Does this sound crazy?

no1beemerfan

I tow different trailers every now and again and they range in size from small to horsebox size.

Anyways I thought I probably wasn't licenced to tow the bigger ones as I got my licence 11 years ago and its just class B not E + B marked on it.

So I rang the motor tax office this morning and as I thought I wasn't licenced to tow the bigger trailers.

This is where I think it gets stupid.....in order for me to get E + B I've to take the car theory test, apply for the car test and inform them its to tow a trailer! (When I've a full driving licence 11 years!)

Surely there should be an easier and simpler way?

Alanstrainor

no1beemerfan wrote: »

I tow different trailers every now and again and they range in size from small to horsebox size.

Anyways I thought I probably wasn't licenced to tow the bigger ones as I got my licence 11 years ago and its just class B not E + B marked on it.

So I rang the motor tax office this morning and as I thought I wasn't licenced to tow the bigger trailers.

This is where I think it gets stupid.....in order for me to get E + B I've to take the car theory test, apply for the car test and inform them its to tow a trailer! (When I've a full driving licence 11 years!)

Surely there should be an easier and simpler way?

Nope that's it. You would be required to have L plates up and an accompanying driver with you at all times when you are carrying a trailer.

no1beemerfan

Alanstrainor wrote: »

You would be required to have L plates up and an accompanying driver with you at all times when you are carrying a trailer.

Ah jaysus.......................:o

Keith186

Lol!

Mr Magners

Keith186 wrote: »

Lol!

That made me LOL!

My comiserations OP, L plates eh, some pain in the hol

Alanstrainor

Yup it sucks! Oh and the accompanying driver would have to have held his/her EB license for at least 2 years.

R.O.R

Alanstrainor wrote: »

Yup it sucks! Oh and the accompanying driver would have to have held his/her EB license for at least 2 years.

I'd offer to sit with no1beemerfan, but he's down in Tipp.

Courtesy of passing my test in a Corsa (Vauxhall MK1 Corsa) in 1993, I have EB, EC1 and ED1.

I also wouldn't be any use as a passenger having never towed a trailer, nor do I have any intention of towing a trailer, but it reassuring that I can legally drive something with a train weight of 7.5Tons if I want to (if I'm right in my thinking, or is it more weight?).

Kind of glad they don't give all the big stuff away for free now as it's a different skill to drive a LWB Transit, yet alone a 7.5Ton Truck.

PaddyFagan

If you're short a qualified passanger - know any old timers no1beemerfan - anyone who got a licence back in the 1960's (or before!) got given everything by default - both my parent's have B, C, D and EB (they did have EC & ED, but a few years ago they dropped these unless you went back and said you needed them!)

Paddy

no1beemerfan

Alanstrainor wrote: »

Yup it sucks! Oh and the accompanying driver would have to have held his/her EB license for at least 2 years.

Would you ever go away and stop making things worse!!

I've asked them to send the application form for the theory test (imagine if I fail!) and I'll do the test. More for the laugh than anything else!

mullingar

According to this document from the Dept of transport:

Towing a Trailer
If you hold a category B licence and wish to tow a trailer you may do so provided –
(1) the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed the unladen weight of the drawing vehicle and the combination does not exceed 3500 kg OR
(2) the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed 750 kg.
If you wish to tow a heavier trailer you must hold a category EB licence.

http://www.transport.ie/upload/general/2709-0.pdf


So:
All B licences can drive a car with trailer as long as :
a) overall train weight <3500kg , and
b) the car (or van) is heavier than the trailer.
c) the car (or van) is designed to tow these weights

So, If its >3500kg, you need an EB licence


For me, my car weighs 1800 kg unladen (yes its a heavy car), so I can legally tow a 1700kg trailer on my B licence

Del2005

R.O.R wrote: »

I'd offer to sit with no1beemerfan, but he's down in Tipp.

Courtesy of passing my test in a Corsa (Vauxhall MK1 Corsa) in 1993, I have EB, EC1 and ED1.

I also wouldn't be any use as a passenger having never towed a trailer, nor do I have any intention of towing a trailer, but it reassuring that I can legally drive something with a train weight of 7.5Tons if I want to (if I'm right in my thinking, or is it more weight?).

Kind of glad they don't give all the big stuff away for free now as it's a different skill to drive a LWB Transit, yet alone a 7.5Ton Truck.

It's 7.5tonnes not 7.5tons.

7.5tons = 7.62tonnes

dtm

excellent thread guys.

ive done ALOT of research into this as i wanted to legally tow my track car around to track days.

ive had a B licence for 9 years yet i was told by the county council that i had to sit the theory test.
so i have just sat it (and passed).

then when i get my provisional i have to have a qualified driver beside me.
Now when i say qualified i mean a person who already is fully licence to tow a trailer over 750kg (as in EB licence). I only personally know of ONE person who has an EB licence!!!!!!! So do i drag him around with me when im towing my trailer huh??

you will also find out that you are not insured to tow a trailer (under regualar insurance) over 750 kg anyway.

AND ALL THIS TIME A 16OLD CHILD CAN LEGALLY DRIVE A MASSIVE 4WD JOHN DEERE TRACTOR AT 100KPH TOWING A LOW LOADER AND A TRACK MACHINE ON IT.

sorry for shouting about this but tou can see how pi"$ed off i am about this.

keep posting!

BrianD3

mullingar wrote: »

For me, my car weighs 1800 kg unladen (yes its a heavy car), so I can legally tow a 1700kg trailer on my B licence

Not quite, if your car weighs 1800 kg unladen it probably has a max laden weight (MAM) of around 2300 kg. This figure added to the MAM of the trailer must be <3500 kg. Also the unladen weight of the car must be greater than the MAM of the trailer.

CiniO

BrianD3 wrote: »

Not quite, if your car weighs 1800 kg unladen it probably has a max laden weight (MAM) of around 2300 kg. This figure added to the MAM of the trailer must be <3500 kg. Also the unladen weight of the car must be greater than the MAM of the trailer.

Heh.
Unladen weight of the car, doesn't need to be grater then GVW of the trailer. It only can't be smaller.
So it can be greater or equal.

In other words.
If there's a car which GVW 2000kg, but the car weights 1500kg on it's own.
Then you can tow a trailer of 1500kg GVW max.

As GVW of the trailer is not bigger then weight of unladen car, and the sum of GVW of both vehicles is not bigger then 3500kg.

Besides - there's also another trick.
Car's have a maximum trailer weight specified by manufacturers.
So in case above, if the manufacturer specify that max trailer weight is 1400kg, then even if legally it'd be alloed to tow 1500kg trailer, you can't, as it exceeds car towing capacity.

mullingar

I had a look at the VIN plate on my car.

The max laden vehicle weight is 2120kg
The max train weight is 4140kg:eek::D Wow, rated upto a 2ton trailer:D

Unladen weight from manual is 1720kg.

So it looks like I can legally tow a 1700kg trailer on a B licence in a gs300!

galwaytt

mullingar wrote: »

I had a look at the VIN plate on my car.

The max laden vehicle weight is 2120kg
The max train weight is 4140kg:eek::D Wow, rated upto a 2ton trailer:D

Unladen weight from manual is 1720kg.

So it looks like I can legally tow a 1700kg trailer on a B licence in a gs300!

er, no, your VIN plate doesn't issue licences.........the CoCo do......:)

mullingar

galwaytt wrote: »

er, no, your VIN plate doesn't issue licences.........the CoCo do......:)

EEhh????

My vin plate stated the max towing weights. My licence states the max Im allowed to tow. Between the two sets on info I worked out what I can legally tow.

I dont get your post

BeardyGit

mullingar wrote: »

EEhh????

My vin plate stated the max towing weights. My licence states the max Im allowed to tow. Between the two sets on info I worked out what I can legally tow.

I dont get your post

Maximum combined has to be <3500 kg on a B license. More than that and you'll need an EB. That's my understanding anyway.

CiniO

mullingar wrote: »

I had a look at the VIN plate on my car.

The max laden vehicle weight is 2120kg
The max train weight is 4140kg:eek::D Wow, rated upto a 2ton trailer:D

Unladen weight from manual is 1720kg.

So it looks like I can legally tow a 1700kg trailer on a B licence in a gs300!

No you can't.
If you tow a 1700kg trailer, then GVW of car and trailer will be 2120 +1700 = 3820kg which is more then allowed 3500kg.
The heaviest trailer you can tow is 1380kg. (1380 +2120 = 3500kg).

mullingar

CiniO wrote: »

No you can't.
If you tow a 1700kg trailer, then GVW of car and trailer will be 2120 +1700 = 3820kg which is more then allowed 3500kg.
The heaviest trailer you can tow is 1380kg. (1380 +2120 = 3500kg).

Are you sure?

Its very clear in quote from the attachment I left in post #10:

Towing a Trailer

If you hold a category B licence and wish to tow a trailer you may do so provided –
(1) the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed the unladen weight of the drawing vehicle and the combination does not exceed 3500 kg OR
(2) the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed 750 kg.
If you wish to tow a heavier trailer you must hold a category EB licence.

So my unladen weight is 1720kg + 1700kg trailer = 3420kg.


Edit:

From the ROTR who worded it a little different (page 17):

http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/pdf-downloads/english/rules-of-the-road%20eng.pdf

Cars and trailers

If you hold a Full category B licence, you may tow a trailer only if:

the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer is 750kg or less, OR
the unladen (empty) weight of your towing vehicle is at least the same as
the trailer’s design gross vehicle weight, and the combined design gross
vehicle weight of the vehicle and trailer is no more than 3,500kg.

When using a car to tow a heavier trailer, you must hold a category EB licence

R.O.R

mullingar wrote: »

Are you sure?

Its very clear in quote from the attachment I left in post #10:



So my unladen weight is 1720kg + 1700kg trailer = 3420kg.


Edit:

From the ROTR who worded it a little different (page 17):

http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/pdf-downloads/english/rules-of-the-road%20eng.pdf

Isn't point 2 in the quote more pertinent?

(2) the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed 750 kg.
If you wish to tow a heavier trailer you must hold a category EB licence.

EDIT****

It's an either, or thing and I'm not awake enough to pick up on these things.

no1beemerfan

dtm wrote: »

excellent thread guys.

ive done ALOT of research into this as i wanted to legally tow my track car around to track days.

ive had a B licence for 9 years yet i was told by the county council that i had to sit the theory test.
so i have just sat it (and passed).

then when i get my provisional i have to have a qualified driver beside me.
Now when i say qualified i mean a person who already is fully licence to tow a trailer over 750kg (as in EB licence). I only personally know of ONE person who has an EB licence!!!!!!! So do i drag him around with me when im towing my trailer huh??

you will also find out that you are not insured to tow a trailer (under regualar insurance) over 750 kg anyway.

AND ALL THIS TIME A 16OLD CHILD CAN LEGALLY DRIVE A MASSIVE 4WD JOHN DEERE TRACTOR AT 100KPH TOWING A LOW LOADER AND A TRACK MACHINE ON IT.

sorry for shouting about this but tou can see how pi"$ed off i am about this.

keep posting!

Let me get this straight.....do I get to keep my full licence that I have at present (for the last 11 years) or do I go back onto a provisional again and lose the full licence?

salamander27

dtm wrote: »

AND ALL THIS TIME A 16OLD CHILD CAN LEGALLY DRIVE A MASSIVE 4WD JOHN DEERE TRACTOR AT 100KPH TOWING A LOW LOADER AND A TRACK MACHINE ON IT.

Mentioned this in a country pub once and got a frosty reception from the locals!
It's ridiculous really. There should be some limit to the works vehicle licence.

CiniO

mullingar wrote: »

Are you sure?

Its very clear in quote from the attachment I left in post #10:



So my unladen weight is 1720kg + 1700kg trailer = 3420kg.


Edit:

From the ROTR who worded it a little different (page 17):

http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/pdf-downloads/english/rules-of-the-road%20eng.pdf

Yes I'm sure
That comes from

S.I. No 537 of 2006

Road Traffic (Licensing of Drivers) Regulations 2006

7. (1) A combination of vehicles which consists of a drawing vehicle and a trailer shall, for the purpose of these Regulations, be regarded as a vehicle -


(a) in category B, where the drawing vehicle is in category B and the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed the unladen weight of the drawing vehicle and the total design gross vehicle weight of the combination does not exceed 3,500 kg,


(b) in category B, C1, C, D1 or D, where the drawing vehicle is in category B, C1, C, D1, or D, respectively, and the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed 750 kg, or

The limit to 3500kg applies to both GVW of car and trailer.

CiniO

R.O.R wrote: »

Isn't point 2 in the quote more pertinent?

(2) the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer does not exceed 750 kg.
If you wish to tow a heavier trailer you must hold a category EB licence.

EDIT****

It's an either, or thing and I'm not awake enough to pick up on these things.

No, it isn't.
There is "or" between these 2 points.

kincaid

Hi

I had not the EB licence either but i done got my C licence 7 years ago and then done my EC and have it also now but when i got my licence back still had not got the EB licence..
I rang the up and stated how come i am fully competent to drive a lorry with a 40ft trailer and not competent to drive a car with a 8ft trailer..
Just does not make sense and makes a mockery of the system..
just another way to squeeze money out of people..
I now have that licence too..

no1beemerfan

no1beemerfan wrote: »

Let me get this straight.....do I get to keep my full licence that I have at present (for the last 11 years) or do I go back onto a provisional again and lose the full licence?

Anyone have an answer to this?

I'll not bother doing the test if I've to go back onto a provisional licence...I forgot to ring the motor tax office before half 11 to ask them.

CiniO

no1beemerfan wrote: »

Anyone have an answer to this?

I'll not bother doing the test if I've to go back onto a provisional licence...I forgot to ring the motor tax office before half 11 to ask them.

You don't go on provisional licence.
You still keep your full B licence, and just get a driving permit for category EB. That's it.

CiniO

kincaid wrote: »

Hi

I had not the EB licence either but i done got my C licence 7 years ago and then done my EC and have it also now but when i got my licence back still had not got the EB licence..
I rang the up and stated how come i am fully competent to drive a lorry with a 40ft trailer and not competent to drive a car with a 8ft trailer..
Just does not make sense and makes a mockery of the system..
just another way to squeeze money out of people..
I now have that licence too..

Whenever you have category EC, you also have the right to drive vehicles in category EB.
Even if it's not stated on your licence.

BTW - it should be, and if you ask motor tax office, they are obliged to put EB on your licence.

no1beemerfan

CiniO wrote: »

You don't go on provisional licence.
You still keep your full B licence, and just get a driving permit for category EB. That's it.

Thanks for that!