Rust repair

jaynexx

Evening all..

Before posting this, I did look for something similar to see if this had already been asked so I apologise if I've repeated another post.

I have a 8 year old Ford KA which failed its NCT because of rust on the underbody. The chap at the Deansgrange centre said it'd be a case of small welding and a patch of metal could just be added. With this advice, I went to a body repair shop in Bray and a similar one in Sandyford. They both said that the job would be bigger than the car's worth. I'm not a car expert, and I'm sure they know what they're talking about but I'm just resistant to scrap the car just yet, knowing its age and milage (60,000 miles).

Could someone please advise me further on this? If it has to be scrapped, then so be it but if I could get this job done, i'd be very happy and would pay the going rate. Also, I must add, the car has been in my underground car park since the failure because my tax was up at the same time. So ideally, i'd be looking for someone who could pick it up.

Thanks in advance for any help.

sogood

I would keep shopping around, especially if the NCT guy maintained that it wasn't a big fix. I suspect that the people you went to may have been trying to make a bit of a killing. Not being sexist here but are you female by any chance? keep watching boards and I'm sure you'll get some better feedback.

Good luck with it.

Go to a mechanic, not a bodyshop
If they won't do it they may well recommend someone.

jaynexx

Thanks for your replies

Yea I am female. I got the feeling that they were more interested in insurance jobs though because they didn't even quote me. Perhaps they were being honest and the job is too big but I just don't get why the NCT man said it was a small job. Would people turn down work?

Also, to add, this car was imported from the UK. Reading the forums, I can see that rust underneath is quite common with such imports.

I will perhaps call a couple more and failing that, I'll just keep the car til the VRT exemption period is up and then scrap it. :S

Thanks again.

Jaynexx

Seosaimh77

Hey,
I would love to get help on this too.

I failed my NCT today for the exact same reason over in Ballymun, and the guy there said it would be a small job too. So it really does sound like the quotes you got were trying to rip you off. I haven't done any price checking yet but when I do I'll let you know of the best offers I get.

Oh, and my car (97 Almera) is a UK import too. And my brother had similar issues a few years ago with a bmw from UK. So it really does seem to be a problem. Maybe they dont check for underbody rust over there in their MOT's (their version of NCT).

mickdw

Of course they check in uk for structural rust. They use more salt on the roads over there so that is why they are worse than irish cars. It is possible that some of the rustier cars are being targeted at the export/irish market too!

patwicklow

i had the very same thing at the nct center in arklow it failed on the under body sills being rusty so i filled them ect went back and they failed me again and said it would have to be plate/spot weilded ect i got a quote for €500 for both sills so said no way would i pay that so my brother had a look at it and said a fiber glass kit would do the job just as good so i paid €12.00 for a fiber glass kit my brother done it in half an hour primed it and sprayed the rest of the sills mat black and it sailed through the nct so my advice is use the fiber glass kit its so easy to do and alot cheaper then the rip off quotes we get,

mickdw

But you were only hiding the rust damage. The cills would be a structural part of the car and it relies on them having the full design strength. You covered up the weakness and got it past the tester. You still have a weakened structure and you should not be advising people to proceed in this way. The NCT people have no problem with fillers/fiberglass when used in a non structural location.

Imagine driving a converible car which only has the cills and floor for strength - no roof. Now imagine being in a crash in this convertible if the cills were made from rust and fiberglass, it woud fold it two.

mickdw

Duplicate post

Tigger

mickdw wrote: »

But you were only hiding the rust damage. The cills would be a structural part of the car and it relies on them having the full design strength. You covered up the weakness and got it past the tester. You still have a weakened structure and you should not be advising people to proceed in this way. The NCT people have no problem with fillers/fiberglass when used in a non structural location.

Imagine driving a converible car which only has the cills and floor for strength - no roof. Now imagine being in a crash in this convertible if the cills were made from rust and fiberglass, it woud fold it two.

Everything he said and it's about 100 quid you saved

jaynexx

Sorry for bringing up this old subject again but think it's bout time I finally tackled the car I have sitting in my underground car park!

Ok, so I might have killed the car having it laid up for 5 months but would really like to either have this thing repaired or look at scrapping it in Jan when VRT exemption is up..

I just don't know where to start now cos obv it's not taxed, insurance is insufficient and obv no NCT! I know I've got myself into a little mess and appreciate that this is gonna be costly so have waited til I'm in a position to get this fixed.

Could any mechanic out there please help? Am I best just waiting to scrap it? I was advised that in it's current state i'd only get 500e, i'd far rather pay this again than pay for a car older than mine, with more milage and that I don't really like. Thnks

biko

Where are you located? I know some really good people for body stuff around Galway.
Don't scrap it until you've let at least a few guys look it over.

Edit, I realise you're over in the East.
There should be plenty of suggestions for that area.

jaynexx

I'm in Cherrywood, South Dublin 18... It'd be great if I could have someone look at it... I just have no idea what to do..!! Thanks for replying anyways ...I'm completely useless at this sort of thing and would be so happy to finally be mobile once again..!!

mcwhirter

I have seen quite a few Ford Ka's with rust. Its not that common on cars these days.
Have seen a few late reg mercs with rust too.

Unfortunately both Ka and Fiesta seem to be worse than average on resiliency for rust (probably not any worse than mid to late 90's Mercs though). I think heavy salting last winter probably pushed rust on many marginal cars over the edge.

Whereabout are the rusty bits on your Ka? They have a design feature (fault) where debris from front wheels very quickly wore paint of the bottom of the b-pillar (door aperture) due to it not being flush with the door. I would imagine that welding that part of the body would be really challenging as it is quite a visible spot.

Yeah, and shame on the fella who suggested fiberglassing a main structural component.

wildefalcon

I do structural rust repairs on Landrovers, which are a very different arrangement to Cars.

The principle is the same, though.

What you need to do is find a good independent mechanic in your area. Not a body repair shop, a mechanic.

He (it is usually a "he") would recover your Ka, lift it in the air with a ramp/lift remove the rust, clean the surrounding area back to shiny steel, disconnect the alternator and battery, to protect the electrics, and then weld on a piece of steel over the hole, all the way around.

He should then spray some anti rust material over the new metal.

He should then bring the Ka back to you.

If you think about that, it should take a 1/2 day. He would charge you about 300 euro for all of this. Maximum.

I'm not in your area, and I don't work on cars out of choice, but if it was me I'd charge you 50 Plus fuel to collect the car, 50 for the repair, and 50 plus fuel to return the car.

Don't fret about the cost of the steel - a 1 foot square of decent steel would cost no more than a tenner, but most mechanics who do this sort of thing would have pieces of scrap for this type of job, and, by rights, not add it into their cost.

Could you take a photo of the rust hole? If you could, and you could post it up here you might get few ideas of local mechanics.

Ask around, there are very good independents that are sensibly priced, and are decent gentlemen, too. If you hear the same name twice, that's the guy to go for.

jaynexx

Perfect, that's just the post I was looking for .. I just went down and took pictures of the rust but can't upload at the min cos only have an android netbook (my other gripe!) But I will certainly do this when I can. I'm able to send pics via email to anybody who wants to see.

I might also add that the NCT guy pointed out that the rust was near the rear wheel on the driver's side whereas both bodyshop repair places spotted a problem area nearer the passenger door so I've taken pictures of both of them.

Thanks for giving me a price to work with.. I'd be more than happy to pay that to any decent mechanic. I'm not looking for any cheap shortcuts, just an honest guy who can get it fixed.

Thanks to everyone for all your help so far

Jaynexx

S Line

The op said she was a resistant to scrap it because of age and mileage, and by that I will assume that she thinks it’s a ‘good’ car. Well it’s not a good car - it has structural rot !!!
I don’t think the body shops were trying to ‘rip you off’ I think they were just trying to price themselves out of the job because they did not want the work. Unless they are classic car restorers no body shop wants to do rust repairs as it would be impossible to offer a warranty on the job and could have the customer back after 6 months complaining about the quality of repairs and wanting it done again for free
I don’t give too hoots about what a reg plate car has and think that many nice useable car have been shamefully scrapped in the scrappage scheme – I say this to establish that I’m not some kind of car age snob that has a Celtic tiger attitude of getting rig of good cars just because they are not new.
The car may be ‘young’ being a 02 and have low mileage – but it has structural rot. Unless you are going to go down the classic car route of a total strip down and either chemical dip or sandblasting the shell and then replacing the rusted panels with new panels you are fighting a losing battle.
Welding on a patch will only get it through the NCT – it’s going to keep rusting
As for the fibre-glass and filler route – sheer lunacy and would only be done by a back street bodge artist.
Scrapping this car would not be a waste – it has reached the end of its useable life.
I know there is a recession but even in this climate you should be able to rustle up say €1000.00 which would surely get you a nice rust free motor .
Also re the scrappage scheme, if the NCT has lapsed I don’t think it will qualify. Also if you did qualify the very least you could buy would be horrible little Hyundai i10 or Kia Piccanto for approx € 8000. For even half of that amount you would pick up a tidy Focus or Golf – a nice upgrade from a KA ??

jillette

I have the same problem as the OP on this thread. My ford ka has failed the nct due to pretty bad rust. I'd like to sell it for scrap - could someone advise me where/how to do this? I've no idea. Are those signs at crossroads saying 'we buy nct failures for cash' ok?? Any tips appreciated!

ljpg

patwicklow wrote: »

i had the very same thing at the nct center in arklow it failed on the under body sills being rusty so i filled them ect went back and they failed me again and said it would have to be plate/spot weilded ect i got a quote for €500 for both sills so said no way would i pay that so my brother had a look at it and said a fiber glass kit would do the job just as good so i paid €12.00 for a fiber glass kit my brother done it in half an hour primed it and sprayed the rest of the sills mat black and it sailed through the nct so my advice is use the fiber glass kit its so easy to do and alot cheaper then the rip off quotes we get,

ridiculous advice,if your sills were meant to be fiberglass they would have come from the factory made of fiberglass,bodge job if i ever heard one....