Being a friend "magnet"

DeclanAbroad

I seem to be in the situation where I'm able to become quite good friends with girls - to the extent where they talk about past or current relationship problems, private matter etc - but nothing ever seems to go further than that. Currently there's probably about 6 or 7 girls that I socialise with on a regular basis (often just 2 of us meeting for drinks and a chat). A couple of these girls I quite like and would be happy if things progressed but that seems unlikely. I seem to have developed a bit of a reputation with some mates because of this - one guy I know socially recently commented on how he'd seen me out and about with 3 different girls in only a few days. I haven't dated anyone in almost 2 years now and I'm starting to feel like I've developed the unfortunate knack of immediately entering the "friend zone" with any new girl I meet. Anyone else ended up in a similar situation before?

Bottle_of_Smoke

DeclanAbroad wrote: »

I seem to be in the situation where I'm able to become quite good friends with girls - to the extent where they talk about past or current relationship problems, private matter etc - but nothing ever seems to go further than that. Currently there's probably about 6 or 7 girls that I socialise with on a regular basis (often just 2 of us meeting for drinks and a chat). A couple of these girls I quite like and would be happy if things progressed but that seems unlikely. I seem to have developed a bit of a reputation with some mates because of this - one guy I know socially recently commented on how he'd seen me out and about with 3 different girls in only a few days. I haven't dated anyone in almost 2 years now and I'm starting to feel like I've developed the unfortunate knack of immediately entering the "friend zone" with any new girl I meet. Anyone else ended up in a similar situation before?

You haven't given much info but I'd bet you're probably just acting the nice guy who listens to their problems. You need to be more assertive, comfortable in yourself etc. Treat girls as you would if you were in a relationship, they need to see you as a boyfriend ''type'' rather than a shoulder they can cry on.

DeclanAbroad

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

you're probably just acting the nice guy who listens to their problems. You need to be more assertive, comfortable in yourself etc.

Well I'm not acting anything, I'm just being myself and yes I do think that I am a "nice guy".....it seems girls pick up on this and become friends - which I don't have a problem with - its just that they consistently become friends rather than anything more.

Logical Fallacy

Have you told any of these girls in the early stages of things that you would be interested in going out on a date?

Greyfox

DeclanAbroad wrote: »

I seem to be in the situation where I'm able to become quite good friends with girls - to the extent where they talk about past or current relationship problems, private matter etc - but nothing ever seems to go further than that.

Spent quite a bit of time in the dreaded friendzone myself and will never go their again! When you meet a women you have a short period of time where you ABSOLUTELY MUST make a move within this period, if you don't make a move your doomed and a women will then never think of you "in that way" as by not making a move you've as good as said your not into them in that way, it sadly looks like your definitely doomed and listening to all their problems is a very clear trademark of the friendzone

For women a man who does not want sex but gives emotinal support and friendly chat are guys that are worth their weight in gold and theirs no way they'll want to risk getting phisical and risk such a wonderful frienship

Next time your getting friendly with a girl you MUST make a move when the first decent oppertunity arises and you MUST clearly indicate that you want more then friendship, the hard part is you MUST clearly explain that if she just wants to be a friend that this is not enough for you, you want MORE or NOTHING

DeclanAbroad

Greyfox wrote: »

When you meet a women you have a short period of time where you ABSOLUTELY MUST make a move within this period, if you don't make a move your doomed and a women will then never think of you "in that way"

Some of these girls I'm not interested in beyond friendship. However some of them I am. Part of my trouble seems to be that, in general, I tend to need to get to know someone a few times before I can tell if I like them and want to take it further.........but by then I'm in the "friend zone". The other issue is that many of them I meet through mates or other female friends so initial meetings tend to be in groups so its hard to get a chance for a bit of a private chat early on. Chatting later on may be one-2-one but again by then its "friend zone" again.

Greyfox wrote: »

Next time your getting friendly with a girl you MUST make a move when the first decent oppertunity arises and you MUST clearly indicate that you want more then friendship, the hard part is you MUST clearly explain that if she just wants to be a friend that this is not enough for you, you want MORE or NOTHING

I only generally make a move when I'm interested in someone......which often takes time for me to figure out. I tend hang around with some guys that do "play the numbers" (try and chat up every girl as eventually they'll get luck) and that sort of behaviour just isn't me.....in fact recently its been really starting to annoy me watching them trying it on all the time.

Red Hand

Greyfox wrote: »

For women a man who does not want sex but gives emotinal support and friendly chat are guys that are worth their weight in gold and theirs no way they'll want to risk getting phisical and risk such a wonderful frienship

True enough. If you don't make your intentions clear at the start that you are interested in them and want to go on a date, then you will end up in the situation where you like the girl, but you cannot do anything about it as she sees you as a friend and someone to chat to/tell her problems to. Sometimes, this could be for years.:eek:

Greyfox

DeclanAbroad wrote: »

Some of these girls I'm not interested in beyond friendship. However some of them I am. Part of my trouble seems to be that, in general, I tend to need to get to know someone a few times before I can tell if I like them and want to take it further.........but by then I'm in the "friend zone". The other issue is that many of them I meet through mates or other female friends so initial meetings tend to be in groups so its hard to get a chance for a bit of a private chat early on. Chatting later on may be one-2-one but again by then its "friend zone" again.

I only generally make a move when I'm interested in someone......which often takes time for me to figure out. I tend hang around with some guys that do "play the numbers" (try and chat up every girl as eventually they'll get luck) and that sort of behaviour just isn't me.....in fact recently its been really starting to annoy me watching them trying it on all the time.

The thing is though if you go for it as though you want more then frienship and then after a couple of dates decide that you just want to be friends chances are you'll still be able to keep the frienship. The thing is most men don't take that long to decide, actually most men know within a few minutes if they would like something more and that's what your up against. Because so many men are more direct the vibe of a guy kinda likeing her but the guy is not sure is off-putting for so many women, also she might also think that you don't have the confidence to go for what you want.
It's harder in a group but if you think you like someone you need to be clearly making an effort to talk to to the new girl, this can simply be staying in the same group as the new girl and as soon as you get the chance ask her if she has a boyfriend. In my experience if you don't do this women persume your not into them.

I'm a huge fan of playing the numbers game, I believe it's the only guarenteed way of scoring due to the fact that overall it's so much easier for women to pull these days then it is for men.

arsenallegend

DeclanAbroad wrote: »

I seem to be in the situation where I'm able to become quite good friends with girls - to the extent where they talk about past or current relationship problems, private matter etc - but nothing ever seems to go further than that. Currently there's probably about 6 or 7 girls that I socialise with on a regular basis (often just 2 of us meeting for drinks and a chat). A couple of these girls I quite like and would be happy if things progressed but that seems unlikely. I seem to have developed a bit of a reputation with some mates because of this - one guy I know socially recently commented on how he'd seen me out and about with 3 different girls in only a few days. I haven't dated anyone in almost 2 years now and I'm starting to feel like I've developed the unfortunate knack of immediately entering the "friend zone" with any new girl I meet. Anyone else ended up in a similar situation before?

Declan i'm in the same boat as you i haven't dated a girl in a year and a half or so cause it seems they see me more as a friend then anything else. I'm a nice guy and seem to make friends with girls really quickly but that all it seems to be. Its happened recently wth a girl that i like who really only see's me as a friend. One of my mates said i probably have to step back cause girls don't like really nice and kind guys like they like 'em rough and tough. i'm not changing for anybody.

DeclanAbroad

Greyfox wrote: »

I'm a huge fan of playing the numbers game, I believe it's the only guarenteed way of scoring due to the fact that overall it's so much easier for women to pull these days then it is for men.

I'm not specifically looking to score - I'd like to meet a girl at some point to date but, in general, despite having contact with many many females they all seem to become just friends: some of them I don't fancy so friends is fine, some I would perhaps like to try developing something with.....yet nothing ever goes beyond friendship despite in a few cases me indicating that I like the girls in question.

Maguined

Surely you get a vague indication early on whether you could potentially be interested in them or not? When you meet someone you should know whether you find them physically attractive within a couple of minutes, you should have an idea if you get on with their personality after one or two nights out so really you should be able to know by then whether it is worth asking them out or not.

I think you are waiting too long, waiting for when you get to know them properly and feel something significant but because you are waiting so long they view you as just a friend, ask a girl out for a date after you have met her 2 or 3 times, after a couple of dates you will figure out by then whether you really do like them or not, if not then just tell her honestly you like her as a friend but don't feel that special extra to continue dating, if you do then great keep it going.

Wibbs

I've mentioned this before... The clue is in the name. Girlfriend. Which part comes first? The "girl" part. So that's what you aim at first. You can and hopefully do turn a romantic/sexual partner into a friend, but the other way around is an uphill struggle. Now it does happen but IMHO and IME 99 times outa 100 its because the woman at the very start put the guy in the "maybe" box. Or they were friends once, they havent seen each other for a period of time(months at least, usually years) and when they meet up she feels the gra for him and looks at him differently. Or she's into him, doesnt think he's into her, so she goes along with the friend part and then it turns out he does like her.

Women can do this with men. They can change from being in the friend pile to the lover pile. It's of a magnitude harder for a guy. The ladies can fall into their own version of this trap. Namely the bonkzone as I like to call it. They'll have sex with a guy hoping that he'll become a boyfriend. It's the other side of the friendzone coin. It's the same start point, in that in both cases they assume wrongly about the other gender based on their own. IE all men want is sex and their emotions follow/All women want is a deep emotional connection and their sexuality follows. Both will be disappointed taking this tack.

IMHO women are just as much if not more influenced by sexual triggers. They'll tend to dress it up in more romantic terms, especially when young, but that's what revs their engines. "I melted inside/my knees went weak/I felt warm all over when I saw him" thems horny feelings folks. "It was love at first sight and I just knew" is another phrase way more of the ladies than men use. TBH I've never heard a guy come out with it yet. And what does it mean? Sexual again. Reproductive attraction anyway. It can't be love unless you subscribe to magical thinking. They've no clue about his personality at that stage, so the "women go more for personality" stuff goes out the window in that example. The rough translation is "I want to fcuk him/have his babies/he makes me feel yummy". It simply cant be anything else, save a projection of her inner template of the right guy for her, but again its all physical and nada to do with his personality at that stage.

So how does this help guys in this friend magnet situation? First off, lose the notion of women not being just as sexually driven as you. And you are. You're accepting a freindship while hoping to get her knickers off. Women well know this and if they spot it you will go down in her estimation as she knows its dishonest. So when you meet a woman, be straight with them.

Maguined

Maguined wrote: »

Surely you get a vague indication early on whether you could potentially be interested in them or not? When you meet someone you should know whether you find them physically attractive within a couple of minutes, you should have an idea if you get on with their personality after one or two nights out so really you should be able to know by then whether it is worth asking them out or not.

Physically attractive depends on personality for a lot of people.
Of course you can bar the extremes but after that, there can be a lot of difference.

Galvasean

Greyfox wrote: »

I'm a huge fan of playing the numbers game, I believe it's the only guarenteed way of scoring due to the fact that overall it's so much easier for women to pull these days then it is for men.

The numbers game is well and good if you wnat to score on a night out, but in terms of finding a good relationship it's pretty bad IMO. Personally, I can only go on so many 'bad dates' with people I quickly find out I have nothing in common with/no interest in beyond looking at them before going mad.

--Kaiser--

Personally I don't really buy into this 'Friendzone' idea. IMO and IME if a woman is attracted to you it won't really matter if you're friends or not (except if there are social group complications and the like).

OP, I would say you probably come off to girls as being not interested or appearing to be not available. Girls are far less likely to make the first move so it's up to you really.

Maguined

bluewolf wrote: »

Physically attractive depends on personality for a lot of people.
Of course you can bar the extremes but after that, there can be a lot of difference.

I agree personality drastically affects attraction but when you initially meet someone its all down to their looks, if you see someone from a distance you can make a quick judgement about whether you find them attractive or not and then when you get to know their personality this adjusts the scale of the attraction however it is still only adjusting the initial physical attraction upon first sight.

You can judge whether someone if physically attractive or not based purely on a photo without knowing their personality.

I just think the OP is waiting too long, he is waiting till he really gets to know the girl or not to decide to ask them out, basically he taking the time to decide whether she is girlfriend material rather than taking the much shorter time to decide if she is date material, figuring out if she is girlfriend material should happen when he starts to date her not sitting back and admiring her from afar while she loses potential interest in him.

kieranlimbo

Read 'The Game' by Neil Strauss. it will solve all your problems

--Kaiser--

kieranlimbo wrote: »

Read 'The Game' by Neil Strauss. it will solve all your problems

:rolleyes:

Wibbs

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Personally I don't really buy into this 'Friendzone' idea. IMO and IME if a woman is attracted to you it won't really matter if you're friends or not

I agree somewhat, but the part in bold is what makes the diff IMHO. If she's attracted to you. She's less likely to be if you're already established as her friend.

--Kaiser--

Wibbs wrote: »

I agree somewhat, but the part in bold is what makes the diff IMHO. If she's attracted to you. She's less likely to be if you're already established as her friend.

In some cases I would say it's more likely that a girl would get attracted to you as she gets to know you, i.e. she might not have immediately thought you were attractive, but as you relax in each others company and your respective characters shine through then she might find she is attracted. This is if both of ye are available and there are no extenuating social circumstances.

But the OP has to make his interest known, start flirting and whatnot (even ask them for a dance). If a girl is just moaning to you about her about relationship problems she is treating you like her other female friends.

Greyfox

kieranlimbo wrote: »

Read 'The Game' by Neil Strauss. it will solve all your problems

Scanned through the book in chapters and found it to be utter tripe, it just waffles about how guys became pick-up artists, you'd learn nothing from reading it

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

In some cases I would say it's more likely that a girl would get attracted to you as she gets to know you, i.e. she might not have immediately thought you were attractive, but as you relax in each others company and your respective characters shine through then she might find she is attracted. This is if both of ye are available and there are no extenuating social circumstances.

But the OP has to make his interest known, start flirting and whatnot (even ask them for a dance). If a girl is just moaning to you about her about relationship problems she is treating you like her other female friends.

It usually doesn't work that way, women usually either feel something quite quickly and if they go a few meetings without feeling anything usually they will never have feelings for the guy. The best thing to do with women is give it a little bit of time to see if the spark is their and if after one evening or a couple of short meetings the spark is not their it's time to move on

Once a girl starts to tell you her problems that's the moment when you know you're definitely slipping into friendzone

Logical Fallacy

kieranlimbo wrote: »

Read 'The Game' by Neil Strauss. it will solve all your problems

It will however lead you to the bigger problem of have just read "The Game" by Neil Strauss.

OP, i would simply say to you that the whole dating is kind of designed to do what you want to do, take the time to find out if someone is the kind of person you want to have a relationship with.

Asking someone on a date isn't a confession of love, it's a confession of interest and an offering of an avenue to get to know each other better with an obvious leaning toward possible future romance.

Personally i think just asking girls out on a date largely solves your problem, you get to know them, they know you are interested, there are no strings.

BumbleB

Declan ,you might not be in the friendzone at all . I can identify with this story .I was in the same position as yourself before I had a lot of girl (friends) who I used to hang out with and I only realised (when another girl, let the proverbial cat out of the bag ) to me in conversation .Up to that point I was oblivious to all the stuff going on. I think youre at the point where you need to push out the boat for once and all with any of these girls you may like and see where it goes.

highlydebased

(this might be why I have so many problems but anyway)

Becoming a shoulder to cry on might indeed lead you to thinking that they will think you'd be a reliable boyfriend etc etc etc. However. Once they have you assigned to that category in your mind thats where you'll maybe remain. They want someone to listen to their problems and someone to make them feel better, but it seems to not let them consider you as anything more. For sure, listen to what they have to say but dont let it become your sole purpose with them. Also, hinting at going on dates needs to be done in early stages of a friendship. Otherwise it may be come overly developed and you'll be the one they "dont want to loose as a friend", etc.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Asking someone on a date isn't a confession of love, it's a confession of interest and an offering of an avenue to get to know each other better with an obvious leaning toward possible future romance.

Personally i think just asking girls out on a date largely solves your problem, you get to know them, they know you are interested, there are no strings.

Whilst that is true in theory, and should be the case, in Ireland I don't think it actually pans out that way. Usually people only agree to the date if they're interested. Usually people go on them after they've kissed or told the person they're interested.

I'll give you an example. I used to work with a Nigerian guy in an office of about 300 people. He was in a different department but we got chatting at staff beers. He told me he's asked four girls from the office on a date and tey'd all said no(he'd been working there about a month). He was good looking, intelligent, well educated etc etc

Where he came from dating was defined how you put it. He described it as ''I wanted to go on a date with these girls to see if we liked each other''

Now I later heard people calling him sleazy, but he was actually the opposite of sleazy, he wanted to go on dates with no strings attached.

However because the Irish definition of a date is effectively a formality when somethings going on he got this reputation.

So I think whilst its a good idea to ask someone out on a date early it is not the most important thing. The main thing is he must not be seen by these girls to be the equivelent of a gay friend. Like Wibbs said he must see them as girls before seeing them as friends.

elleburp

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

In some cases I would say it's more likely that a girl would get attracted to you as she gets to know you, i.e. she might not have immediately thought you were attractive, but as you relax in each others company and your respective characters shine through then she might find she is attracted.

That's not attraction, that's called "growing on her".
a. She likes him because he's funny. She's attracted to his funniness. It's not that she finds him attractive because he's funny.
b. She likes him because he's clever. She's attracted to his clever mind. It's not that she finds him attractive because he's clever.

OP; if you fancy these girls then just go for it. If you don't fancy them then what's the point?

HavingCrack

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Personally I don't really buy into this 'Friendzone' idea. IMO and IME if a woman is attracted to you it won't really matter if you're friends or not (except if there are social group complications and the like).

OP, I would say you probably come off to girls as being not interested or appearing to be not available. Girls are far less likely to make the first move so it's up to you really.

Mmm, I'm still kind of undecided on the Friend zone thing myself but your 2nd paragraph kind of ties in with the usual friend problem. Basically Man A likes girl B but is afraid to ask her out/make a move etc so girl thinks he's not interested and just considers him as a friend and any attraction she did have just disappears.

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Whilst that is true in theory, and should be the case, in Ireland I don't think it actually pans out that way. Usually people only agree to the date if they're interested. Usually people go on them after they've kissed or told the person they're interested.

I'll give you an example. I used to work with a Nigerian guy in an office of about 300 people. He was in a different department but we got chatting at staff beers. He told me he's asked four girls from the office on a date and tey'd all said no(he'd been working there about a month). He was good looking, intelligent, well educated etc etc

Where he came from dating was defined how you put it. He described it as ''I wanted to go on a date with these girls to see if we liked each other''

Now I later heard people calling him sleazy, but he was actually the opposite of sleazy, he wanted to go on dates with no strings attached.

However because the Irish definition of a date is effectively a formality when somethings going on he got this reputation.

So I think whilst its a good idea to ask someone out on a date early it is not the most important thing. The main thing is he must not be seen by these girls to be the equivelent of a gay friend. Like Wibbs said he must see them as girls before seeing them as friends.

I actually find it quite sad the way just meeting up with a girl or guy in Ireland is considered "OMG so, loike formal". I'd find it far more normal to ask a girl out for a coffee, realise we don't get on and move on ratehr than drunkenly kissing her in a pub and meeting up next day and realising we have nothign in common.

It's the main reason I truly prefer American girls,

Bottle_of_Smoke

HavingCrack wrote: »

I actually find it quite sad the way just meeting up with a girl or guy in Ireland is considered "OMG so, loike formal". I'd find it far more normal to ask a girl out for a coffee, realise we don't get on and move on ratehr than drunkenly kissing her in a pub and meeting up next day and realising we have nothign in common.

It's the main reason I truly prefer American girls,

Has its advantages and disadvantages. Some people can't stand the formalities of a date and simply dont have the confidence to ask someone out. The irish way can help there.

Maybe there should just be both!