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Court Summons has Wrong Location of where it happened

  • 12-10-2010 12:33pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 SeanKc


    Hi im just wondering if anyone knows if, there is the wrong location as to where the incident happend, the wrong street name does that affect the court summons in any way????


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,961 Hooch


    A Summons is an article that gets you, the defendant to court. An error on the said summons is not a fatal flaw in a case. Summons can be fully amended in court once they do not adversely prejudice the defendant.

    IE a Name, address or location can be changed once the error was just that, and error. You cannot amend a summons from lets say section 2 assault to Section 53 dangerous driving .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,062 dermot_sheehan


    Summons shows jurisdiction on it's face if it alleges the crime in the District court district the summons is returnable to. Any error as to where the crime took place can be amended in court, it's the prosecution's evidence at trial that controls in any case.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 29,821 ✭✭✭✭ Our man in Havana


    Say nothing and let them read the wrong location out as evidence. Then you can challenge their evidence directly.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,925 ✭✭✭ ballsymchugh


    i can see that going well..

    'so if you were not at the place identified at that time, where were you?'

    'i was around the corner'

    'what were you doing?'

    'fighting!'


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 42 ✭✭✭ crabfeet


    Haddockman wrote: »
    Say nothing and let them read the wrong location out as evidence. Then you can challenge their evidence directly.

    The Defendant has to plead "not guilty" before that can happen. If it doesn't work the sentence will be higher.


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭ nuac


    It depends on whether the defendant is prejudiced by the mistake in the summons.

    Judges have wide powers of amendment. Some more inclined than others to amend. Talk to a solicitor practising in the court concerned.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭ Bosco boy


    I've seen cases in drink driving where the error in the summons was not spotted by prosecution and when the defence looked to have it struck out it was not struck out by the judge because the correct location was the townland adjacent to the one in the summons. There's case law but I have no link.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,857 ✭✭✭ Reloc8


    Order 12 Rule 2. District Court Rules :-

    A Judge may amend any summons, civil summons, notice or counterclaim by adding or striking out parties or by amending such other defects and errors in any such document as may be necessary for the purpose of determining the real question at issue between the parties. Such amendments may be made in such manner as the Judge directs and upon such terms as the Judge thinks fit. If in the opinion of the Judge, the amendment is one which might prejudice any party to the proceedings in the merits of that party's case, he or she may make the amendment and, if necessary, adjourn the case or may refuse to make any such amendment and, if necessary, dismiss the proceedings.

    Order 38 Rule 1(1) :

    Subject to the provisions of paragraph (3) hereof, in cases of summary jurisdiction no variance between the complaint and the evidence adduced in support thereof, as to the time at which the offence or cause of complaint is stated to have been committed or to have arisen, shall be deemed material, provided that such information or complaint was in fact made within the time limited by law for making the same; nor shall any variance between the complaint and the evidence adduced in support thereof, as to the place in which the offence or cause of complaint is stated to have been committed or to have arisen, be deemed material, provided that the said offence or cause of complaint was committed or arose within the jurisdiction of the Judge by whom the case is being heard, or that, the accused resides or in the case of an offence was arrested within such jurisdiction. In any such case the Court may amend the summons, warrant or other document by which the proceedings were originated and proceed to hear and determine the matter.

    Order 38 Rule 1(2)

    (2) Subject to the provisions of paragraph (3) hereof, no objection shall be taken or allowed on the ground of a defect in substance or in form or an omission in the summons, warrant or other document by which the proceedings were originated, or of any variance between any such document and the evidence adduced on the part of the prosecutor at the hearing of the case in summary proceedings or at the examination of the witnesses during the preliminary examination of an indictable offence, but the Court may amend any such summons, warrant or other document, or proceed in the matter as though no such defect, omission or variance had existed.

    Order 38 Rule 1(3)

    Provided, however, that if in the opinion of the Court the variance, defect or omission is one which had misled or prejudiced the accused or which might affect the merits of the case, it may refuse to make any such amendment and may dismiss the complaint either without prejudice to its being again made, or on the merits, as the Court thinks fit; or if it makes such amendment, it may upon such terms as it thinks fit adjourn the proceedings to any future day at the same or at any other place.



    In other words, it doesn't generally matter. A summary court (District or on Appeal Circuit) has jurisdiction to amend and if necessary adjourn. However there is also a discretion to allow a judge dismiss or strike out. As nuac says, some judges are more inclined to exercise their discretion to amend than others.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2 SeanKc


    Thanks everyone for their help but it looks like it will be going ahead so,, thanks again


  • Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭ corcaigh1


    If one receive's a summons for a minor offence that took place in there home county of dublin but the summons lists the case to be heard in a district court 150km away in another county..can the case be thrown out on the basis of a different jurisdiction?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 992 dazza21ie


    corcaigh1 wrote: »
    If one receive's a summons for a minor offence that took place in there home county of dublin but the summons lists the case to be heard in a district court 150km away in another county..can the case be thrown out on the basis of a different jurisdiction?

    From memory district Court rules allows summons to be brought in court area offence was committed or area defendant resident or if defendant was arrested the area of the arrest


  • Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭ corcaigh1


    dazza21ie wrote: »
    From memory district Court rules allows summons to be brought in court area offence was committed or area defendant resident or if defendant was arrested the area of the arrest

    Thanks ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,087 Pro Hoc Vice


    Reloc8 wrote: »
    Order 12 Rule 2. District Court Rules :-

    A Judge may amend any summons, civil summons, notice or counterclaim by adding or striking out parties or by amending such other defects and errors in any such document as may be necessary for the purpose of determining the real question at issue between the parties. Such amendments may be made in such manner as the Judge directs and upon such terms as the Judge thinks fit. If in the opinion of the Judge, the amendment is one which might prejudice any party to the proceedings in the merits of that party's case, he or she may make the amendment and, if necessary, adjourn the case or may refuse to make any such amendment and, if necessary, dismiss the proceedings.

    Order 38 Rule 1(1) :

    Subject to the provisions of paragraph (3) hereof, in cases of summary jurisdiction no variance between the complaint and the evidence adduced in support thereof, as to the time at which the offence or cause of complaint is stated to have been committed or to have arisen, shall be deemed material, provided that such information or complaint was in fact made within the time limited by law for making the same; nor shall any variance between the complaint and the evidence adduced in support thereof, as to the place in which the offence or cause of complaint is stated to have been committed or to have arisen, be deemed material, provided that the said offence or cause of complaint was committed or arose within the jurisdiction of the Judge by whom the case is being heard, or that, the accused resides or in the case of an offence was arrested within such jurisdiction. In any such case the Court may amend the summons, warrant or other document by which the proceedings were originated and proceed to hear and determine the matter.

    Order 38 Rule 1(2)

    (2) Subject to the provisions of paragraph (3) hereof, no objection shall be taken or allowed on the ground of a defect in substance or in form or an omission in the summons, warrant or other document by which the proceedings were originated, or of any variance between any such document and the evidence adduced on the part of the prosecutor at the hearing of the case in summary proceedings or at the examination of the witnesses during the preliminary examination of an indictable offence, but the Court may amend any such summons, warrant or other document, or proceed in the matter as though no such defect, omission or variance had existed.

    Order 38 Rule 1(3)

    Provided, however, that if in the opinion of the Court the variance, defect or omission is one which had misled or prejudiced the accused or which might affect the merits of the case, it may refuse to make any such amendment and may dismiss the complaint either without prejudice to its being again made, or on the merits, as the Court thinks fit; or if it makes such amendment, it may upon such terms as it thinks fit adjourn the proceedings to any future day at the same or at any other place.



    In other words, it doesn't generally matter. A summary court (District or on Appeal Circuit) has jurisdiction to amend and if necessary adjourn. However there is also a discretion to allow a judge dismiss or strike out. As nuac says, some judges are more inclined to exercise their discretion to amend than others.

    The bit in bold is the important bit. The last part of the sentence being most important.


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