car gets 7-8 years old its not compatible with the USB 3.0 sticks we all have , or the new ipods it cant control or the music filled blu-ray discs or the new standard of radio over DVB-T etc... and your left with the choice of live without your music etc... or buy another car , whereas with my car i can just keep changing the stereo aslong as they stick to ISO-DIN connectors and double DIN fitting

pajo1981

Eric Cartman wrote: »

personally not a fan of it , that wheel never did much for me , I like the touch screen nav in my car , far easier for entering addresses . my biggest problem is the lack of ability to change the stereo, most jap cars (with the exception of lexus) you can put any stereo single or double DIN that you want into it . On these BMW's you cant anymore, they e39 was great because you could use bmw's alright navigation if you wanted , or you could put in your own stereo with an adaptor, with the iDrive your trapped, so when the car gets 7-8 years old its not compatible with the USB 3.0 sticks we all have , or the new ipods it cant control or the music filled blu-ray discs or the new standard of radio over DVB-T etc... and your left with the choice of live without your music etc... or buy another car , whereas with my car i can just keep changing the stereo aslong as they stick to ISO-DIN connectors and double DIN fitting

I don't think that the people who buy these cars new are too worried about the ability to fit an after-market stereo 7 or 8 years down the line...

as for living without your music for the lack of a blu-ray disc player, DVB-T reciever or USB 3 socket- get real

Eric Cartman

pajo1981 wrote: »

I don't think that the people who buy these cars new are too worried about the ability to fit an after-market stereo 7 or 8 years down the line...

as for living without your music for the lack of a blu-ray disc player, DVB-T reciever or USB 3 socket- get real

just saying, would you be happy with a car with an AM radio and tape player you couldnt change ?, im not saying new buyers will be concerned but BMW are hurting their own resale, we dont know whats around the corner with car media or what apple will do to ipods next and in all fairness i like the option to upgrade if somethign came along, just think, in 10 years, therll be perfectly good 5 series that have gps maps outdated by 5-6 years that cant be updated (unless bmw release a retrofit nav computer) that you cant plug the latest iphone into and you cant put in new usb sticks

bmstuff

Voodoomelon wrote: »

I still don't "get" a lot of his designs. The E90 3 series, ...

He did not.
Joji Nagashima did, as he also designed BMW E36, Z3, the E39 5 series and E90/E91 3 series.

Bangle was the director of design, he influenced the designs, most of them were not done by him.

VolvoMan

bmstuff wrote: »

He did not.
Joji Nagashima did, as he also designed BMW E36, Z3, the E39 5 series and E90/E91 3 series.

Bangle was the director of design, he influenced the designs, most of them were not done by him.

It's ironic to think that Nagashima (a Japanese man) designed some of BMW's most proportionally perfect models, yet he came up with the E90 as well.

bmstuff

VolvoMan wrote: »

It's ironic to think that Nagashima (a Japanese man) designed some of BMW's most proportionally perfect models, yet he came up with the E90 as well.

Yeah I was suprised too. The guy who designed the e39 also designed the e90 and e91, I could not believe it when I first read it.

Many attributes of those cars, including the rear of the e65 were not designed by Bangle either. I am sure everybody remember the 7 series when it came up with this horrible rear, people were giving out a lot about Bangle, oh well, it was not him either lol

But yes Bangle surely gave them the general tone anyway.

Voodoomelon

Claus Luthe who was head of design as the E38 was finishing up, was sent to prison for stabbing and killing his 33 year old drug addict son!

VolvoMan

bmstuff wrote: »

Many attributes of those cars, including the rear of the e65 were not designed by Bangle either. I am sure everybody remember the 7 series when it came up with this horrible rear, people were giving out a lot about Bangle, oh well, it was not him either lol

The person who in fact was responsible for that ugly rump has now replaced Bangle. (Adrian Van Hooydonk)

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Claus Luthe who was head of design as the E38 was finishing up, was sent to prison for stabbing and killing his 33 year old drug addict son!

He sadly passed away about 2-3 years ago.

As well as many of the best BMWs we know, he was also responsible for the NSU Ro80; a car that to look at today one would never believe was designed in the sixties.